Marvel sues City of Heroes

[Sky]

I had that comic!

[Riggswolfe]

I wonder if Marvel has enough money to win. I'd think Cryptic has as much money as they do considering the state of the comics industry.

[Trippy]

A pencil is a tool that allows people to do the same thing.  Great argument.

Speaking of pencils -- from www.pvponline.com:

http://www.pvponline.com/archive.php3?archive=20041112

Edit: Crude too wide, removed direct image link.

[Velorath]

Thank you, DMCA, and Fuck You, Marvel. I don't feel at all bad about getting BitTorrent comics now.

Seriously, after the raping of the Avengers that just took place in Avengers' Disassembled, the raping of Gwen Stacy's memory for the sake of short-term shock value, and this, I'm losing all respect for Marvel. DC, a minion of AOL Time-freaking-Warner is looking better.

Yeah, both good examples of crap for shock value and hype, but DC came close to crossing the same line with Identity Crisis (still one more issue to go before I can make a real judgement).  While I don't feel too bad about torrenting comics though, I do still support the writers and comics I like, which as far as Marvel goes means I'm only buying New Thunderbolts and Astonishing X-men at the moment (Supreme Power got taken off the list due to it's extremely slow pace after the first arc, and the fact that having seen JMS posting online, I've seen that he's a bit of an ass).  I'll still check out New Avengers as I don't really think Disassembled was Bendis' fault but that's a whole other discussion.

[Arnold]

A pencil is a tool that allows people to do the same thing.  Great argument.

Speaking of pencils -- from www.pvponline.com:

http://www.pvponline.com/archive.php3?archive=20041112

Edit: Crude too wide, removed direct image link.

Heh, I hadn't even seen that before I posted.  I just used "pencil" because that's what the Marvel guys use before their stuff is inked and colored.

[Big Gulp]

I'd think Cryptic has as much money as they do considering the state of the comics industry.

Marvel doesn't make money on comics any more, they make money on IP.

When you've got massive loads of Hollywood sugar coming in at regular intervals putting out funny papers just kind of seems silly.

[Velorath]

I'd think Cryptic has as much money as they do considering the state of the comics industry.

Marvel doesn't make money on comics any more, they make money on IP.

When you've got massive loads of Hollywood sugar coming in at regular intervals putting out funny papers just kind of seems silly.

Partly true, in that I don't think Marvel makes much money of the monthlies anymore, save for maybe the very top books.  I would say though that they probably make a decent amount of cash publishing TPB's since there's a lot more bookstores out there than comic book stores, not to mention that you can order them from Amazon.com (shipping costs among other factors make it a pain for a casual reader to order monthlies online).  I've heard the Ultimate Spider-man collections sell fairly well, and Essential Tomb of Dracula, Volume 1 of which came out about a year ago has done so well that Vol. 3 and 4 are already on the way.

Besides that, I wouldn't advise Marvel to get out of the "funny papers" quite yet since it would just take a couple of Batman and Robin sized flops to send superhero movies back to the cellar for another decade if the public isn't getting tired of them already.  How many more Spider-man movies do you think they really have left in them, and how many 2nd or 3rd teir characters will end up having actually successful movies like Blade?

[SurfD]

Fantastic 4 has a scheduled release data on the master list at work, just thoughti I would let you know.

[UnSub]

There are lots of possible Marvel movies that are still in the pipeline - have a look here if you feel like finding out.

To add to the comics-don't-make-money idea, there was a rumour a while back that Warner Bros lets DC Comics lose money since 1) its a tax write-off and 2) its the Superman / Batman / DCU IP that really matters.

Cryptic has known this day would come for a long time - fanbois who have been in the forums since October 2001 (ie me) have seen this issue raised repeatedly for no response from Cryptic. I'm sure that they've had their legal ducks set up in a row for quite a while, just waiting for such a lawsuit.

Finally, the character I see ripped off the most is War Machine - I've seen about six different versions (ie War-Machine, WarMachine, War.Machine etc) since CoH launched, all in the gray armour.  The best rip-off I ever saw was Papa Smurf, which just shows you how versatile the CoH character creation system is.

All in all, I expect a purge to happen soon.

[Velorath]

There are lots of possible Marvel movies that are still in the pipeline - have a look here if you feel like finding out.

To add to the comics-don't-make-money idea, there was a rumour a while back that Warner Bros lets DC Comics lose money since 1) its a tax write-off and 2) its the Superman / Batman / DCU IP that really matters.

The question isn't how many more movies based on Marvel comics can be churned out, it's whether or not they'll be any good or make money.  Characters like Iron Fist, Namor, or Man-Thing who are getting movies are probably going to have a hard time reaching Blade's level of success let alone Spider-man or X-men.  Blade's on it's last movie, X-men lost the director that helped make it successful, and Spider-man loses Raimi after the next movie.  I've heard a lot of negativity regarding Fantastic Four (although people trashing a movie before it's released is nothing new).  Studios can aim lower like they did with Daredevil or Punisher, but if a bunch of lower quality superhero movies start getting pushed into theaters does it risk killing the audiences interest in seeing any of them?

As far as the DC thing goes, that's a partial truth from what I understand.  I don't think it would be possible for DC to survive just based on their IP alone.  They've had about as many flop movies as they've had successful ones, and Smallville, the cartoons, and videogames I don't think are pulling in so much money that DC would be allowed to flush cash down the toilet on comics that don't make profit.  Being part of Time-Warner just allows them a little more leeway when it comes canceling books.  They can allow a lower profit margin on their books than Marvel can, and have been able to take more risks, creating imprints like Vertigo.

DC also makes a lot of their money off their TPB's.  They've been pretty good about collecting issues into TPB's soon after each arc is finished.  About halfway through Preacher's run I stopped collecting the monthies in favor of waiting for the trades since there was only a short wait for them.  In fact Marvel has been playing catch-up in the TPB market, and I'd say they really only caught up within the last year or so.  Marvel does have their Essentials line though which is a 24 issue collection or so in B&W for around $12-15, which is something I haven't seen a DC equivalent of yet.

[eldaec]

Cryptic's forum statement on the issue...

Heroes –

We at Cryptic Studios and NCsoft thank you for your kind words of support. We strongly disagree with Marvel's claims and intend to contest this matter vigorously.

Cryptic and NCsoft have been working hard since beta to enforce our intellectual property clause of the End User License Agreement ("EULA") and will continue to do so. I have read many posts and received many PMs asking how Paragon City can help. The best way you can help is by reporting characters that you believe might violate the intellectual property rules in our EULA. You can do this via /petition in-game or by sending an email to support@coh.com.

Again, thank you for your support and for being ever vigilant in helping us enforce our EULA. It is our policy not to comment on pending or current litigation, so please do not expect further discussion from us here on the boards regarding this matter. If and when we feel we can say something further, we will.

Thanks much,

Cuppajo
 

[HaemishM]

Trade paperbacks have issues of their own, the main one being that in order to get into the bookstores, you have to agree to take back unsold product. For anyone who knows anything about the comics biz, that's a mortal sin. Comic shops get stuck with all the unsold product they buy, thus the collector's market has been propped up. Of course, that same collection/speculation market almost killed the industry by choking comic stores with the "next big thing" which got bought by stores in droves and ignored by comics fans. TPB's I think are the distribution medium of the future, as the monthlies are just a PITA for the whole industry. But transitioning like that takes a lot of time.

I don't know who to blame for the Avengers Disassembled, but I'll put it squarely on Bendis and Quesada. Their choices of characters to kill REALLY pisses me off, but the whole reasoning behind the attacks was even worse. Yeah, fuck you for pissing on continuity. I'm not one to say don't try something new, but holy shit, at least make it good. It just felt arbitrary.

And fuck them if they really do put Wolverine in the Avengers.

Identity Crisis makes me feel all icky, but at least its a well-written story, and the characters aren't too far out of their selves.

[Velorath]

I don't know who to blame for the Avengers Disassembled, but I'll put it squarely on Bendis and Quesada. Their choices of characters to kill REALLY pisses me off, but the whole reasoning behind the attacks was even worse. Yeah, fuck you for pissing on continuity. I'm not one to say don't try something new, but holy shit, at least make it good. It just felt arbitrary.

And fuck them if they really do put Wolverine in the Avengers.

Identity Crisis makes me feel all icky, but at least its a well-written story, and the characters aren't too far out of their selves.

Last good Avengers story I liked was the recent Avengers/Thunderbolts mini.

I don't blame Bendis (not entirely anyway) because I think Joe Q. spent more time sucking his dick and telling him what a great writer he is and letting him write pretty much whatever he wants than he did making sure that Avengers Disassembled got done properly.  Even a lot of good writers need to be edited, but I think Marvel let's Bendis get away with a lot (especially after he brought Powers over) for fear that he would start writing more for other companies if they don't give him as much creative freedom as possible.

And I like IC, probably in part the same way that I've seen some people like Avengers Disassembled.  I don't know the characters all that well, so if they act a little out of character I won't really notice so it can't affect my enjoyment.  And yeah, Wolverine in the Avengers is a terrible idea.  Like some people have pointed out, New Avengers sounds more like that Secret Defenders comic Marvel put out in the 90's where Dr. Strange randomly throws groups together for each arc.

As far as trades go, Marvel especially paces it's stories now for the eventual tpb, making a lot of their comics hard to read as monthlies.  Stores that could have been told in 2-3 issues are now padded out to the standard 6 issues.  Trades do have their own problems, I've just been saying that regardless of how much money Marvel has made off their movies lately (and with Sony's creative book-keeping I have no idea how much money they've actually seen from the Spider-man movies) they probably shouldn't stop making comics and move to Hollywood quite yet.

[Delf]

The Avengers just haven't been the same since Diana Rigg left.

[personman]

She's still hot - just in a matronly sort of way... :)  Only TV show that made me certain I'd look good in a bowler.  Well Clockwork Orange too of course...

"... sinnnnggging in the rain <OOF!>, just siinnnging in the rain <OOF!>"