Star Trek Online: Here We Go Again!

[Lantyssa]

Think that's the normal edition, though.

There's a few things in the Digital Deluxe I want, so were I to get it at that price, it'd need to be that version.  The normal one isn't worth even $3.75 in my eyes.

[luckton]

They should sell the game to someone who will support the game and grow it.  STO should be the #2 or #3 largest MMO in North America.  The IP is solid and there are a legion of fans.

I agree...I so wanted STO to succeed and be the sci-fi MMO I've always wanted, but who could do it?

Sony would just roll it into Station Pass and forget it ever existed until 'EVERY' last dev on board quits a la MXO.

Bioware/Mythic's got Star Wars

FunCom... 

Turbine could actually have some potential...a sci-fi MMO would be nice nice in their catelog.

Indies couldn't afford the fees.

[ghost]

I'm so surprised that this one isn't F2P yet.  It's  the only price point that will work for it.

[Speedy Cerviche]

They should sell the game to someone who will support the game and grow it.  STO should be the #2 or #3 largest MMO in North America.  The IP is solid and there are a legion of fans.

I agree...I so wanted STO to succeed and be the sci-fi MMO I've always wanted, but who could do it?

Sony would just roll it into Station Pass and forget it ever existed until 'EVERY' last dev on board quits a la MXO.

Bioware/Mythic's got Star Wars

FunCom... 

Turbine could actually have some potential...a sci-fi MMO would be nice nice in their catelog.

Indies couldn't afford the fees.

Has there ever been a study done on if IPs are even worth it for a more serious game? I mean its one thing to re-skin Thor or Spiderman into a generic console beat 'em up, or real life players into a console sports game, but what IPs have ever made serious money on PC format? Failing to get those Warhammer IPs didn't hold Blizzard back, contrast that with the trail of tears that is the history of Star Wars/Trek IP games.

[Lantyssa]

I'm so surprised that this one isn't F2P yet.  It's  the only price point that will work for it.

It's the only price point that will work for the players.  I'm not sure it'd help the game's survival any.

[Brolan]

They should sell the game to someone who will support the game and grow it.  STO should be the #2 or #3 largest MMO in North America.  The IP is solid and there are a legion of fans.

I agree...I so wanted STO to succeed and be the sci-fi MMO I've always wanted, but who could do it?

Sony would just roll it into Station Pass and forget it ever existed until 'EVERY' last dev on board quits a la MXO.

Bioware/Mythic's got Star Wars

FunCom... 

Turbine could actually have some potential...a sci-fi MMO would be nice nice in their catelog.

Indies couldn't afford the fees.

Has there ever been a study done on if IPs are even worth it for a more serious game? I mean its one thing to re-skin Thor or Spiderman into a generic console beat 'em up, or real life players into a console sports game, but what IPs have ever made serious money on PC format? Failing to get those Warhammer IPs didn't hold Blizzard back, contrast that with the trail of tears that is the history of Star Wars/Trek IP games.

You make a good point because it is kind of a lose/lose situation for them.  You have extra cost involved for IP, and fanboys constantly bitching how the game is not faithful to the "universe".

[Malakili]

contrast that with the trail of tears that is the history of Star Wars/Trek IP games.

I dunno, there have been some pretty solid Star Wars game, and a few good Star Trek games too.  Its really in the MMO arena that they have failed. Jedi Knight, TIE Fighter, KOTOR, Elite Force, etc.  Warhammer didn't hold Blizzard back, but the Dawn of War series is very solid too.  

edit: The only big IP MMO that I can think of that turned out good is LOTRO.

[Spiff]

edit: The only big IP MMO that I can think of that turned out good is LOTRO.

The IP was certainly a big part of why I picked it up and (considering it's an MMO) it rarely disappointed me in its rendition of Middle Earth.
High points being the Shire and Moria for me, being able to experience some of what I dreamt of as a kid reading those books certainly added flavour which otherwise wouldn't have been there.

Did it keep me paying longer? I'd like to think so; at launch it really wasn't the game it is now: combat was piss-poor (even compared to now  ), there was virtually no flexibility in most classes and some zones where utter grindyards. Yet I stuck with it for about 3 months.
Had a lot in common with STO really, except that it had style, hobbit-flavour and wasn't trying to annoy me every 2 minutes.

[Merusk]

contrast that with the trail of tears that is the history of Star Wars/Trek IP games.

I dunno, there have been some pretty solid Star Wars game, and a few good Star Trek games too.  Its really in the MMO arena that they have failed. Jedi Knight, TIE Fighter, KOTOR, Elite Force, etc.  Warhammer didn't hold Blizzard back, but the Dawn of War series is very solid too.  

edit: The only big IP MMO that I can think of that turned out good is LOTRO.

Yeah, good Star Wars games are an easy formula.  Get the action right and you're good to go.  You don't even really need Jedi, unless it's a character-based game, as X-wing showed. All the Star Wars arcade games were pretty successful, even the Pod Racing one.  The ones that failed have been the ones that tried to look too deep beyond pew-pew lazers and vroom-woom lightsabers.

Star Trek games that were successful followed this same paradigm, iirc.  While the lore there might be deeper, the games don't have to be.  Because they're effing games.

[5150]

I'm so surprised that this one isn't F2P yet.  It's  the only price point that will work for it.

What would they sell in the store though? It's 99% single purchase items that are typically account wide (the exceptions being the timed xp boosts and extra ship slots)

I hardly ever use the food/hypo's/shield boosts as it is (and the hypo's/shield boosts can be crafted) so unless you nerf the loot drops for free players (might not need to since STO is kinda loot-lite already) and prevent them from crafting you won't have much store traffic

I play both LOTRO & DDO F2P and have never put my hand in my pocket for anythng temporary..... maybe I'm just unusual (read: stingy)

[Malakili]

I'm so surprised that this one isn't F2P yet.  It's  the only price point that will work for it.

What would they sell in the store though?

With Cryptic getting purchased by Perfect World, I have to imagine they'll think of something.

[Mrbloodworth]

I hate Temp items in cash shops.


Just had to put that out there. Its a retarded idea.

[Stormwaltz]

I played the "remastered" Doomsday Machine mission over lunch. It's fucking fantastic - it starts with you disabling and seizing a Klingon Bird of Prey in boarding combat.

It's a pretty clear high water mark, despite a few detail issues (many dialogue typos, ships intended as scenery that you can target and reduce to zero health, but won't blow up).

[Rishathra]

Don't forget that nice little bit of Klingon opera!

It's been mentioned before, but I also want to give praise to the live team for the work they have done on this game.  They have managed to add a lot of good content, and they seem to understand better than the development team did on how to make the game feel more Trek-like.  It's a bunch of little things, like adding titles to the beginnings of missions when you warp in, and adding the 'streaking stars' effect to sector space when you are moving.  Several of the feature episodes and remastered missions use interior ship locations and cut-scenes to much greater effect as well.

For those who tried it out again and still found it horrible, I would say that one of the weakest aspects of the game is those first ten levels, when you are stuck in that shitty Miranda that's no fun to fly.  Much of the improved content exists outside of that range, also.  I made an alt the other day just to fuck around, and was reminded how miserable the game is before you hit Lt. Commander.  It's possible I'm just spouting fanboy excuses though, so fee free do disregard.

[Mrbloodworth]

So, 4th time is the charm? Can we do it the way fans wanted it done this time? Or will the next version be the same game as the first three again?

Inquiring minds want to know.

[01101010]

For those who tried it out again and still found it horrible, I would say that one of the weakest aspects of the game is those first ten levels, when you are stuck in that shitty Miranda that's no fun to fly.  Much of the improved content exists outside of that range, also.  I made an alt the other day just to fuck around, and was reminded how miserable the game is before you hit Lt. Commander.  It's possible I'm just spouting fanboy excuses though, so fee free do disregard.

No you are spot on. The first 11 levels suck ass and feel grindy as fuck after lvl 5. Once you get access to the first tier of diverse ships and can afford to buy more than one, the game starts feeling much better. But it still feels grindy more times than not. The ships are really what does it for me though. I love seeing some of the huge cruisers and higher level gunboats. Science vessels are stupid though.

[Ingmar]

I hate Temp items in cash shops.


Just had to put that out there. Its a retarded idea.

I admit to occasionally springing for the fast travel unlock in LOTRO when I'm working on the epic. But points from my lifetime thing don't count, am I rite?

[5150]

Science vessels are stupid though.

My enginering officer will definately spring for the Nebula when I hit Commander in 1 level's time. I think its a great ship design and I've always thought the Excelsior was ugly (not a huge fan of the 'non-series' ship designs).

I'm going to have a slot issue at Captain though (although slots are 50% off atm) as I want all 3!

[Simond]

The Excelsior is the best-looking ship in the Star Trek universe.

[Surlyboi]

The Defiant begs to differ. As does the Sovereign class Enterprise.

[Merusk]

The Defiant was a pissass ugly little ship that reminded me of a lady's razor.  The Sovereign class Enterprise has a great profile but looks too much like the Voyager for my taste.  I always hated the design of that ship. It looks like a planarian trying to grow legs.

The Excelsior still looked rockin' when it was seen at Farpoint in TNG.  It was a badass design and still looks great.

[koro]

I started playing this again a few days ago with a new account. Hit Commander and am now in an Excelsior, which wasn't in the game last I played.

Game is a lot better than it was at release; I can't run out of things to do no matter how hard I try, and I'm purposefully avoiding large swaths of the repeatable content so as to avoid getting too overleveled for the more storyline-based missions.

Ground combat is still a dull chore, though. Enemies have way too much fucking HP, period. Just slashing enemy health pools by 50% would instantly make the ground game better.

[UnSub]

Is that before or after the ground combat update that I thought was coming?

[koro]

I heard a ground combat revamp was in the works, but I haven't seen anything about it.

Just found out new ground combat's on Test, and will be going live in two weeks. I'll have to try it out.

[koro]

Okay, I tried it out (it got delayed on Test til today).

Good lord it is fun. The "shooter mode" is take-it-or-leave-it (I personally find it neat, but I may stick to the normal tab controls once the novelty wears off), but the weapon and enemy HP rebalance is like night and day. Minion-type enemies go down in 2-4 shots, shielded lieutenants take 3-6. Third tier troops take a little bit more, but not much. For reference, enemies on Live currently take at least 5x as much damage as on Test. Conversely, you also take much more damage, but my bridge officers seemed pretty competent at keeping me alive despite that, so...

The weapons themselves are very different. Each weapon has had a DPS boost of something along the lines of 6x, and where the secondary fire modes for each weapon were in the 15-20+ second recharge range, they're now usually 6 seconds or less. Rifles fire much faster, dual pistols rip people to shreds at close range, the "assault cannon" type weapons are essentially phaser chainguns, spewing massive amounts of death in a wide arc. Each weapon also has its own melee combo which does - gasp, shock - decent damage. I bludgeoned a Klingon to death with my phaser rifle in very short order.

Player and bridge officer abilities also seem buffed across the board as well. My tac captain abilities seem much more useful, and the new Kirk jump kick is fun. My engineer officers' turrets also seemed to be much more effective by actually hurting enemies and restoring significant health and shields.

All in all, this patch is absolutely amazing for the game, and I can't wait to see it live.

[Surlyboi]

The Excelsior still looked rockin' when it was seen at Farpoint in TNG.  It was a badass design and still looks great.

To each their own. The Excelsior looks like a pregnant manatee to me.

[01101010]

The Excelsior still looked rockin' when it was seen at Farpoint in TNG.  It was a badass design and still looks great.

To each their own. The Excelsior looks like a pregnant manatee to me.

Tier 3 heavy cruiser ships are kinda dumb looking - all of them. The Excelsior is nice in that it has transwarp to the three lower level zones and a bigger crew, but meh... not worth the price. Hell, the tier 3 science vessels look stupid as well... the Escorts all look ok. WHY AM I TALKING ABOUT THIS?

[Surlyboi]

Heh. I stopped playing as an admiral with a shitton of credits, I'll buy a few more ships when the ground rebalance goes live.

[tmp]

Tier 3 heavy cruiser ships are kinda dumb looking - all of them.

pfft, so not true.

[Strazos]

Is this game FTP yet?

[luckton]

Is this game FTP yet?

[Riggswolfe]

No it's not F2P but I've recently seen an add for a browser based FTP Star Trek MMO. Whether or not it will be another nail in the coffin I don't know.

[Rishathra]

I just tried out the ground combat changes on test, and I agree with koro.  It's a LOT more fun.  The previous tedium is basically nonexistent now.  The shooter mode did nothing for me, and felt clunky, but I can see how others might enjoy it.  It is, however, a load of fun when you use it with the new 'chain gun' weapons.

I also like the little art and effect details that have been added.  The replication effect when you create turrets and drones is very cool, and they also got rid of the spinning frisbee look the old drones had and replaced them with exocomps, a nice TNG reference.  I liked that the seeker drone had 'MACO' stenciled on the side.

[koro]

I only have two real gripes about the new ground combat: the more I try it, the less I like Shooter Mode (against enemies at the Admiral level or higher, Shooter Mode is practically suicide), and sometimes the player him/herself is just too damn squishy for what you fight. You have to now make split-second decisions with an unresponsive UI, and that kind of holds it back a bit. I'll still take dying occasionally but having combat resolve itself in 20 seconds to never dying ever and having each squad of mooks take 2+ minutes to kill, though.

My only worry is that since Cryptic is spread super fucking thin right now between Champions, STO, and Neverwinter that the new ground combat won't get the needed iterative polish it needs either on Test or before it goes live.

One thing this has kind of revealed to me, though, is that apparently the only people who read and post on STO's official forums are PvPers. Nearly every thread relating to the new combat balance is full of PvPers bitching about anything they can manage to find to bitch about.

[Surlyboi]

Fuck the PvPeeners.