AOC - State of the Game: February 2008

[Evildrider]

If you're "moving around alot" in DDO to fight you're a fucking idiot.  DDO's combat system is either spamming clicks while tripping,  or you took the awful "I can strafe and attack!" feats that totally gimped your character.  Also, DDO has autoattack, it works alot better than sitting there spamming clicks.

From what I've heard, this combat system is NOTHING like WoW, or any other MMORPG really.

Huh?  If you think getting spring attack is gimping your character.. well.. I'm not even gonna go there.  I don't tend to stand in one spot and let spells get spammed on me, or I move position to always be behind or flank. 

Yes, there is an auto attack.. and it also attacks slower then actually clicking to attack..

Maybe you should learn the game a bit more before calling me a *fucking idiot* lol.  If you are standing in one spot using auto attack and hitting your one special attack, then you are better off playing some other mmo's.

bah doublish post :(

[Ratman_tf]

The Diablo comment deserved to be ignored as I mentioned different attack directions but Ratman chose the smarty way regardless. I got distracted by its lack of a point.

#1. Every game can be boiled down to clicking on shit. One man's involved combat is another's spastic clickfest.

#2. Attack facings, unless they're very careful, can easily degenerate into PvP being about grabbing the other guy's ass. The RPPvP equivalent of bunny hopping.

#3. They should have made this game about a Real Barbarian.

[Nerf]

Lol @ avoiding spells in DDO.  Sorry dude, but thats a load of shit, DDO melee combat is clickspam and spamming trip.  You can't effectively flank or get behind NPC's unless you're not tanking, and good fucking luck avoiding anything except at point blank.

[Evildrider]

Lol @ avoiding spells in DDO.  Sorry dude, but thats a load of shit, DDO melee combat is clickspam and spamming trip.  You can't effectively flank or get behind NPC's unless you're not tanking, and good fucking luck avoiding anything except at point blank.

Yes, any one that doesn't play your way sucks.. you know everything.. 

Sorry because you may not know how to avoid spells.. that's your flaw.  you do realize you can get out of line of sight by moving when you start seeing casting animations right?  Oh wait.. you are just standing there spamming.. you might not have picked that up.

[Nerf]

How long has it been since you played DDO?  Most npc's don't even have spellcasting animations, at least the ones that really fucking hurt you.  The only time moving and attacking would be worthwhile in DDO is shot on the run for ranged classes, spring attack is a total waste of way too many feats for the benefit it provides.

I've only got a couple 16s though, what would I know.

[Evildrider]

Umm been playing since beta.. have 1 capped cleric, 1 battle cleric at 14, 1 wizzy at cap, 1 sorc at cap, 1 fighter at cap, 1 ranger at cap, 1 rogue at cap. 

It's just different playstyles probably.  However you can dodge most of the damage spells like flame strike, fireball, and scorching ray, cone of cold... Their animations are quick but you can tell when they are casting.

And if you ahve a fighter you have more then enough feats for spring attack.. if you are a twf ranger.. you are probably getting spring attack for Tempest ranger.  I'd say over 50% of the fighters in my guild carry spring attack.  Barely any of them trip.. because you aren't tripping the Orthos and Beardeds Devils on the higher difficulties.  Since the devils port ALOT that also makes Spring Attack well worth it.. especially on the Orthos on ELITE who's AC is insane.

[Nerf]

Ah, maybe the content made spring attack wortwhile, my fighters been mothballed for awhile, but it used to be fucking worthless, unless you just felt like running around all cracked out.

[Falconeer]

Umm been playing since beta.. have 1 capped cleric, 1 battle cleric at 14, 1 wizzy at cap, 1 sorc at cap, 1 fighter at cap, 1 ranger at cap, 1 rogue at cap. 

Wait. Are you trying to say that D&D Online is fun?

[Falwell]

So I've been trying to dig up some more info on the spellweaving system they mentioned back in the day with no luck. Anyone know if this is just under tight NDA or has this went the way of the Dodo?

[K9]

I think it's pretty heavily  and probably not as polished as the physical combat system (guessing0; hence it has been showcased less. The only casting dynamic to get shitcanned was the hell consequence of being overambitious with your casting because it just lead to unfun downtimes in groups while the caster had to fight their way out of hell.

[Pennilenko]

The only casting dynamic to get shitcanned was the hell consequence of being overambitious with your casting because it just lead to un-fun downtimes in groups while the caster had to fight their way out of hell.

Heh. That sounds fun. I really think people need to lose the concept of having to stay constantly busy on the go and grindy in MMO's. What ever happened to real risks for your choices and socialization? Spending time chatting with people and getting to know them better?

Outside of everyone's guild how many people do you really know in  <insert your current mmo name here>?

Does anyone actually use their MMO to relax anymore?

[Aez]

The only casting dynamic to get shitcanned was the hell consequence of being overambitious with your casting because it just lead to un-fun downtimes in groups while the caster had to fight their way out of hell.

Heh. That sounds fun. I really think people need to lose the concept of having to stay constantly busy on the go and grindy in MMO's. What ever happened to real risks for your choices and socialization? Spending time chatting with people and getting to know them better?

Outside of everyone's guild how many people do you really know in  <insert your current mmo name here>?

Does anyone actually use their MMO to relax anymore?

It's called MySpace.  It's all pink and fuzzy.  Have fun.

[Pennilenko]

The only casting dynamic to get shitcanned was the hell consequence of being overambitious with your casting because it just lead to un-fun downtimes in groups while the caster had to fight their way out of hell.

Heh. That sounds fun. I really think people need to lose the concept of having to stay constantly busy on the go and grindy in MMO's. What ever happened to real risks for your choices and socialization? Spending time chatting with people and getting to know them better?

Outside of everyone's guild how many people do you really know in  <insert your current mmo name here>?

Does anyone actually use their MMO to relax anymore?

It's called MySpace.  It's all pink and fuzzy.  Have fun.

I wasn't suggesting that people become total slack asses. I was mearly pointing out what i think is a worsening trend in MMOs. Also i was asking questions in which i was intersted in discussing. You didn't need to go overboard and throw poo at me.




 

[Megrim]

The only casting dynamic to get shitcanned was the hell consequence of being overambitious with your casting because it just lead to un-fun downtimes in groups while the caster had to fight their way out of hell.

Heh. That sounds fun. I really think people need to lose the concept of having to stay constantly busy on the go and grindy in MMO's. What ever happened to real risks for your choices and socialization? Spending time chatting with people and getting to know them better?

Outside of everyone's guild how many people do you really know in  <insert your current mmo name here>?

Does anyone actually use their MMO to relax anymore?

Soooo.... they threw out the only thing which was going to make casting interesting. Yea, ok, gw. It's an interesting strategy Cotton, let's see if it pays off for them....

[rk47]

hell why don't they just add a pacman mini-game whereby it kicks in when you're knocked out of the fight. If the 'ghosts' gets your pacman you can't self rez.

[tmp]

Does anyone actually use their MMO to relax anymore?

Sure, when they choose to. Not when they have to because one guy in group screwed up and there's nothiing they can do about it but sit and pretend forced downtime for nth time in the row is fun and relaxing.

[Raguel]

It used to drive me crazy when I read devs/players discussing a unique,innovative system/feature but it gets canned because it conflicts with the grind. Now I just accept that this is just what the industry  is going to make (at least when it comes to fantasy mmos). 

[Phred]

I think trying to do any sort of harder sci-fi as a MMORPG would be difficult, especially a traditional character-centric DIKU one. That PS3 game "The Agency" is going to have the same problem, how many different types of guns can you have as items?

They could always do what they did with AO, and make a shit ton of useless guns.

[Venkman]

Smith & Wesson called. They want their business model back.

(always wanted to do that)

On AoC system requirements: anyone who's surprised hasn't followed the game at all. This was one of those titles they pulled out as a reason DX10 was worth getting Vista for, so that should have been the big hint. Those of us you in the beta can decide whether the graphics are worth the spec.

[Aez]

The only casting dynamic to get shitcanned was the hell consequence of being overambitious with your casting because it just lead to un-fun downtimes in groups while the caster had to fight their way out of hell.

Heh. That sounds fun. I really think people need to lose the concept of having to stay constantly busy on the go and grindy in MMO's. What ever happened to real risks for your choices and socialization? Spending time chatting with people and getting to know them better?

Outside of everyone's guild how many people do you really know in  <insert your current mmo name here>?

Does anyone actually use their MMO to relax anymore?

It's called MySpace.  It's all pink and fuzzy.  Have fun.

I wasn't suggesting that people become total slack asses. I was mearly pointing out what i think is a worsening trend in MMOs. Also i was asking questions in which i was intersted in discussing. You didn't need to go overboard and throw poo at me.




 

Sure.

There's good and bad wayy to encourage socialisation in mmog.

The good ways include :
- Mini-game (WoW card game)
- Elaborate pointless but fun feature (music instrument in Asheron's Call 2, dancer profession in SWG)

The bad ways are mainly when the socialisation is forced to your throat :
- Having to watch a Wookie dance to regenerate an obscure meter
- Having to tolerate a bad/stupid/annoying healer because you can't do shit with out him
- And yes, having to wait for your mage to come out of hell by doing a lame and repetitive punitive quest

[Mrbloodworth]

The only casting dynamic to get shitcanned was the hell consequence of being overambitious with your casting because it just lead to un-fun downtimes in groups while the caster had to fight their way out of hell.

Heh. That sounds fun. I really think people need to lose the concept of having to stay constantly busy on the go and grindy in MMO's. What ever happened to real risks for your choices and socialization? Spending time chatting with people and getting to know them better?

Outside of everyone's guild how many people do you really know in  <insert your current mmo name here>?

Does anyone actually use their MMO to relax anymore?

It's called MySpace.  It's all pink and fuzzy.  Have fun.

I wasn't suggesting that people become total slack asses. I was mearly pointing out what i think is a worsening trend in MMOs. Also i was asking questions in which i was intersted in discussing. You didn't need to go overboard and throw poo at me.




 

Sure.

There's good and bad wayy to encourage socialisation in mmog.

The good ways include :
- Mini-game (WoW card game)
- Elaborate pointless but fun feature (music instrument in Asheron's Call 2, dancer profession in SWG)

The bad ways are mainly when the socialisation is forced to your throat :
- Having to watch a Wookie dance to regenerate an obscure meter
- Having to tolerate a bad/stupid/annoying healer because you can't do shit with out him
- And yes, having to wait for your mage to come out of hell by doing a lame and repetitive punitive quest

None of that is really social interaction.

[Merusk]

You obviously weren't a dancer in SWG's beginning and didn't partake in some of the music groups in AC2.   They were very social bits during the time I played with both.

What ruined the social bit of SWG was the holocron grind.  All of the sudden folks who had no interest in being a dancer were forced to be master_dancer.  Better to just afk macro and walk away, they thought.  It fucking killed it for the small group of us dedicated to Theed & Corellia's scene on Scyllia.

[Aez]

None of that is really social interaction.

Care to elaborate?

[Venkman]

None of that is really social interaction.

Wuh? Having been in bands in both SWG and LoTRO, I beg to differ.

[palmer_eldritch]

I used to love going to the cantinas with my tailor and touting for business. The entertainers would buy stuff, and then the fighters who were watching them would want stuff. There was a crafting station outside the cantina in the town I used to go to (too long ago to remember the name), so I could make stuff to order right there. It certainly seemed more social than doing instances in WoW.

[Slyfeind]

None of that is really social interaction.

Wuh? Having been in bands in both SWG and LoTRO, I beg to differ.

I used to love the entertainer community. We'd braid each others' hair after getting a bubble in music or dance. Great fun. Nothing to do really but bullshit while our experience bars filled themselves. Raph needs to put this crap in his new MetaMMO and he knows it! DAMMIT!

[schild]

Yea, I need experience bars to chat with other people too.



HOW I PINE FOR THE CANTINA.

[Mrbloodworth]

You obviously weren't a dancer in SWG's beginning and didn't partake in some of the music groups in AC2.   They were very social bits during the time I played with both.

What ruined the social bit of SWG was the holocron grind.  All of the sudden folks who had no interest in being a dancer were forced to be master_dancer.  Better to just afk macro and walk away, they thought.  It fucking killed it for the small group of us dedicated to Theed & Corellia's scene on Scyllia.

Oh, i was a lot of things, including the mayor of a 4 guild city of over 100's +.

My point being, that those mechanics may have CAUSED social interaction. They, themselves, were not. Most social interaction was happening in spite of, or during the time those mechanics were required, or in someones other words, "forced".

Manly, the mechanics brought people to a common place. Thats about it. Social interaction happened anyway.

I don't believe you can code social interaction.

Your right about the holocron grind.

Bands and traveling circus were another thing entirely, and were 100% player created. No mechanic required you to come up with a name for the band, song selection, matching outfits and a date list.

[Ratman_tf]

Outside of everyone's guild how many people do you really know in  <insert your current mmo name here>?

I know them enough to know that I don't want to communicate with them.

[trade: A$$HaT] CHUCK NORRIS!!!

[Venkman]

Yea, I need experience bars to chat with other people too.

They, themselves, were not. Most social interaction was happening in spite of, or during the time those mechanics were required, or in someones other words, "forced".

Here's what Aez said:

- Elaborate pointless but fun feature (music instrument in Asheron's Call 2, dancer profession in SWG)

The pointless-but-fun part is what enabled social interaction, not the Battle Fatigue/Mind Wound nonsense. Don't think about SWG the total game (because these systems shouldn't have been forced in the first place). Just consider the music/dance/ID activities in comparison to the equally pointless-but-fun music system in AC2 and LoTRO. By themselves they did not give XP, and there really was no reason to do them from a gameplay point of view. They are mere toys people created experiences around.

[grunk]

oh man,i cant get over this...

IS THIS GAME UBER OR NOT!? WTF... !!!!

[Slayerik]

oh man,i cant get over this...

IS THIS GAME UBER OR NOT!? WTF... !!!!

The prophecy has been fulfilled. He has returned. All praise be grunk.

[Triforcer]

oh man,i cant get over this...

IS THIS GAME UBER OR NOT!? WTF... !!!!

Apparently, it is.

http://www.techchill.com/2008/03/24/age-of-conan-tops-sales-charts-despite-being-unreleased/

[Evildrider]

oh man,i cant get over this...

IS THIS GAME UBER OR NOT!? WTF... !!!!

Apparently, it is.

http://www.techchill.com/2008/03/24/age-of-conan-tops-sales-charts-despite-being-unreleased/

Well it has CGI boobies, and now we know how many people love those.   

[Threash]

oh man,i cant get over this...

IS THIS GAME UBER OR NOT!? WTF... !!!!

Apparently, it is.

http://www.techchill.com/2008/03/24/age-of-conan-tops-sales-charts-despite-being-unreleased/

Well it has CGI boobies, and now we know how many people love those.   

Very appropiate avatar for this post.