Schild's WoW Gripe Thread

[schild]

Rules: Everyone gets 1 reply to each post. ONE. There will be no arguing Except by me. I can ban you. Don't be a fanboi. Each one of my posts will have two new gripes in it. And two pros. Just to balance things out.

To celebrate the kicking off of this thread, I will post 5 gripes.

All of these are being made as I play an undead rogue.

Pros:
1. I can have liberty spikes as an undead.
2. I can run the game on max at 1280x1024.

Gripes:
1. Liberty spikes is ALL the character creation has going for it. Otherwise I feel like I'm customizing peons in WCIII.
2. Too bad it still looks like shit at 1280x1024. Shit as in, could have been out 4 years ago.

Bonus Gripes!
1. You don't give me a skill at level 2? Die of syphilis, idiots.
2. ANIMATE ALL MY SKILLS. I WILL NOT PLAY WHEN I PUSH A BUTTON AND NUMBERS APPEAR. To set the record straight, 2 of my 4 skills were animated. But really crappy-style. Blizzard has no excuse whatsoever.
3. BITTORRENT. Another game that shall remain nameless took less than 2 hours to download. It was 5 gigs. Blizzard, eat me.

Edit: 2fer1.

Pros:
1. Did I mention I can play as undead.
2. Loot seems very Diablo-like. I like that. Too bad I can buy Guild Wars to get that + a better/freepermonth game.

Cons:
1. McFlyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy, is anybody home? If you are going to record voices, don't do little greeting generic ones. Go full bore.
2. It's Everquest 1, you lying fuckers.

[kaid]

Which skills were not animating schild? Just curious as I played a rogue to level 20 in stress test and all of my abilities that were active had animations. Mind you some of them were pretty darn minimal but they all did animate.

As far as graphics everybody I talk to is in one of two camps they either really like them or they really hate them. With the style they went for I doubt there is any middle ground.  It was designed to make you feel like you were in Warcraft 3 and for that they reached their target well.

My big gripe in WoW is their spell art is really lack luster. For as cartoony as the game is I am shocked that most of their spell effects are so minimalist. This is even more odd due to the simplicity of the models the game runs hella fast on every system I have seen it on so I do not see why they would not spend some cycles on really impressive spell effects.

I have seen eq2 in person. There are newbie spells that make you go OOOOO PRETTY!. I have not seen any spell yet in WoW that was any better than bare bones acceptable.


Kaid

[Shockeye]

Rules: Everyone gets 1 reply to each post. ONE. There will be no arguing Except by me. I can ban you. Don't be a fanboi.

And you wonder why it took so long for you to get into the beta.

Hmm.. I used my one post for such a throwaway comment. So be it.

[schild]

It's not that I don't like the graphics. I liked them.

5 YEARS AGO.

Oh and I noticed some type of animation was attached. the weapons just go through shit and I can run through enemies, etc etc. It's crap. For the amount of money they spent - a better product should have come out of it.

Edit: You are allowed one response each time I post. Point is, I don't want fanbois - which there are a few, but not Hrose :) - posting 2-3 times on a page.

Also: Just so everyone knows - I have gripes about a few other games. A lot of them. I just can't talk about them. So if it looks like I'm hating on WoW, it's not because it's Blizzard, it's because it's shitty and I can say so.

[Liquidator]

It's not that I don't like the graphics. I liked them.

5 YEARS AGO.

Oh and I noticed some type of animation was attached. the weapons just go through shit and I can run through enemies, etc etc. It's crap. For the amount of money they spent - a better product should have come out of it.

Edit: You are allowed one response each time I post. Point is, I don't want fanbois - which there are a few, but not Hrose :) - posting 2-3 times on a page.

Also: Just so everyone knows - I have gripes about a few other games. A lot of them. I just can't talk about them. So if it looks like I'm hating on WoW, it's not because it's Blizzard, it's because it's shitty and I can say so.

You have no taste.

[Ardent]

Gripes:
1. Liberty spikes is ALL the character creation has going for it. Otherwise I feel like I'm customizing peons in WCIII.

I'm not going to argue with you there. This game is truly Attack of the Clones. After experiencing the character creation of City of Heroes, don't you think the other so-called "next generation" games that haven't been released yet should be embarassed? Especially WoW and [5 gig nameless]?

2. Too bad it still looks like shit at 1280x1024. Shit as in, could have been out 4 years ago.

Gah! Curses! I want to disagree with you, but you keep bringing up legitimate gripes! Why can't you just be a kiddie whiner with no sense of grammar, like on the WoW boards?

1. You don't give me a skill at level 2? Die of syphilis, idiots.

Dude ... getting to level 4 takes about 15 minutes. Patience, young padawan.

2. ANIMATE ALL MY SKILLS. I WILL NOT PLAY WHEN I PUSH A BUTTON AND NUMBERS APPEAR. To set the record straight, 2 of my 4 skills were animated. But really crappy-style. Blizzard has no excuse whatsoever.

Well, the problem I see here is many of the rogue skills are very fast. That's the whole point of being a rogue. You're a stabby-stabby-quick-quick guy, so not every move can be animated or else you'll look like a Wang Chung video. The big moves, like eviscerate, are animated nicely.

3. BITTORRENT. Another game that shall remain nameless took less than 2 hours to download. It was 5 gigs. Blizzard, eat me.

Yep. BT is still suckage. Would you believe me if I told you this last patch was actually an improvement?

[El Gallo]

I am pretty shocked that someone who has repeatedly and publically committed himself to WoW's suckage long before he ever played the game has written a negative review of it after playing it briefly.  Shocked I say.  Anyone have that smiley with the monocle popping out of its eye handy?  Because that's how shocked I am.

5 out of the 7 comments are pure eyecandy whines, to be expected from someone who has been humping EQ2's leg for months, 1 legitimate complaint about the beta distribution method, and 1 complaint that is, uh, utterly trivial.

Now, WoW has a lot of problems, but this review is a snoozer.

[schild]

Dude ... getting to level 4 takes about 15 minutes. Patience, young padawan.

Why get levels if I get nothing? I WANT STUFFS. I PAY FOR STUFFS. GIVE ME STUFFS.

Well, the problem I see here is many of the rogue skills are very fast. That's the whole point of being a rogue. You're a stabby-stabby-quick-quick guy, so not every move can be animated or else you'll look like a Wang Chung video. The big moves, like eviscerate, are animated nicely.

 
What's wrong with a Wang Chung Video? Seriously though, they are just cutting corners. I want elaborate swashbucklish animations. I'm a freaking rogue. I should be the lord of the undead....dance. Seriously. I just don't see where all the money went.

Yep. BT is still suckage. Would you believe me if I told you this last patch was actually an improvement?

No.

[schild]

I am pretty shocked that someone who has repeatedly and publically committed himself to WoW's suckage long before he ever played the game has written a negative review of it after playing it briefly.  Shocked I say.  Anyone have that smiley with the monocle popping out of its eye handy?  Because that's how shocked I am.

5 out of the 7 comments are pure eyecandy whines, to be expected from someone who has been humping EQ2's leg for months, 1 legitimate complaint about the beta distribution method, and 1 complaint that is, uh, utterly trivial.

I can't talk about EQ2.

I never said it was a review.

Blizzard is the company without the NDA.

What the hell do you want? Information you can't find somewhere else?

Think man, think.

I'm in a 6 month old beta. Shit isn't done. What's the excuse? It's an MMORPG? Mediocrity is ok? Meh.

[schild]

There are many gameplay aspects I'd like to compare to two other games. But I'm not at liberty to do such a thing. The gripes until then will be shallow.

That said.

WoW is EQLive. If I wanted to play EQLive, I'd go buy the new expansion, kthx.

[MrHat]

It is a 6-month old beta.

There have been several games with 6-month old betas.  They were all crap at this point.  WoW is releasable.

I don't know where I was going with that.  Fucking schild posted 3 times in a row instead of editing his original and now I'm all confused.

[Shockeye]

I think what schild is trying to say is that the beta has been going on long enough and enough money has been spent that some things should be taken care of already. In other words, WoW is a giant development sink for time and money without enough to show for it. If schild were an investor he would be very pissed.

I wish I had gotten into the beta but I'm probably the wrong person to give an account to. I would be evaluating the game based on the beta and not really "testing" per se. In the end I'd be satisfied with my time spent in WoW by release and would not need to buy it. Of course, the more I hear about WoW due to no NDA, more the chance I will not buy it.

[schild]

WoW is releasable.

No, it's not. Not when you have problems like the below on a good system (p4 2.8ghz, 1GB DDR333, FX5200 Ultra):



I think that map is supposed to go in that circle. And those words, yea, perhaps they were supposed to go over the buttons.

[Rasix]

Never had that problem. Suck to be you.

[schild]

Never had that problem. Suck to be you.

I should point out. It's not gamebreaking. It's just unacceptable at this stage in development.

Let's make this clear though:

Blizzard could pee in a box and people would buy it.

Blizzard pees in a box and people buy it.

I have bought every Blizzard/BNorth product released, some up to 4 times (ahem, diablo II).

Azaroth is not interesting enough for an MMOG.

If I don't bash it who will? The only other company that gets such unanimous knobgobbling from everyone around is Nintendo and their first party games.

The "It Must be Good Because Blizzard Made it" does not apply to WoW.

[plangent]

My only major gripe is that I can't get into the beta.

Schild, rather than have you suffer playing a game which is so utterly incapable of gratifying your exquisite tastes I will graciously take your beta account for you.  No need to thank me, you can PM me your login and password.

[Rasix]

The "It Must be Good Because Blizzard Made it" does not apply to WoW.

Personally I don't think it ever applies.  Besides Diablo and Warcraft II, all of their products to me have been somewhat of a disappointment.

I think it's good for what I outlined in it's my stress test review.  Well, good enough.  

As for the other game, I'm just not convinced yet that:

a) I'll be able to run the fucker as fluidly as WoW.  And WoW's graphics bother me not.

b) With all that I'm reading, EQ2 just won't meet my needs. It won't go far enough with solo/casual  support (special mobs on dungeon fringes doesn't count).

I'd love to actually get in the EQ2 beta and be proven wrong. I think I forgot to sign up, so that could be a problem.  I think Norath is a much better setting than the War 3 world and would love to be convinced that my time spent in it would be worthwhile.

What are your impressions on the combat, quests and stuff other than eye candy?

[schild]

Combat feels like horizons. Attacks to match up with the enemies. There are timers for related skills.

Quests? Same as everything else. Choice is neat, but uhm, that never mattered to me anyway.

I haven't seen any new eye candy that I didn't already see in Warcraft III.

I think it all comes down to - Blizzard aimed low and hit it's mark. That doesn't impress me. Far too much money spent on a refined 1st generation MMOG.

[schild]

Warcraft III:
http://www.frictionlessinsight.com/PC_Previews/WarcraftIII/WarcraftIIIB.jpg

WoW:
http://www.miateam.de/wow/bilder/new2.jpg

See what I mean by aimed low? At least you could "Win" the first one.

[Alluvian]

NDA Rasix.  Can't compare WoW and EQ2 now, as much as I would love to.  For me there is very little comparison.  But I can't discuss it.

WoW didn't impress me.  Nothing in the world made me think "Holy shit, that's cool".  Some other nameless game has done that a lot so far.  But that other nameless game is not only under an NDA, it is also a lot earlier in their beta phase, and has it's own problems at the moment.

Bottom line is I am not considering buying WoW.  Not even crossing my mind in a dream anymore.  I won't even be back for the open beta.

[Ardent]

Combat feels like horizons.

I strongly disagree. I only played the Horizons beta for a week, so I had to quit before opening up my wrists, but WoW combat is far superior. You are given tons of options for combat strategy, especially for the melee and hybrid classes. Will any sane person tell me that combat with a WoW shaman or warrior or rogue (or even druid) is WORSE than Horizons?? Please.

As for that fucked up screenshot you posted above, I can't explain that one. I've been in WoW beta since January and I've never seen that before.

Can't compare WoW and EQ2 now, as much as I would love to.

Me too. Insert poopy-sad-face emoticon.

[Merusk]

Some of us liked EQlive's gameplay and just hated the timesinks. That's always been the crowd I've seen Bliz as going after. Them and the crowd that enjoy raiding and guild mechanics.  EQ2 is targeting the old folks who played EQ and might have enjoyed it, but left for various gripes. Lack of soloability, inability to get a group and timesinks being the biggest I've heard them addressing.

You guys are the first I've heard of actually enjoying EQ2.  You know as well as I do that if an opion of the game sucks people break the NDA without a care.  Mainly because they think their anonimity on the internet will protect them from litigation.  I've heard from others in the beta that it's not worth the time.  I'll still check it out when I get my invite, but It's got a lot of ground to make up.  Eyecandy doesn't impress me much, gameplay and fun do.  If the grind is anything like EQlive I'll give it a pass without a second thought.  I'm done with the pointless treadmills.

As for the customization.  No, WOW doesn't have as much as EQ2, but then EQ2 doesn't have as much as CoH, which has far lower system specs. Shifting my eyes around and moving my ears on my head don't compare to looking absolutly fucking different from another character.  That said I fully expect EQ2 to suffer from the same complaints as WoW, EQlive and SWG.  "At high levels, everyone looks alike! WTF!?" That's what happens when you've got looks based on equipment (All of those) rather than personal tastes, like CoH.

People also keep defending EQ2 with "It's a lot earlier in it's beta stage."  No, it's not. It's at the same beta stage, they just have less time under their belt and got there a lot faster.  Part of that is their experienced team. Part of that is SOE at least can turn things around fast when they have to.  It also means they rush shit out the door, but we've all bitched about that aspect of SOE for years.

  Bliz has a glacial pace that I think will hurt them come live.  They've started speeding up, but they'll never match SOE's frenzied pace of 2-3 patches a week. Not if they want to maintain their reputation with their fanbase.  (Hell it's already taken a small hit just on rumors that the game will be live in November.)

"Just put it out there and see if it fucking works" is SOE's motto.  Yes, you pay to beta test SOE patches.  They know you'll still keep paying, and it's to their advantage to use that.  I kind of admire them for it, really, because they play their playerbase for the tools they are.  Advantage of being run by suits who game rather than gamers who are suits.

WoW and EQ2 both say they will release this year. I know they'll both do it, if only out of fear that if they don't the other guy will. My summation is, I expect WOW to be the winner in the short-term, but over the long-term EQ2 might just win out because of their understanding of MMOs.

As for that fucked up screenshot you posted above, I can't explain that one. I've been in WoW beta since January and I've never seen that before.

There's been a few threads about it on the WOW forums.  Something about certain cards, drivers & this latest patch if I remember right.  I was drinking at the time so I'm probably not.

[Riggswolfe]

I would reply to this but I'm unimpressed with these gripes. They all boil down to "Wahhhh! I want shiney!". Give me gameplay gripes and I'll consider it worth my time. But I have to second the other poster who said it's no surprise Schild is bitching and slamming WoW since he did that well before he was ever in Beta. At this point, if Schild was a paid journalist I'd suspect him of taking money from SOE.

I'll come back to this thread when I see something substantive to talk about.

[schild]

Give me gameplay gripes and I'll consider it worth my time.

I'll come back to this thread when I see something substantive to talk about.

If I wanted to play Everquest 1. I'd get the new expansion. WoW offers nussing except an uninteresting world and different graphics. If that's all it takes to throw your hair back, then, great. :) Have fun with it. Otherwise, I'll be looking elsewhere.

I will probably play through the mid-high game in the coming months to give full impressions.

[Pig Destroyer]

Give me gameplay gripes and I'll consider it worth my time.

I'll come back to this thread when I see something substantive to talk about.

If I wanted to play Everquest 1. I'd get the new expansion. WoW offers nussing except an uninteresting world and different graphics. If that's all it takes to throw your hair back, then, great. :) Have fun with it. Otherwise, I'll be looking elsewhere.

I will probably play through the mid-high game in the coming months to give full impressions.

Sounds like all your gripes are graphics related, if that's the best you can do, then I think Blizzard did ok.

To me, it seemed much more a clone of DAoC than of Everquest, of course there are elements of both.  As well as elements of other games.  

Personally, I'll be playing for what will hopefully be a full PvP community.  I cannot wait to kill the b.net fucktards in droves.

EDIT:  I find it ironic that you complain about fanbois, when you are, in fact, the biggest Guildwars fanboi on the planet.

[schild]

EDIT:  I find it ironic that you complain about fanbois, when you are, in fact, the biggest Guildwars fanboi on the planet.

Correction. I'm a huge single player Diablo I/II Fanboi who *thinks* Guildwars will be the closest thing to it online.

I could be wrong.

[Fabricated]

I'll do a write up as soon as I get done dealing with this fucking wedding (not mine, my brother's), but here's a summary of my impressions:

Good:
-For the first 10 levels or so there was just one quest after another. I barely felt the grind besides a few problems I'll mention in a bit.

-Excellent graphics engine IMO. Ran like butter with lots of people, all options max, at 1280x960.

-I like the graphical presentation myself. Simplistic, but colorful.

-I dig the interface and the overall presentation. Skills are easy to recognise, and the 2d art doesn't look like a rejected spelljammer card like most MMORPGS.

-Diablo-ish equipment.

-Friendly atmosphere, at least in the stress test. I was amazingly at no shortage of helpful people. I got buffs, free wizard generated food, and help on quests several times.

-Quest rewards actually don't suck. You get decent amounts of cash/equipment for your level as you progress. This is unusual to me since  I used to play FF11, where your reward for FedExing something across the field of level 500 Goblin Rapists was 5 gold and a piece of lint.

-The human capital city is fucking huge and cool looking.

-Even low level monsters drop loot that doesn't suck!

Bad:

-Lots of renamed monsters with color swaps. Nothing unusual for MMORPGS, but it's getting old.

-Lots of "Bop X monster" and "Collect X drops from Y monster" quests, and most of these have completely fucked monster distribution. (i.e. I need to kill kobold WORKERS for X item, but only 2 of those fucking things spawn every 15 minutes, whereas there are Kobold LABORERS everywhere that don't give me said item)

-That smooth progression of quests ground to the screeching halt after I got to level 10 and ran out of quests in the starting forest zone. I then walked out into a very pretty field area that my last quest pointed me at, to be greeted by monsters 3+ levels above me. BAH.

-Nothing here hasn't been done before. Nothing.

-Even on servers without mandatory PVP, players from another alliance can kill quest NPCs. Fucking weak.

[jpark]

Schild I don't find your gripes at the start of this thread compelling for me about WoW.  Perhaps you may find these gripes more appealing:

1.  Priest.  Warrior.  Do these key classes display improved gameplay over EQ?
No.

2.  Is there a compelling reason to adopt tradeskills in WoW with the belief they will not be an economic disappointment as they were in EQ?  
No.

3.  Is there a sense of avatar / skill tree identity in the game, unlike EQ, but like SB Or Coh?
No.

There is a great deal I like about WoW - I am a supporter currently.  But the above are disappointments for me so far.

WoW appears to have delivered on solo content, fast gameplay pace, an immersive atmosphere, intriguing pvp mechanics and a much improved quest system.

[Merusk]

-Lots of "Bop X monster" and "Collect X drops from Y monster" quests, and most of these have completely fucked monster distribution. (i.e. I need to kill kobold WORKERS for X item, but only 2 of those fucking things spawn every 15 minutes, whereas there are Kobold LABORERS everywhere that don't give me said item)

You're looking in the wrong place.  They spawn in 2 places, the camp and at the entrance of the mine. The mine has 6 spawns that spawn about every 3 mins. Or at least did during the stress test.  

Just make sure to start up a group, folks seem to think KSing these from each other and getting one every 20 mins is preferable to grouping and getting credit for each spawn.

-That smooth progression of quests ground to the screeching halt after I got to level 10 and ran out of quests in the starting forest zone. I then walked out into a very pretty field area that my last quest pointed me at, to be greeted by monsters 3+ levels above me. BAH.

I had the same problem.  What you're *supposed* to do if you're looking to continue solo, is head off to one of the other races' zone for that level.  I was in Darkshore and hit a wall at 10 until I took the boat/ griffon to westfall.  The other alternative is to group up and get the extra XP for killing tougher monsters plus the quest XP. This needs to be better communicated and is one of the sticking points.

[Liquidator]

WoW is releasable.

No, it's not. Not when you have problems like the below on a good system (p4 2.8ghz, 1GB DDR333, FX5200 Ultra):


I think that map is supposed to go in that circle. And those words, yea, perhaps they were supposed to go over the buttons.

That is a bug that was introduced in the latest patch, and it only shows itself when you're running in non 4:3 resolutions, i.e. 1280x1024 and whatever else there is.  You can fix it by editing your config.wtf file and adding the line SET Widescreen "0".

If World of Warcraft were to be released today, I believe it would be in better shape than any other MMO that has launched to date - by far.

[schild]

If World of Warcraft were to be released today, I believe it would be in better shape than any other MMO that has launched to date - by far.

City of Heroes. Of course, Cryptic aimed even lower than Blizzard in terms of depth.

[Liquidator]

If World of Warcraft were to be released today, I believe it would be in better shape than any other MMO that has launched to date - by far.

City of Heroes. Of course, Cryptic aimed even lower than Blizzard in terms of depth.

I don't think it's even close.  From my limited experience with the WoW stress test and the last two days in the closed beta, it is far more polished in every aspect save for character creation.  I still don't understand why everyone has a friggin hard on for CoH character creation.  OMG you look different from everyone else but you all have the same powers!  WTF?

[schild]

If World of Warcraft were to be released today, I believe it would be in better shape than any other MMO that has launched to date - by far.

City of Heroes. Of course, Cryptic aimed even lower than Blizzard in terms of depth.

I don't think it's even close.  From my limited experience with the WoW stress test and the last two days in the closed beta, it is far more polished in every aspect save for character creation.  I still don't understand why everyone has a friggin hard on for CoH character creation.  OMG you look different from everyone else but you all have the same powers!  WTF?

Dude, did you even read what I just said? CoH was bland, but completely releasable. Nearly bugfree. Why do people have a hardon for character creation in Coh though? Because it's freaking beautiful, that's why. Yes, same powers, but beautiful character creation. Now if the man in the ivory tower would just say 'capes for all,' things would be better.

[Sky]

I should be the lord of the undead

Oh man, don't give me EQ flashbacks about being a manabitch. Or like the (underrated) Sacrifice...a manawhore! I always got a kick about being followed around by my pack of manawhores...

I still don't understand why everyone has a friggin hard on for CoH character creation.

Really? You don't understand why humans want to individualize themselves? The holy grail of mmorpgs is to have each player's character look unique. CoH did more for that than any game so far, by a pretty decent margin, too (with a nod to SWG for being able to make my dancer, Weezy Jefferson)

[personman]

-Quest rewards actually don't suck. You get decent amounts of cash/equipment for your level as you progress. This is unusual to me since  I used to play FF11, where your reward for FedExing something across the field of level 500 Goblin Rapists was 5 gold and a piece of lint.

Hey don't knock lint...

"Fluff is interesting stuff: a deadly poison on Bodega Minor, the diet staple of Frazelon V, the unit of currency on the moons of the Blurfoid System, and the major crop of the laundry supplies planet, Blastus III. One ancient legend claims that four pieces of fluff lie scattered around the Galaxy: each forming one quarter of the seedling of a tree with amazing properties, the sole survivor of the tropical planet Fuzzbol (Footnote 8). The ultimate source of fluff is still a mystery, with the scientific community divided between the Big Lint Bang theory and the White Lint Hole theory. (Footnote 8, should you care to check, informs you that it's not much of a legend really.) "