White Wolf MMoG?

[Bunk]

Apparently White Wolf is venturing in to the MMoG market: http://www.white-wolf.com/worldofdarkness/index.php?articleid=746

Anyone heard or know anything about it? Being a fan of the video games and a long time player of the CCG, I am at least a little interested.

[Mrbloodworth]

Apparently White Wolf is venturing in to the MMoG market: http://www.white-wolf.com/worldofdarkness/index.php?articleid=746

Anyone heard or know anything about it? Being a fan of the video games and a long time player of the CCG, I am at least a little interested.

White wolf + CCP. I don't think anything but "We are making one" has been released...like...at all.

[Yegolev]

We figured this out when CCP bought WW, and then CCP said they were working on avatars for EVE, which meant they were prototyping for something that needed avatars, such as a WW MOG.  I'd bet actual money on it happening.

[Kitsune]

Your skill in Cutting Yourself While Reading Your Bad Poetry And Sobbing has increased! [10]

[Evildrider]

Hmm.. Vampire the Masquerade MMO?  Could be interesting, at least it won't be a fantasy setting.

[Morat20]

Your skill in Cutting Yourself While Reading Your Bad Poetry And Sobbing has increased! [10]

My WoD games never went like that. They were a bit heavier on political intrigue, and THEN the shocking acts of senseless violence.

Mage games just involved explosions.

[Evildrider]

Your skill in Cutting Yourself While Reading Your Bad Poetry And Sobbing has increased! [10]

My WoD games never went like that. They were a bit heavier on political intrigue, and THEN the shocking acts of senseless violence.

Mage games just involved explosions.

Haha yeah.. our Vampire games mainly was lots of killing and backstabbing trying to take over a city.  Our Mage games mainly came down to.. hmm what can I get away with without screwing myself.

[Falwell]

Yep, CCP confirmed that it is indeed World of Darkness back in ....March I believe it was? They also said they can't say shit about it simply because they haven't made anything for it yet. 4 -5 years out minimum.

Sources:

http://tentonhammer.com/node/8241 (Ten Ton Hammer release)

http://www.ccpgames.com/jobs.aspx (CCP job listing. Looks like it's being put together mainly in the Atlanta shop.)


Emo gothic "The World Fucking Hates Me" types aside, I'm seriously pumped for this one. If CCP can take the political environment of EvE and put it in a modern horror setting, sign me the hell up.

[Evildrider]

I'll just be happy for a decent non-fantasy setting MMO.

[kaid]

A good dark future/horror kind of MMO could be very good and say what you want about the emo's the story behind the world of darkness is pretty interesting and I think it would work well for a MMO. Curious if it would be vampires only or would they allow were as well.

[Yegolev]

Werewolves are an expansion.  Always.

[Morat20]

Haha yeah.. our Vampire games mainly was lots of killing and backstabbing trying to take over a city.  Our Mage games mainly came down to.. hmm what can I get away with without screwing myself.

Haven't tried the new versions, but old school Mage -- the way our Mage GM handled paradox, it was like a game of hot potato. Everyone tossing discreet spells and hoping not to be the poor schmuck who ended up with an assload of "Sorry, that's just one coincidence too many to believe. PARADOX!".

Or fireballs.

[WayAbvPar]

Hopefully they will come up with an economic system that doesn't skull fuck the newer players.

[Kail]

Hopefully they will come up with an economic system that doesn't skull fuck the newer players.

I always thought that was kind of the point of Vampire.  The newbies getting pushed around by the elders with 900 years worth of accumulated power.  Ventrue basically sucking up to the vets in the hope that they'll get some table scraps.  The Brujah as the WoD equivalent of Goonfleet, taking their four thousand n00b frigates up against the guys at the top of the food chain, just because they can.  The Sabbat saying "Screw this, I'm going to start my own club, and it'll be cool vampires only."  The Malkavians off in the distance somewhere gumming cinderblocks and trying to mind control potatoes.

[angry.bob]

Hopefully they will come up with an economic system that doesn't skull fuck the newer players.

Hopefully they can not play the game themselves. They could do incredibly interesting things with this that revolve around interplayer politics and whatnot  for the bulk of the game instead of killing a billion rats, but instead I'm sure they're going to play it themselves and completely ruin the whole thing by doing the same exact stuff they did and are still doing in EVE.

[angry.bob]

I always thought that was kind of the point of Vampire.  The newbies getting pushed around by the elders with 900 years worth of accumulated power.  Ventrue basically sucking up to the vets in the hope that they'll get some table scraps.  The Brujah as the WoD equivalent of Goonfleet, taking their four thousand n00b frigates up against the guys at the top of the food chain, just because they can.  The Sabbat saying "Screw this, I'm going to start my own club, and it'll be cool vampires only."  The Malkavians off in the distance somewhere gumming cinderblocks and trying to mind control potatoes.

You just perfectly described the vampire community in Second Life. Except there's no actual fighting.

[Typhon]

You'll just control a car, boat or airplane at first.  It'll be a couple years before they patch in player characters.

[Evildrider]

Haha yeah.. our Vampire games mainly was lots of killing and backstabbing trying to take over a city.  Our Mage games mainly came down to.. hmm what can I get away with without screwing myself.

Haven't tried the new versions, but old school Mage -- the way our Mage GM handled paradox, it was like a game of hot potato. Everyone tossing discreet spells and hoping not to be the poor schmuck who ended up with an assload of "Sorry, that's just one coincidence too many to believe. PARADOX!".

Or fireballs.

I haven't played the new version either.. actually I didn't even try the revised version.  My group doesn't get together too often now that we are older, and it's harder to get time to learn new systems.  Hell, we still play 2nd. edition D&D.

[Roac]

I always thought that was kind of the point of Vampire.  The newbies getting pushed around by the elders with 900 years worth of accumulated power.  Ventrue basically sucking up to the vets in the hope that they'll get some table scraps.  The Brujah as the WoD equivalent of Goonfleet, taking their four thousand n00b frigates up against the guys at the top of the food chain, just because they can.  The Sabbat saying "Screw this, I'm going to start my own club, and it'll be cool vampires only."  The Malkavians off in the distance somewhere gumming cinderblocks and trying to mind control potatoes.

That's the old version.  Incase you missed it, WW decided to have Gehenna descend onto the world, by cannon.  The world ended.  Which is sad, because I really liked Ravnos.

They've made a new ver that's very different.  Generation doesn't mean anything; instead they have a concept called Blood Potency.  Mechanics for feeding/spending blood is about the same, but instead of getting daddy-1 points in it you start out with 1 dot in it.  Always, for any new vampire, you get 1 dot there (buy more at creation!).  It increases via xp or naturally over time (decades or centuries per point).  It also effects what you can feed on; after a couple dots you gain no blood from animals, and after your 6th dot none from humans.  That tends to cause trouble, as you can now only feed on vampires who you can also become blood bound to.  The way out is to go into torpor, which causes your blood potency to drop over time (decades/centuries).

Oh, and there are only 5 clans now.  Ventrue (but now crazy), Gangrel, Daeva (Toreador remake), Mekhet (Lasombra remake), Nosferatu.  No Camarilla/Sabbat; there's 5 covenants now, but they're all more or less at peace.  They did throw in VII, which is sorta like the Sabbat, and Belial's Brood which is Baali remake.

[Simond]

NewWoD sucks*, though.

*obligatory vampire joke here

[Nevermore]

If it ends up playing like Vampire: Bloodlines Online, it'll be a lot of fun.  That game did a great job in capturing the WoD, especially if you played a Malkavian.  They'll probably use the new rebooted WoD setting though, which kind of sucks.

Edit: bah, took too long to reply.

[Roac]

If it ends up playing like Vampire: Bloodlines Online, it'll be a lot of fun.  That game did a great job in capturing the WoD, especially if you played a Malkavian.  They'll probably use the new rebooted WoD setting though, which kind of sucks.

My guess is that any VtM game will heavily revolve around running missions in order to score money and standing.  The main theme is more or less that of an undead soap opera.  Take Eve's mission system, give it some serious polish, and that's probably what will comprise a lot of anything VtM online.

[Mrbloodworth]

I always thought that was kind of the point of Vampire.  The newbies getting pushed around by the elders with 900 years worth of accumulated power.  Ventrue basically sucking up to the vets in the hope that they'll get some table scraps.  The Brujah as the WoD equivalent of Goonfleet, taking their four thousand n00b frigates up against the guys at the top of the food chain, just because they can.  The Sabbat saying "Screw this, I'm going to start my own club, and it'll be cool vampires only."  The Malkavians off in the distance somewhere gumming cinderblocks and trying to mind control potatoes.

That's the old version.  Incase you missed it, WW decided to have Gehenna descend onto the world, by cannon.  The world ended.  Which is sad, because I really liked Ravnos.

They've made a new ver that's very different.  Generation doesn't mean anything; instead they have a concept called Blood Potency.  Mechanics for feeding/spending blood is about the same, but instead of getting daddy-1 points in it you start out with 1 dot in it.  Always, for any new vampire, you get 1 dot there (buy more at creation!).  It increases via xp or naturally over time (decades or centuries per point).  It also effects what you can feed on; after a couple dots you gain no blood from animals, and after your 6th dot none from humans.  That tends to cause trouble, as you can now only feed on vampires who you can also become blood bound to.  The way out is to go into torpor, which causes your blood potency to drop over time (decades/centuries).

Oh, and there are only 5 clans now.  Ventrue (but now crazy), Gangrel, Daeva (Toreador remake), Mekhet (Lasombra remake), Nosferatu.  No Camarilla/Sabbat; there's 5 covenants now, but they're all more or less at peace.  They did throw in VII, which is sorta like the Sabbat, and Belial's Brood which is Baali remake.

That is a change from the original.

But this game does bring up an interisting topic, could the can of worms known as "players know numbers for stats" be closed with the Dot system? I think so, and i loved it. I know the mini-maxers and mathematicians will be upset, but i hope i don't see a % # or anything any where in the game, just dots and rolls.

It was ok for (PnP) DnD, because you had to do your own math, but i always thought it was a mistake to give the player that info... Its unnecessary.

[HaemishM]

No Malkavians? What the fuck? I didn't play one, but they added a helluva good dimension to that setting.

[Nevermore]

The new system has 'subclasses'.  The new Malkavians are a bloodline that falls under the Ventrue, iirc.

[HaemishM]

Blearg.

[Roac]

Blearg.

Yeah.  Ventrue are crazy this go round - power mad in every sense.  The Malkavian bloodline is even MORE crazy, but the bloodline itself is fairly rare.  Bloodlines are, by the way, relatively easy to create; any vampire with enough blood potency can do it, and anyone with slightly less potency can join an existing line (regardless of your sire).  The only catch is that bloodlines are bound to clan, so to be a Malk you gotta be a Ventrue.  It fits, you just have to get the 'new' Ventrue, since the nature of the clan is different from what it was.

[Falwell]

I'll fully admit that I've never played NWoD but I did play quite a bit of the old school. From what I have read from my ill gotten source books, NWoD is focusing more on mystery and suspense rather than conflict. Not sure I care for the change.

[Modern Angel]

oWoD is a better world, nWoD is a better gaem. The rules are tight, streamlined and with the exception of the new Changeling so bland and boring I wouldn't dream of running them. And I guarantee the game will be nWoD.

The essential problem with the MMO is going to be the same one you ran into with the various MUSHes which populated the web during WoD's heyday: a city or area doesn't have 100 vampires, 50 lycanthropes and 50 mages with a sprinkling of whatever furry/otherkin garbage people could come up with. A city filled with vampires is City of Heroes, not World of Darkness.

[UnSub]

I've got friends who really like the new Werewolf game, while I think the Promethean idea is gold. But from what I've read, Vampires have fallen a long way from where they were under the old rules.

[Roac]

I've got friends who really like the new Werewolf game, while I think the Promethean idea is gold. But from what I've read, Vampires have fallen a long way from where they were under the old rules.

The rules are much better than what they were.  Knocking the clans from 13 to 5 didn't really matter except for people who were attached to the old set.  You can bloodline anything so you can recreate whatever you want.  Getting rid of the Cam/Sab nonsense was good. 

Main downside as I see it (aside from loss of old favs) is that many of the discis have been heavily scaled back.  Granted, old VtM had obscene disci strength at 5 dots, but quite a few of them aren't even cool anymore.  Play with illusions?  Badass.  Fleshcrafting?  Badass.  Beating you to death with your own shadow?  Badass.  All of that is gone now though.

[Riggswolfe]

No Malkavians? What the fuck? I didn't play one, but they added a helluva good dimension to that setting.

I hated Malkavians usually because alot of people just used it as an excuse to play silly and over the top. Jack Nicholson joker. The best Malkavian I ever saw was one that none of us knew was a Malkavian until the game was over. We all thought he was a ventrue and he even became prince of the city. Turned out he was more like Hannibal Lector than the typical "Hey look, my navel hair is trying to send me a message" that I always saw people play Malkavians like.

[bhodi]

What's changed with WoD? Any link where I can get a current history lesson, what happened between masquerade and requiem? I haven't looked at the new source book, and don't have anyone to play with, but at least I find the story entertaining. It seems almost as if they started a new story, alternate-timeline type stuff and didn't make any effort to bridge the two.

[Roac]

What's changed with WoD? Any link where I can get a current history lesson, what happened between masquerade and requiem? I haven't looked at the new source book, and don't have anyone to play with, but at least I find the story entertaining. It seems almost as if they started a new story, alternate-timeline type stuff and didn't make any effort to bridge the two.

What actually happened is a guy named Justin Achilli came on board and decided he wanted to wipe the slate clean.  He was fairly vocal about disliking a lot of the setup for old VtM and how he wanted to cut down to just a handful of clans.  All of that was years ago.  He got his wish.

On the story front, nWoD has nothing to do with the old, except maybe for some recycled concepts.  The myth of Caine is gone entirely, Golconda is all but gone, the clans have been entirely reworked, etc.  Camarilla exists, but it's a pseudo-mythical vampire utopia that was going on during ancient Rome, and fell apart for an unknown reason.  No one knows what vampire history was before that, and there is no creation myth (like Caine).  The nature of torpor is radically different, because it drops your blood potency but also gives you really bad nightmares and fucks up your memory, so even a 2,000 year old vampire can't recall with any reliability what went on in Rome.  He may not even be certain that he's really 2,000 years old.  You're better off going in with the expectation that it's not the same story, at all.  It's not Ann Rice vampire vs. Bram Stoker vampire difference, but not far from it. 

On the game front, the overall concept is pretty similar.  You struggle with your dwindling humanity, with older and more powerful vampires who couldn't care less if you were dusted, with political structures that would grind you down.  Very story intensive, as the old game was. 

By the way, I never read the old Mage rules, but the new rules are pretty sweet.  I love the whole concept of "my powers do whatever I can imagine".  Doesn't translate into a game mechanic well though, unfortunately.

[bhodi]

Ah. New story entirely, I guess they never dealt with the apocalypse and stuff.

Old mage rules were like that too. I'll take a look at the new system. I always liked mage more than VtM anyway.

Wait, what? Entirely different game, too. Fuck. I LIKED the idea of the technocracy versus traditions and the fight for a global belief system and paradigm battles. It was totally and completely human and a great counterpoint to world of darkness where every mystical thing under the sun (or moon) was fighting for world domination.