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Author Topic: War  (Read 1685144 times)
setar
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Posts: 329


Reply #3780 on: February 04, 2009, 09:37:57 PM

I apologize, but I have to: what happened to 'lie with dogs, get fleas' and 'if you cannot beat them in game beat them out of game' all of a sudden :) ?


EVE - Yalson [BDCI] [-A-]
sanctuary
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Reply #3781 on: February 04, 2009, 09:42:16 PM

Who is IGNE?
Phildo
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Reply #3782 on: February 04, 2009, 09:54:38 PM

IGNE is a member corp in Goonswarm.

Setar: this was accomplished entirely through in-game espionage.  Nothing out-of-game that we're currently aware of.
setar
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Posts: 329


Reply #3783 on: February 04, 2009, 09:57:35 PM

Fair enough, although that's the same claim that was made for DG- (and here the claim is that Hargooth's account was hacked into). It's a big one, no dount. Even _if_ not half of BOB's corp decide to just forget about the whole Eve thing and form a new alliance right away all jammers and JB will be down for one month, their POS need to be reconfigured, all supercaps in built are aborted, all stations are conquerable.

It's the ultimate heist. My guess is that it's all over in a few weeks, with BOB no longer being around as I do not see CCP touching this with a ten-foot pole. I'd rather fought it out in game, but that's not how EVE works these days, unfortunately.

Edit: Found posts from Harg by now which would indicate it was him indeed. Can't think of any single event that would have a more severe impact to any alliance. It means no NC or GS can ever complain about meta-gaming anymore, but it sure is bound to win this war rather decisively :)
« Last Edit: February 04, 2009, 10:03:54 PM by setar »

EVE - Yalson [BDCI] [-A-]
Thrawn
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Reply #3784 on: February 04, 2009, 10:06:25 PM

Everyone is very anxiously awaiting tonights downtime.  No one seems to be 100% sure the effects this will have on everything.

"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the Universe is that none of it has tried to contact us."
Fordel
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Posts: 8306


Reply #3785 on: February 04, 2009, 10:07:48 PM

So do we have any idea of the actual wealth that was stolen? BNC has been around for a long time and I understand they had significant industrial 'weight' to them.

While the actual number cost is probably moot compared to the fact all the Sovereignty is toast, it still makes a great sound bite (byte?)

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Phildo
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Reply #3786 on: February 04, 2009, 10:11:53 PM

Approximately 13 billion in liquid isk, 14 dreadnaughts and a ton of other subcaps/mods from BNC.
Fordel
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Reply #3787 on: February 04, 2009, 10:15:01 PM

That's a lot of Rifters  Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly?


Only 14 dread's though? I assume most of the capital fleet was actually personally owned by members then?

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
tmp
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POW! Right in the Kisser!


Reply #3788 on: February 04, 2009, 10:16:58 PM

Edit: Found posts from Harg by now which would indicate it was him indeed.
Well, posts made from supposedly compromised account in no way indicate who is actually posting Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly? Of course, it would take an extremely dumb person to post from hacked account so i'm inclined to believe this could be a real deal.
Sir T
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Reply #3789 on: February 04, 2009, 10:31:15 PM

Edit: Found posts from Harg by now which would indicate it was him indeed.
Well, posts made from supposedly compromised account in no way indicate who is actually posting Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly? Of course, it would take an extremely dumb person to post from hacked account so i'm inclined to believe this could be a real deal.

Hes flying on our fleet right now and chatting away to us in fleet. I invited him myself. Its him, no question.

And Mittani has screenshots of every step on this which he will give in case of petiitions.

I'm sorry but this is yet another someone in a long line of people that went fuck BOB.

http://www.massively.com/2009/02/04/rumor-band-of-brothers-breaks-apart-in-eve-goonswarm-responsib/

Quote
Rumor: Band of Brothers breaks apart in EVE, GoonSwarm responsible

by Colin Brennan Feb 4th 2009 at 10:50PM

Filed under: Sci-fi, EVE Online, News items, Rumors

One of the oldest and best known alliances has broken apart in EVE Online today. Band of Brothers (BoB) has disbanded, or been disbanded, under circumstances which have not fully yet come to light. Band of Brothers is well-known for their role in "The Great War" in EVE for their fierce opposition to GoonSwarm alliance and their allies over the years. Through that war they claimed such firsts as the first Titan ship kill through their conflict with Ascendant Frontier, and have been well-known amongst the media.

Current rumors suggest that this was a GoonSwarm infiltration, but as of this posting this is unconfirmed. Multiple sources suggest that a director of the alliance has defected to GoonSwarm, stealing billions worth of assets, and compromising the sovereignty that Band of Brothers had previously established.

Massively.com will keep you up to date as more information is known about this major EVE event.

(Thanks, Six Strangelove!)
« Last Edit: February 04, 2009, 10:36:05 PM by Sir T »

Hic sunt dracones.
tmp
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POW! Right in the Kisser!


Reply #3790 on: February 04, 2009, 10:41:36 PM

Hes flying on our fleet right now and chatting away to us in fleet. I invited him myself. Its him, no question.

And Mittani has screenshots of every step on this which he will give in case of petiitions.

I'm sorry but this is yet another someone in a long line of people that went fuck BOB.
Yeah, i've listened to that mp3 now too.... hearing the things available to a director i'm mostly amazed that they give this kind of unchecked control suitable for some 20-people WoW guild, in game where corporations can have hundreds and thousands of people, with assets that can take months and years to gather. It looks GS struck the gold, by having just the right sort of guy (by right i mean with this type of access) come to them?
Fordel
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Reply #3791 on: February 04, 2009, 10:52:49 PM

That would seem to be the case, yes. It didn't even dawn to them at first, just how much damage could be unleashed.


The issue with guild control, is eventually SOMEONE has to have the ability to check the boxes and set the standings and whatnot.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Samprimary
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Reply #3792 on: February 04, 2009, 10:57:00 PM

Brotherly love!
tmp
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Reply #3793 on: February 04, 2009, 10:59:49 PM

The issue with guild control, is eventually SOMEONE has to have the ability to check the boxes and set the standings and whatnot.
Yup, just thinking at this level it'd be pretty natural to give at least option for things like that to require click by at least two different people or something.
Fordel
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Reply #3794 on: February 04, 2009, 11:10:05 PM

I think you can have things enabled via shareholder voting in game, but I imagine it's a giant hassle and far less useful then it would seem at first glance.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Goumindong
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Reply #3795 on: February 04, 2009, 11:26:02 PM

I think you can have things enabled via shareholder voting in game, but I imagine it's a giant hassle and far less useful then it would seem at first glance.

Shouldn't be too bad if you keep tight control of the shares.
tmp
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POW! Right in the Kisser!


Reply #3796 on: February 04, 2009, 11:32:59 PM

I think you can have things enabled via shareholder voting in game, but I imagine it's a giant hassle and far less useful then it would seem at first glance.
Ahh, i didn't think of these. Would imagine though this way has its own issues, with everyone who gets shares being granted (partial) right to decide about everything that goes on, plus the people still keeping the shares after they stop playing... easy to turn into mess just as bad. Oh well, something for CCP to take a good look at and maybe address in some expansion down the road.
Fordel
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Reply #3797 on: February 04, 2009, 11:50:04 PM

I think you can have things enabled via shareholder voting in game, but I imagine it's a giant hassle and far less useful then it would seem at first glance.
Ahh, i didn't think of these. Would imagine though this way has its own issues, with everyone who gets shares being granted (partial) right to decide about everything that goes on, plus the people still keeping the shares after they stop playing... easy to turn into mess just as bad. Oh well, something for CCP to take a good look at and maybe address in some expansion down the road.


I believe there was already a similar share heist relatively recently like this, where someone quitting or 'retiring' from 0.0 space, sold his controlling shares to a enemy.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
tmp
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POW! Right in the Kisser!


Reply #3798 on: February 04, 2009, 11:57:23 PM

I believe there was already a similar share heist relatively recently like this, where someone quitting or 'retiring' from 0.0 space, sold his controlling shares to a enemy.
Hmmm the shares takeover approach could at least take hillarious form once they have their ambulation project up and running -- being able to literally walk into the war room of your enemy alliance and announce change of leader and whatnot... possibilities awesome, for real

in the meantime have to do with the irc chatlogs i guess. Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly?
Goumindong
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Reply #3799 on: February 05, 2009, 12:05:54 AM

I think you can have things enabled via shareholder voting in game, but I imagine it's a giant hassle and far less useful then it would seem at first glance.
Ahh, i didn't think of these. Would imagine though this way has its own issues, with everyone who gets shares being granted (partial) right to decide about everything that goes on, plus the people still keeping the shares after they stop playing... easy to turn into mess just as bad. Oh well, something for CCP to take a good look at and maybe address in some expansion down the road.


I believe there was already a similar share heist relatively recently like this, where someone quitting or 'retiring' from 0.0 space, sold his controlling shares to a enemy.

It wasn't a takeover. GHSC(i believe it was) got a hold of 100k shares of RKK and was selling them for 1m isk each.
Fordel
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Reply #3800 on: February 05, 2009, 12:15:10 AM

That's probably what I am thinking of Goumindong.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
apocrypha
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Reply #3801 on: February 05, 2009, 03:12:24 AM

Jesus. There's no drama like EVE drama.

To the assorted GS people here though... doesn't this feel like a hollow victory? I mean, it's been pretty clear for a while now, even to a total outsider like me, that BoB were a dying entity and that GS were the superior military force. BoB had lost pretty much all respect from the EVE community a very long time ago and their eventual military defeat and humiliation was something that a lot of people were looking forward to seeing.

This just feels like a cheatcode win for GS. This leaves them with the eternal ability to claim that they only lost this war because of this event and not because of their own arrogance, poor tactics, underestimation of the Goons, treating their pets like chattel, etc etc. If this stays then it basically lets them off the hook imo.

"Bourgeois society stands at the crossroads, either transition to socialism or regression into barbarism" - Rosa Luxemburg, 1915.
Endie
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Reply #3802 on: February 05, 2009, 03:23:24 AM

Jesus. There's no drama like EVE drama.

To the assorted GS people here though... doesn't this feel like a hollow victory?

Nope, this is the best way to win: the biggest alliance of consistent and proud cheaters, who with their allies have been flailing around desperately using spies to try all that they could to buy even a single victory just fell to their own game.

In the words of the great Windsor Davies: "Ohdearnevermindhowsad".

Bob have been shitty for a couple of years, since they lost their raison d'etre in 9-9 and recruited every pubbie from every failed pet they could.  Maybe Bob 2.0 (because let's face it, they will be back in some form) will prove to be a bit better at the game: smaller, leaner and all that.

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Phildo
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Reply #3803 on: February 05, 2009, 03:29:34 AM

Aside from that, this is a much better and clean death for their alliance than a (hypothetical) protracted series of wartime failures.  It gives them a chance to start over fresh under a new name and potentially new leadership if they choose, free from the stigma of the grandiose statements made in the past or the dev scandals.
Endie
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Reply #3804 on: February 05, 2009, 03:31:59 AM

Good point, Phildo.

Dammit if i had found this out two hours ago I'd not have gone to work today: I'd have burned a day's holiday (not such a big deal as for you Americans, since we get 30+ a year) to start work on Delve.

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Arthur_Parker
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Reply #3805 on: February 05, 2009, 03:32:15 AM

This is awesome, best way for GS to win.
apocrypha
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Planes? Shit, I'm terrified to get in my car now!


Reply #3806 on: February 05, 2009, 03:43:35 AM

Aside from that, this is a much better and clean death for their alliance than a (hypothetical) protracted series of wartime failures.  It gives them a chance to start over fresh under a new name and potentially new leadership if they choose, free from the stigma of the grandiose statements made in the past or the dev scandals.

Yeah good point.

And Endie.... just develop a migraine and go home ffs  why so serious?

"Bourgeois society stands at the crossroads, either transition to socialism or regression into barbarism" - Rosa Luxemburg, 1915.
Phildo
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Reply #3807 on: February 05, 2009, 04:00:01 AM

It's worth adding that from what I've read on CAOD today's events have had a nice polarizing effect on the Eve community.  There are plenty of people who are sad to see BoB hurt in this fashion but there are also quite a few people who feel that breaking their alliance through any means other than grinding POS warfare is despicable.  Goonswarm has made a few new enemies today.
TripleDES
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Reply #3808 on: February 05, 2009, 04:23:24 AM

Where's JoeTF and his wisdoms?

EVE (inactive): Deakin Frost -- APB (fukken dead): Kayleigh (on Patriot).
Fordel
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Reply #3809 on: February 05, 2009, 04:24:54 AM

From my Outsider looking in PoV, this is just Karma. BoB has a long history of doing just about *anything* to win, and being giant arrogant pricks the entire way.

At least it's going out with some sort of a Bang, instead of just a whimper.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Endie
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Reply #3810 on: February 05, 2009, 05:39:38 AM

Now that we have complete access to all the director-level comms from BNC's side, there is an interesting tale of woe as Evil Thug and Molle talk.

Remember how AAA were confident that they could defeat us alone, but that Bob just showed up (quelle surprise!)?

Quote
evilthug@mail.ru säger (20:01):
We started from AZN capital constellation. Goons responded with pos spam.
evilthug@mail.ru säger (20:01):
We stuck here, atm.
evilthug@mail.ru säger (20:01):
i cant get enough numbers to give a fight in this time zone
evilthug@mail.ru säger (20:05):
Basicly, i wanted to get at least 10 poses into reinforced this evening
evilthug@mail.ru säger (20:05):
but Goons fucked us up this morning, gettign 330 ppl in system

[Actually even the bit about us spamming is wrong: we only countered to be a minimal amount above them each time]


You know how BCDI are in AAA and blue to the GBC bloc?  Well, they weren't always that desperate:

Quote
ThomasM säger (20:03):
but i won't blue seleene!
ThomasM säger (20:04):
ever!
SirMolle säger (20:04):
ditto


You want to see Molle's grasp on where his power bloc stood?

Quote
SirMolle säger (20:09):
we'll keep gbc harassing mm and rzr
evilthug@mail.ru säger (20:09):
cache = SOLAR
ThomasM säger (20:09):
and killing their titans


Oh, and we control(led) their game.

Quote
SirMolle säger (20:03):
goonies are why we attacked north to split their allies before goons


Oh, you know that all that stuff about AAA being bought by ROL was crap?

Quote
evilthug@mail.ru säger (21:00):
Greedy mofos = that would be Red Overlord. and they are already plus with us.
SirMolle säger (21:00):
lol
SirMolle säger (21:01):
tbh, i dont care which way
evilthug@mail.ru säger (21:01):
same, because they are reimbursing my losses



And let's give the last word to Evil Thug:

Quote
evilthug@mail.ru säger (20:25):
By resetting goons, and starting this war, i basicly joined the dark side.

Now that has to be enough content to let me give one line of fofofo, Yoru  awesome, for real
« Last Edit: February 05, 2009, 05:41:26 AM by Endie »

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Arthur_Parker
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Reply #3811 on: February 05, 2009, 05:46:56 AM

Don't get me wrong, I only started playing EvE because BoB had dev friends spawning bpo's for them, so I have zero sympathy for them.  But what's the chances of CCP reversing this?  BoB, previous members of the alliance known as BoB, seem to be playing the hacked account card.  Is this BNC director talking anywhere?
Endie
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Reply #3812 on: February 05, 2009, 06:03:16 AM

Don't get me wrong, I only started playing EvE because BoB had dev friends spawning bpo's for them, so I have zero sympathy for them.  But what's the chances of CCP reversing this?  BoB, previous members of the alliance known as BoB, seem to be playing the hacked account card.  Is this BNC director talking anywhere?

The second that we started doing stuff we petitioned CCP to explain what was happening and let them watch.  Within the hour our directorate were in direct dialogue with CCP, who were therefore effectively overseeing the process.  Everything was done in-game by the people who owned the relevant accounts.  As Mittens said, we're not as dumb as Jakey Noble.  A reversal of this would make the Threadnought pale by comparison.

My blog: http://endie.net

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"What else would one expect of Scottish sociopaths sipping their single malt Glenlivit [sic]?" Jack Thompson
Arthur_Parker
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Reply #3813 on: February 05, 2009, 06:11:35 AM

Double awesome, thanks for that.  Heart
Quinton
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Reply #3814 on: February 05, 2009, 06:35:09 AM

To the assorted GS people here though... doesn't this feel like a hollow victory? I mean, it's been pretty clear for a while now, even to a total outsider like me, that BoB were a dying entity and that GS were the superior military force. BoB had lost pretty much all respect from the EVE community a very long time ago and their eventual military defeat and humiliation was something that a lot of people were looking forward to seeing.

I think this will be far more entertaining -- big expanses of 0.0 with no sov?  Tons of corps and alliances interested in grabbing some space.  Those who don't give up and go home possibly reforming for revenge?  I predict all sorts of fun.  Damn.  Need more time for spaceship games.
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