Scarlet Monastery Reward for Dual Wield Shaman?

[rk47]

Question, should I pick the dagger with 1.5 speed and chance to do 30 shadow dmg on hit or the two handed ax?
And can someone tell me what sort of weapon would be ideal for shamans that are planning to dual wield?

[Chenghiz]

If you're dual-wielding, you generally want a slow main-hand and a fast offhand. The offhand will proc more flurry and windfury, and the extra attacks (or damage I guess it is now) from windfury are calculated from your main-hand's damage range.

[Rasix]

The offhand will proc more flurry and windfury, and the extra attacks (or damage I guess it is now) from windfury are calculated from your main-hand's damage range.

This is not correct.

There's a decent amount of debate on the subject of fast v. slow in on the boards.  There's some factors that play into this:

1.  Stormstrike does instant damage based on your weapon damage.  Slower weapons are better for this.
2.  Windfury can proc off either hand.  Windfury is 2 instant +AP attacks. Offhand damage is halved, so the damage is less.  Slower weapons are better for this.  Windfury will proc more with a faster weapons, however.
3.  Flurry and Unleashed Rage proc off crits.  Faster weapon = more crits.
4.  Shamanistic Rage is a per hit chance (this is not 100% confirmed).  Faster weapon = possibly more mana back on using Shamanistic rage.

IMO, it's just best to go with the two best weapons you can find and preferably have your heaviest hitter in your mainhand.  Later on when you can be choosey about the stats on your weap, you'll want to prioritize AP, Crit and Hit Rating with the best DPS available to you.  Optimal would be a fast weapon in the offhand though because the WF crits aren't very large and you'd like to have flurry up at all times.  Unleashed Rage is just about always up.

FYI, I'm sitting at about 800 AP and 22% crit right now at 66 (yes, it could be better and yes, this is before any buffs). My mainhand I'm still using my HWL mace until my unarmed rating gets better (got the 62 DPS fist from Ring of Blood) and my mainhand WF crits can go upwards of 1.1k damage.

There's an interesting bug/feature right now with Windfury.  You can derank your offhand to have your main and offhand working off separate proc chances.  Each hand works off it's own 20% to proc and one doesn't effect the proc chance of the other (min 3 secs between WF procs). This also seems to have the added bonus of allowing WF to proc WF again (by appearance, not sure what's really happening).  I've had some interesting experiences with this, and have seen it where I'll end up with a block of 6 yellow hits.  A Stormstrike followed by a WF proc followed by a WF proc.  Most likely a bug. 

[MrHat]

The problem is when that when you do get the double proc (MainH/OffH) sometimes it will report as quad main hand or quad off hand hits.  ie, 400,400,400,400 or 100,100,100,100.  Still awesome though.

<3 My shaman.  As for shaman and dual wielding, at L41 or so you have enough for just dual wield right?  If that's the case, I'd stick w/ a heavy hitting 2hand until you can get a few points into that +hit% talent.

Other than that, just pick whatever gives you the most DPS.

[Rasix]

The problem is when that when you do get the double proc (MainH/OffH) sometimes it will report as quad main hand or quad off hand hits.  ie, 400,400,400,400 or 100,100,100,100.  Still awesome though.

Ahh, is that what it is?  Just a display error?  Interesting.  Guess that debunks the return of WF proccing WF.

[Morfiend]

I dont know how the machanics of Windfury work, but about 95% of the procs in WoW are PPM or Procs per minute, so a fast weapon doesnt actually help this. On the other hand, the talent that give you mana with each hit would be better with faster weapons, unless the about of mana scales to weapon speed.

[MrHat]

Not a display error.  You actually get 1600 damage or 400 damage.  The bug is just that.  Instead of consistantly getting 400,400,100,100 (WF MainH, WF OffH).  Also, the only way to get the double proc from each hand is to use the bug on purpose 4/3 WF or 5/4 WF.  When they fix it, it should allow the normal WF double proc w/ WF5/5 or 4/4 so that you can maximize the AP bonus on yer off hand.

[MrHat]

I dont know how the machanics of Windfury work, but about 95% of the procs in WoW are PPM or Procs per minute, so a fast weapon doesnt actually help this. On the other hand, the talent that give you mana with each hit would be better with faster weapons, unless the about of mana scales to weapon speed.

Shamanistic Rage is just AP based.  If I get a chance tonight (In-Laws just got in to stay with us for a month, ugh) I'll jump on Paxx and put on a 2hander to check, although, reading the shaman forums (lots of time at work today) it seems that faster weapons + more ap = more mana back always.

Also, I was pretty sure windfury was part of the 5% that isn't PPM.

[Rasix]

I dont know how the machanics of Windfury work, but about 95% of the procs in WoW are PPM or Procs per minute, so a fast weapon doesnt actually help this. On the other hand, the talent that give you mana with each hit would be better with faster weapons, unless the about of mana scales to weapon speed.

WF isn't PPM.  It's straight 20% chance.  I believe there was a confirmation that there is a minimum 3 sec between WF procs though.

Shamanistic Rage is a chance per hit of 15% of your AP.  When I'm trinketing and have other stuff going I can get about 200 per hit.

[Chenghiz]

The offhand will proc more flurry and windfury, and the extra attacks (or damage I guess it is now) from windfury are calculated from your main-hand's damage range.

This is not correct.

There's a decent amount of debate on the subject of fast v. slow in on the boards.  There's some factors that play into this:

1.  Stormstrike does instant damage based on your weapon damage.  Slower weapons are better for this.
2.  Windfury can proc off either hand.  Windfury is 2 instant +AP attacks. Offhand damage is halved, so the damage is less.  Slower weapons are better for this.  Windfury will proc more with a faster weapons, however.
3.  Flurry and Unleashed Rage proc off crits.  Faster weapon = more crits.
4.  Shamanistic Rage is a per hit chance (this is not 100% confirmed).  Faster weapon = possibly more mana back on using Shamanistic rage.

IMO, it's just best to go with the two best weapons you can find and preferably have your heaviest hitter in your mainhand.  Later on when you can be choosey about the stats on your weap, you'll want to prioritize AP, Crit and Hit Rating with the best DPS available to you.  Optimal would be a fast weapon in the offhand though because the WF crits aren't very large and you'd like to have flurry up at all times.  Unleashed Rage is just about always up.

FYI, I'm sitting at about 800 AP and 22% crit right now at 66 (yes, it could be better and yes, this is before any buffs). My mainhand I'm still using my HWL mace until my unarmed rating gets better (got the 62 DPS fist from Ring of Blood) and my mainhand WF crits can go upwards of 1.1k damage.

There's an interesting bug/feature right now with Windfury.  You can derank your offhand to have your main and offhand working off separate proc chances.  Each hand works off it's own 20% to proc and one doesn't effect the proc chance of the other (min 3 secs between WF procs). This also seems to have the added bonus of allowing WF to proc WF again (by appearance, not sure what's really happening).  I've had some interesting experiences with this, and have seen it where I'll end up with a block of 6 yellow hits.  A Stormstrike followed by a WF proc followed by a WF proc.  Most likely a bug. 

That doesn't seem to contradict anything I said. Does WF damage now come from the proccing weapon?

[Rasix]

extra attacks (or damage I guess it is now) from windfury are calculated from your main-hand's damage range.

That doesn't seem to contradict anything I said. Does WF damage now come from the proccing weapon?

You can have offhand windfury procs that are determined by your offhand damage range.  So, to answer your question: yes. 

[Chenghiz]

Ah, okay. I imagine that's why it says 'extra damage according to damage range' instead of just 'extra attack'.

[Dren]

I don't know how duel wield works for shaman but for rogues the offhand is handicaped quite a bit without talents.  It is reduced in both damage and accuracy from what the weapons displays for stats.  It doesn't matter much if it procs if you can't hit and when you do it is for less damage. 

My advice is to put your most damaging weapon in your main hand if this is the case (which I would think it is.)  If you get talents to help boost damage or accuracy for the offhand, get it.  I did for my rogue and it made a pretty sizeable difference in overall DPS.

Most of the time I'm limited though.  It seems like the I'm always wanting to put a weapon in my main hand, but not able to since the one that is there is main hand only.  You have to watch for that.  I got burned on the AH due to being lazy and not looking at the full item description.

[Sairon]

Hehe, I liked it more when there were no 3 second period between procs, and you could proc wf on a wf. And the totem that gave 7 extra attacks instead of 1  :-D

[rk47]

Yeah I got the ravager drop. So I decided to pick up black menace...and use it as an offhand at lvl 40 with Hand of Righteousness on my main hand. Should be pretty sweet, Scarlet shopping mall is awesome.

[SurfD]

Pretty sure all dual-wielders suffer from the same initial offhand negatives, regardless of if you are a Warrior, rogue or shaman.
All offhand weapons have a reduced chance to hit (compared to main hand single wielding), and reduced damage (compared to the Damage numbers listed on the weapon).

However, every class should get talents that help offset these (base + to hit chance, increased offhand damage) stuff like that.

[MrHat]

Damage from the off hand is -50%.  Missrate is 18% for dual wield.

[Morat20]

Pretty sure all dual-wielders suffer from the same initial offhand negatives, regardless of if you are a Warrior, rogue or shaman.
All offhand weapons have a reduced chance to hit (compared to main hand single wielding), and reduced damage (compared to the Damage numbers listed on the weapon).

However, every class should get talents that help offset these (base + to hit chance, increased offhand damage) stuff like that.

Hunters -- except for the occasional fool -- only dual-wield for stats and enchants. We can't use shields, so two weapons tends to give us more options. If I was dual-wielding for melee, I might place a fast weapon with a good proc -- like lifestealing -- on the offhand and use the main-hand for damage. The offhand is more for applying affects than damage.

Might be a bad idea -- haven't actually tried that setup on a melee dual-weilder.

[Shrike]

Offhand weapons suffer the same tohit penalty as the mainhand: 24% miss rate overall, before secondary stats and talents. Offhand weapons use 50% of the ATP as mainhand. This is modifiable by talents for warriors and rogues (haven't looked at shamans for a while, but I think they only have the tohit mod talents).

You do NOT rely on your offhand for proc effects. The offhand gets no special attacks to boost your proc-rate. It's used for stats (particularily for warriors). Since shamans have only one special attack (which fires both hands at once), this really doesn't apply to them, but for warriors and rogues (and not-so-bright hunters) that's the bottom line. Many rogues rely on the offhand for poison application, but what the hell else is there for them? The fact is it still only gets the white damage attacks for the proc and has no specials to add additional chance of procs.

Despite the ATP penalty of the offhand it's a very significant amount of your damage ouput. More importantly, it's a HUGE boost to your rage generation as a warrior. For shamans, it's another weapon to apply windfury to, and for rogues it's a stat boost and another chance of applying poisons. For hunters, it's simply stat boosts to RATP.

[Morat20]

Offhand weapons suffer the same tohit penalty as the mainhand: 24% miss rate overall, before secondary stats and talents. Offhand weapons use 50% of the ATP as mainhand. This is modifiable by talents for warriors and rogues (haven't looked at shamans for a while, but I think they only have the tohit mod talents).

You do NOT rely on your offhand for proc effects. The offhand gets no special attacks to boost your proc-rate. It's used for stats (particularily for warriors). Since shamans have only one special attack (which fires both hands at once), this really doesn't apply to them, but for warriors and rogues (and not-so-bright hunters) that's the bottom line. Many rogues rely on the offhand for poison application, but what the hell else is there for them? The fact is it still only gets the white damage attacks for the proc and has no specials to add additional chance of procs.

Despite the ATP penalty of the offhand it's a very significant amount of your damage ouput. More importantly, it's a HUGE boost to your rage generation as a warrior. For shamans, it's another weapon to apply windfury to, and for rogues it's a stat boost and another chance of applying poisons. For hunters, it's simply stat boosts to RATP.

Not damage procs. Procs like lifestealing, or whatever the hell brainhacker does.

My hunter had my weapons enchanted with agility, back when that meant more.

Admittedly, I can't think of any that I'd want one of but not two of -- unless it was a weapon specific proc of some sort, where all I wanted was the proc.

[Shrike]

Lifesteal does damage, it just returns a bit to you. It still procs less on the offhand than the mainhand (white vs. yellow damage). My point wasn't so much about applied enchants as weapon secondary stats.

In the end, it's just a decision you have to make. The offhand will proc fewer times because it lacks yellow damage. When choosing an offhand weapon, I go for innate stats (i.e. BB over another Deathbringer). However, when enchanting, then it depended on what I was actually doing. I eventually went dual crusader (warrior) since the benefits of double crusader were considerable. Nowadays, in Kun...errr, TBC, it's back to stats. Mostly because the new enchants roundly suck and what else is there?

[SurfD]

The offhand will proc fewer times because it lacks yellow damage.

Err, wouldnt this be somewhat untrue, especially if, as someone mentioned earlier (or was it in another thread) that the vast majority of procs are per minute based?

[lamaros]

The offhand will proc fewer times because it lacks yellow damage.

Err, wouldnt this be somewhat untrue, especially if, as someone mentioned earlier (or was it in another thread) that the vast majority of procs are per minute based?

I believe it's along these lines:

Weapon speed determines how often the proc will hit, that is, a proc-rate.

Specials don't change the weapon speed and make it proc less, but they do hit and can trigger a proc.

[Shrike]

Lamaros is correct, but to add (a bit of) detail:

Proc rates are normallized across weapon speeds. So 2h have the same ppm as 1h, no matter what the weapon speed involved. Crusader, for instance, is largely recognized as being about 1ppm.

However, special attacks aren't factored into any of this. The crusader proc is set as a percentage check with your weapons. Any attacks additional to this (yellow damage), will add additional proc checks. So the mainhand has more chances to proc crusader. The offhand is what it is (with the exception of shaman's stormstrike). This is one reason warriors complain about instants vs. next hit attacks, and the reason for the nickname spamstring--you use hamstring as an instant to increase procs of things like your enchant, flurry, and any weapon procs there are.

Since the offhand has (usually) no extra specials, it's considered a haven for stats. In some cases, your enchant is good enough (crusader) that what it does for you is considered more advantageous in some situations (mostly PvP) where it's worth having it even on the offhand as opposed to just another wad of STR or AGI or whathaveyou. Basically, the old argument of "burst" damage (or what I call "one big hit") vs. steady damage over time (a PvE concern).

As a fury warrior, I can assure you that double crusader procs were the stuff bloodthirsty dreams were made of. That was when raid buffed. On my own farming whatever, then having a nice steady ATP increase on the offhand (+15 STR) was generally a better idea from the aspect of fights generally being over with very quickly. Before TBC, though, I generally so outgeared most encounters, it really didn't matter that much. In PvP, the additional damage to bloodthirst was such that it was worth gambling on double crusaders to raise hell with (relatively) unsuspecting prey.

[Merusk]

So I rolled-up a shaman got it to 14 and I love the class.  I might swap this character into becoming my 'main' as hunters are a dime a dozen and finding a group is hell at times.  At least as a Shaman I'm more likely to get picked-up as 'backup' healer/ dps than as anything as a hunter. 

However, the questions:

1) Totem stomping.  Already getting kind of old with the 'throw down totems, walk 6 yards and throw down more for the next mob' stuff.  Any mods to assist with this?

2) Leveling-up spec:  So far I've been going enhancement, and I'm aiming at something like this spec at the end.   I've read a few things about elemental shaman being kind of gimpy, even tho I'd love to go that route.

3) Any pitfall levels/ times where all of the sudden you feel 'weak'?  It happened in the early 40s on my pally, where mob HPs were suddenly > my dps and really drew things out.   After playing a hunter, priest, warrior where the problems were early, or at least the class played consistantly throughout it was enough for me to stop right there and say "meh, screw it."

[Morat20]

3) Any pitfall levels/ times where all of the sudden you feel 'weak'?  It happened in the early 40s on my pally, where mob HPs were suddenly > my dps and really drew things out.   After playing a hunter, priest, warrior where the problems were early, or at least the class played consistantly throughout it was enough for me to stop right there and say "meh, screw it."

I've only gotten to 20, but I'll tell you this: When you hit 20, and get ghost wolf, life will be wonderful. It's 8 kinds of fucking crazy awesome. I wish I'd specced two points into the improved ghost wolf talent before I'd gotten it now.

[Driakos]

1) Totem stomping.  Already getting kind of old with the 'throw down totems, walk 6 yards and throw down more for the next mob' stuff.  Any mods to assist with this?

2) Leveling-up spec:  So far I've been going enhancement, and I'm aiming at something like this spec at the end.   I've read a few things about elemental shaman being kind of gimpy, even tho I'd love to go that route.

3) Any pitfall levels/ times where all of the sudden you feel 'weak'?  It happened in the early 40s on my pally, where mob HPs were suddenly > my dps and really drew things out.   After playing a hunter, priest, warrior where the problems were early, or at least the class played consistantly throughout it was enough for me to stop right there and say "meh, screw it."

I leveled my Shaman(s) awhile ago, so what I say may not be entirely accurate.

The totem thing, it's always like that.  They did give us a new spell, that picks up all your dropped totems, and refunds a portion of the mana.  Not sure what level you get that.  You are always and forever littering though.

Elemental was a lot of fun in PVP, but I didn't like deep Elemental (past 31).  Having both Elemental Mastery and Nature's Swiftness makes you a killer, and a lingerer.  Elemental is not so much fun in PVE.  Get used to drinking.  Often.  Shocks never become affordable.

I felt weak in the high 30's.  Mail armor at 40 helped beef me up a bit, but by the end of the 40's you'll feel weak again.  It wasn't until 60 that I felt competitive once more.  Leveling now post BC is not so much fun.  I've been playing my mage, just because it's faster.  My Shaman is currently deep Restoration for Earthshield.  Not terribly fun for solo'ing.

Finding areas where there are lots of casters will make your PVE'ing go much faster.  Shaman wax casters fast.  You'll get Grounding totem to compliment Earthshock, and if you're a tauren, Warstomp to interrupt their spells.  With Stoneclaw you can absorb a spell or two more from a caster add.

Anyhow, I blazed through the early levels, and hit a wall late 30's.  Though to be honest, I feel this way with most of the classes.  I think It is the lack of non-STV content that slows things down.  Both my Shaman have felt gimpy though in the 50's.  My mail armor wasn't good enough to really offtank anymore, and intensive casting chewed through my mana pool quick.  Once I got geared up at 60, it changed drastically for the better.

I haven't leveled with dual wield.  That could change the largest problem, lengthy, Paladin'esque fights.

[rk47]

not much solution on dreaded autotems per fight...I kinda grew bored with it too and only relied on one or two totems unless if I really needed more. Basically when you're soloing, you just need searing totem and strength/agi boost totem.

enhancement is awesome for levelling. I'm very happy with the performance at 40-50 when I ran out of quests, so I decided the grind on caster mobs like ogre mages in Feralas...performance was fantastic with grounding totem & earth shock to eat whatever they throw at you...and WF procs simply eats 1/3 - 1/2 of their HP bar. I'm sitting at lv 52 right now and pretty happy with my spec. I picked Shamanistic rage and was somewhat disappointed, but perhaps I'm too low lvl to feel the difference.

I havent felt 'weak' yet, but having played a hunter some quests are harder cause you cannot rely on your pets to take all the dmg anymore or ninja the objective while your pet is the one dying. Some encounters are hard if you dont have enough HP too, slapping on a shield will add a considerable % though at the cost of Dps.

 I just finished an AV raid to get a decent one hand mace ;) so we'll see how it turns out post 60 soon.

PS:  might wanna drop anticipation for improved ghost wolf form...it's a life saver and adds taht extra mobility when pvping. 1 sec cast to get 40% Spd boost is great.

[Rasix]

So I rolled-up a shaman got it to 14 and I love the class.  I might swap this character into becoming my 'main' as hunters are a dime a dozen and finding a group is hell at times.  At least as a Shaman I'm more likely to get picked-up as 'backup' healer/ dps than as anything as a hunter. 

However, the questions:

1) Totem stomping.  Already getting kind of old with the 'throw down totems, walk 6 yards and throw down more for the next mob' stuff.  Any mods to assist with this?

There was an old mod called "totem stomper".  Never used it.  Honestly, I don't drop totems anymore unless I'm grouped or fighting multiple mobs/elites.

2) Leveling-up spec:  So far I've been going enhancement, and I'm aiming at something like this spec at the end.   I've read a few things about elemental shaman being kind of gimpy, even tho I'd love to go that route.

Elemental shaman would be too mana intensive pre-60.  There's simply not the gear available to make it worthwhile pre-expansion.  Post.. anything but gimpy from what I've heard.  You have good burst/steady DPS and it is a lot more controllable than enhancement.

I leveled with enhance/resto to 60 a long time ago.  Getting the 70% interupt resist is very nice as is nature's swiftness.  But if I had to do it over again, I would likely go solely enhance until you can afford to put points in resto.  Dual wield is not great though until you can put some points in both hit talents and get some +hit gear as well as getting your crit percentage up.  You can always take 2h weapons though to get that nice melee damage increase to speed up kills. 

Btw, shamanistic rage won't be great until you have some decent AP.  Now, it saves me a lot of downtime.

Some feedback on your spec: guardian totems is a waste, weapon totems is a waste unless you group a lot and thus somewhat useless for leveling, same goes for enhancing totems, improved reincarnation is also somewhat wasteful (I really didn't die a lot when I leveled).

3) Any pitfall levels/ times where all of the sudden you feel 'weak'?  It happened in the early 40s on my pally, where mob HPs were suddenly > my dps and really drew things out.   After playing a hunter, priest, warrior where the problems were early, or at least the class played consistantly throughout it was enough for me to stop right there and say "meh, screw it."

Level 20 is when life really gets good as a shaman: ghost wolf, lesser healing wave and FROST SHOCK!!!

Late 30's before chain you start to feel a little squishy, even with a decent shield.

You won't feel underpowered as enhance leveling up, but you'll honestly be amazed at what the gear in BC does for you.  Enhance really functions best when your AP is decent and your crit percentage is 20-25%.   You just honestly can't pull that off without a buttload of hard to get epics pre BC.  After.. easy peasy.

[Shrike]

I don't totally agree. Enhance (pure enhance at 48 is what I am at the moment) levels like a sunavabeech. You still tend to drink more than I like, but compared to a fury warrior a DW enhance shaman is a walk in the park through the mid-levels.

There are a few caveats. One is keep your gear relatively up to date. It's imperative you have good weapons. Early on that means a nice beefy 2h axe or mace. You won't be dual wielding until 40, so you'll spend a lot of time with a big 2hander waiting for windfury crits. The levels from 35 to 40 do kind of suck and you'll feel like you're slowly fading away. Chain armor and your nice shiny new 1handers will change that. Also, use separate windfurys on your one handers. WF is, well, lets just say with windfury 2 on your mainhand and 1 on your offhand you'll see a LARGE increase in dps over windfury 2 on both hands. Yes, it's stupid, but that's the way it is. If you can stomach the class forums, you can find more info on the actual mechanics. It works in game, though, and that's good enough for me.

Totem management can be a real pain the butt. Level 30ish brings totemic recall which simplifies things a bit. I've been using the YATA addon as totem storage (not so much for the extra hotkeys, but they are nice). YATA's interface sucks bigtime, but it's the cleanest addon I"ve seen (I'm open to suggestion here if anyone has anything better). I use totems frequently (Grace of Air is the shiz...), but I try and tailor use to conditions. If fights are easy, then I use one or none. If I know it's going to be a knock down/drag out, then the totem forest goes up. Recall makes it easier to move around more quickly, but mana costs get out of hand if you get too carried away dropping them right and left.

Lastly, I'm not really high enough level to see this myself, but from discussing mana issues with priests, I suspect spirit might be a big help if you can pile the stat on. As enhance you spend a lot of time fighting with physical weapons and not really much time casting. So spirit regen works well for you. The problem is you need a lot of different stats (like a fury warrior). You need stamina to take hits, intellect to boost the mana pool, ATP to increase damage, AGI to boost your crit rate, straight crit rating, and a few points of tohit would be nice (though optional--your talents cover this pretty well). That's a lot of competing stats to deal with.

[Merusk]

Thanks for the tips, guys.

I'll take another look at the talents based on what you all have said.  I'm mainly playing the character with my wife, who's leveling a Discipline/ Holy priest along side me, so that was one of the reasons for some of the talents.

Bleh on the totem stomping thing, but knowing that it seems to be a common complaint I'm sure there's some kind of management tool I can find if I really look.   It's just walking literally 6-yards and "oops out of range of that totem you dropped for the last mob"  thing that's driving me nuts.   If it was a few more yards, or even across a camp I can understand but for every. single. mob. it just gets aggravating at times.   :-D

 I went Enhancement since I already know a bit about melee weaps, and don't recall seeing a lot of low-level +dam leather or mail.  The reason I mused about Elementalist is exactly what Rasix mentioned  (and annoyed the hell out of me as a hunter) seeing all that lovely +int, +dam/heal, MP/5 itemization in BC.   Perhaps I'll respec once I hit 61 or so.

Shrike:  From playing a priest I can tell you that Spirit is indeed nice, BUT MP/5 is much better.  You always get your MP/5 wether in combat or not, but Spirit regen is reduced while in combat and stops entirely for 5s after any cast.  Wowwiki Mana Regen Article