Is the gloss starting to wear off?

[UnSub]

I'll state up front that I still enjoy CoH and that's it's still the best mmog I've played.

But is the gloss starting to wear off? I'm noticing an increase in the number of complaints about CoH, especially now that WoW is on the horizon (so people can now actually go somewhere shiney when they leave, rather than just threatening to go).

Might just be me, but I'm interested if CoH has gotten "old" after three months.

[Sable Blaze]

I could think of any number of minor complaints. Most of them would be due to build idiosyncracies; some more basic game desigin.

However, CoH is still the only MMRPG I"m playing right now, so that about says it all. It's still fun, and I still have some builds to explore. Quite frankly, WoW worries me more than CoH does. The fanbase that WoW seems to be building is a distinct turn-off to me.

[Murgos]

CoH certainly needs more depth, and I don't mean trade skills.  I mean a sense of exploration and discovery.  There are a few zones I have't seen yet but only because they have level requirements and as for the rest of the zones, a city is a city is a city.  I like the feeling in other MMOG's of traveling across countries and seeing some clever little feature that was put in to break up the terrain.

That said I'm still happy with CoH (though I am a bit annoyed at the exp requirements, have to kill the equivalent of 1600 white cons to advance from lvl 28 to lvl 29, tedium may set in soon) and Statesman has said that the next few issues will be doing a lot to expand the sense of exploration (one example was an alternate dimension where Germany won WWII) and he has hinted at other things, with all teh wealth of comicdom out there I am sure they can come up with something interesting.  How neat would a visit by a world devouring super-creature be?

I would like to see the mob spawning be perhaps a little more interactive, rather than just groups on street corners.  With the inclusion of outdoor missions and some time to let the devs be creative with them there could be some really neat things coming in that department.   Also hinted at were random missions that you 'happen upon' in some way which could be cool too.  Currently you can click on random street people and they give you a little coment or two (some of it quite personalized like, "I read in the newspaper that Electron Volt saved Senator X from the Sky Raiders") I doubt if it would take too much effort to have them occaisionally pop up a little mission dialogue like the contacts do.

I have faith in the dev team, they have been nailing B's and A's so far in developing CoH into a great game and I will certainly be interested to see what CoH morphs into over the coming year or so.

Things that have been promised that I am interested in are (in the order they come to mind):

Vehicles.
Super Group bases (with attendant reward gee-gaws for spiffing them up).
PvP of some form.
More customizable characters (particle effects, weapons, special costume enhancements).
More involved story lines.
More outdoor missions.
New zones.
New trials.
respec (I loathe teleport).

Also on the official boards yesterday one of the devs said they were shooting for the end of August for issue 2 to go live which too me seems as a reasonable rate of introducing new content.

[kaid]

I am still really enjoying it and I was in beta for three months in addition to the time it has been live. Yes you can pretty easily hit all the city zones but it is a good fun game to play for a few hours with friends. Its not a soul destroying game like eqlive is for free time consumption.

It is much easier to play COH in a truly casual way than just about anything else I can think of. Also since all the power combos play so differently I am cursed by constantly making lil alts to toy with.

kaid

[CmdrSlack]

The optional timesink part of the game is what is keeping it shiny for me.

I can log in and get a box of xp, then log out.  By then I'll have enough dough to upgrade an enhancement and feel like I've whupped a sufficient amount of bad guy ass for the day.

I can also choose to start a pickup TF or organize one here, which still gives me my needed dose of catass.

A lot of this is because of the ability to SK, so I can generally hunt with or bring people along who aren't in the proper level range.

Yeah, more "community" would be nice, but I don't know if the game really demands it.  Needs it?  Yes.  Game breaking to not have it?  Not yet.  At least for me.

[SurfD]

something that would definately add more "Deapth" to the game, would be more Task Forces, and more Story line missions.  If each TF contact gave you 2 or 3 to chose from, instead of just one, that would make a HUGE difference.

Also, the Story Arc missions are sort of the "Exlporation" content.  It is primarily through the Arcs that you learn the most about a given villian faction (for example, I just did Library of Souls, a CoT arc.  Gods, if you thought you knew the CoT, you have NO idea what they are really all about).

[Azhrarn]

Yeah, I need to make a good solo character just for doing story arc missions and such.  As whenever I group, people rush through so fast, I don't get a chance to read the NPC dialog and such.  Like for the TFs - I might end up reading one in 3 descriptions from the contact.

Also, when I'm in groups (which is basically always), we usually end up doing all the highest level door missions available.  Which completely bypassed any story arcs I may have had up to this point as I levelled.  Quite annoying.

[Sky]

Slack nails it for me, too. I like that I can log in, take part in a TF with you guys and get a few hours of group fighting, or I can just run a few missions.

I guess it's a different perspective when you're not really playing to advance your character. Cosmic is still level 20 and 12 of those were from the catass weekend :)

Still having a lot of fun every time I log in to play.

Good point brought up about most pickup groups, one reason I tend to avoid them. Even with my slow progression through levels, I'm still missing a few story arcs. I can see hunting for xp if you are out of missions for your level and don't have time for a TF, but that's the only scenario I can see it in. Otherwise it's kinda odd to rush past the story parts.

[CmdrSlack]

Yep, street hunting seems to lack direction.  I like the story arcs specifically because I like to read the clues, etc.  

Randomly hunting on the street is good for an hour here or there, but certainly not what I'd prefer to do with my time in-game.  

Right now, I'm in a dead zone between 24 and 25 where there's no new missions, but I have 5 new contacts who won't yet speak to me.  So I'm forced to street hunt since I won't have time for a TF until Thursday.

Speaking of that maybe I should try to rally some people for a TF this weekend.  Guess that needs a new thread.

[geldonyetich]

I'm certainly burned out from CoH.  Of course, I had the jump start of being in the beta for a month, so that's probably why I was ranting about COH's issues about a month ago.

Sky's right that CoH is a good game to jump into, pummel some bad guys for kicks, and just have some fun.  However, I usually look for MMORPGs for a little more lasting purpose than that.   CoH delivers the fun, visceral gameplay action that most other MMORPGs are lacking (and I am sure to complain about after I notice this lacking), but CoH falls short on the lasting purpose angle.    Much like Planetside, I'm left wondering if it's really worth a full subscription price.  I'd pay $6/mo for it, even $10/mo considering all the content the developers are introducing (certainly more than Planetside has), but not $15/mo.

I actually became so disillusioned with CoH's lack of long term purpose that I found it a motivation to play SWG, a game that is a converse opposite to CoH when it comes to "Combat Fun" vrs "Long Term Action Reprocussions".    Granted, SWG's existing combat is not totally god awful (AC2 and Horizons had worse) but it's still a far cry from the fun pummeling action in CoH or even the EQ+ gameplay in FFXI.  In SWG, at least, I'm left feeling I've invested my time as a small but important part of a massive dynamicly changing persistant state universe.    (Of course, that's not all I can look forward to: there's also the "X-Wing versus Tie Fighter: THE MMORPG!" Space Expansion looming some time between Fall and the end of the year (if it isn't delayed).  That's something I definately want to take for a spin.)

Regardless of my apparent satisfaction with Sim-Beru's dubious charms, once in awhile I find myself pining for my old CoH hero, The Nanites...(no, not in that way.)   I have to tell you, that little nanite colony could really put the fear of do-gooders in the hearts of never-do-wells.   I find myself thinking I wish The Nanites had an actual movie or comic book, and it is with regret that I know his exploits in Paragon City have reached such an abrupt end.    If I remember CoH for anything, it'll be how it gave me the ability to craft a memorable hero.  

Had I money to burn, I'd happily play both games - SWG for the long term time investment, City of Heroes for when I wanted to continue The Nanite's crime-fighting exploits.   However, I don't have that much monkey kicking around, so I had to choose.   Choosing long term worthwhile (as far as a game can be worthwhile) time investment over temporary fun, I haven't regretted my choice to go with SWG.  

Besides, towards the end of my CoH subscription I could barely keep the Nanites logged in more than half an hour anyway before being overwhelmed with an attack of depression asking me, "What's the Point?!".   Ultimately, I guess I just played CoH out.   Having found a niche in exploring the face of SWG's dynamically changing landscape, I never found myself once asking, "What's the point?!", and so in a way I guess the thing is that I "Get it".   In "Getting it", I'm in SWG's zone and it's the MMORPG for me.

Hows that for a few dozen layers more abstraction on the issue of MMORPG burnout than you were expecting?

[Liquidator]

CoH lost it's gloss after a week of beta.

-Liquidator

[jpark]

It is much easier to play COH in a truly casual way than just about anything else I can think of. Also since all the power combos play so differently I am cursed by constantly making lil alts to toy with.

kaid

That sums it up for me.  I do wish there was more community in the game - as evidenced by the almost sheer irreleveance of super groups currently since we are all pretty self sufficient or can get by easily with random pick-up groups.

[Soukyan]

I still enjoy CoH and log in every so often to play.

My life is what I concentrate on when I need something with long term purpose. Games are good for a short break from reality. But that's just my set of priorities. Your mileage may vary.

[Fargull]

Still really enjoying the game.  Right now the only real complaint revolves around the mission xp payout for teaming in the 30's plus.  Disparity of missions also seems to be upsetting when you have such a varied level of people at the higher level.  One thing I wish would happen is that mission level scalled with the level of the group, which it currently does not...  Which means that a group composed of 4 27's, 2 29's and 2 31st level characters are really only going to get benefit from running the 31st level missions.. and generally survival requires either SKing the 27s or hoping the 31st's have enough controlling/tanking power to handle the mass of bads so the 27's dont get snuffed in the first few minutes of each battle.

[eldaec]

get by easily with random pick-up groups.

I rolled a scrapper last week.

Now I no longer even need random pick-up groups.

I storm through xp and story arcs at at least the same rate I did with my other chars only without the annoying overhead of having to build a group during off-peak UK evening hours.

Grouping is something I do solely for reasons of fun, and I don't have to fear politely leaving crap groups or simply going without a group for a session.

For me at least,

- The game is still fun.
- I still don't have to log in for 6 hours at a time to play.
- It's still better than any other pve MMOG I've spent time in.
- But yes, it still does need community based features.

[Alluvian]

Fargull is EXACTLY right in his wish.  The number 1 thing the game needs in my opinion:

One thing I wish would happen is that mission level scalled with the level of the group, which it currently does not... Which means that a group composed of 4 27's, 2 29's and 2 31st level characters are really only going to get benefit from running the 31st level missions

You can sidekick a friend, but only if that friend has no interest whatsoever in collecting their OWN souveniers, doing their OWN missions or completing their OWN story arcs.  I am forced to solo a lot because my group of friends tend to be higher level than me.  It means nobody wants to do my missions because the highest level of the bunch get NO exp and it is walk in the park boring for all.

When I sidekick my wife to play she wants to do her missions as well, contribute to what we are doing, etc...  But the only way anyone gets any experience on her missions if if I unsidekick her and ungroup once we enter the mission.  It isn't any fun to her playing with 'big brother' standing there in case things get out of hand.  So I still had to end up making low level characters to play with her characters.  Which is EXACTLY what sidekicking was meant to avoid.

[kaid]

Yes that is the biggest downside of sidekicking at the moment. The max level of the mobs in the missions are currently tied to the max level of the person who took the mission. So if you side kick somebody you really can't effectivly do their missions.

I imagine that some day this will get changed but we are still in the early days of this mmrpg.


Kaid

[tar]

I can't remember if I've seen it mentioned here, but Statesman has been talking about a 'mentoring' system for the next issue. Supposedly it works like a reverse-sidekicking - the high level mentor drops down to the level of their pupil to join them on their missions.

Or something like that anyway. It won't solve all the problems but it's still worth the devs time to do IMO.

[eldaec]

I suspect automatic level scaling can never be balanced so that you even approach the effciency of outdoor hunting, due to running about overhead, and the ability to pick the perfect mobs, numbers, and levels for your group when outside.

They need to have the contacts offer missions of various levels and let you pick.

They also need to significantly reduce that amount of kill x of y missions that gum up the works and reduce your mission selection. They espeicially need to stop the 'go see security chief' crap from taking up one of the two mission slots on EVERY SINGLE CONTACT when they come due.

Have every contact typically offer 4 doors, each marked with levels running from 0 to +3 relative to you; and 1 kill x of y for the masochists. imo.

I really don't mind if a few more generic repeatable 'break up gang fight' doors come into the mix if it means we can get the choice, the level spread, and avoid having to grind outside. I'd much rather grind at repeated doors than have to grind at repeated outdoor spawn points because I have run out of missions.

[jpark]

It might be neat to see something done with he existing vehicular traffic in the game.  Maybe if you're hit by a car you can get knocked back /up.  Or from a mission standpoint - it might be hilarious to see "drive by shooting" scenarios - which would also make use of the existing traffic flow in the game.

They have a solid core - so adding to it in its manifold ways is a lot of fun to think about.

[Alluvian]

What I would love to see at this point is something the game probably can't do at all.  But it would be a blast.  Full physics system within instanced areas.  I don't think it would work in a MMOG though.  In order to keep everyone on the same page the server would have to handle all the physics and send all that data to all players in the instance.  Would crush the server and bandwidth, but it would be so neat for this game.  Let grav controllers really throw things around, add a super strength scrapper type that can throw objects, use objects in melee (smacking people with crates/pipes/streetlamps).  Would be fun for sure.

[HaemishM]

I haven't played CoH since I got back into DAoC. I do not regret paying a subscription fee for a game I don't play much, because unlike all the other MMOG's, I feel like Cryptic followed some of the best practices in the industry and deserve my ducats.

The game doesn't require constant play to have fun, nor does it make advancement the only reason to play.

In comparison to almost all other MMOG's (other than DAoC), it released stable, and has stayed stable. Strange how the two subscriptions I pay for are both for games that released STABLE.

I can have fun whether I group or not, whether I play for an hour or 10 minutes.

[RipSnort]

A+'s across the board for all the features in COH. I'm especially enamored by the avatar creation and the in game animations.
To me it's content is only one component of many that would be the MMO I'd stay sub'ed to. I grew bored of this game faster than any MMO I've ever played.
Hell even SB kept me addicted for a half a dozen months (masochist).
COH feels like a fancy sports car your only allowed to drive aroound the block.

[hkgoh]

Was on COH when it launched, and played it till about a month ago when I quit.

After awhile when the gloss fades, and I found the game seriously bland. The zones look very similar, the instanced rooms were largely repetitive. The npcs walking on the streets cannot really be interacted with, and strangely the little lady walking can push a huge Tank hero out of her path without batting a lash... but I digress.

And by 27, theres nothing new that you can equip your char with other than the rare dual SOs from Hamidon.

Cash was too plentiful... when I reached 27 I already had enough to upgrade all my SOs/DOs in a single shot, beyond that I was giving out cash to my friends.

Game balancing was still out of whack. Some classes have problem soloing slightly higher cons, my ice/dev blaster can actually take on purple bosses/lts with red minions with little problems. Group xp is pitiful compared to solo xp, unless its small groups of blasters.

Knew I was burning out when I began to make one alternate after another, when I had fun making characters with different looks and powers.... but even that fizzled out in the prospect of going through Galaxy City > Steel Canyon > Independance Port for the Xth time again.

In EQ the end game was epic raids, in DAOC its the realm based RVR. In COH I find the end game content lacking... though they inserted higher lvl mobs recently, the question is whats the reward for taking on these mobs?

Though the game was stated to be PVE, theres still no /duel option available for consentual pvp. While City of villians is supposed to address this, until today the pvp details is vague, and seemingly targeted for the distant future.

[Mesozoic]

Sorta on topic...

Developers always seem to produce quest/mission content that assumes each player only goes through the early game once.  The missions that ask you to read plaques about dead heroes and the missions clearly designed to make you visit "new" zones come to mind.  Don't even get me started on the CoH tutorial.  In DAoC there were missions that forced you to group, as if each new character needs to learn how grouping works.  

There ought to be a way to flag an entire account as "been there, done that" with the tutorial missions.  Replace those mission/quest slots with useful ones after an account has done them once.

[Sky]

I can see burning out if you treat it like a mmog. I don't care about rate of exp, or loot to outfit my avatar with. I play it because it's fun, and when I start getting bored, I log out and do something else :)

[jpark]

There is one thing I do want, keeping mind I am level 26, that would be easy to implement:

Tougher combats.

Man they are easy.  So easy, you can be any fool you want in combat.  Hell, as a healer I don't gaurentee survival, I gaurentee stupidity:  healing seems to allow blasters to tank while scrappers run to catch-up to the next wave of kills.

[ClydeJr]

There ought to be a way to flag an entire account as "been there, done that" with the tutorial missions.  Replace those mission/quest slots with useful ones after an account has done them once.

Statesman recently mentioned that they are planning a way to let you skip the tutorial and go straight to Atlas Park or Galaxy City.

I just hope the keep adding mission arcs. I don't really care if I get a little souvineer to keep, I just want to follow along a story.

[Phred]

Just noticed one thing on Victory that seems to indicate falling population. Saturday afternoon, what I'd consider prime time, there was only 1 kings row up. I think that's the first time I haven't seen 2 copies since I started the game.

[Sable Blaze]

Just head over to Steel Canyon. Most of the King's Row crowd of the last few months is in SC now.

I had a couple of 5th Column story missions from one of my IP contacts. They just happened to be in SC. It was a zoo there today. Hordes of people loitering (and lagging) around the trams, Positron/Valkyrie, Perez and Boomtown zone entrances. Complete idiocy in the /broadcast channel. Basically, the same stuff that caused me to sigh in relief when I left KR behind months ago. Talos is well on its way to the same fate.

Hard to say about absolute numbers, but seemed plenty busy to me.

[shiznitz]

Steel Canyon is the new bottleneck since it takes some harder grinding to clear the teens compared to the earlier levels. It seems a lot of people get stuck in the 16-20 level range and start an alt instead of pushing through. I found soloing in Skyway much better than SC at those levels.

[Alluvian]

Yeah, I have an 18, a 16, and several 9s and 10s.

[kaid]

Yup I fully agree if you want to do city hunts from 16 to 20 skyway is a TON better. Lots more mobs and bigger packs of them and its a great deal less hunted than steel canyon is.

That being said I am an altaholic I have one level 23  one level 15 and a bunch in the level 7 to 13 range.

Kaid