Heroes (SPOILERS)

[Merusk]

Also in the comics i believe Linderman told papa Petrelli that he could on heal the living.

I think he said he only WOULD heal the living.  That he'd tried the dead before and he didn't want to repeat the results.

[Velorath]

Of course the point could be moot anyway.  Personally, i think Peter will end up sacrificing himself in order to kill Sylar.  They're both just way too powerful to be around for the next season.  On the other hand, if Peter ends up surviving then Sylar will survive as well.  They're natural foils to each other.  If they do survive they'll get increasingly more difficult to write as they each get more and more powerful, though.

If either of them return for Season 2, I don't think there will be as much focus on them as there was this season.  It seems that next season (which they're calling Generations) is going to be putting a lot of focus on the previous generation of Heroes.

[SnakeCharmer]

I could see Sylar being a throw away villian.  Peter a throwaway hero?  Not so much, at least not this early in the game.  He's THE hero, I think:  The idealist, the one who always wants to do RIGHT.  He's the one willing to sacrifice it all for the better good.  He's the one that they all (should) aspire to be.  So, in that respect, it makes for better story and theme.  In my mind, he's the Captain America of the show, the leader, albiet sometimes a reluctant one.

Linderman's death scene, for whatever reason, is the best death scene so far, even though it was only about 2 seconds long.  It was about as subtle as a sledgehammer, and made me shout out "OH MY FUCKING GOD!!!" loud enough to scare the bajezus out of my baby boy as I was feeding him his last bottle of the night.

Great, powerful episode. 

[tazelbain]

I think Hiro is going to kill Peter and Sylar.

[Samwise]

Maybe he'll teleport to the farthest regions of space, or the end of time, or something, and take them with him.  No more boom.

[CmdrSlack]

I'm rather interested to see how the standoff between Bennett and Mohinder wiil play out.  I'm really hoping for something cooler than gunplay or a long, moralizing speech about how Bennet shouldn't kill Molly because to hurt another person's little girl to protect his own is uncool, etc.  I can't quite come up with what's cooler, but my guess would be basically that Bennet realizes they can use her to find Sylar, thus protecting Claire and whatnot.  Or something.

The rest of the episode was great, but it felt really short.  It makes me wish the finale was like a 2 hr special or something.

[sigil]

Jack coleman (Bennet) thinks the ending for  Heroes first season is awesome. *mild spoiler*

[Wolf]

Awesome episode, etc

I just found out/realised today that the guy playing Linderman is actually Malcolm McDowell - the guy that managed the most awesome piece of acting in the fucking history of cinema. And the bastards killed him today. I should have realised earlier, now I have to re-watch all episodes with linderman and pay extra atention. Yeah... you could say I sort of like clockwork orange.. ;)

[Velorath]

Awesome episode, etc

I just found out/realised today that the guy playing Linderman is actually Malcolm McDowell - the guy that managed the most awesome piece of acting in the fucking history of cinema. And the bastards killed him today. I should have realised earlier, now I have to re-watch all episodes with linderman and pay extra atention. Yeah... you could say I sort of like clockwork orange.. ;)

How in God's name did it take you this long to realize that it was Malcolm McDowell?  I realize most of his work isn't high profile stuff, but he has done quite a bit in the 36 years since A Clockwork Orange came out.

[kaid]

Man that is a hell of a way to go though. As soon as I saw that I was expecting an oriental voice to shout FATALITY! Hehe if that is not a mortal combat finishing move DL did on linderman I don't know what is.


edit cause I had football on the brain.

[Samwise]

I recognized McDowell instantly from his role in Star Trek: Generations.

I don't think I'd realized before that he was the lead in Clockwork Orange.   

[Merusk]

Certainly an interesting comic this week.  I'm pondering if the "death" is metaphorical (as in she'll assume a new name and disappear) or actual.

[Samwise]

I'm guessing metaphorical.  If it were actual, next week's installment is going to be awfully dull.  BLAM.  End.   

Or, if she does "die", she uploads her consciousness into the satellite first.  That would be kinda cool.

[Merusk]

Well I was thinking more along the lines of she goes up in the rocket, shuts-down the satellite and dies of asphyxiation as the rocket enters the upper atmosphere.

[SnakeCharmer]

I'm rather interested to see how the standoff between Bennett and Mohinder wiil play out.  I'm really hoping for something cooler than gunplay or a long, moralizing speech about how Bennet shouldn't kill Molly because to hurt another person's little girl to protect his own is uncool, etc.  I can't quite come up with what's cooler, but my guess would be basically that Bennet realizes they can use her to find Sylar, thus protecting Claire and whatnot.  Or something.

I'm thinking Mohinder appeals to the father in Bennett, and wins.  Bennett and crew use the little girl to locate Sylar, then he uses her as a springboard in the process of hiding other 'heroes' as he did in the Five Years Gone (I think is the name of it) episode.

The rest of the episode was great, but it felt really short.  It makes me wish the finale was like a 2 hr special or something.

I DID feel short; thought I was the only one that felt that way.  It moved quick, was very fast paced. 

Is the season finale just one hour?

Bleh.

[Merusk]

I am disappointed that this doesn't make any sense.  I don't see how anything Hiro has done could have affected DL and changed his future.  They want to use fate as a way handcuff Hiro and added gravity to the story, but then break it later for no reason.  Sloppy.

I've been thinking about this since I read it earlier today, and here's my theory.  It's got nothing to do with being unable to change fate, or predestiny.  Hiro can't change his past. The future is malleable, changing according to ecisions made and the intersection of people at key points - as Future Hiro mentions.  Once you're past those points, your path is set.  Future Hiro couldn't escape his status, because the past self-corrects.  However, by going back and nudging one or two things, he could alter the major flow of time.   It's kind of a quantum theory of time, but more like a tree than a billion splits at each decision point.

[Lantyssa]

I think Nikki said that he died when the bomb went off, but that may not be reliable.  Sylar had DL's power (he used it to pull Peter through the door), and presumably he didn't get it by exploding him.

No one knew Sylar was alive and pretending to be Nathan.  Only Peter knew it was him who exploded.  Nikki knew she lost DL in the 'bomb' in the sense of never seeing him again.  She simply assumed he died by the blast instead of being eaten, or surviving by melding and then getting eaten, before he could contact her again.  Tracking down people after a nuclear explosion in a major metropolitan area is not going to be easy.  (Well, without the Walker System.)  Think about how long it took to determine all the World Trade Center victims on a scale four orders of magnitude larger and in a radiological and environmental wasteland.  The scale is so massive it's incomprehensible.

I do agree with Hiro not being able to alter the past.  At least directly.  He can give clues to help others do so, but if he takes an active role we see things play out in similar if not near-identical ways.  Such as I'm not sure Charlie knew Hiro when she first met him, but her fate was still determined.  He got around that by telling Peter something cryptic and letting him figure out the meaning on his own.

Would Peter have met Claude if he never knew about and hadn't saved Claire, gone into a coma, and then tried to hide from everyone?  It was through him he learned to gain control over his powers and now the stage is set for it to really be Sylar that goes off.  BOOM indeed.

[Venkman]

Awesome episode. The part with Takei was awesome. My favorite moment was when Hiro said "...about killing" when Takei's eyes were reflected in the sword. Great angle. Then of course discovering Takei was a good guy after all, and like could use that sword with some skill, adds to it. Fisted skull death, nice, but i can't see Linderman dead for good. Too bad about Sprague but it makes sense.

The thing I really liked is that there were a few different possible bombs and they kept ya guessing over the last 1/2 of the season.

Episode also substantiates, yet again, the two-faction theory. Linderman's group wants Nathan to run the world so mutants can save it, probably through some totalitarian control. Takei (and assumed associates) don't like their methods.

Seems like the season finale has Peter facing down Sylar, probably after Molly helps the former find the latter. Way I see it, Peter absorbs everything Sylar can do and sorta cancels him out in some way. I'd wager Parkman gets shot (accidentally) by Mohinder while negotiating with Bennett. Molly obviously is still alive, but like truly blowing up NYC, I'm not surprised. Network TV and all. And I'm man enough to admit as a father of two girls, I'd stop watching the show if they went there, so call me the demographic.

I can't see Sylar nor Peter becoming second fiddle next season. I doubt either one dies at the end of this one. Best once-reluctant-villain / still-reluctant-hero duo I've seen since A New Hope (and to extend the analogy, Ando/Hiro = C3PO/R2D2? Nikki schizo = Lando flipflop? What else: Bennett = Palpatine, behind the scenes means well). The mini-series-spawned-hero will probably get much air-time, but in a Peter sorta way, not more. 

I also don't think the bomb goes off, or if it does it gets undone by Hiro. This Hiro seems to be able to control his powers almost as good as the +5 Years Hiro could, which after all is all he needs. The swordplay is fun though, even if he only had a few hours of training.

Comic: I hope the "death" of Hana is metaphorical. She (Wireless) is one of my favorite characters and I've been wishing one of the six mini-episodes focuses on her (though they do mention this mini-series is about choosing a new hero...).

[Evil Elvis]

I am disappointed that this doesn't make any sense.  I don't see how anything Hiro has done could have affected DL and changed his future.  They want to use fate as a way handcuff Hiro and added gravity to the story, but then break it later for no reason.  Sloppy.

The future episode said Nathan passed the "Linderman Act", so I assume he died before he did in the previous timeline.

But, I'm still not 100% convinced Linderman's dead.  Killing him and Eric Fucking Roberts in the same (not-finale) episode doesn't sit right.  For all we know, him and DL were both mirages by whats-her-name. 

If he is dead, there was either some change in the timeline by Hiro that isn't quite evident, or the writers dropped the ball.

[Merusk]

...in the same (not-finale) episode doesn't sit right. 

They've been advertising this week and next week as the "Two-Part Season Finale."  So in reality it's supposed to be one 2-hour long episode.. why it wasn't aired as such you'd have to ask the execs.

[CmdrSlack]

If he is dead, there was either some change in the timeline by Hiro that isn't quite evident, or the writers dropped the ball.

Nah, he can be dead and still have a piece of legislation named after him.  Moreover, if current-day events are different than described in the 5 years later episode, I don't see it as the writers dropping the ball.  I think it all depends on how you think about time travel.  Either destiny is immutable or it isn't.  I buy into a multiple futures thing, so I think that any actions taken by others in response to the events set in motion by saving Claire (there's quite a few if you think about it) cannot possibly be counted on to be the same as described in the five years later future.   Time travel is confusing without someone spelling out the specific mechanism by which it works, IMO.

[Evil Elvis]

Claire was alive in the future episode, where as DL was still dead from Sylar. The past obviously affects how the future turns out.  So, DL dying seems like it was a new change in the timeline.

Nathan hated Linderman (and Sylar doesn't know him), so I don't see why he'd pass a bill in his name if he wasn't alive at the time pushing for it to go through.

[Samwise]

Nathan hated Linderman (and Sylar doesn't know him), so I don't see why he'd pass a bill in his name if he wasn't alive at the time pushing for it to go through.

Irony?

[Mr_PeaCH]

I have been watching from the beginning with my daughter (10) and we typically take it in the following evening over dinner via DVR.  Last night I found myself doing a lot of reminding her of where plotlines were getting tied up from earlier in the season (like the girl being kept and healed by Mohinder and the head spook (Roberts) being the same girl the thought-hearing cop rescued from Sylar).  Anyways, we had our finest OMGWTF! moment when we both realised at the same time that the 'tracking device' Poppa Bennet and the cop are looking for *IS* the girl... probably about 30 minutes after the rest of you but, still... pretty cool beans.

She loves Hiro by the way but I'm sticking with Peter as *the one*.

[Dren]

I'd figured out the tracking device was her as soon as she said she can find people wherever they are.  That was a few episodes back. 

[Venkman]

You're so smart :)

Time travel is confusing without someone spelling out the specific mechanism by which it works, IMO.

Exacty. But it needs to be defined. This is either Back to the Future universe time or Star Trek multiverse time. Given how they've framed Hiro's ability, I'm going with universe. The nuances we can discuss, but the underlying theme of the show has almost always been Peter on his quest to save the world because +5 Hiro went back in time to tell him to do so, in order to change that future.

[Phildo]

Was anybody else bothered by how fast Hiro learned to swordfight after being a total nerd most of his life?

[Venkman]

Yea. However, there is as yet the unanswered question of just what Takei's power is. At the time I was annoyed by the scant hours it took Hiro to seemingly master Bushido. But since then I've been wondering if Takei's power is the ability to teach quickly. Would make sense of a few things.

[HaemishM]

Was anybody else bothered by how fast Hiro learned to swordfight after being a total nerd most of his life?

Only the little geek monkey inside of me. Let's face it, Hiro could take them both back in time to live for weeks, training the whole time, before popping forward fully trained. Or maybe Sulu has the power like Darniaq said. Either way, it was a minor quibble probably not worth taking 30 seconds to explain.

[MrHat]

Yea. However, there is as yet the unanswered question of just what Takei's power is. At the time I was annoyed by the scant hours it took Hiro to seemingly master Bushido. But since then I've been wondering if Takei's power is the ability to teach quickly. Would make sense of a few things.

Ya, I was thinking it was that, or some time pause thing that let them train and train, reset, and train and train.

[Nevermore]

There should have been a montage!

[Tale]

That was a really satisfying episode. The writers are delivering - I won't have any criticism of how they end it, because they've done so well already.

[Lakov_Sanite]

I liked to think Hiro already had sword training as part of growin up but never really had the 'heart' for it.  The little montage was his father instilling in him the will to use what talent he had.  In addition, he doesnt need to really know perfect sword skills, just enough to freeze time and cut someone's head off.  You don't need to be a bushido master when your opponent can't move.  You just need to have the willpower to slay them.

[Merusk]

There should have been a montage!

There was!  It just wasn't an 80's montage, it was a late 90's "tell the foreshadowing story w/ flashback while we train, then come back to the student kicking-ass" montage.

[CmdrSlack]

There should have been a montage!

There was!  It just wasn't an 80's montage, it was a late 90's "tell the foreshadowing story w/ flashback while we train, then come back to the student kicking-ass" montage.

Yeah, but an 80's montage, perhaps with a song by Dio, would have been kinda nifty too.