Television thread

[Reg]

OK Ming just chopped the finger off a slave girl because she cut him while she was shaving him. Now that's proper Mingish behaviour! He can't help it if he looks like Corbin Bernson.

The new Flash Gordon show rocks. 

[stray]

Sorry to ramble on about Smallville (LTTP and all that), but man, has anyone ever seen the Aquaman episode? That's about as cheesy as it gets (as if Aquaman wasn't already bad enough). I've seen more talent from porn stars.

The Green Arrow has turned out to be pretty cool though.

[Velorath]

Sorry to ramble on about Smallville (LTTP and all that), but man, has anyone ever seen the Aquaman episode? That's about as cheesy as it gets (as if Aquaman wasn't already bad enough). I've seen more talent from porn stars.

The Green Arrow has turned out to be pretty cool though.

Yeah, Aquaman was pretty much crap, but then as I've said, I think the bigger problem with the show is that it seems to lack any clear direction.  They don't seem to want to make Clark "Superman" until the end of the series, and they likely aren't going to end the series until the ratings are no longer there to support it.  I'm sure I'll probably watch the last five episodes of the series, in whatever season that happens to be in (fucking Charmed lasted 8 years), but until then I fully expect them to get by on dragging in various DC characters to guest star, or giving Superman characters recurring roles (maybe they'll bring in Bibbo for next season).

[stray]

I don't know.. Superman could come sooner. The Green Arrow dude is starting to chew Clark's ass out a lot about wasting his time bundling hay.

[EDIT] Wait a sec... How much of this have you seen? I'm only on last season still, but.... they pretty much have a version of the Justice League already (by name as well). Impulse/Flash, Cyborg, Green Arrow, and Aquaman are all a team. Martian Manhunter is starting to pop up, helping Clark now too.

[stray]

Vel, I recommend you give it a shot again. It really has a lot more direction than it would seem at first. Basically everything happening now is sort of like a long version of Kal El's training sequence in the beginning of the first movie. The whole rite of passage thing with Jor El, etc.. Less and less Dawson's Creek shit is happening, and like I said above, the DC universe is starting to flesh out as well. Green Arrow and the rest of those dudes are waiting on Clark to get his shit together, slowly forming Justice League, Martian Manhunter is starting to pop up, and the last season just ended on a cliffhanger battle between Clark Kent and Bizarro.


OK, enough about Smallville from me :)

[Velorath]

I don't know.. Superman could come sooner. The Green Arrow dude is starting to chew Clark's ass out a lot about wasting his time bundling hay.

[EDIT] Wait a sec... How much of this have you seen? I'm only on last season still, but.... they pretty much have a version of the Justice League already (by name as well). Impulse/Flash, Cyborg, Green Arrow, and Aquaman are all a team. Martian Manhunter is starting to pop up, helping Clark now too.

That in some ways is part of my problem with the show.  It seems like they're so bound to the name Smallville, and to their original plans of never having Clark suit up as Superman until possibly the end of the series, that they're holding him back, but trying to move things forward by introducing the Justice League, Supergirl, Lois Lane, and Jimmy Olson.  It's got this bizarre feel like "we can't move Clark into Metropolis yet, so let's just have everyone else end up in Smallville for various reasons".

[stray]

They're not doing a bad job at that though. Sure, they're redefining some things, but it's not done outrageously or anything like that. About the only ones who are really fleshed out and know themselves are the Green Arrow and Aquaman. Cyborg's a newb, Impulse/Flash is still a kid. Supergirl has a long way to go. Lex has his moments, but he's not complete dick just yet. Lois is only now getting into reporting. Everyone is kind of figuring themselves out in a way just like Clark is.

Secondly, although it's called Smallville, it's taking place there less and less as time goes on. He doesn't meet up with Green Arrow except in Metropolis (and I think his team mainly works out of Star City or some shit).

[HaemishM]

I've said it before, I'll say it again. No cape, no watch.

[stray]

Lol, well.. umm.. He's got a red jacket, with a blue t-shirt ;)


Seriously though... Currently (finally up to date on the last episode), Clark's being a shit about the cape thing. I get ya. Some chick actually gave him a red cape, but he just hung it up by his barn.

...

One final thing -- I think it's hilarious that Zod (Terrence Stamp) is the voice of Jor-El. It's also kind of cool how everyone who's been involved with Superman productions over the past 30 years has made an appearance in the show. Chris Reeves being the big one. Then Margot Kidder. Helen Slater as his Kryptonian mother. Dean Kain. Even the chick that plays Martha Kent was Lana in one of the Reeves movies. Now if only they could get Gene Hackman and Ned Beatty somehow...

[schild]

Shows creators said they never wanted to have him in a cape.

Mostly because capes are for jerks. It's like the graphical stamp of gay.

Anyway, Justice League getting formed? Time to pick up the rest of the DVDs.

[Evildrider]

Shows creators said they never wanted to have him in a cape.

Mostly because capes are for jerks. It's like the graphical stamp of gay.

Anyway, Justice League getting formed? Time to pick up the rest of the DVDs.

It's actually a copywright thing.  They said they wouldn't ever be able to show him in the full costume on Smallville.  That may change if the Superman/superboy legal troubles ever get finalized.

And yeah the Justice League.. is sort of formed already, with Green Arrow leading Impulse, Cyborg, and Aquaman.  Supes hasn't really officially joined them.  Also Chloe pretty much acted as their communications/info officer in one of the episodes with the codename watchtower.

Last season and this season have been pretty good.

[HaemishM]

Gay or not, without the cape, he's not Superman. Now, if they wanted to do a Conner Kent thing and give him the black T-Shirt with the red S, I'd be able to go with them. But without that? He's just generic bohunk superhero guy.

[stray]

Umm, a "bohunk" is another word for gypsy/bohemian. Last I checked, Tom Welling wasn't even close to that description

..

Seriously though... I know what you mean -- but think you're wrong. It's more than that. The main gist of the character, as it stands so far in the show, is him trying to come to grips with his Kryptonian identity and that of being raised as a human. In this version of story, he fights the path handed to him by Jor-El (who has it more in mind for him to be a sort of ruler, albeit a benevolent one), and at the same time, considers Jonathan Kent, with all of the humanity that Jor-El lacks, to still be a little small minded. Instead of following either one fully, Clark slowly creates something on his own from the two.

So that's what keeps me interested. The idea that Clark himself creates Superman. That it isn't a part of his "destiny" at all. That he has to learn a lot of things before making it to that point.

[Velorath]

Anyway, Justice League getting formed? Time to pick up the rest of the DVDs.

It's a Justice League made up of Clark, Flash, Green Arrow, Cyborg, and Aquaman (they haven't been allowed to put Bruce Wayne in the show, and Wonder Woman is unlikely also).

[stray]

Someone explain to me these "copyright" issues. What's that supposed to mean? Why no suit? Why no Bruce Wayne? It's all owned by Time Warner, right? I figure that they could put Neo and Bugs Bunny in the show if they really wanted to.

[Velorath]

Someone explain to me these "copyright" issues. What's that supposed to mean? Why no suit? Why no Bruce Wayne? It's all owned by Time Warner, right? I figure that they could put Neo and Bugs Bunny in the show if they really wanted to.

In the case of Bruce Wayne, it's not a copyright issue.  It's some sort of conflict with WB's film division, who apparently don't want Bruce Wayne to appear on Smallville, I guess because they see it as something that could potentially hurt the Batman movies.

[Trippy]

Someone explain to me these "copyright" issues. What's that supposed to mean? Why no suit? Why no Bruce Wayne? It's all owned by Time Warner, right? I figure that they could put Neo and Bugs Bunny in the show if they really wanted to.

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2006/08/02/superboy-copyright-faq/

[stray]

Hmm, it's a shame and all how they screwed Seigel back in the day, but as far as my entertainment goes, I hope the case is ruled in DC's favor and "Superboy" is never brought up again. Hell, the character in the show isn't nearly a "boy" anyhow. He hasn't been in a highschool for a few seasons, and even when he was, I'd hardly consider highschool to be a "boy's age" either. Lastly, the actor playing him is in his 30's.

And as far as the show is currently being written, he is very much Superman. Chloe already jokingly calls him that, and he's been called the Man of Steel several times by others. Also, the traditional "S" logo pops up throughout the show. I figured that he just didn't have the suit because that's not where the story is at yet.

[EDIT]

In the case of Bruce Wayne, it's not a copyright issue.  It's some sort of conflict with WB's film division, who apparently don't want Bruce Wayne to appear on Smallville, I guess because they see it as something that could potentially hurt the Batman movies.

I suppose that Wayne isn't really necessary yet anyhow. He doesn't become Batman until, like, he's in his mid-20's, early 30's or something right? With Supes already the defacto "veteran" superhero by then. So I guess it doesn't fit with Smallville's chronology anyways.

[Trippy]

Hell, the character in the show isn't nearly a "boy" anyhow. He hasn't been in a highschool for a few seasons, and even when he was, I'd hardly consider highschool to be a "boy's age" either. Lastly, the actor playing him is in his 30's.

Superboy was of that age (high school) when he was part of the Legion of Super-Heroes and in fact of whole slew of those characters had "Boy" or "Kid" names -- that's just how their creators named them back then.

[HaemishM]

Copyright law is SO FUCKED. While I would normally agree with authors claiming copyright on their creations, especially after the dirty tricks Warner used in the 40's to make their own Superboy, Mr. Siegel is dead. His family, like the Tolkein family, is exerting way too much influence over the copyrights of the original author. It's legal, but copyright was never meant to be an inheritance, it was meant to protect a living author from being screwed. To me, what the Siegels are doing is just as fucked as what Disney does with their attempts to protect Steamboat Mickey.

And what about Schuster? Is he not getting any of this luv for a character he helped create?

[Abagadro]

You think that story is messy you should check out what has been going on with the Winnie the Pooh copyright case for the last 20 years.

[schild]

Gay or not, without the cape, he's not Superman.

Superman is an idea. Not a costume. Don't be a punk.

[tazelbain]

Gay or not, without the cape, he's not Superman.

Superman is an idea. Not a costume. Don't be a punk.

LOL, you are touchy.  You quit smoking or something?

[schild]

Gay or not, without the cape, he's not Superman.

Superman is an idea. Not a costume. Don't be a punk.

LOL, you are touchy.  You quit smoking or something?

Eh? What's touchy about that?

[HaemishM]

Gay or not, without the cape, he's not Superman.

Superman is an idea. Not a costume. Don't be a punk.

No, Superman is an icon. Icons can be fucked with, but some things must remain consistent or the idea is lost. Supes without the cape is like Jesus without the cross.

[schild]

Gay or not, without the cape, he's not Superman.

Superman is an idea. Not a costume. Don't be a punk.

No, Superman is an icon. Icons can be fucked with, but some things must remain consistent or the idea is lost. Supes without the cape is like Jesus without the cross.

You're crazy.

[Trippy]

I won't go as far and say that Superman without a cape isn't Superman but he definitely looks "wrong" to me when drawn without it, as does Batman for that matter.

[stray]

Capes are cool when he's flying.

Umm... Perhaps that's why the original artists gave him one in the first place.

[Paelos]

Superman is all about the blue and red, a big S, and a silly haircut. I don't think the cape is going to break up my view of the icon.

[Sky]

Supes without the cape is like Jesus without the cross.

So it would be Superman without all the tacked-on psuedo-mystical magic reincarnation mythos garbage that totally clouds the true message he came here to give?

You just made Superman without a cape so much more interesting.

[Yegolev]

Superman without a cape is Moses.  Sheesh.

[stray]

Moses had a cape too.

[HaemishM]

Supes without the cape is like Jesus without the cross.

So it would be Superman without all the tacked-on psuedo-mystical magic reincarnation mythos garbage that totally clouds the true message he came here to give?

You just made Superman without a cape so much more interesting.

Supes without a cape is just another hero with super-strength who can fly. The cape (and really the whole costume, Big S and all) is what makes him an identifable icon. Smallville's Clark isn't an identifiable icon, he's just an angsty teen heartthrob with superpowers. He might as well be Peter on Heroes (though I think Peter is cooler).

If they didn't try to convince me it's Superman, i.e. called it something besides Smallville, and him something besides Clark Kent, I'd probably be able to watch it. But my comic geek roots won't let me enjoy a Superman that purposefully ignores the cape/costume combo.

[stray]

OK, now I'm in agreement with Schild. I mean, the cape is cool, but hardly what seperates him from other characters. I don't even read the comics and know that at least. I think the only one cheapening Superman is you.

[Reg]

Clark is wearing the red and blue Superman colours constantly this season. The cape will come eventually.