Go Play....NOW!

[Strazos]

Just a heads up to all of you not in the know....

The game kicks ass, go get a pre-order box and play a bit before it's too late.

This is the first night I have ever played the pvp....and it was some of the best online gaming I have ever had, and it all seems pretty balenced.

Don't cheat yourself - Go Get Some.

Note: Unfortunately, the PvP is nto for those who are a bit sluggish on the keyboard.

[schild]

I don't know. It's all mediocre. I'm still picking it up, though I'll have little time to play. I'm more excited by the fact I can just play whenever I want since it's sub-free.

Don't know if I care about the Ltd Ed though. Maybe. Maybe not. Art Books are niiiiiiiiiiiiice though.

[RVWinkle]

I'm suprised more people aren't interested in this game. Minimal grind, balanced pvp, low catassing. Shit I've mostly played the pvm stuff and I love the world and quests. The pvm content is worth $50 in itself, there's a whole nother game you get for that price that I haven't even tried.

I was prancing around in this bloom filtered fantasy world (reminisent of the elves in the LOTR movies) thinking I had already seen everything, turns out the whole world I had explored is like a square inch on the world map. Then everything got blown the fuck up and it all changed, turns out I had spent all day and 1/3 of my whole character development in the newbie area. I'll stop now because I've become a total fanboy.

[Shockeye]

The PVM/PVE shit bored me to tears last month.

I'm considering cancelling my pre-order.

[Trippy]

This game is still crashing with a graphics driver error after a few minutes of play on my main machine. Ah well...

[Strazos]

Yah, I know 1 person who had the beta crash on him. I honestly can't figure it out, because it works flawlessly on my machine.

[Margalis]

Wow, the wind really went out of the sails on this one.

It took forever to come out, and from what I've seen/heard the final version isn't really all that much better different than it was 6 months to a year ago.

PvP seems nice but for someone like me who doesn't play too often I'm sure it would be find random crappy group, get owned, repeat.

[Signe]

Yes, it's not as shiny as it seemed it might be in the beginning.  I enjoy the little bit of PvP I've done but the rpg side is rather "meh".  Hopefully, it'll improve as expansions are released.  I don't think I could use this as my main mmog... but I sort of knew that from the start.  I agree, however, it's nice to have a game that doesn't require a subscription and that in itself will probably make this game a big hit.  Especially with non CC holding population. (teens)

[Strazos]

I played most of the Pre-Charr Ascalon stuff, and I thought it was alright, somewhere between WoW and EQ2. I'm just going to miss playing with lvl20 characters to experiment with different builds I think of.

[Shockeye]

Yes, it's not as shiny as it seemed it might be in the beginning.  I enjoy the little bit of PvP I've done but the rpg side is rather "meh".  Hopefully, it'll improve as expansions are released.  I don't think I could use this as my main mmog... but I sort of knew that from the start.  I agree, however, it's nice to have a game that doesn't require a subscription and that in itself will probably make this game a big hit.  Especially with non CC holding population. (teens)

And we all sure love them from b.net.

[trias_e]

I loved the PvP the first beta weekend I played.  Unfortunately, the past few beta weekends I have realized just how important being in a 'hardcore' guild is for this game, and am thus quite a bit less interested.  I actually enjoyed to some extent the PvE, but not enough to justify it being in a primarily PvP game.  I can't help but think that the resources they are squandering on that side of the game should be put to better use elsewhere.

Overall, I still think the game is fun, but I am definitely less excited about it than before.  Maybe if I can find a good competetive guild I could have some fun with this one.

[Strazos]

Unfortunately, catass guilds are important for any game these days. You should still be able to do well in the random team games.

[Signe]

Unfortunately, catass guilds are important for any game these days. You should still be able to do well in the random team games.

I don't agree. 

Catass guilds are definitely necessary in some games.  This one, perhaps, SB, Lineage2... but not in the more popular recent games such as WoW, CoH and EQ2.  In fact, except for the indie games coming out...  DnL, Darkfall, etc...  I think you can get along quite nicely with more casual guilds.  With WoW, you don't need a guild at all.  EQ2 is very group oriented but even they are adding solo content and I have a feeling that 'casual' is a trend that mmorpgs are leaning towards... at least the ones made by big name companies.  WoW will probably have set this standard for anyone who wants huge numbers of subscribers.  If we want to play a game with full PvP that gives rewards, we might have to turn to those little indie games that seem to be having such a difficult time even getting themselves released.  Wish and Mourning sort of proved that to me.  Even though there might be a part of the gaming population that has a desire for that sort of game, they are not a large enough group to actually successfully sustain one.

WoW proved that casual guilds and anti-social loners are the money makers and any company with capitalistic tendancies will accomodate them.  I've also noticed that many of the indie games I follow, the ones that some of the more hardass SB and UO guilds would be attracted to, are filled with many more Europeans than I'm used to seeing.  A lot of the games are originating in Europe, too.  The need for casual and loner doesn't seem to have invaded Europe as much as the US.  I think we've become a nation of apathetic carebear gamers and the only thing that gets our dander up is someone who tries to interfere with our casual loner carebearness.  That's when we complain to mommy and... guess what?  For once she seems to be listening.

Dammit.

(Shockeye, what the hell is wrong with your avatar?)

[trias_e]

That explanation for WoW works until you hit level 60.  At that point, the need for a raiding guild simply rises and rises until the player either joins ones or quits.  There is very little else to do at that point and WoW seems to totally change focus at 60.  Just like in EQ, you don't need a guild at all until you are high level.  Just like in EQ there is an end-game which requires catass raiding guilds.  The game is 100% a total EQ clone, and is nothing different whatsoever other than polished execution.  Thus, as far as WoW goes, there is no lasting change of focus from the group player to the solo player.  The game basically is a solo game which turns into a hardcore raiding game, instead of a group game which turns into a hardcore raiding game.  So to recap:  Nothing has really changed.

Battlegrounds may change this, but they are still aways off.

[Dren]

Signe, I'd agree with you on WoW right up until level 60.  At that point, there is nothing to do but PvP (just for kicks right now) or do the high level raids.  Unless you want to do high level raids with a bunch of idiots that either get you killed repeatedly or ninja loot all the goodies afterward, you need to join up with a very good sized group of people you can trust.

You can be very independent from 1-60 quite easily, but unless you plan to just quit at 60, you'll need to make friends in uber guilds.

Oh yeah...GW.  Yep, I'll be getting it and I do like the PvE.  Yes, it is nothing different, but there is a lot of it and I can play it when I want and as slow as I want.  The PvP is going to be the icing that tastes oh so good. 

I take it I missed another Beta Weekend?  I knew I forgot something.

[Mesozoic]

Unfortunately, the past few beta weekends I have realized just how important being in a 'hardcore' guild is for this game, and am thus quite a bit less interested. 

If you're talking about "hardcore" in the sense that you need a catass guild that spends lots of time beating on uber mobs for uber loot to compete in PvP, then

1) I totally agree with you, and
2) GW has flubbed its major design goal of skill-based pvp.

But if you're talking about a hardcore guild that practices pvp a lot to hone their teamwork and pvp "skills" as it were, then thats just the nature of competitive games.  Its no use to ask that other humans stop trying so hard to win in direct competition. 

[Hoax]

I'm with Mesozoic on this one, its not catass'ing or uber guilding when you are doing it for non-zerg pvp.

There is little to no advantage to having 20+ people in your guild and unless something has changed dramatically getting all the skills for your two classes will not be too hard or time consuming and definately will not require a "uber guild".

Anyways, thats like saying you need an uber guild for tribes, you dont unless you want to be top20 and involved in the highest levels of competition.  The real question is, will there be a middle ground for lower committment pvp'ers, but I would hardly say that makes this a catass required game.

[e_bortion]

Maybe this thread should be moved to WoW forums 

[trias_e]

Going back to GW now ; ).

The real issue I had with the recent weekends is that I had alot of trouble having any fun in the game solo.  If I cannot have fun soloing or in pickup groups, then I will need a coordinated guild, who will always be on when I am, who I always like to work with, etc.  By 'hardcore' I basically meant guildmates who play the game all the time.  Because if I get on and no one from my guild was on, I would have little fun in the game.

So no, it had nothing to do with massive numbers, or PvE grinding.  It has to do with finding a guild that is A) active, and B) enjoyable to be around, a close-knit group that knows what they are doing.  I have alot of trouble finding guilds like these for some reason.

Again, this isn't a real gamebreaking issue for me, especially when the game goes live.  I do prefer games where I can solo and have fun if I so choose.  Guild Wars is right on the edge of that line.  Since there's no sub-fee, I'll be much more inclined to buy it and see how it goes in the live version.

[Stephen Zepp]

Does anyone have any new info on how GW plans on staying profitable? Everyone keeps saying how they like the no sub fees, but I'm still trying to wrap my head around how they will pay for the server infrastructure upkeep costs.

Most of the people are saying that they will play for pvp but not much else, and only casually--do you plan/will you purchase the expansion packs as they come out, since this is how GW appears to plan on funding continued costs?

[Shockeye]

I'm going to guess that there'll be expansion packs every 3-4 months probably running around $29.99 or so.

[Stephen Zepp]

I'm going to guess that there'll be expansion packs every 3-4 months probably running around $29.99 or so.

Yeah, that's what they suggested (although not sure on the rate of release), but with everyone talking about wanting to play it pretty much just for pvp, and only casually at that, I'm wondering if the revenue model is going to work.

GW is one of the first MMOG's to try a seriously different revenue model, and it's got a lot of attention in various forums...if it works, it opens up a lot of options, but overall not many seem to positive it's going to work (me being one of them).

[Shockeye]

Well, as I've stated before, if the expansion packs have uber items that will help dominate in PVP, then people will buy them without question. See Trials of Atlantis.

[stray]

I really wouldn't give a shit if it had subscription fees or not. I'm going to have to catass either way, so it's already DOA to me.

[Hoax]

Still not seeing any catass'ing.  Unless you consider playing the game, learning the maps, having a mic and practicing/discussing pvp strats catass'ing.

Also hopefully they will not just power creep everything (they will) with the expansions.  Instead due to their system I expect them to add 1-2 new classes per expansion as well as some skills to all the existing classes.  Eventually there will be a major power creep ala TOA but I doubt it will come with the game b0rking grind o doom...

[HaemishM]

I look at GW like I look at UT. You'll have the first few weeks of hardcore playing, which in GW will amount to levelling up and getting as many skills as you can. Then after that, you can either become a dedicated hardcore player, at which point you will need a guild/clan, or you become casual and play it when you want to. Since it doesn't require a sub, unless you have to be the bestest of the bestest and the smelliest of the smelliest, I don't see where you will need a solid ubah type guild.

[Margalis]

My problem is that a team-based competitive game requires a team to practice together a lot, especially in a game like GW where is seems like coordination is more important than individual skill. I just don't have time for that. I guess I'll stick to things like SF:AE for XBox.

[Mesozoic]

As far as it being soloable to 20th...probably not.  Afer all, the focus of the game is pvp, and the pvp is totally and deliberately a team exercise.  One would expect that design mindset to express itself in the pve as well.  What good would it do to have a 20th level character in GW with no regular friends or reliable guildmates anyway?  You'd need solo-able pvp, but the devs have explicitly stated that the pvp is balanced and focused on the 8v8....its just not looking like a solo game. 

I for one fear that each successive expansion will be more or less required to stay competitive in pvp.  That has to be a huge temptation for the devs.  Developers going out of their way to make sure that people can get by without their newest product runs counter to every business instinct.

[Hoax]

As long as it comes with entirely new classes and new shiney does that matter though?  I mean I'd rather pay $30 every 3 months for a box or a download where I know there are tons of new shit then $45 for 3 months of Blizzard telling me they may or may not patch something eventually...

I'm not sure this revenue model is perfect, I'm surprised they didn't go w/ a small (like 2.50-$5) sub fee that could easily be purchased by kids via some gamecard system at the local game store just so they can make good expansions and aren't in too much of a timecrunch to get them out.

Also I hope they are smart enough to see this is a GREAT lancenter game, all metropolitan Gaming places should have a guildwars guild or two, if they can pry their idiot customers away from SC or CS long enough to try something that hasn't been the same for 5 years...

[schild]

Also I hope they are smart enough to see this is a GREAT lancenter game, all metropolitan Gaming places should have a guildwars guild or two, if they can pry their idiot customers away from SC or CS long enough to try something that hasn't been the same for 5 years...

Hasn't combat in MMORPGs just been variations on the same things for 10 years?

I think I'm missing the point. I mean, I see the point, I just well, shit, I'm very jaded.

I want to play Guild Wars. Really, I do. I enjoy what it does, I enjoy the casualness, I enjoy the content. Simply put, I'm enjoying this modern Renaissance we're currently experiencing whatwith titles like God of War, Jade Empire, and a host of other things I can't seem to put down.

[Strazos]

God, I wish I had made videos of my PvP action just to showcase the beastly potential of the play.

Here's a big plus: this is the first game where I have actually Liked healing.

[stray]

God, I wish I had made videos of my PvP action just to showcase the beastly potential of the play.

Here's a big plus: this is the first game where I have actually Liked healing.

Did you ever play Shadowbane?

Btw, I haven't played GW in quite a while --- Any other SB vets enjoying it?

[Shockeye]

God, I wish I had made videos of my PvP action just to showcase the beastly potential of the play.

Here's a big plus: this is the first game where I have actually Liked healing.

Did you ever play Shadowbane?

Btw, I haven't played GW in quite a while --- Any other SB vets enjoying it?

No.

[Signe]

I know a few SB vets outside f13 who are playing or have played GW and some of them quite like it, but none who have talked about it think it compares favourably to even SB beta and none are making it the focus for their primary game.  Two of those people were in naughty SB guilds and both hate it.  I suppose they don't see enough good 'sploiting possibilities. 

As I said before, I can't see this as more than a 'once in a while' thing to do.  I probably won't play at all if there isn't a significant number of people I know playing it.  Well, at least enough to make a decent group.

[Shockeye]

I'm 95% sure I'm cancelling the pre-order. I have no real desire to play this game anymore due to the preview weekends. It's not because I got burned out, it's because I was underwhelmed by it.