Ahsoka (Disney+)

[Trippy]

Ahsoka | Teaser Trailer | Disney+

Streaming August 2023.

[Khaldun]

Well, there's my thought about Thrawn and Snoke in the Mandalorian thread made good, I think.

But who's the bearded guy with the red lightsaber?

Ezra?

[Threash]

I thought it was animated at first, nope just kinda colorful. Those lightsabers looked more orangey than red to me.

[Riggswolfe]

I thought it was animated at first, nope just kinda colorful. Those lightsabers looked more orangey than red to me.

I noticed that too. I wonder if they're going to be some other faction of Force users or something.

[HaemishM]

I liked the trailer. But for a time where there are few Jedi left, there sure are a lot of lightsaber-wielding motherfuckers around.

[Tebonas]

They are rediscovering a Jedi every few days in the Canon. It Star Wars Galaxies all over again, only with less Dancers 

[Threash]

Well since Ahsoka is not a Jedi it makes sense to give her some non sith but adjacent enemies.

[Khaldun]

Much as I think the Jedi have to rethink what they're doing (apparently we'll have to wait for Daisy Ridley to do that in a new movie), maybe Dark Side-ish Jedi are thinking "you know, hm, the Rule of Two is kind of fucking dumb". Or arguably maybe they've been thinking that all along.

I'd still love to see a non-martial group of Force users, e.g., people who don't fuck around with training and organization but who are close to the Force because they live intensely--because they're close to life and death, to the rhythms of being. That's a classic branching of religions--most organized religions end up with a group who are philosophers/mystics who don't think much of the guys wearing uniforms, owning real estate and contending for power.

[Riggswolfe]

Much as I think the Jedi have to rethink what they're doing (apparently we'll have to wait for Daisy Ridley to do that in a new movie), maybe Dark Side-ish Jedi are thinking "you know, hm, the Rule of Two is kind of fucking dumb". Or arguably maybe they've been thinking that all along.

I'd still love to see a non-martial group of Force users, e.g., people who don't fuck around with training and organization but who are close to the Force because they live intensely--because they're close to life and death, to the rhythms of being. That's a classic branching of religions--most organized religions end up with a group who are philosophers/mystics who don't think much of the guys wearing uniforms, owning real estate and contending for power.

Some of the Star Wars novels and comic books have groups like this. Various monks and shamans that aren't Jedi or Sith and just kind of do their own thing. I don't know a ton about them and have mostly just heard about them in various places here and there. Even Jedi: Fallen Order talks about another Force tradition with the Zeffo and their various tombs though honestly it's a bit odd since you never really find out much about them other than a Jedi Master hid a holocron in one of their tombs and one of them went to Dathomir and fell to the Dark side and became a tyrant.

[Samwise]

I'd still love to see a non-martial group of Force users, e.g., people who don't fuck around with training and organization but who are close to the Force because they live intensely--because they're close to life and death, to the rhythms of being. That's a classic branching of religions--most organized religions end up with a group who are philosophers/mystics who don't think much of the guys wearing uniforms, owning real estate and contending for power.

I mean, in the original trilogy, that was Yoda, but then the prequels had to fuck it up.   

[Khaldun]

"Wars not make one great". Like, Yoda is not one to talk here. Let's just say I trust the wisdom better when the wise one has the balls to disclose that he's talking first and foremost about lessons from his own life.

[Samwise]

This is really why Star Wars peaked in the OT; all of these characters were way better when we didn't know their backstories.  Yoda was originally written as this wise hippie mystic, and he was irrevocably ruined the first time he pulled out a lightsaber.

[Riggswolfe]

"Wars not make one great". Like, Yoda is not one to talk here. Let's just say I trust the wisdom better when the wise one has the balls to disclose that he's talking first and foremost about lessons from his own life.

I mean, in fairness, he is talking from a place of learned cynicism. He had 20 years to sit there and go "You know, it was really stupid for us to be in that war..."

This is really why Star Wars peaked in the OT; all of these characters were way better when we didn't know their backstories.  Yoda was originally written as this wise hippie mystic, and he was irrevocably ruined the first time he pulled out a lightsaber.

Agreed. The clone wars and the Old Republic were 100X cooler when it was all in my imagination. Star Wars is what taught me to be wary of prequels and I can't think of a single prequel I have ever seen to any film or book series where I didn't go "it was cooler when I didn't know every single bit of backstory..."

Ok...maybe the Hobbit is an exception...

[Samwise]

Ok...maybe the Hobbit is an exception...

The Hobbit was written first, so it's not a prequel.   

[Khaldun]

The only time prequels work is when they surprise you--when what you think was the case *isn't* or when it makes everything you've seen so much deeper and better. Andor makes Rogue One (and really all of Star Wars) better.

If the OT had grasped the nettle and stopped with the "certain point of view" bullshit about Obi-Wan lying--if Obi-Wan had sat down with Luke at the beginning of ROTJ and said, "Look, Yoda and I have lied to you; we're scared and confused. The Jedi got their asses kicked by Vader and the Emperor, and we're out of ideas. The Force isn't telling us what to do any longer. It's all up to you, Luke: your instincts are the only right thing we have"? That would have sold what happens in the end so much harder. And then if the prequels had been "How did Obi-Wan and Yoda, these wise souls, get themselves into this situation? What went wrong?" the prequels would have worked. But Lucas didn't have the imagination to go there, so it's left to viewers to try and push the subtext into text.

[HaemishM]

I think by the time ROTJ was written, Lucas and Star Wars was already so wildly successful that he probably couldn't physically envision a different scenario. The accepted wisdom that had become dogma of the Jedi couldn't fail because he had become a part of that successful machine that was Hollywood, instead of an outsider trying to impose his vision on the world.

Also, merchandising.

[Riggswolfe]

Ok...maybe the Hobbit is an exception...

The Hobbit was written first, so it's not a prequel.   

I guess I tend to think of a prequel as any work that precedes another but technically a prequel does need to be made later so point conceded! Also, it just proves that nope, I can't think of a single actual prequel that added anything good to a work of fiction.

[Setanta]

The Hobbit is a great stand alone novel. My generation tended to read it before LotR. Just ignore the fact that Jackson butchered the story and dragged it out horribly... and yeah, you are right, the films did nothing for Middle Earth, unlike the book.

[Riggswolfe]

The Hobbit is a great stand alone novel. My generation tended to read it before LotR. Just ignore the fact that Jackson butchered the story and dragged it out horribly... and yeah, you are right, the films did nothing for Middle Earth, unlike the book.

I've never seen the Hobbit films. I was super annoyed they took a short(ish) novel and made it into a trilogy. I knew they'd just add lots of useless padding to it and so I never bothered.

[Khaldun]

Jean Rhys, Wide Sargasso Sea (prequel to Jane Eyre, not by original author) is one of the few examples I can think of--the sort of prequels that are also commentaries upon the original, those work ok. Or "sidequels" that retell the main story from a perspective of a main character, e.g. Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are dead.

[HaemishM]

Prequels are the dry hump of serial fiction.

Not saying they can't be good, but the ones that serve no purpose other than fan service, author paychecks, or "expounding on things that didn't need more words written about them" are the worst. I'm thinking of things like the movie Solo, and doing things like explaining why Han Solo had those dice on the Falcon, or how he got the name Solo.

[Khaldun]

Completely idiotic.

Han Solo plainly had a lot of adventures before meeting Our Heroes, so SHOW US THOSE. We don't need him explained that way; he's explanation enough when we see him. He's an archetype--a fun one. The idea that "Solo" is meaningful AS THE WORD blows up the entire fucking Star Wars universe. You mean *all those assholes* who have names that sound like English have 'meaningful names'? How did "Sleazebaggano" get his name?

[Riggswolfe]

Prequels are the dry hump of serial fiction.

Not saying they can't be good, but the ones that serve no purpose other than fan service, author paychecks, or "expounding on things that didn't need more words written about them" are the worst. I'm thinking of things like the movie Solo, and doing things like explaining why Han Solo had those dice on the Falcon, or how he got the name Solo.

Solo was a sort of fun movie but yeah, the name bit was just extremely dumb and should never have been put to film. I didn't mind the dice or him getting his gun from Woody but the name just made me groan.

[Velorath]

Best prequel I can think of is Better Call Saul, but yeah, most of them are garbage.

That said, I'm a lot more interested in The Acolyte (mostly due to the cast and the showrunner) which is set during the High Republic era and thus technically a prequel, than I am in anything I've seen for Ahsoka so far. Skeleton Crew doesn't sound especially interesting either although it at least sounds like it's doing something slightly different.

[Setanta]

Completely idiotic.

Han Solo plainly had a lot of adventures before meeting Our Heroes, so SHOW US THOSE. We don't need him explained that way; he's explanation enough when we see him. He's an archetype--a fun one. The idea that "Solo" is meaningful AS THE WORD blows up the entire fucking Star Wars universe. You mean *all those assholes* who have names that sound like English have 'meaningful names'? How did "Sleazebaggano" get his name?

I didn't hate Rogue One now that I think of it. Sure it had a few problems, but if anything, the gaining of the Deathstar plans was more interesting than midichlorians.

[Riggswolfe]

Best prequel I can think of is Better Call Saul, but yeah, most of them are garbage.

That said, I'm a lot more interested in The Acolyte (mostly due to the cast and the showrunner) which is set during the High Republic era and thus technically a prequel, than I am in anything I've seen for Ahsoka so far. Skeleton Crew doesn't sound especially interesting either although it at least sounds like it's doing something slightly different.

I don't consider something like the Acolyte a prequel. To me a prequel is something like an extended prologue for earlier work that fills in backstory. The Acolyte is unconnected to the main Star Wars films so doesn't really count.

I didn't hate Rogue One now that I think of it. Sure it had a few problems, but if anything, the gaining of the Deathstar plans was more interesting than midichlorians.

Hmmm...Rogue One is a good example of a rare prequel that works. It focuses on one thing and doesn't go out of its way to fill in every little detail of past events in the most silly way possible.

[Threash]

Best prequel I can think of is Better Call Saul

Yeah, a prequel that actually makes the original better is hard to top.

[Velorath]

I don't consider something like the Acolyte a prequel. To me a prequel is something like an extended prologue for earlier work that fills in backstory. The Acolyte is unconnected to the main Star Wars films so doesn't really count.

Yeah, that wasn’t really part of the prequel discussion, just me rating my interest in upcoming D+ Star Wars shows. Ahsoka, as pure live action Filoni, will have to work hard to win me over.

[Riggswolfe]

I don't consider something like the Acolyte a prequel. To me a prequel is something like an extended prologue for earlier work that fills in backstory. The Acolyte is unconnected to the main Star Wars films so doesn't really count.

Yeah, that wasn’t really part of the prequel discussion, just me rating my interest in upcoming D+ Star Wars shows. Ahsoka, as pure live action Filoni, will have to work hard to win me over.

I love Filoni's Star Wars content. I think he actually has a better grasp of Star Wars than George Lucas does or at least, what fans care about and want to see. The Clone Wars actually made me care about Anakin and somehow made Ahsoka into an amazing character. Rebels was just plain fun especially in the last 2 seasons. I'm looking forward to Ahsoka more than the Acolyte to be honest because I trust Filoni to make good content.

[Velorath]

I don't consider something like the Acolyte a prequel. To me a prequel is something like an extended prologue for earlier work that fills in backstory. The Acolyte is unconnected to the main Star Wars films so doesn't really count.

Yeah, that wasn’t really part of the prequel discussion, just me rating my interest in upcoming D+ Star Wars shows. Ahsoka, as pure live action Filoni, will have to work hard to win me over.

I love Filoni's Star Wars content. I think he actually has a better grasp of Star Wars than George Lucas does or at least, what fans care about and want to see. The Clone Wars actually made me care about Anakin and somehow made Ahsoka into an amazing character. Rebels was just plain fun especially in the last 2 seasons. I'm looking forward to Ahsoka more than the Acolyte to be honest because I trust Filoni to make good content.

[HaemishM]

I love Filoni's Star Wars content. I think he actually has a better grasp of Star Wars than George Lucas does or at least

Damning with faint praise.

[Riggswolfe]

I love Filoni's Star Wars content. I think he actually has a better grasp of Star Wars than George Lucas does or at least

Damning with faint praise.

Dave Filoni grew up with Star Wars. I guarantee you he got into a lot of nerdy arguments about stuff and thought about it a lot. You can tell when he does interviews where he talks about the lore. He's a super nerd about it. Lucas created it but somewhere along the line I think he lost his creative spark.

I personally think the Clone Wars and Rebels are some of the best Star Wars content ever made in any medium though both of them have their rough episodes of course. I mentioned it earlier and I'll say it again, I think the Mandalorian is probably struggling this season because Filoni is 100% focused on Ahsoka but in Seasons 1 and 2 he was more involved.

[Velorath]

Dave Filoni grew up with Star Wars. I guarantee you he got into a lot of nerdy arguments about stuff and thought about it a lot. You can tell when he does interviews where he talks about the lore. He's a super nerd about it. Lucas created it but somewhere along the line I think he lost his creative spark.

I personally think the Clone Wars and Rebels are some of the best Star Wars content ever made in any medium though both of them have their rough episodes of course. I mentioned it earlier and I'll say it again, I think the Mandalorian is probably struggling this season because Filoni is 100% focused on Ahsoka but in Seasons 1 and 2 he was more involved.

Most of the people on this board grew up with Star Wars, as did most of the people who made Star Wars shows or movies after Lucas (including JJ Abrams). That by itself doesn't give him any sort of special cred, it just means he grew up in the '70s/'80s.

Personally some of the worst elements of Mandalorian for me are the things pulled from Filoni's previous work. I can't eyeroll hard enough at the Darksaber as a plot device.

[Riggswolfe]

Most of the people on this board grew up with Star Wars, as did most of the people who made Star Wars shows or movies after Lucas (including JJ Abrams). That by itself doesn't give him any sort of special cred, it just means he grew up in the '70s/'80s.

Personally some of the worst elements of Mandalorian for me are the things pulled from Filoni's previous work. I can't eyeroll hard enough at the Darksaber as a plot device.

No, of course not. I just mean that he is a total lore nerd about it and it's not just a job he took on. I actually like his stuff. I'm more or less neutral on the Darksaber but that's mostly because I find Mandalorian culture sort of meh personally and always have. It's why I enjoyed Season 1 and 2 more as it felt like the story of a man slowly emerging from the brainwashing of his cult but Season 3 is hitting the reset button hard sadly.

I actually really enjoyed stuff like Ahsoka showing up but I really enjoyed his previous two shows as I admitted. My biggest single issue with Ahsoka in the Mandalorian was the casting if I'm honest but Rosario Dawson seems to be doing a good job with it.

[Khaldun]

The Mandalorians generally seem like a weird narrative cancer--like, here's Boba Fett, he's supposed to be something, he's a badass, he gets his ass handed to him in a ridiculous way, let's do some EU compensation for that, oh wait here comes Jango Fett oh shit the backstory is growing oh noes here is all this other stuff people think about them oh wow Clone Wars. Etc. Reading the whole backstory in order on a wiki is like "oh fuck this is really incoherent bullshit and these guys seem really stupid". It's like the opposite of the Klingons in Star Trek, who start just as oily oriental pseudo-Soviets and end up being pretty complicated but mostly consistent in their complications. The Mandalorians make *less* sense every time they get more attention.