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Author Topic: The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power (Prime Video)  (Read 15993 times)
Khaldun
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on: January 13, 2021, 12:27:23 PM

Apparently confirmed that this will focus on the Second Age--Numenor, the forging of the Rings of Power, the Last Alliance. Not a terrible choice.

Edit by Trippy: fixed subject
« Last Edit: February 14, 2022, 12:02:14 PM by Trippy »
Korachia
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Reply #1 on: January 13, 2021, 01:04:34 PM

It gives a lot of leverage in telling the story. This will be on my radar.
Khaldun
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Reply #2 on: January 13, 2021, 02:09:04 PM

Yeah. I mean, when you think of the way Tolkien describes Numenor in the Akallabeth, it's a pretty loose sketch rather than a fully-realized story. Rather Old Testament Kings of Israel stuff--Sauron as a charismatic seducer, corrupt and idolatrous kings, Byzantine court politics, but underneath it also a genuinely paralyzing fear about what happens to Men when they die. This isn't a world where God speaks to mortals even through a Moses but there are other beings around who know angels personally and know exactly what death means to them (basically, rezzing in a boring zone forever), which makes the very very remote and non-disclosing God of Tolkien's mythology even more frustrating for Men, especially Numenoreans.

Could be a way for them also to actually get into places like Umbar and the survival of some evil Numenoreans who really would be the opposite numbers of the Dunedain etc. Lot of places they can depict, lots of interesting story elements. I think they have the rights because this is all in LOTR in the Appendices in minimal ways, but even if the have the Silmarillion rights, staying away from the First Age is a good idea. I don't think there's a proper way to make the First Age look right visually--to give it the sense of scope and power and grandeur (even evil grandeur) that makes the Third Age look like a nursery school romper room.
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Reply #3 on: January 15, 2021, 06:44:57 AM

I think they have the rights because this is all in LOTR in the Appendices in minimal ways, but even if the have the Silmarillion rights, staying away from the First Age is a good idea. I don't think there's a proper way to make the First Age look right visually--to give it the sense of scope and power and grandeur (even evil grandeur) that makes the Third Age look like a nursery school romper room.
So I agree it's highly unlikely Hollywood could come up with a proper way to portray this era in the way it deserves.... but man, ever since I saw the opening battle scene in Fellowship, I've always wanted to see what a depiction of the Silmarillion would look like on screen.  No way to do it as a movie, it would have to be some 10 part one of series on HBO Max or whatever.  But yeah, they'd have to shoot it and act out the entire thing in a very different way than most films do.  Pure mythological epic power in how all the characters interact with each other, not just the battles.  So many scenes from that book still stand out in my mind that would be glorious to see on screen (but again, they look amazing in my mind.  I'm sure the results when given to some random Hollywood hack would be less than so).   

It's a pipe dream, but seeing a well done take of this era is probably the number one thing I want from TV before I die.

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Khaldun
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Reply #4 on: January 15, 2021, 09:05:06 AM

That battle scene WILL in fact be in this series--it's from the Second Age, not the First Age. It's only treated in the last small part of the work collected in The Silmarillion, it's the Last Alliance of Men and Elves. It's a bigger battle with more power players in it than the battles of LOTR but the participants aren't that dramatically different than the LOTR folks--Aragorn is pretty much of the stature of Elendil and Isildur (it's why he can wield Anduril and summon the Army of the Dead) and the elves involved are pretty much comparable (or the same) as those in LOTR. The only big players in LOTR who are not around are actually the Wizards, who don't show up until a thousand years later.

Whereas the First Age? The elves involved are godlike by comparison--Galadriel and Cirdan are the only ones around in the Third Age who are from that time, and they were minor players back then by comparison to Feanor's children or many others. The great among the First Age elves go one-on-one with balrogs and even dragons. There's a dragon that makes Smaug look puny by comparison. There are armies of balrogs and many dragons. Sauron is around as much more powerful vampire who is nevertheless dwarfed by the power of his master Morgoth. Shelob is a puny little child of Ungoliath. Morgoth's fortress and lands makes Mordor look like a child's toy. Even the human beings back in the First Age make Aragorn, Isildur, etc., look like toddlers in terms of their power and skill. When the First Age ends, it ends because the gods themselves decide to listen to the pleas of Elrond's father and come to Middle-Earth in person to fight Morgoth--but even though there's a lot of Valar who come to fight him, the fight isn't just over in a flash but goes on for a good while and essentially destroys the entire landmass of northern Middle-Earth as it was in the beginning.

That's pretty hard to visualize in a way that gets all of that across to an audience.
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Reply #5 on: January 15, 2021, 11:31:48 AM

That battle scene WILL in fact be in this series--it's from the Second Age, not the First Age. It's only treated in the last small part of the work collected in The Silmarillion, it's the Last Alliance of Men and Elves.
I know man.  ;)  I just meant in that, when I saw that battle on screen, it was actually really close to how I envisioned it, so have forever held out hope for similarly good portrayals of older battles since.  I am a LOTR Nerd, and the Silmarillion despite all odds is probably one of my most favorite novels of all time.  I fully understand the issues going into this, haha.

Quote
That's pretty hard to visualize in a way that gets all of that across to an audience.
This is what I was trying to get at before.  I have some amazing visuals in my head for these events..... but I doubt those will ever make it to screen.  It would require a director to take a tale and tell it from a god like perspective, and nobody really does that.

Somebody could do an amazing job at this whole series.... but most will probably do shit.  Best to let it just die in obscurity, but god, I can still dream.  Again, I love the Silmarillion.  Not just as a Tolkien/Fantasy book, but as one of my top books of all times.  I'm well aware this puts me in 'send them to the camps' territory, but here I am.

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Reply #6 on: January 15, 2021, 11:57:55 AM

Just chiming in to say that I really enjoy the Silmarillion as well.  You're not alone.
Khaldun
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Reply #7 on: January 15, 2021, 02:00:13 PM

I like it quite a bit too. I actually love thinking about the dangling storylines that it opens to imagine, really. Maglor is still wandering around the shores. Ungoliant is still alive somewhere in the south of Middle-Earth. The entire East by the Second Age is pretty open to imagination (especially since Tolkien's few notes on it are horrible rubbish and best forgotten). The culture of Numenor and the cities it founded in Middle-Earth is really open to imagination, especially as they developed further in the Third Age.

I think Tolkien does really well also with establishing the mythic scale of the First Age--it really does feel more Old Testament compared to the more Beowulf/Norse saga feel of LOTR.
 
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Reply #8 on: January 15, 2021, 09:12:43 PM

This is what I was trying to get at before.  I have some amazing visuals in my head for these events..... but I doubt those will ever make it to screen.  It would require a director to take a tale and tell it from a god like perspective, and nobody really does that.

So basically, what you are looking for is the "Hard Fantasy" equivalent of 300, dialed up to way past 11?

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Reply #9 on: January 16, 2021, 01:26:14 AM

Had to refresh myself on who is behind this:

Quote
In July 2018, it was announced that writing duo JD Payne and Patrick McKay would develop “The Lord of the Rings” for Amazon, serving as the series’ executive producers and showrunners. While it was a big move forward in terms of the series’ development, this particular news was a shock, especially because of the scale of the series. Prior to the news, Payne and McKay’s IMDB pages were empty, save for their uncredited writing job on “Star Trek Beyond.” But Star Trek” producer J.J. Abrams was reportedly one of a number of high-profile producers who recommended Payne and McKay for the position.

Given that the article also says Amazon had to commit to five seasons (and the first season has 20 episodes), I'm somewhat baffled that they handed this thing over to a couple unknowns based partly on J.J. Abrams recommending them. Between that and the fairly unknown cast (the only name I recognized was the replacement Naevia from Spartacus)  Amazon seems to have made a fairly big financial commitment in order to get the rights to do the show and then entrusted it a lot of people without a proven track record. They've got J.A. Bayona directing the first couple episodes and he's at least directed some fairly good movies, but also Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom. There's a couple writers who've done a few episodes each of a number of good shows, but the rest seem to have some fairly thin credits, worked on a good show or two but maybe only did 2-3 episodes, and there's a guy who wrote 11 episodes of Game of Thrones.

I don't know, it could end up being good. Certainly I'd be surprised if Amazon allowed something this high profile to be a complete failure. On paper though I'm just not seeing anything to suggest that anyone involved in this is up to the task of creating new stories set in Middle-Earth that are going to satisfy Tolkien fans, or fans who only know the Peter Jackson movies.
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Reply #10 on: January 16, 2021, 02:54:23 AM

I had not been aware of this and am a bit nervous we're going to get LotR the series without any attempt to communicate how it's different from the world of the Third Age. Will keep hoping this covers some of that, playing through Shadows of Mordor got me all excited about LotR stuff again, especially an interesting look at fleshing out those big names: Sauron, Shelob and Celebrimbor. That does give me hope that there are some stories worth telling in the Second Age that won't just strip out the 'majesty'. I guess my biggest worry is they try too hard to avoid the mythicness of it making it hard to connect to and shoot too much for relatable characters and motivations.

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Khaldun
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Reply #11 on: January 16, 2021, 06:03:39 AM

It'll be interesting to see where they start. The very early Second Age isn't really described much by Tolkien--the vast destruction of the War of Wrath was still cooling. I guess if they wanted to go early, they could show Men settling in Numenor and building a beautiful, wise and powerful kingdom, and the Elves who remain building up Eregion and being good buddies to Men AND Dwarves. (That's another thing the series can do, almost has to do: show Khazad-dum in its full glory--it's already significantly built up by the end of the First Age, though under attack by orcs all the time.)

I would guess they might just do that in a prologue like the first LOTR did.

Then I think after that you've got your dramatis personae:

Celembrimbor
Sauron, in the guise of Annatar

That's a key early relationship. Annatar/Sauron comes along to teach the Elves the art of crafting Rings of Power and then works with them to make the Seven and the Nine. In the meantime, Sauron builds what must at first have been a rather small and hidden secret base in Mordor to secretly forge the One Ring. But however they depict it, Celembrimbor has to be one of the few who doesn't trust Annatar, because he learns the art of ring-forging but makes the Three entirely on his own and secretly from Sauron.

The making of the Rings also lets them introduce:

The nine men who become Ringwraiths. We literally know nothing about them--Aragorn says as much. So that's interesting! I've always assumed they were Numenoreans, so this could be the first way we get introduced to the politics of Numenor, which will have to dominate the second major plot arc of the show. But they could also be from Umbar, Harad, and the East, which would make some sense also.

The seven leaders of the Dwarves who take the rings surely have to represent the seven houses--so it's a chance to really dive into dwarf-lore, to show us other places besides Khazad-dum.

Then probably in the end of the first season, you've got the putting on of the One Ring, Sauron revealing his armies (which likely have to include men from the East, so there's another subplot they could explore if they're so inclined), and the beginning of his war on the Elves.

There's a good subplot in that about the Dwarves--we know they resist the power of the Seven but they bugger off during the war with Sauron--Khazad-dum shuts its gates, and the Dwarves get embroiled in a completely separate war with orcs at Gundabad. (The balrog doesn't come into play until the Third Age, though.) Lots of good drama in that--the failure to unify and the origins of the hostility between Dwarves and Elves. The Elves are very nearly destroyed, so there's a good half-season or full season of episodes right there if you want, about the war and about it growing more desperate all the time. We know the proto-Ringwraiths are on Sauron's side the whole time--they could be his generals over combined forces of orcs, trolls, and men. (Maybe even a dragon or two?) Good chance to explore the power of the Rings, too--the Three Rings have to be sort of the only thing that keeps the Elves alive. Then you've got the Numenoreans showing up to save the day--that's a great season ender.

Sauron still has power in Mordor after--so that sets the stage for the next season--the Numenoreans grow arrogant, they think they're hot shit, better than the Elves, the saviors of Middle-Earth. I kind of think of them in this point basically like the United States after World War II, with the Elves being Europe. Or maybe worse, like the US at the end of the Cold War. But there's a significant time gap here before you get to the next turn. When you get there, you then you get to see Sauron humbled and taken prisoner, deserted by all of his armies, and the whole great storyline of his corruption of Ar-Pharazon. Sauron is still good-looking, he establishes a cult of Melkor/Morgoth (so here there's a fucking great chance to do a deep dive on the legendarium--I mean, if you join that cult, it's because you think Morgoth was right!) and starts to sacrifice good Numenoreans who are faithful to Eru. That could be some great shit if it's done right.

And then you've got the Last Alliance, which could easily be the final season.

slog
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Reply #12 on: January 25, 2021, 06:05:29 PM

Not getting my hopes up too high on this, but I can't wait to see what they come up with.  The source material isn't the easiest to work with.

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Reply #13 on: January 26, 2021, 10:36:23 AM

Just the fact that they are going for 20 episode seasons tells me they are probably not gonna be all that high quality.

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Khaldun
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Reply #14 on: January 26, 2021, 01:21:18 PM

Yeah, that's hard to really make sense of unless they're planning a whole bunch of weirdly talky bottle episodes where people just sit inside a simple interior and talk about forging Rings of Power. I hope they learned at least from watching Game of Thrones self-immolate that if you wanna be a fantasy epic, you gotta bring the epic pretty consistently and that fans will know full well when you're cheaping out on them by sending the inconveniently expensive CGI dire wolf out of the scene again. There are a bunch of expensive set designs and CGI exteriors that they can't skimp on if this is gonna work: Khazad-Dum in its glory, Eregion, Mordor, Numenor, probably Umbar, plus costumes etc.
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Reply #15 on: January 27, 2021, 06:40:24 AM

Video wall tech should make a lot of that stuff cheaper.
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Reply #16 on: February 10, 2022, 02:58:17 PM

https://twitter.com/VanityFair/status/1491759235402711047

Quote
In a bold move, #TheRingsOfPower condenses Tolkien’s Middle-earth timeline and adds entirely new characters. Sophia Nomvete’s dwarven princess, Disa, and Ismael Cruz Córdova’s Silvan elf, Arondir, broaden the notion of who lives in Middle-earth.

I'm out. It's the one story I just didn't anyone to mess with, but here we are.
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Reply #17 on: February 10, 2022, 04:13:42 PM

I don't see what the problem is. This is not a complete fleshed out story like the hobbit or lord of the rings, they obviously have to make up the majority of the characters.

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Reply #18 on: February 10, 2022, 04:55:03 PM

Also revealed in the Vanity Fair interview: no nipples in Middle Earth, and no gore.

Quote
So will there be Westerosi levels of violence and sex in Amazon’s Middle-earth? In short, no. McKay says the goal was “to make a show for everyone, for kids who are 11, 12, and 13, even though sometimes they might have to pull the blanket up over their eyes if it’s a little too scary. We talked about the tone in Tolkien’s books. This is material that is sometimes scary—and sometimes very intense, sometimes quite political, sometimes quite sophisticated—but it’s also heartwarming and life-affirming and optimistic. It’s about friendship and it’s about brotherhood and underdogs overcoming great darkness.”

Which is pretty much right, just as long as they make the darkness great enough.
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Reply #19 on: February 10, 2022, 07:59:41 PM

I don't see what the problem is. This is not a complete fleshed out story like the hobbit or lord of the rings, they obviously have to make up the majority of the characters.

This is what I always assumed. And as much as I was nodding along to all of what Khaldun said as a fellow First Age nerd (ohhhhhhhhhh, how I would love to see Morgoth crush Fingolfin to death beneath his shield), I don't want to see them botch it the way I felt they did for Wheel of Time.

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Ashamanchill
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Reply #20 on: February 10, 2022, 08:15:30 PM

Sauron, in the guise of Annatar

When I first heard they were doing the 2nd Age my first thought was it was a chance to do something cool with this. According to Tolkien's letters, Sauron really did repent after the destruction of Beleriand, mostly because he saw his former master who he thought was hot shit, defeated and humbled. Even so, Tolkien paints his repentance as real, except of for one little detail. I would love to have a scene when Sauron goes to Eonwe saying what a changed man Ainur he is, how things are going to be different now, and won't Eonwe please just let the last thousand years slide? And for a brief moment we could see the fate of Middle Earth in the balance, and it's salvation so close at hand. Then of course Eonwe will have to go, "nah man, this is above my pay grade. Come talk to my boss."

But of course even after that, we would get to follow Sauron's path from genuinely thinking he can make the world a better place, to raw Tyranny.

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
Khaldun
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Reply #21 on: February 11, 2022, 11:07:01 AM

That would honestly be great, to have Sauron have an actual character arc. Maybe he starts thinking about ring-making because he's thinking, "hey, you know who actually kind of DID make something that wasn't just the will of Eru, that was genuinely original in creation? Not Morgoth, who just corrupted elves and made big lizards, but Feanor. Maybe I could do what I was drawn to in Melkor back in the dawn of time by imitating Feanor?"

So when Celembrimbor makes the Three in secret, maybe Annatar/Sauron is enraged not so much at the failure of his plan for dominion but because it feels like copyright infringement--the rings are MY thing, you fucking elf.

I dunno--but it would be powerful if the Sauron who ends up in Numenor egging the King and his court towards what he absolutely has to know is their own destruction has a real emotional reason for his malice and despair--he tried to repent and was denied, he tried to do something he thought might be good and failed, he tried to grow beyond his past and got pulled into the same old schtick, he tried to hang out with elves as a friend and got cheated, so fuck you, I'm going to trick you into your doom and you know what, I'm going to do it by telling you the truth, which is that when you die you disappear while other beings get to live forever in paradise. (A very Lucifer move: eat the apple! God is trying to keep you ignorant!)

I have no problem with them inventing new characters. They have to. As long as they're not stupid, it's absolutely fine.
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Reply #22 on: February 11, 2022, 11:35:14 AM

I forget how much of this is brought through the appendixes, and how much was from Tolkiens letters, but Sauron's repentance goes roughly like this: Sauron repents to Eonwe, but Eonwe tells him he doesn't have the authority to absolve him, he has to go back to Valinor and appeal to Manwe, which Sauron is unwilling to do. But you know what? Sauron thinks, I was a Maia of Aule, not to mention I learned a shit ton from Melkor, who had no small knowledge of all the domains of middle earth, I have a lot of knowledge to offer the world. So he starts teaching some of the remaining Noldor shit, and they lap it up (none of the rings would have been possible without his knowledge, even the elven ones), but they do shit differently then he does. Okay, thinks Sauron, I know better than them, and I'm here to help, so any dissent is not just a slight against me, it's gonna slow down this whole project of making the world better. Which turns into, well, if you dissent from me (who knows best), you are fucking over everyone else, soooooooo, your opinion has to be silenced. To, since I know best, and the people I am trying to help aren't listening to me, I am going to have to over power them to get shit done. They have an army and I don't so........ (please dig deep Christians, we need phase cycling proton blasters- oh wait that was South Park  awesome, for real).

That's where I hope there is some real fun to be had in the series. In LOTR Sauron is a Dark Lord (not literally a fucking eyeball Peter Jackson) incapable of like looking anything other than Darth Vader joins a Scandinavian metal band. No shit the Western world is against him. But this is a chance to show a good looking dude, who is charismatic, and may even seem helpful at times, telling people lies they want to hear. Done right, most of the audience should be nodding along  with Annatar's talking points for a moment or two before going, wait a second.... I also thought this was how the show was going to weave in some fun T&A. Annatar's a good looking dude, and he's not stuck with some of the more prudish versions of morality. Just off the top of my head, they could have made up a character who is Sauron's go between for him and  Ar-Pharazon, maybe as a hot chick who seduces him to get the ball rolling. But I see they are not going that way, which is fair enough I suppose. It is what Tolkien would have wanted.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2022, 11:37:04 AM by Ashamanchill »

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
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Reply #23 on: February 11, 2022, 12:13:42 PM

(not literally a fucking eyeball Peter Jackson)

thank you

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Reply #24 on: February 11, 2022, 12:27:00 PM

Sauron was just misunderstood? Yeah, I'm down for that, but can they pull it off?

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Ashamanchill
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Reply #25 on: February 11, 2022, 01:46:05 PM

Less Sauron was just misunderstood, more, there are multiple steps between honestly trying to help and trying to bash down the gates of Minas Tirinth with a battering ram named after the devils personal flail.

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
Khaldun
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Reply #26 on: February 11, 2022, 03:04:22 PM

When you read Tolkien's actual account of Sauron in captivity (sort of) on Numenor, there's a TON of T&A really, not even implied--like actual satanic orgies and shit.

But there's also space for Annatar to be having a sexual relationship with an elf--Tolkien constantly describes how attractive and charismatic and seductive he is.
Ashamanchill
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Reply #27 on: February 14, 2022, 09:15:52 AM

I don't know if you guys have seen the Superbowl trailers or not. Yeah, looks okay. I am skeptical we are going to get our political thriller involving the descent of Sauron though, and more of a fun adventure romp.

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
Khaldun
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Reply #28 on: February 14, 2022, 09:28:43 AM

Sort of looks it. Room for that too in the Second Age, I think. We've never known who the Ringwraiths were beforehand, but at least a couple of them could be from Harad, from Umbar, from Khand or Rhun, or maybe northern Eriador, all places where there's stories we don't know at all but that are full of potential--rebel Numenoreans in Umbar establishing Morgoth-worshipping outposts, etc. Establish enough of a place like Rhun and then if they carry the story into the early Third Age you could even follow the Blue Wizards to there. We know the dwarves and elves in Moria and Lothlorien got along really well, so that opens up a lot of storytelling. I have no problem with anything they choose to do as long as it's GOOD and not third-rate Wheel of Time-ish stuff.
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Reply #29 on: February 14, 2022, 09:50:56 AM

Yeah, I was mostly just going off the vibe of the trailer. Had a very LOTR the movies, but more. Especially FOTR and TT vibes. There was plainly a battle scene in there as well, and I got a very Isildur-ey vibe from the kid in armor looking up heroically.

I don't have a problem with showing the thousands of "little" stories of the Second Age either, including made up ones that follow the spirit of it. But the other trailer does show a sort of forging of a ring, and reads from the famous inscription on the One Ring, so pieces of its tale have to be in their somewhere I should guess.

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
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Reply #30 on: February 14, 2022, 11:55:07 AM

I'm pretty sure that the Tolkien estate could come after them if the actual material of the Appendices is not used substantially, because that's how they established the right to do this in the first place, basically. The rumor is that Amazon negotiated and got conditional rights to use Numenor and other Second Age material from The Silmarillion after they established the Appendices rights but that the estate continued to withhold all First Age-related stuff from The Silmarillion. I suppose they could probably do a teeny bit of backstory on Sauron himself at any rate.

Edit by Trippy: fixed subject

« Last Edit: February 14, 2022, 12:02:40 PM by Trippy »
Ashamanchill
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Reply #31 on: February 14, 2022, 12:27:49 PM

Ar-pharazon: Ahhhh, the teenage years. I remember mine fondly. How about you?

Cuts to a picture of Edge Lord Vampire Sauron with an emo fringe, arm in arm with Luthien's Thuringwethil costume.

Sauron: Uhhhhhh, so how come there's no more dragons these days? What's the deal with that?
« Last Edit: February 14, 2022, 12:29:30 PM by Ashamanchill »

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
Johny Cee
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3454


Reply #32 on: February 14, 2022, 12:55:11 PM

Ar-pharazon: Ahhhh, the teenage years. I remember mine fondly. How about you?

Cuts to a picture of Edge Lord Vampire Sauron with an emo fringe, arm in arm with Luthien's Thuringwethil costume.

Sauron: Uhhhhhh, so how come there's no more dragons these days? What's the deal with that?

Sauron was a goth werewolf, and he would be getting his ass kicked by a dog or losing a freestyle rap battle to Luthien.
Ashamanchill
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2274


Reply #33 on: February 14, 2022, 01:09:13 PM

Yeah but he beat Finrod Felagund (my favourite character) at least!
« Last Edit: February 14, 2022, 01:13:07 PM by Ashamanchill »

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
Trippy
Administrator
Posts: 23612


Reply #34 on: July 05, 2022, 12:11:31 PM

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