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Author Topic: Spider-Man: Far From Home  (Read 13496 times)
HaemishM
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Reply #70 on: July 16, 2019, 10:19:57 AM


Khaldun
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Reply #71 on: July 16, 2019, 10:46:57 AM

I think it's basically a
Velorath
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Reply #72 on: July 16, 2019, 12:53:26 PM

« Last Edit: July 17, 2019, 07:05:20 PM by Velorath »
BobtheSomething
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Reply #73 on: July 16, 2019, 10:38:02 PM


I assume they used that location so that they could set up some contingency plans in case Beck failed his first try.
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Reply #74 on: July 17, 2019, 10:17:26 AM

Yup, they were getting Edith whether Peter played along or not.

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Reply #75 on: July 17, 2019, 06:36:47 PM

That wouldn't work, he needed to give over command voluntarily.

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Reply #76 on: July 17, 2019, 09:53:31 PM

While you can do certain things with his technology, other things likely are better served by having a human hand - such as handing over a drink.  Plus, I'd imagine that everyone invoved wanted to witness the moment. 

Additionally - evil villain has to make speech.

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Reply #77 on: July 24, 2019, 03:44:53 AM

Saw this a few days ago, liked it just fine.  Not being a comics guy, I knew nothing about Mysterio.  I liked him before the heel turn, but found it a bit silly and far-fetched afterwards.  There were probably too many moments where I was like "wait....that probably wouldn't work".  And I have a pretty high tolerance for such things.  Oh well, an MCU movie with a few flaws is still better than most other movies by default.



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Reply #78 on: July 24, 2019, 07:30:57 AM

I saw it over the weekend and enjoyed it. I knew Mysterio was a villain so I was expecting a betrayal, but I really liked him before that. Like others have said, I had some complaints but all in all I really enjoyed it.

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Reply #79 on: July 24, 2019, 12:43:27 PM

One thing I really liked was the big surreal scene where he's punking Peter on multiple levels--that was a terrific translation of comics to screen.
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Reply #80 on: July 24, 2019, 01:31:17 PM

Mysterio is one of those really 4-color style comic villains that is really easy to fuck up. I was concerned about their translation of him to the big screen but they captured the character perfectly. The hallucination scenes were a perfectly example of how the character has always operated in the comics.  As for his plan being silly and far-fetched... that's Mysterio. I realize that's a bit hand-wavey but I think it works perfectly for MCU movies in that all of them fall apart if you think too incredibly hard about them.

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Reply #81 on: July 24, 2019, 03:56:58 PM

I enjoyed the movie as soon as I reset my expectations as to the audience age it was aimed at.

In retrospect it makes sense they'd go back to a more juvenile target audience. It's either that and try to win over some new fans to the franchise or keep trying to keep the aging and more and more nitpicky older fans happy, and that is pretty much impossible.

So yeah, fun, and pretty well written considering the above.
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Reply #82 on: July 24, 2019, 06:16:57 PM

In the comics, Mysterio is *always* easy to beat once you know what the con is; the thing is that sometimes he times his con so well and frames it so intelligently that Spider-Man/Peter Parker doesn't see it coming.
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Reply #83 on: July 25, 2019, 12:10:09 AM

I enjoyed the movie as soon as I reset my expectations as to the audience age it was aimed at.

In retrospect it makes sense they'd go back to a more juvenile target audience. It's either that and try to win over some new fans to the franchise or keep trying to keep the aging and more and more nitpicky older fans happy, and that is pretty much impossible.

So yeah, fun, and pretty well written considering the above.

Anecdotally speaking, my 14 and 17 year-olds both thought it was awesome and clearly one of the better MCU movies.  Usually I am the bigger fan boy, but they both like it better than I did.  I think spiderman just resonates somehow better with younger people, not least because he's a kid himself.

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Reply #84 on: August 03, 2019, 09:38:50 PM

So finally saw this today.  Liked it better than the first film, but still very middle to lower MCU for me.  Thinking over it, the biggest personal reasons I donít like this version of Spider-Man is that I fucking hate watching awkward teen drama.  Both movies spend waaaay to much time concentrating on what an akward person Peter is, and lets just watch his cringey akward actions as he fucks up over and over again.  Which is something I gain zero enjoyment from watching.  This movie had less of it than the first one (which was almost entirely just that), so worked better for me.  I fully understand thats a personal thing, and others may enjoy it, but I just cannot stand watching any movies or TV shows centered around that kind of comedy.

Also, I think the other let down is that this version of Spider-Man is just not fun in his own movies.  I actually really liked him in all the avengers movies.  He feels like Spider-Man in those.  He jumps around, fights great, and makes lots funny jokes/comments as he does (though because of the character they are mainly generational jokes compared to his fellow heroís, but still), giving a light hearted character to contrast the super serious ones.  In both of his own movies, he mainly fights via jumping around and panicking, with zero wise cracks.  Just awkwardly flailing around trying to stop one of his fucks ups after another in a panic, with zero fun.  Which is unfortunate because, again, I feel the actor nails the characater in all the Avengers films.

Jake was easily the best part of this movie.  Did a great job with is role, even if (As I see others mentioned above) the entire plot makes zero god damned sense overall.  And like, the leap of Peter going from having a drink with nice dude he barely knows to Ďyou should be the next Iron Maní was some of the laziest writing I have seen in a long time.  But whatever, if they are going to hand wave away the entire Ďblipí with a 30 second explanation that makes the whole thing a happy fun time joke (as we discussed before, realistically trillions of people died from this event because Stark refused to undo the last five years), then Iím just going to have to give up on any expectation of quality writing in the MCU here on.

Anyways, lest I sound totally negative, things I liked:
Cast all pretty good (despite teen drama stuff).  Jake easily the best.
Well paced.
Happy and Aunt May thing is fun and a great way to take those characters.
Some cool fight moves from Peter in the very end fight scene.

However, the mid credit scene reveal sort of retroactively made me hate the whole movie.   Ohhhhh, I see.

Like, what a dumb load of shit.  I was so happy that the movie avoided ending with things going that way (despite teasing it multiple times), and then it stabbed me in the face with it in the after movie credit sequence.  ARG.  Iíll only approve of this if it forces the plot to move forward where the next time we see Peter heís a college student/adult and working full on for the Avengers or something, so we can get to real Spider-Man instead of this alt teen version.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2019, 09:41:04 PM by Teleku »

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Reply #85 on: August 03, 2019, 10:03:02 PM

I fucking hate watching awkward teen drama.

stop watching movies about teenagers in high school goddamn
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Reply #86 on: August 03, 2019, 10:15:32 PM

No.  Marvel just needs to stop making them.   awesome, for real

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Reply #87 on: August 03, 2019, 10:19:03 PM

this sounds like a you problem
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Reply #88 on: August 03, 2019, 10:30:04 PM

No.  Marvel just needs to stop making them.   awesome, for real
I'm pretty sure "teen drama" is just Spiderman in the MCU, which is kind of the point. Ant Man is heists, Cap is special ops thrillers, Thor...is family soap opera, and Spiderman is teen drama.

So, what you're saying is that you've had enough Spiderman?

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Reply #89 on: August 03, 2019, 10:35:52 PM

Iíve had enough Peter Parker High School only movies, which is two.  As I said, he was great in the Avengers MCU movies.

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Ruvaldt
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Reply #90 on: August 03, 2019, 10:45:38 PM

Iíll only approve of this if it forces the plot to move forward where the next time we see Peter heís a college student/adult and working full on for the Avengers or something, so we can get to real Spider-Man instead of this alt teen version.

The "real" Spider-Man?  In the comics, the character is overwhelmingly depicted as either a teenager or someone in their very early 20s, and Peter Parker's teen drama takes up far more space in the comics than fights (at least in the 60s/70s...I haven't read as much 80s+ Spider-Man).  Taking that out of the story makes him just another generic superhero.  To me, this is what makes Spider-Man...Spider-Man.  I'm not interested in him unless he's young and has teen/young adult drama.  A lot of his best stories have come from that also.  The death of Gwen Stacy/Harry Osborn's transformation to the Green Goblin, for instance.

Taking that away would be to take away one of the things that makes Spider-Man unique.  Especially in the MCU.

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Reply #91 on: August 03, 2019, 11:04:03 PM

Uh, far as I know, the only major version of Spider-Man that has been a teenager is in the Ultimate Universe (and while that version had some great stories until it went to shit, I always thought it was hindered by the High School setting).  Heís always been college age 20 something for the 40 odd years of his existance. 

And Iím not saying take away the normal life, as I agree thatís what adds to the charm.  Itís why I was pissed about the shitty mid credits reveal!  It makes it so thatís not actually possible from here on in the MCU (so the only plus side of it is maybe forcing him out of the High School setting).  I just think Peter as a young adult and dealing with life/everyday shit is faaaaaar more watchable and enjoyable than badly written teen drama where we get to watch somebody be the worst teen stereotype over and over again.  First two 2000ís Spider-Man movies were better than both of these films in that regard (and in many others),  IMO.

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HaemishM
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Reply #92 on: August 03, 2019, 11:09:00 PM

The angsty teen drama stuff is one of the things I hated about the Spider-Man comics but somehow for the movies, I like it a lot. I do want to see them move the character forward into college age in the next one though if they are going full Civil War Iron Spider reveal, I'm not sure where the fuck they are going from here.

EDIT: Also, Teleku, at least the first 30+ Spider-Man comics ever had him as a teenager in high school. I'm not sure exactly when he graduated and went to college but him as a teenage is very much a part of the original Ditko/Stan Lee stories.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2019, 11:10:47 PM by HaemishM »

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Reply #93 on: August 03, 2019, 11:37:00 PM

Uh, far as I know, the only major version of Spider-Man that has been a teenager is in the Ultimate Universe (and while that version had some great stories until it went to shit, I always thought it was hindered by the High School setting).  Heís always been college age 20 something for the 40 odd years of his existance. 

Sorry, but Peter Parker was 15 when he got his powers in Amazing Fantasy #15.  He is in high school from Amazing Spider-Man 1 - 28.  And even then, he's in his late-teens while in college for a long time in Amazing Spider-Man.  Probably beyond #100+.   

As for movies, he is also a high school student in Spider-Man (2002) and Amazing Spider-Man (2012).  He's probably late-teens or maybe 20/21 in the other Spider-Man movies.

Teen/young adult drama is a defining characteristic of Spider-Man comics and movies.

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Reply #94 on: August 03, 2019, 11:45:58 PM

<snip>

That's a long winded way to say you don't like Spiderman. The stuff you're complaining about? That's a core component of Spiderman and has been pretty much since he was created.

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Reply #95 on: August 04, 2019, 12:23:35 AM

EDIT: Also, Teleku, at least the first 30+ Spider-Man comics ever had him as a teenager in high school. I'm not sure exactly when he graduated and went to college but him as a teenage is very much a part of the original Ditko/Stan Lee stories.
Sorry, but Peter Parker was 15 when he got his powers in Amazing Fantasy #15.  He is in high school from Amazing Spider-Man 1 - 28.  And even then, he's in his late-teens while in college for a long time in Amazing Spider-Man.  Probably beyond #100+.   

As for movies, he is also a high school student in Spider-Man (2002) and Amazing Spider-Man (2012).  He's probably late-teens or maybe 20/21 in the other Spider-Man movies.

Teen/young adult drama is a defining characteristic of Spider-Man comics and movies.
Dudes, that was literally in the 60ís.  He was out of High school before the comic even hit the 70ís. Thatís literally him out of high school for the last 50 years of his comic run.  Every single iconic moment of his character arc that gets reused over and over again happened after this point.  Spider-Man out of High School is his defining character status.  The High School part was just a small early part of the comic they quickly moved forward from as they fleshed him out.  And he was in High School in the 2001 film for all of 10 minutes, and everything after that for the whole trilogy was set as him out of it.  This is extreme hair splitting.

Also, the 2012 Spider-Man (and itís follow up) were terrible.
<snip>

That's a long winded way to say you don't like Spiderman. The stuff you're complaining about? That's a core component of Spiderman and has been pretty much since he was created.
Iíve been complaining about the high school awkward teen drama.  As I stated above, him being in high school makes up about 2% of his total body of work over the last 60 years.  It is in fact zero part of his core component.

Spider-Man as a 19 year old college student is a 100% different story and character than Spider-Man as an 18 year old high school student.  His entire social life, job, dating scene, motivations, everything is different.  And generally just works far better based on all the previous Spider-Man works that have come before this.  This is not to say that I wouldnít have enjoyed a High School version!  But in the MCU, they dialed up the awkwardness of these movies to painful levels and the writing just felt like shit.

Or in short, I felt they handled his personal drama and characteristation far worst in these films than all previous bodies of work.  I enjoyed the comics I read from the 80ís/90ís.  I enjoyed the 90ís cartoon.  I enjoyed the 2000ís era movies.  Just canít get into these (though again, I think the character shines in all the non Spider-Man MCU movies).

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HaemishM
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Reply #96 on: August 04, 2019, 11:28:19 AM

Spider-Man as an adult can work - I wasn't a huge fan of the marriage with Mary Jane Watson era but the stuff after he returns from the dead and gets his body back from Doc Ock (i.e. the post-Superior Spider-Man work by Dan Slott) was really great. I liked it though, as much because it removed a lot of the angsty drama and sense of self-loathing that has been core to the Spider-Man character. He had become a socially conscious Tony Stark, essentially, and I'd love to see them build to that character in the movies. I don't think they'll have time before Holland moves on (i.e. I think they have 1-2 more movies with him).

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Reply #97 on: August 04, 2019, 01:08:59 PM

they're already making him a socially conscious tony stark

you have seen far from home right?

that's like, exactly what they're doing, but as a teen

so everyone else can love it except for teleku
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Reply #98 on: August 04, 2019, 01:11:01 PM

616 spiderman started his career at 14/16. The death of gwen stacy occurred when he was in high school. Relative to the characters history he only been an adult when, and by I mean adult I mean early 20s since the 80s. Marvel and those who Marvel licenses to write spiderman rarely want to tell an adult peter story, the comics literally had him make a deal with the devil to get back aunt may instead of being married to mary jane. A decision that has got me out of comic book for the last decade.

The best telling of teen spiderman was Spectacular Spiderman. It literally covered all the major story beats and had him evolving as a young man, while still keeping some of the parker fuck ups that he is known for. This version of spiderman is simply a white Miles Morales. The original version from the ultimate comics and not the good version in into-the spiderverse. Which isn't entirely a bad thing, there is "some" traditional parker story beats but not a lot. Its still 'good' and even excellent at times but that is more due to the production and the MCU being what it is and less spiderman himself. Its getting there and I definitely enjoyed both movies BUT I only watch them once.

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HaemishM
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Reply #99 on: August 04, 2019, 02:09:46 PM

they're already making him a socially conscious tony stark

you have seen far from home right?

Yes, only in the comics I'm talking about, he was a billionaire too. I'm guessing that could be in the next movie except for the whole mid-credits scene.

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Reply #100 on: August 04, 2019, 04:01:29 PM

In the comics, Peter Parker as Spider-Man, in almost ALL eras of story-telling and situations, alternates between jokes/patter and emo/melancholy over his own fuck-ups. It is the basic modality of the character--he is constantly bouncing between the two of them. It does not stop when he isn't a teenager.
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Reply #101 on: August 04, 2019, 05:30:49 PM

they're already making him a socially conscious tony stark

you have seen far from home right?

Yes, only in the comics I'm talking about, he was a billionaire too. I'm guessing that could be in the next movie except for the whole mid-credits scene.

he has access to Tony Starks everything after Far From Home. he's effectively a billionaire.
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Reply #102 on: August 05, 2019, 01:19:21 PM

I liked it very much, but of course Spider-Man is my guy. Bonus: son wants to watch the Raimi movie now.

This thread is pretty entertaining, too.

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Reply #103 on: August 06, 2019, 01:48:21 AM

My 14 year-old the other day also told me that he was now watching the Raimi ones, because maybe they were the best ones.  My mind was a little blown.

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Reply #104 on: August 06, 2019, 07:53:20 AM

14 year olds are often wrong
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