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Author Topic: Marvel's Black Panther  (Read 4096 times)
jgsugden
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on: February 15, 2018, 01:31:04 PM

Thoughts?

I'm surprised we had no thread on it commenting on the Fake Rotten Tomatoes reviews, etc...

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Raguel
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Reply #1 on: February 15, 2018, 02:38:52 PM

I'm hyped for this. He's probably my second fave character behind Captain America.

It sounds like it's a really good movie. There are a lot of good actors and good director behind this so I will be very disappointed if it's not at least good.

I'd like to take this opportunity to pimp Christopher Priest's run on BP. It's really great, as long as you don't have a problem with his story structure (Priest tells stories out of chronological order).
Threash
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Reply #2 on: February 15, 2018, 03:12:33 PM

Watching tonight, excited.

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Soulflame
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Reply #3 on: February 15, 2018, 04:27:06 PM

I would be fine with seeing this as soon as possible, but we will likely wait until Monday.  Or maybe earlier.

The movie looks good.

I am not terribly interested in the whole DCEU thing though.  They can try to drag down Marvel the only way they can!  Have fun with it, I guess.
Threash
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Reply #4 on: February 16, 2018, 09:00:51 AM

This was good, not mind blowing but good.

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Teleku
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Reply #5 on: February 16, 2018, 09:10:07 AM

Apparently this was packed, on an English showing no less, last night here in Laos.  I've never been to any movie here that had more than 1/5th of the theater filled.  Which is really weird given the movie and location, frankly.....

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Ginaz
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Reply #6 on: February 16, 2018, 08:58:34 PM

It's getting really good critic reviews but it's also getting trolled with user reviews.  I wonder why. Ohhhhh, I see. Facepalm

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HaemishM
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Reply #7 on: February 16, 2018, 09:39:20 PM

Fucking white people.

Velorath
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Reply #8 on: February 16, 2018, 10:10:36 PM

The cast is fantastic and a lot of them get to play really great characters. For the most part the plot is pretty good as well but I have no idea what Killmonger's plot through the first half of the movie is. Once he gets to Wakanda, that stuff is all clear but prior to that the sequence of events doesn't end up adding up to anything.


I had a lot of fun with this though and Shuri (Letitia Wright) would be an excellent replacement for Iron Man in a post-RDJ MCU. She's absolutely the highlight of the movie.
jgsugden
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Reply #9 on: February 17, 2018, 02:54:59 AM

Velorath's plot issues aside,  it was really good. I dismiss that plot issue a bit by thinking KM was just waiting for the best opportunity, missed his window and had to take drastic measures to get what he wanted.  I think KM was one of the most interesting and impactful baddies in the MCU, though.

Minor quibble... Wakanda felt very small to me. I feel like it should have been bigger. I'd like to have seen more of it, even if just in a few momentary flashes.

Regardless, when the weakest performances were from Angela Bassett and Forest Whitaker, you had a damn good cast. They were not bad... just a bit flat compared to other cast members.

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SurfD
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Reply #10 on: February 17, 2018, 04:13:22 AM

Extremely good movie. The story was very well crafted, and the characters were extremely well done, with a lot more depth of character than is typical of a superhero movie,  but I get the feeling that it is going to push the wrong buttons for a certain demographic.  It touches on quite a number of social and racial issues that some people are not going to want dragged out into the spotlight in the way that a blockbuster motion picture can do.

I especially can't wait to see if we get any kind of response from the Trump camp and the MAGA morons, as the message the movie sends (especially the UN Speech in the mid credits scene) is literally like someone throwing a gauntlet in their faces.

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Ironwood
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Reply #11 on: February 17, 2018, 03:41:44 PM

Fuck Them.

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Shannow
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Reply #12 on: February 17, 2018, 04:03:35 PM

Outside of Michael Jordan's character this was fairly standard Marvel stuff.  Good not great.

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Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #13 on: February 17, 2018, 06:02:27 PM

This was the movie the first Thor should have been.

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Raguel
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Reply #14 on: February 17, 2018, 06:04:10 PM

I really enjoyed the movie. Killmonger is my fave BP villain and I think they did him justice.
patience
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Reply #15 on: February 17, 2018, 11:07:49 PM



I especially can't wait to see if we get any kind of response from the Trump camp and the MAGA morons, as the message the movie sends (especially the UN Speech in the mid credits scene) is literally like someone throwing a gauntlet in their faces.



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this is however not the case.
Soln
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the opportunity for evil is just delicious


Reply #16 on: February 18, 2018, 07:24:01 PM

Khaldun
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Reply #17 on: February 18, 2018, 07:27:55 PM

This was fucking great.

Yes, still the standard Marvel plot in some ways, but the best possible version of it.
Abagadro
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Reply #18 on: February 18, 2018, 10:23:53 PM


I agree Kilmonger came in a little late and it made the back half confrontation seem a bit rushed.

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Reply #19 on: February 18, 2018, 11:16:29 PM

I find this funny. Because this movie is a 7/5 and I can't say whether its the hype talking or that I "get" most of the small moments (beyond the politics) where someone did some research on African culture (my mom being Cameroonian). This is a typical marvel movie, hero does hero shit, hero meets bad guy who is them +1, hero kisses the girl as their future seems bright and clear. Its the meat in between that gives this formula the extra humph it needs.

Oh and killmonger is hilarious. Because he is a "The Wire" of marvel villains. His narrative is literal red meat to black audiences who will see one thing and white audiences who will see an entirely different thing. It's a confirmation bias that i have to assume was unintentional he manages to please all movie goers.

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Abagadro
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Reply #20 on: February 18, 2018, 11:18:32 PM

You're just saying that because he is Wallace.   awesome, for real 

Where's Killmonger, String? Where's Killlmonger?

"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.Ē

-H.L. Mencken
Ironwood
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Reply #21 on: February 19, 2018, 07:19:38 AM

So, um, I watched this movie.

I was bored.

It was not for me. 

I'm ok with this.

(It was basically Black Thor.  Which, again, I'm ok with, but that's what bored me.  I can see how people would love the shit out of it, as I know people ARE loving the shit out of it.  And that's great.  But it was not for me.)

Anyway.  Onwards.

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Teleku
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Reply #22 on: February 19, 2018, 07:33:39 AM

Hmm, just got back from this.  I enjoyed it, but Iím leaning a little more towards Ironwoods view on this.  Donít think it was as tight as many here say, and didnít really keep me as interested as most other marvel movies do.  I still enjoyed it overall, just think it was maybe a little over hyped for me.

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MahrinSkel
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Reply #23 on: February 19, 2018, 08:47:47 AM

Yeah, it was good, the Afro-Futuristic aesthetic was fresh, and I can see why people for whom "looks like us" in superhero movies has been limited to Black Heimdall feel really excited about it. But under that, it's a fairly standard MCU offering, competently executed. I enjoyed it, I will probably watch it about as often as I do the Edward Norton Hulk or original Thor, but it's not going to make my personal short list of "best comic book movies".

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Ironwood
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Reply #24 on: February 19, 2018, 09:08:11 AM

I had a real issue with Wakanda though.  I wanted to know how the economy worked.  I wanted to know how everything worked. 

Instead, Magical City.  It was basically Black Asgard.  Even Jane in the Soul Forge was the same as Bilbo in the Spine Forge.


I will say the fifth tribe was fucking awesome, especially M'Baku who basically summed up MY attitude to the whole film when he interrupted the squabbling with 'Are you done, get the fuck out my house'.  Which I couldn't stop giggling about.

I get it.  I was NOT the target audience.  I'm happy for those who finally got to see the movie film they wanted and needed.  Same as Wonder Woman.

But.  I was bored.

Edited to spoil that shit since I got carried away.





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HaemishM
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Reply #25 on: February 19, 2018, 09:58:49 AM

I get it.  I was NOT the target audience.  I'm happy for those who finally got to see the movie film they wanted and needed.  Same as Wonder Woman.

I haven't seen this yet, but this is kind of how I feel about the latest series of Black Panther written by Ta-Nehisi Coates. I get that it's good but I'm definitely not the target audience.

Ironwood
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Reply #26 on: February 19, 2018, 10:07:28 AM

Yeah, pretty much. 

It's like when I had to read Atwood at Uni.  It wasn't for me.

I really, with hindsight, shouldn't have taken that Womens Literature semester though.

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HaemishM
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Reply #27 on: February 19, 2018, 10:34:02 AM

Dear God, I would PAY to have video of you in that class.  why so serious?

Raguel
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Reply #28 on: February 19, 2018, 11:07:46 AM


I'm still wondering what I think of M'Baku; they used him in an interesting, albeit non-canonical way.

mild spoilers:

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Reply #29 on: February 19, 2018, 11:47:15 AM

My only complaint about the movie


This is wasn't really that culturally significant to me. Black Panther was always a power fantasy for African Americans less so for people actually from Africa, where I'm pretty sure my people wouldn't imagine a super advance civilization where the primary weapon is chucking a spear.  That's more of a American imagination of Africa. While this wasn't any step forward for me, its also not a step backwards either. They could have phoned in a mediocre movie with some good moments (wonder woman), but instead decided to do a good movie with great moments and some not so obvious complexity that went over the heads of its target audience.

But this is basically as good as Ant-man which i enjoyed and rewatched a few times so, second marvel movie reinanssance all a fucking board. Do. Not. Fuck. Up. Captain Marvel.

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Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #30 on: February 19, 2018, 12:04:04 PM

There's a lot of minor hang-ups sure and overall I really liked this world they built, even if unrealistic is was interesting.  One thing however that almost ruined the movie for me was the final in-suit fight with bp and kilmonger.  That fucking cgi was spiderman3 bad.

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BobtheSomething
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Reply #31 on: February 19, 2018, 02:36:10 PM

The fight scenes were the worst part of the film.  They either needed to be cut down to half the duration or rewritten to be more character driven.  With such an entertaining cast of capable characters, the film would have been better off giving them anything else to do besides punch each other.

It's also tragically short sighted for Marvel to kill off Killmonger, a charismatic, sympathetic, competent, imposing villain who should have been the MCU's Magneto.  i'm glad the film let him say some of the things he did and express a perspective not often seen in a blockbuster.  At least the film was careful not to vilify him for his cause so much as his methods.  That made for a much stronger conflict.
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #32 on: February 19, 2018, 02:47:36 PM



It's also tragically short sighted for Marvel to kill off ...

Every.Single.Time. 

Marvel just does not know how to stop fucking themselves over when it comes to villains.  Hell even Serkis was knocking it out of the park in this movie and nope, can't have that!  Heroes are only ever as good as their villains and if they ever did wanna make a BP2 the chances of them topping these ones are virtually nil.

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BobtheSomething
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Reply #33 on: February 19, 2018, 03:50:02 PM



It's also tragically short sighted for Marvel to kill off ...

Every.Single.Time. 

Marvel just does not know how to stop fucking themselves over when it comes to villains.  Hell even Serkis was knocking it out of the park in this movie and nope, can't have that!  Heroes are only ever as good as their villains and if they ever did wanna make a BP2 the chances of them topping these ones are virtually nil.

Serkis, as the minor threat villain who's just having a blast, was the perfect companion for every overly serious Marvel villain ever.  I can think of a number of films that would have been miles better by just giving him a coup,e of minutes' screen time.
Mandella
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Reply #34 on: February 19, 2018, 04:52:43 PM

I'm hesitating to post this, because it touches on serious themes and this is not the politics subforum, but I do want to share, so here goes.

Going in Sunday for a matinee showing my wife and I were surprised to find the first show sold out even thirty minutes before showtime (rarely happens here even for mega hits). Not to be daunted, we pre-purchased tickets for the next showing and went about killing a few hours before coming back in. This time we got there only ten minutes before the trailers started, but even so the theater was so packed that we had to split up and seat separately.

The audience was probably 95 percent black to 5 percent white/other. The lights were still up when we came in so I got a good look at the demographic breakdown, and we are talking entire extended families. Mom, Dad, Grandma, Grandpa -- and I'm pretty sure the adults equaled or exceeded the number of teens/kids present. Lots of folks were dressed like they just came from church.

I hope the Grandmas and Grandpas liked it. I'm pretty sure it was kinda loud and violent for many, and as it has been pointed out by some here, while enjoyable this was not the Citizen Kane of comic movies. It was pretty good, and I think Ryan Coogler and Chadwick Boseman and all the rest can be justifiably proud of what they accomplished, but it was probably the first MCU movie a lot of the crowd has ever seen. But I could hear some at least getting into it, and the audience applauded at the end. And most stayed for the stingers. Well, the first one.

I've deleted a couple of longish social analyses. I'm not that great at expressing that sort of thing. But I do think that political events over the last couple of years has scared some folks plenty, and maybe people are feeling like they need to come out and start representing again. Even if it's just to show support for a movie that *gasp* has a nearly all black cast and doesn't have (much) to do with basketball.


So back to it just being a MCU movie with comic book heroes: I liked it a lot. Strong cast, neat effects, and I have no problem with a simple story told strongly. Will watch again.

I do disagree with the common complaint here that Marvel "wastes" its villains. I'm pretty sure that's by design, and it's a good one. Repeating a bad guy weakens that bad guy, until he is just a joke. You know he's going to lose (again) and it just gets harder and harder to suspend disbelief every time you see him. Or you actually start *rooting* for the guy to finally catch a break (Loki).

MCU let's their villains burn brightly and then burn out, and I'm okay with that. Let the antagonism between the "good" guys be the friction that heats things up over the movie arc, and let the bad guys be brief.
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