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Author Topic: Star Trek (CBS VOD 2017)  (Read 12490 times)
HaemishM
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Reply #140 on: July 24, 2017, 12:10:26 PM

Yep, still not paying for it.

Draegan
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Reply #141 on: July 24, 2017, 12:28:42 PM

I'll watch it but I still haven't seen the latest movie.

But I won't pay for it.
Khaldun
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Reply #142 on: July 24, 2017, 01:02:51 PM

There is no way I'm paying for this separately even if it's great. I just am not buying more services. If it gets bundled into what I already buy, great, I'll give it a watch.
pxib
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Reply #143 on: July 24, 2017, 05:09:33 PM

Where is my slow-paced nerdy pondering? I wanted slow-paced nerdy ethics and political commentary!

Also I do not understand Jason Isaacs career at all. The man looks like James Bond but plays nothing but scenery-chewing weirdos and psychopaths.

“All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone.” - Pascal
Hoax
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Reply #144 on: July 24, 2017, 09:31:47 PM

That looks like absolute garbage. Like TFA levels of bad misuse of IP. Fuck everyone involved in that stupid thing, unless that is the most poorly edited trailer of all time that show is going to be way worse than Voyager and/or Enterprise.

A nation consists of its laws. A nation does not consist of its situation at a given time. If an individual's morals are situational, then that individual is without morals. If a nation's laws are situational, that nation has no laws, and soon isn't a nation.
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Sir T
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Reply #145 on: July 24, 2017, 11:56:34 PM

I like the ship design.

Otherwise, that Trailer sucked. If that's all from the pilot I have no idea how they could string all that together into a coherent story. There is just way too much in there, so it gives the feeling of the Star wars "prequel" movies. The Captain seems to be a decent actress, however.

EDIT: wait a sec, Klingons have 4 nostrils now?

Remember this is before they had this big accident with the "genetic virus" that DS9 made up to explain why TOS Klingons look different. It also obviously allowed them to move their neck.  why so serious? Fuck sake, the poor guy was moving like Batman before he developed neck moving technology, and he obviously could not breath through his nose either.

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Reg
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Reply #146 on: July 25, 2017, 12:40:39 PM

Maybe it's just me but I've had enough of prequels and reboots. It's time to advance a few years into the future, IMO.
Riggswolfe
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Reply #147 on: July 25, 2017, 06:07:34 PM

The ones who say that Rodenberry's box too severely hampered their ability to write compelling stories, I say, shut the fuck up. WRITE BETTER.

BSG arguably takes place completely out of this "box". Frankly, the idea that people were perfect and rarely argued in the future did cause problems, especially in early TNG episodes. I'm in the camp that thinks that some aspects of Trek improved after Roddenberry's death. DS9, for example, probably wouldn't be the show it was had Roddenberry had much input into it.

Admittedly, Enterprise is awful and Voyager is only so-so but that's because by then the IP owners had gotten lazy and put their own restrictions on it that severely hampered both shows. Voyager should've been Trek meshed with BSG but the producers wouldn't allow it so despite years of being away from Federation space the crew always had nice uniforms, got along for the most part despite being from very different backgrounds and the ship not only didn't get worn down, it actually got better as the show progressed.

Enterprise. Well, Enterprise just showed how bad the idea of doing a prequel was, particularly if the writers decide to rewrite Trek canon as they go because why the hell not?

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
Khaldun
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Reply #148 on: July 25, 2017, 08:50:26 PM

I think Roddenberry's box was real. I think he misunderstood what a utopian society as a setting has to be, and he also came to believe in his own publicity as much as any bloated rock star surrounded by groupies might, and made the same kinds of dumb overreaches that many creative people in that situation do.

There is a possible Star Trek that is set in a comprehensively better, post-scarcity society that nevertheless has a smart vision of why people might continue to have serious dramatic conflicts. One of those would be basic philosophical differences about the purpose of life, some of which might be surprisingly resistant to the elimination of scarcity; the other would be that people are just different from each other in some pretty serious ways in terms of personality and outlook that might not go away even if we have all our basic needs met. But by all accounts Roddenberry was dubious about #1 in his post-TOS influence on Trek (all the philosophical differences are thrown off onto crazy admirals and 'backward' civilizations); and he was actively opposed to storytelling that dealt with #2, which is just dumb and bad.

Any future version of Trek will have to shuck that off entirely without insisting that shucking it off means tits and explosions and nothing more.

BobtheSomething
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Reply #149 on: July 26, 2017, 12:53:05 AM

I feel like nBSG took it so far in the other direction after a while that it was every bit as ridiculous as any episode filmed in Roddenberry's box, and much more unpleasant.  I would prefer to watch any third season TNG episode over any third season nBSG episode.
HaemishM
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Reply #150 on: July 26, 2017, 09:24:02 AM

Once nBSG left New Caprica (with that fantastic battle scene episode), it had no fucking idea where it wanted to go. Once it did figure out where it wanted to go, it started manipulating the characters in such a way as to force the destination, often in complete opposition to everything we'd seen from those characters previously. The characters became ciphers for the authors, which always ends badly. Plus... fucking angels and hidden cylons. FUCK OFF.

Khaldun
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Reply #151 on: July 26, 2017, 09:59:24 AM

Yeah, the problems there were less with forcing conflict between people and more with what happens when you launch a show that has a "mystery metaplot", e.g. asserts that there is a hidden plan or design or truth that is pushing the situation that the characters are in, and yet have no idea what that plan is. nBSG is almost the very best example of why you should never, ever do that--you should always know, as show creator, what the basic 'hidden truth' is.

Now if you don't have a single "mystery plot" but you do know the overall rules or principles at play in your universe or setting, you can still introduce new or surprising elements that will affect how characters relate to one another as time goes on--conflicts don't have to be purely internally driven. In fact, they shouldn't be, because sooner or later this forces you to have characters who undergo an implausible number of transformations in their relations to other characters, or it forces you to do dumb things to the characters in order to explain why they're still relating to one another or working with each other. Thinking about a Trek that doesn't have the Roddenberry box, for example, if you have characters whose evolving story puts them into unmanageable conflict, sooner or later you need to resolve that by having one of them leave the ship and the show if you're honest to the conflict. If you have characters fall in love or flirt, you have to move that along too, and so on.

There's a lot wrong with how Babylon 5 was managed if you take the full production history of the show, but the character arcs for G'Kar and Londo are nearly perfect examples of what *can* happen if you're committed to avoiding the reset button, willing to let characters evolve as they ought to (and as the actors add life to them).
Merusk
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Reply #152 on: July 26, 2017, 10:10:33 AM

I just rewatched S1 of B5 and I'd forgotten just how different G'Kar was and how on the outs the Narn in general were at the beginning. They were the intergalactic bad guys right up until the Shadow showed up and things flipped and suddenly everyone hated the Centauri. Makes for a much more real show.

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HaemishM
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Reply #153 on: July 26, 2017, 11:12:09 AM

It didn't hurt that you had to excellent actors who both really inhabited those characters to the fullest.

Raph
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Reply #154 on: July 26, 2017, 01:48:32 PM

I have no idea whether the plot and tone for the new Star Trek will work or not, but I got to see the costumes and props up close at SDCC this weekend, and they are certainly going all out on those. They looked great.
Riggswolfe
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Reply #155 on: July 26, 2017, 03:39:35 PM

I have no idea whether the plot and tone for the new Star Trek will work or not, but I got to see the costumes and props up close at SDCC this weekend, and they are certainly going all out on those. They looked great.

I agree, the props and costumes look great. They just don't look like props and costumes from a decade before TOS.

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
NowhereMan
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Reply #156 on: August 10, 2017, 04:54:32 AM

That trailer looked like a really fun to watch Sci-Fi action series. I would have no idea that it was anything to do with Trek without the intro title though.

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Special J
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Reply #157 on: September 24, 2017, 04:19:58 PM

Don't what happened in the lead up. I am super-excited.
 awesome, for real
Ironwood
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Reply #158 on: September 24, 2017, 04:24:35 PM

People are saying this isn't shit.  Is it shit ?

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Special J
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Reply #159 on: September 24, 2017, 04:41:27 PM

No idea. But in the end I'm a fanboy that prefers mediocre Star Trek to no Star Trek at all.

The trailer sure looked action-y I presume it distilled a lot that down because otherwise it would be the most expensive show ever.  While I love a good space battle, I am hopeful that it has more Stars and Treks than what was shown.

FWIW my teenage daughter (admittedly already a TNG fan), thought the trailer was "pretty awesome".  That is a demo they need if they're going to succeed.
Brolan
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Reply #160 on: September 24, 2017, 09:20:18 PM

God damn, that was nothing but a teaser to make you pay to see conclusion of the episode.  Long, dull and boring.
Khaldun
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Reply #161 on: September 24, 2017, 09:32:47 PM

People I trust are saying it was pretty good.

So, still not paying, but.
Father mike
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Reply #162 on: September 24, 2017, 09:41:29 PM

Missed it because the wife was watching Outlander, and I didn't care enough to interrupt her show .  Hopefully it will be on one of the On Demand for a few weeks before it goes in the CBS vault.

If not, then there's dubious streaming sites that will have it in a week.

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Cyrrex
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Reply #163 on: September 25, 2017, 12:20:35 AM

I think it might be free on Netflix over here, so I may have to give it a twirl.

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Special J
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Reply #164 on: September 25, 2017, 12:29:35 AM

Watched both e1 & 2. While I disagree e1 was a bore, it definitely was a total tease. To get the full premiere you need both episodes. It was certainly the darkest of any Star Trek launch, but that doesn't mean it wasn't fun.

Things I liked: The space shots & visuals are spectacular. I am warming up to 4 nostriled "new" Klingons. Are they canon? Dunno, but they sold 'em well.  Space battle fucking rocks.

Things I didn't like: I really didn't like the interior shots. They seemed sterile, with awkward camera angles. Not much character development outside a couple cast.  Without spoilers: I could see how this would hopefully improve.

It's definitely is not your standard Star Trek, at least not at launch. But it left me pretty hopeful for where it goes. I am still fearful that the CBS paywall cripples is potential. Would 1 show make me pay for a channel or steaming service? Probably not, but I have it already and it's giving me Star Trek so that makes me happy.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 12:36:22 AM by Special J »
Abagadro
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Reply #165 on: September 25, 2017, 01:10:04 AM

So wait, they showed the first ep on regular TV but that is the only one they are airing outside of their pay-for on demand service?

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Reply #166 on: September 25, 2017, 01:32:23 AM

Yep!

Abagadro
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Reply #167 on: September 25, 2017, 01:42:59 AM

Well that's some bullshit.

"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

-H.L. Mencken
jgsugden
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Reply #168 on: September 25, 2017, 02:22:02 AM

There will eventually be a way to see this (legally) without suscribing. I watched the pilot, but will wait for the free option for more. Pretty, some interesting elements, but flawed. It feels like some insanely rich kid made their fan fiction after only watching the recent movies and reading message boards. 

It was an interesting pilot, but not Star Trek. It also had a lot of logic gaps. Without the Star Trek name or the pay wall issues, I'd be recording it and seeing if they could fix the flaws.

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Abagadro
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Reply #169 on: September 25, 2017, 02:30:55 AM

I think Trek is just past its prime thematically altogether. I think The Expanse is much more in tune with the current zeitgeist.

"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

-H.L. Mencken
jgsugden
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Reply #170 on: September 25, 2017, 03:13:41 AM

I believe that if DS9 or the Next Generation where to go back into production today and continue on as if they had never ceased that both shows could be successful today despite the changes that have taken place since they went off the air. I'm not saying that they would be massive hits, but I am saying that they could hold enough of an audience that they would continue on for a number of seasons. In fact, I think DS9 in particular would be a well suited show to address current concerns in the world. DS9 was explicitly not the same as the Next Generation. It was a distinct departure from the structure of the first two series, but it still felt like Star Trek to me. This show does not.

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Ceryse
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Reply #171 on: September 25, 2017, 03:29:36 AM

Watched the first two episodes (no, I didn't pay to access the service; nor would I). Some elements were good; in general the visuals were good (interiors were good, but felt off to me, likely due to camera angles and the like as has been said before). Did not like their visual take on Klingons at all. It isn't just the change in their personal appearance; much of the visuals (interior ship design, for example) seem divorced from anything even remotely Klingon. The speech patterns were horrendous, often sounding like the actors were struggling to speak Klingon (literally at times it was one word, pause, one word, pause, etc.). Even Shatner would shake his head. In general the acting wasn't good among the core characters, even to Star Trek standards.

Overall it doesn't come across as Star Trek, but generic sci-fi show stealing core Star Trek lore and dressing it up as 'meh' action sci-fi for the masses, and not doing a great job of it (DS9 had better fight scenes from what we saw -- largely because the camera work and such was very modern-jump-cut heavy). I wasn't expecting much from it, and the preview of the rest of the season at the end of episode two (dumb idea, imo) made it look un-appealing. I'll probably give it one more episode in hopes they turn it around, but I have strong doubts that its for me.
Special J
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Reply #172 on: September 25, 2017, 08:16:30 AM

I'm glad I'm not the only one to notice.  For some reason, they felt it necessary to tilt the camera on so many shots for no reason.  Why would you do this?  It's distracting to me. And scenes on the bridge just didn't look right.

Bunk
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Reply #173 on: September 25, 2017, 08:36:09 AM

It was playing on Space up here, so I got to see both episodes, sort of. They started it 15 minutes late for some reason, so anyone who PVR'd it lost the last 15 minutes of the second episode. Of course they replayed it like three times through the night, so Ive got it recorded to watch tonight.

It was pretty much what I expected - PEW, PEW, KABLEWY! And Theo Galavan for some reason.

I think I would have preferred a show about Michelle Yeoh as Captain instead, but I'll give it a chance.

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satael
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Reply #174 on: September 25, 2017, 09:49:41 AM

The first two episodes looked pretty good and hopefully it isn't just the extra money usually used for pilots. As for the plot it didn't impress me but then again Star Trek rarely does at the start.

Hopefully they'll get to exploration etc instead of more Klingons for a while.
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