Foot in the door - looking for interview advice

[Flood]

So after having to return home to regroup from some bad career decisions I'm attempting to relocate, get a job etc.  I'm focusing my efforts on the San Luis Obispo area of California.  It's a college town and there's a decent sized tech sector there - software companies and such - which fit my skillset (such as they are). 

A little embarrassed here - but my questions are related to the interview process.  I've been researching some of the companies I'm applying for, and they appear to be more progressive, relaxed, and...well hip I guess, with a younger employee base.  I'm in my early 40's but I'm wondering if the standards I used to use re: applying and interviewing are a bit dated.  I don't consider myself completely out of touch but I've become more conscious of my age in relation to the rest of the potential hires.   

Specifically - interview attire?  In this instance I'm not sure if suit and tie (or a tie at all) is going to throw a flag at a company where most of the employees are wearing sandals and flip flops to work each day and go to lunch at the beach a couple of miles away.  I don't want to show a lack of respect with my attire, but I'm trying to figure how to strike a balance between professional and appearing as a "good fit" for these types of companies.  Same principle goes for resume format and overall content really.  I don't want to come off as a poser basically.

Any input or experiences from you guys appreciated.           

[Samwise]

What department are you interviewing with and who's making the hiring decision?  For myself (as an engineer) I instinctively distrust anyone in a suit and tie because I associate that with somebody who's trying to put one over on me.  I try to put that aside during an interview and focus on the content but I'd be lying if I said that all else being equal I wouldn't tend to be more favorably disposed toward a more casually dressed candidate.  I'd tend to say "business casual" conveys that you aren't a slob (it's certainly better dressed than I'd be while interviewing you) without putting on airs.

If you're interviewing with marketing, though, it's pretty much the exact opposite and they probably won't even consider you if you aren't dressed like a snake oil salesman.  

[Flood]

Ah yeah should have mentioned - this is mid-level client services / product support / account management type stuff.  Customer facing, but over phone or email.

[Merusk]

Customer-facing put on your best clothes as you're representing the company. If they don't want groomed folks representing them, fine, but they'd better have a damn fine product.  I'm also an old fart, however.

[Samwise]

For account management you're more likely to be working with suits (and trying to razzle-dazzle them more than actually solving technical problems), so yeah, dress up a little more.

FWIW I've done a lot of in person customer facing stuff and never in a suit -- stuff like staffing booths at trade shows, giving talks at conferences, etc.  Clean/presentable casual (i.e. no holes or stains in your jeans and/or tshirt) or business casual tends to be the norm.  Might be a west coast thing.  But again, this is as an engineer who's generally talking to other engineers.

[Selby]

I'm younger than you by 10ish years but I've worn a suit to all my interviews despite having waist length hair & guitar playing fingernails.  I'm solely in engineering and never facing customers, plus most of the people I work with are never dressed nicely as I work with transformer oil regularly & wearing nice clothes to get ruined is dumb.  That said, if I interview someone not dressed in a suit or at least extremely nicely, I'd be reluctant to consider them unless their resume was completely stellar & they interviewed amazingly well.  There's just a certain "respect for the job" you're interviewing for that comes with putting your best foot forward including a decent suit.  Will some places refuse to hire you for wearing a nice suit to a job interview?  Sure.  But if they base their decision solely on "not wearing sandals to a job interview" decision, I'd question whether I'd want to work there anyways.  If they are a serious company they'll determine whether or not you'll fit in based on your skills & interview tactics.

If the interviewer says "feel free to ditch the tie/coat" during the interview as everyone is in sandals & shorts, take the hint ;-)

Times are changing but I don't think we're just there yet where you want to show up to a job interview not looking your best.  Doesn't mean crew cut & IBM suit but definitely a bit more than business casual.  Once you get the job you'll never have to look that good again most likely.

[Rendakor]

I've always worn a suit and tie to interviews as well, even when interviewing at places that didn't dress that way. Better to be overdressed than under.

[Trippy]

My general recommendation is dress for the interview a step above what you expect normally wear to that job. E.g. if the job's attire is "business casual" then I would wear a jacket along with some nice pants and shirt but most likely no tie.

However, figuring out the dress code for the position you are interviewing for may be a bit tricky without actually visiting the place before hand. Generally, though, for your kind of position, if customers regularly visit the office and/or the company's customers pay a lot of money for support your position will probably be expected to dress nicer.

[Tannhauser]

If you don't want to dress up, tell them you are coming straight from your current job so they'll understand you showing up with business casual.  I turned down the job though, never seen such rude/unprofessional management.

[Yegolev]

Just ask what the dress code is.

[schild]

Never work at a software company in a tech-related position if you can't wear flip-flops to the interview. Any company that gives a shit about dress code isn't worth working at.

(i checked my privilege at the door with my coat and whiteness)

[Signe]

If I had worn something fancy or business-like for most of my interviews, not that I had many, I probably wouldn't have got the job.  Most of my work mates and clients had more metal than skin.  I had hate to dress up anyway.  If I had to dress up for work every day, I'd fall over and cry real tears.  My clothes are mostly strange and, like me, not fit for the corporate world.  I would take a part time job at an ice cream shop, though, and wear an apron.  It's my dream job.

[Viin]

Never work at a software company in a tech-related position if you can't wear flip-flops to the interview. Any company that gives a shit about dress code isn't worth working at.

(i checked my privilege at the door with my coat and whiteness)

Oh please. You might be able to wear flipflops after you get the job, but you sure as hell shouldn't be interviewing in them. It's called being respectful and showing that you are a serious candidate.

[MahrinSkel]

I've been spoiled by video games, where the dress code is usually limited to "Must dress sufficiently as to not be arrested for indecent exposure during business hours." As I recall from before that, generally how uptight the dress code for tech workers is depends on how small a part of that company's business it is, and the standards for the business in general. If it's purely a software company, it's rare for the dress code to go beyond 'appropriate casual dress' for the area (from jeans and polo/open collar in the northeast to flip-flops and cargo shorts with t-shirts in the Southwest). Generally, tech workers inside of larger companies can go a notch or two more towards casual than general employees (so programmers and IT nerds at a bank wear slacks and dress shirts without ties, when everyone who isn't in a full suit is wearing a tie).

As a general rule for interviewing blind, khakis and an open-collar dress shirt with black walking shoes generally won't be so far in either direction as to hurt you regardless of what the dress standard for that shop is.

--Dave

[schild]

Never work at a software company in a tech-related position if you can't wear flip-flops to the interview. Any company that gives a shit about dress code isn't worth working at.

(i checked my privilege at the door with my coat and whiteness)

Oh please. You might be able to wear flipflops after you get the job, but you sure as hell shouldn't be interviewing in them. It's called being respectful and showing that you are a serious candidate.

Break barriers. Hang in there. Cat.gif

Every interview I've been to where I got the job, I've been wearing flipflops. Every interview I didn't, I was dressed the part of "stodgy white butthead."

You should watch the latest episode of Silicon Valley.

[Yegolev]

I do like that show.  If I wasn't stuck here, I'd go just for the spectacle.  I love a good spectacle.

Regarding the flip-flops, I'm glad that's working out for you but I really can't pull that off in the arena I'm working in.  I'm wearing a suit tomorrow to interview at Equifax; showing up in flip-flops would be job-slot suicide.  I even wore a button-up and coat to interview at Fiserv, where despite being a financial institution, everyone wore street clothes and one dude was wearing a Harley Davidson tee shirt.  I didn't get that one... is it the shoes?  BOOM SHAKA LAKA

[Quinton]

You have to know your audience.  SV tech companies... jeans and a (clean) t-shirt will likely be sufficient.  I've always worn closed shoes to interviews, but I wouldn't blink if someone I was interviewing was wearing sandals... flip-flops are a bit out there but still would have zero impact on my opinion of the candidate.  I find that most people do tend to dress a step above the expected day-to-day, which usually means something at the edge of business casual.  The only people I have every seen in suits are kids clearly fresh out of school (and often nervous as hell), but that doesn't count against you either, so no worries.

Financial or non-primarily-sw-shop, yeah, people probably expect folks to be in somewhat less casual wear.  East cost software shops, I gather, tend towards somewhat more formal than West coast ones.

Certainly if you're not sure there's zero harm in asking the recruiter or interview coordinator -- they're spending time (and maybe money) bringing you on-site, and their goal is to hire someone, so they have no incentive to needlessly make it harder for you to get the job due to some pointless non-technical issue like dress code.

[schild]

I guess its worth noting I've only applied to real jobs in Phoenix and Austin. 

[Shannow]

I even wore a button-up and coat to interview at Fiserv, where despite being a financial institution, everyone wore street clothes and one dude was wearing a Harley Davidson tee shirt.  I didn't get that one... is it the shoes?  BOOM SHAKA LAKA

Maybe that's why Fiserv sucks so much..

[Lantyssa]

I'd immediately discount someone in flip-flops, but that's because I hate them.  Otherwise, if you're showered and clean looking with closed-toe shoes, I'd only consider your qualifications and not care what you're wearing.

[Tebonas]

I went to my job interview at my current job (the data center for a banking house) with suit and tie. The second person I saw wore a Cannibal Corpse T-Shirt and black shorts. Turns out that was the department head of the Infrastructure department. Last time I wore a tie at work except when dealing with outsiders.

Still got the job, so I presume being overdressed potentially hurts less than being underdressed. People assume you become more casual when you settle in, people seldom assume you up your game once you get the job if your first impression is that of a hobo.  

[Engels]

You guys over think everything. Simple collared polo and dockers, 'sensible' shoes. If they don't hire you based on your attire when you wear something utterly innocuous and inoffensive, then they are either pretentious as fuck or too stuffy for words and you should bolt.

[01101010]

I'd immediately discount someone in flip-flops, but that's because I hate them.  Otherwise, if you're showered and clean looking with closed-toe shoes, I'd only consider your qualifications and not care what you're wearing.

But what about lifeguards!?!?   

[Hawkbit]

You guys over think everything. Simple collared polo and dockers, 'sensible' shoes. If they don't hire you based on your attire when you wear something utterly innocuous and inoffensive, then they are either pretentious as fuck or too stuffy for words and you should bolt.

It's pretty much this. We tend to frown on suits and ties, but sandals would be a bit too loose. We'd even be okay with dark jeans, too.

When we were acquired by our parent company from NY, the directors came in suits and our president told them to at least take off the ties. Otherwise they would seem to dominate and make the transition weird. Apparently, one of them threw a fit about not wearing a tie because it was 'unprofessional', but was told by the new COO to lose it or go home.

[schild]

guys, I'm half-fucking with you

Dress how the oldest executive at any given company would expect an interviewee to dress. There's no hard rule. I just happen to wear flip-flops to the vast majority of tech interviews because I have the confidence of 10,000 lesser men - all of whom work at tech companies.

[Paelos]

Show up to an interview in a suit. If it goes casual, take of the jacket.

There.

[schild]

Show up to an interview in a suit. If it goes casual, take of the jacket to reveal a "I fuck on the first date" shirt.

[Trippy]

If you do want to wear a tie but you don't have any that are hipster enough there's a company now that solves that problem: http://www.skinnyfatties.com/

[Teleku]

Show up to an interview in a suit. If it goes casual, take of the jacket.

There.

Ehhh, at my software company, experience was basically the same as Samwise.  Anybody who showed up to the interviews in a full suit set off a lot of warning bells to me and others I worked with.  Probably not fair, but the bias against them was there none the less.

[Paelos]

I always forget yall work in a weird ass industry.

[schild]

I always forget yall work in a weird ass industry.

Sorry, but given the landscape of the future, accounting is the weird ass industry now.

[Paelos]

K

[Draegan]

What department are you interviewing with and who's making the hiring decision?  For myself (as an engineer) I instinctively distrust anyone in a suit and tie because I associate that with somebody who's trying to put one over on me.  I try to put that aside during an interview and focus on the content but I'd be lying if I said that all else being equal I wouldn't tend to be more favorably disposed toward a more casually dressed candidate.  I'd tend to say "business casual" conveys that you aren't a slob (it's certainly better dressed than I'd be while interviewing you) without putting on airs.

If you're interviewing with marketing, though, it's pretty much the exact opposite and they probably won't even consider you if you aren't dressed like a snake oil salesman.  

I wore business casual to a skype interview (2nd phase of the interview process, first was a phone call, third would be in person interview) and the recruiter gave me feedback after I wasn't called back that I "wasn't dressed for an interview". It was an account manager type position.

I'm happy that I did, fuck working for a company like that anyway.

For any interview you do, wear a suit even if no one in the company ever wears them.

[Merusk]

If it's the Midwest/ South, wear a goddamn tie you fucking hippies.

 

[Samwise]

If it's the Midwest/ South, wear a goddamn tie you fucking hippies.

 

Yeah, if he hadn't said the job was in California I wouldn't have even said anything.  I'm well aware of how weird the rest of the country is about what configuration of textiles is draped over you.