Nextbox infinity anticipation station

[Fabricated]

Microsoft seriously has never gave up on that settop box fantasy have they?

[Miasma]

(And am I the only one basically just "Fuck this" at the no backwards compatability thing? Or has that been known and I'm late to the aw crap response?)

We knew they weren't going to stick with HD-DVD so it would be nigh impossible for it to be backwards compatible.  What would they do, add a second disc tray, try some sort of gimmick where the reading head uses two different lasers?  As soon as blu-ray won the format wars we knew the next xbox wouldn't be backwards compatible.

Best they could do is let you download old games and stick them on the hard drive, also not super likely.

[luckton]

Best they could do is let you download old games and stick them on the hard drive, also not super likely.

But that's exactly how the new Xbox is going to work.  You'll be able to download the game off the disc onto the Xbox hard drive.  That's where the whole argument about pre-owned games and charging a fee to download the game onto a different Xbox is coming from.

[Merusk]

(And am I the only one basically just "Fuck this" at the no backwards compatability thing? Or has that been known and I'm late to the aw crap response?)

We knew they weren't going to stick with HD-DVD so it would be nigh impossible for it to be backwards compatible.  What would they do, add a second disc tray, try some sort of gimmick where the reading head uses two different lasers?  As soon as blu-ray won the format wars we knew the next xbox wouldn't be backwards compatible.

Best they could do is let you download old games and stick them on the hard drive, also not super likely.

Except the Xbox doesn't use a HD-DVD drive. That was an external add-on. The box itself is a basic Dual-Layer DVD Drive and has no reason not to be able to run disks on the new system.   

A more likely reason would be something processor-based but I suspect there's no real reason there, either.

[Mrbloodworth]

The reason is so they can charge 19.99 so you can play games you already own when they "patch" them in the store.

[Miasma]

I think I might have early onset Alzheimers or something.  I thought the 360 lauched with hd-dvd.

[waffel]

Wouldn't the old games have to be updated to run on the new architecture of the new system? Pretty sure that would be a large undertaking and why it wasn't done.

[HaemishM]

I think I might have early onset Alzheimers or something.  I thought the 360 lauched with hd-dvd.

No, it was an add-on drive because Microsoft wasn't sure who would win the format war.

[schild]

I think I might have early onset Alzheimers or something.  I thought the 360 lauched with hd-dvd.

Nope. Wasn't ready in time. Everyone lolled. Sony won the HD war with zero effort.

[koro]

The reason they're claiming no backwards compatibility is due to changes in architecture, from whatever nVidia GPU they had powering the 360 to whatever they have going in the One, along with other changes, like with the CPU.

I don't know how much is bullshit though, as I'm not that technically inclined.

[Paelos]

I don't know how much is bullshit though, as I'm not that technically inclined.

Just assume 100%, and you'll usually be within about 10% or so.

[Mrbloodworth]

Wouldn't the old games have to be updated to run on the new architecture of the new system? Pretty sure that would be a large undertaking and why it wasn't done.

See: The Playstation store.

[waffel]

Any reason they can't slowly update 360 games to run on xbox One? They would just need to put them in the store, and use the old game's DVD to verify the purchase then allow you to download the updated game to the hard drive. A bonus is they could promote the games as Store-only and allow people that never purchased the classics to pay for the updated version.

Or maybe that makes too much sense...

[Phred]

A more likely reason would be something processor-based but I suspect there's no real reason there, either.

Isnt the 360 a power pc cpu? Wasn't it a huge headache for apple making the new intel macs emulate the old power pc based ones? Or is my memory fuzzy here.

[Maledict]

Seems like the entire machine is aimed to the USA and no-where else in the world. Definitely no appeal at all for me in Europe.

[luckton]

E3 is gonna be a hoot this year.  Sony's scrambling to get their new shit together, while MS seems to be on some level of zen that permits them to do whatever they want and just not care about "gaming".

And then there's Nintendo...

[Evildrider]

[Phred]

Any reason they can't slowly update 360 games to run on xbox One? They would just need to put them in the store, and use the old game's DVD to verify the purchase then allow you to download the updated game to the hard drive. A bonus is they could promote the games as Store-only and allow people that never purchased the classics to pay for the updated version.

Who do you think is going to do these upgrades? Microsoft? Every game company that has sold a game on the XBox? A bit impractical to expect Microsoft to update all those games. They'd have to beg the code from the original writers, pay a programmer to get familiar enough with it to port it to the new platform, etc. If you expect the game companies to port all their games for free maybe you've missed how many are hurting recently. I don't think you could make a business case for the cost vs goodwill here besides the game still works on the 360, it's not the game companies responsibility to make their game future proof.

[Rendakor]

I expect most of the popular old games to appear on the marketplace, but I'm pretty confident they'll charge for them (again).

[Phred]

I expect most of the popular old games to appear on the marketplace, but I'm pretty confident they'll charge for them (again).

Ya don't they reboot them as HD versions or something?

[Jeff Kelly]

Nope. Wasn't ready in time. Everyone lolled. Sony won the HD war with zero effort.

Bluray had most of the industry behind it, including the MPEG partners, they had created a licensing organization and had a roadmap for increasing the capacity and adding features without breaking compatability over the next five years.

HD-DVD had Microsoft and Panasonic, an inferior video codec as default that wasn't supported by any hardware decoder chip and no plan moving forward beyond the initial announcement. It was pretty much dead from the start. If they had included it in the 360 it might have had a fighting chance but with the XBox using DVDs it was pretty much done.

[Jeff Kelly]

The 360 has  a 3-core IBM PowerPC processor,  ATI graphics and 512 MB GDDR3 memory. The XBox One has an AMD CPU, ATI GPU and 8 GB of GDDR3 memory. So no direct downwards compatibility they'd have to integrate an 360 into the new XBox to make that happen.

There are rumors of a redesigned 360 for $99 floating around though that supposedly has CPU, RAM and GPU on a single chip and will supposedly be announced at E3.

[Kageru]

Microsoft seriously has never gave up on that settop box fantasy have they?

It could also be because they are concerned about apple making inroads on the TV and this is a preemptive maneuver. And being a proprietary system that is powered by exclusive content you don't have much of an option but to accept that their corporate goals have precedence.

Also bragging about having multiple operating systems on a console is a good indication you are doing it wrong.

[Jeff Kelly]

They want to make app development more accessible to developers familiar with Windows who have no prior XBox os experience. Yet they need the lightweight OS for game developers already invested and trained in XBox development.

Also: The completely new feature of multitasking.

[Sky]

Bluray had most of the industry porn behind it, including the MPEG partners, they had created a licensing organization and had a roadmap for increasing the capacity and adding features without breaking compatability over the next five years.

HD-DVD had Microsoft and Panasonic, an inferior video codec as default that wasn't supported by any hardware decoder chip and no plan moving forward beyond the initial announcement. It was pretty much dead from the start. If they had included it in the 360 it might have had a fighting chance but with the XBox using DVDs it was pretty much done.

[UnSub]

Actually, I think the pr0n industry picked HD-DVD first. But that's not something I can search for right now.

Someone else made the point that this looks like MS' challenge to any potential AppleTV set-up. I'd agree with that thinking. Now all they need is an absolute ton of licence deals to get the content needed for such a push.

I'm waiting to see what the E3 presentation says about the XBone - this presentation wasn't for the hard core gaming market. So it isn't surprising that hard core gamers weren't impressed.

[Maledict]

If this is Microsofts potential challenge to Apple TV then its laughably embarrassing.

Seriously, why do they think this is how they should compete? Why do they keep making these similar, stupid mistakes?

And why on earth does their operating system take up 3 gig on an 8 gig machine?

[schild]

Actually, I think the pr0n industry picked HD-DVD first. But that's not something I can search for right now.

That was because HD-DVD was readily available 3 months before blu-ray. By 2007 they were publishing on both platforms. By 2008 they dropped blu-ray.

Porn didn't have a horse in the race until it decided it was too expensive to support both. Besides the market penetration of cheaper blu-ray players, and the PS3, and blu-ray readers being available for PC made the decision for them. Hybrid players cost over $400 and HD-DVD readers were few and far between.

Porn didn't pick the winner, it just put the final nail in the coffin of HD-DVD (though, arguably, Microsoft did it themselves by rushing the 360 out the door without HD-DVD as the standard).

[Azazel]

Porn would also have simply gone with the flow of popularity this time. It wasn't a VHS/Betamax situation, and porn consumers already had DVD and various online options for their "needs", especially since DVD production at that time was cheap as dirt, while either of the hi-def options would cost a fair bit more.

[schild]

Also, hi-def porn is still terrifying.

[apocrypha]

[apocrypha]

Seriously, why do they think this is how they should compete? Why do they keep making these similar, stupid mistakes?

Because the problem that Microsoft sees is always "Why isn't our stuff in these lucrative markets?". Which is never the problem that us consumers see.

The Xbone hasn't been created to answer the question "How can we make an awesome gaming machine?" but "How can we make a machine that taps into as many markets as possible?".

Diversify or excel. Not both.

[Azazel]

When it comes to buying games, I've massively favoured towards the 360 over my Blu-Ray player PS3 this round, just as the PS2 won over my XBMC XBox 1 last time. This time, it looks like I won't even need to buy an Xbox 1.1. For this next wave, I'll stick with my PC, and maybe a SteamBox or possibly a PS4 if they don't also go full retard. Which means it's probably PC/Steambox.

[Rendakor]

Bloodworth from this page.

[apocrypha]

Bloodworth from this page.

Oops, sorry! Knew I'd seen it somewhere before...