Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
March 28, 2024, 07:38:57 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Search:     Advanced search
we're back, baby
*
Home Help Search Login Register
f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  World of Warcraft  |  Topic: To what extent should RP servers be enforced? 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 Go Down Print
Author Topic: To what extent should RP servers be enforced?  (Read 40153 times)
Train Wreck
Contributor
Posts: 796


on: February 23, 2005, 11:32:14 AM

I just finished reading this thread (also linked to from a different topic as an example of what's wrong with humanity).

I'm on ER, which is nominally RP.  I've never been on a general server, but the level of stupid on the RP server doesn't seem to be any lower than the other MORPGs I have played.  Far less than half the population makes any attempt to role play, and many of the names are just as stupid (I ran into somebody named "xxyabc" last night, for instance).

I've seen two types of players that feed off of each other in some kind of bizarre relationship: The ultra RPers and the doods.  The former constantly cry about what goes on in general chat.  When suggested that they put general chat on ignore, they get indignant and insist on staying because they "aren't the ones ignoring the rules."  (I don't know if they're roleplaying sissy elves, or if they really act like that all the time.)  The later type, of course, lives to menance players that are trying to stay in character.  (Apparently the memo about "not feeding the trolls" never made it into the World of Warcraft.

Since a lot of you have characters on ER, I am wondering what your attitudes are about it?  I don't care much what other people do, except when it comes to names that are sexual in nature, or a truly random stream of letters, such as Mr. Xxyabc.  As far as chat goes, my ignore trigger finger is just as fast as the best of them, and I actually have more bad RPers in there than anything else right now.
Llava
Contributor
Posts: 4602

Rrava roves you rong time


Reply #1 on: February 23, 2005, 11:44:56 AM

I'd prefer a community of casual roleplaying, which is to say that most people do it but they don't flip out if you decide not to.  The flip side of that is that the ones who choose not to would respect those who do and try to avoid getting in the way.

Of course, that will never happen.

I like to listen in to those arguments and toss in points to confuse people.  The doods, for example, were saying "If this is a RP server, why aren't you RPing on general chat?" and the RPers counter by saying "We can't RP on general chat, it doesn't make sense.  Why would we be able to hear what everyone's saying?"

And then I jump in and say "The power of Teldrassil and the spirits that support it cause a sort of communal telepathy to occur in all who currently reside upon the new World Tree."

And then they all hate me- the RPers because I disagreed with them and the doods because I tried to put some story into the game.

That the saints may enjoy their beatitude and the grace of God more abundantly they are permitted to see the punishment of the damned in hell. -Saint Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica
Shockeye
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 6668

Skinny-dippin' in a sea of Lee, I'd propose on bended knee...


WWW
Reply #2 on: February 23, 2005, 12:06:24 PM

I play on RP servers so I don't have to see "HawtBetty3431" and "BuffGuy12" running around all over.
WayAbvPar
Moderator
Posts: 19268


Reply #3 on: February 23, 2005, 12:08:30 PM

I play on RP servers so I don't have to see "HawtBetty3431" and "BuffGuy12" running around all over.

Ditto. I don't mind a bit of light roleplaying, but I certainly don't go out of my way to do it or expect anyone else to. I just want the jarringly stupid names away from me.

When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM

Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood

Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
Sky
Terracotta Army
Posts: 32117

I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.


Reply #4 on: February 23, 2005, 12:10:09 PM

1. Turn off /1 General.
2. Ignore rp nazis.
3. Ignore d00dz.
4. Enjoy WoW.
5. FOR THE HORDE.

I roleplay casually. I try to keep in the flavor of my character. But honestly, Azeroth is just a bit too generic fantasy for me to work up any sort of real character history or motivations, so I generally play a bloodthirsty orc who wants to rip elves. I gauge my speech patterns (which are usually just 'kill that elf' anyway) by the quest and flavor text provided in game, not all orcs speak like peons. Generally I just speak normally with a bit of gruffness and don't take the anti-elf sentiment to the disturbing lengths some folks do.

I like roleplaying until I'm around "hardcore" roleplayers for a while, then I want to claw my eyes out or watch monster trucks or something. "Hardcore" roleplayers can ghey up anything imo.

I have no idea why people who don't want to roleplay are on the roleplaying server. Perhaps we could ask...Bat Country ;)
Shockeye
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 6668

Skinny-dippin' in a sea of Lee, I'd propose on bended knee...


WWW
Reply #5 on: February 23, 2005, 12:12:03 PM

I play on RP servers so I don't have to see "HawtBetty3431" and "BuffGuy12" running around all over.

Ditto. I don't mind a bit of light roleplaying, but I certainly don't go out of my way to do it or expect anyone else to. I just want the jarringly stupid names away from me.

I can respect the fruity RPers wishes to RP and I can avoid the silly levels of it some of them get in to. I just want a quiet place to kill my Foozles that doesn't lower my IQ when I look at the names of the people around me. Also, the people on RP servers seem to have a better grasp of english. As in, they can actually type a coherent sentence every so often
ahoythematey
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1729


Reply #6 on: February 23, 2005, 12:16:30 PM

I generally stay away from RP servers because, although I'll have to deal with a flock of assholes no matter where I play, I'd rather deal with the generic variety than the haugty, self-important fuckheads that throw a hissy at everything outside of their control.
MrHat
Terracotta Army
Posts: 7432

Out of the frying pan, into the fire.


Reply #7 on: February 23, 2005, 12:18:34 PM

1. Turn off /1 General.
2. Ignore rp nazis.
3. Ignore d00dz.
4. Enjoy WoW.
5. FOR THE HORDE.

Turning off /1 General is essential to a sane environment.
Jayce
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2647

Diluted Fool


Reply #8 on: February 23, 2005, 12:19:43 PM

Raph the Great said (somewhere) that any RP server or game would be a police state by definition.  I think that's the only way to go if they are serious about keeping the RP flavor of those servers, which sounds like a joke atm.

It would have to become a violation of the CoC to talk about anything OOC except perhaps on some special channel.  Rules lawyers would have to be dealt with ruthlessly too unfortunately.  The good news is that they wouldn't have to ban anyone, just put a flag on their account saying they can't use RP servers.

That, or they could put manpower toward dealing with issues that actually affect anyone, which seems to be what they are doing.

Witty banter not included.
Shockeye
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 6668

Skinny-dippin' in a sea of Lee, I'd propose on bended knee...


WWW
Reply #9 on: February 23, 2005, 12:22:16 PM

I generally stay away from RP servers because, although I'll have to deal with a flock of assholes no matter where I play, I'd rather deal with the generic variety than the haugty, self-important fuckheads that throw a hissy at everything outside of their control.

Were you bashing RPers or people in this forum?






































JUST KIDDING ALL YOU HAUGHTY, SELF-IMPORTANT FUCKHEADS!
Sky
Terracotta Army
Posts: 32117

I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.


Reply #10 on: February 23, 2005, 12:32:50 PM

Quote
It would have to become a violation of the CoC to talk about anything OOC except perhaps on some special channel.
Don't violate Pepper Keenan!
HaemishM
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 42628

the Confederate flag underneath the stone in my class ring


WWW
Reply #11 on: February 23, 2005, 12:35:43 PM

Turning off /1 General is essential to a sane environment.

Goddamn right.

Not one of those Arrr-peeee fags should ever use General chat. NOT FUCKING ONE. There is no goddamn ARRR-PEEEEE justification for it. Every single zone-wide AND peer to peer chat should be fucking turned off, including /tell. Every fucking one. Now THAT'S roleplaying.

Of course, you can't do that, because the RP fags would bitch and it would dramatically alter the game. However, the trend of setting up special RP servers is retarded. The rules that are in place for them WILL NEVER BE ENFORCED, unless you give the RP'ers enforcement powers. You won't have the manpower, especially when you think about the fact that RP servers are the minority of server types. It's just a retarded idea to ever think it could be enforced. You won't have the manpower.

And this comes from a casual RP'er myself. MMOG's have too many people on servers to try to enforce some arbitrary and potentially idiotic ideal of roleplaying.

Shockeye
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 6668

Skinny-dippin' in a sea of Lee, I'd propose on bended knee...


WWW
Reply #12 on: February 23, 2005, 12:43:29 PM

The rules that are in place for them WILL NEVER BE ENFORCED, unless you give the RP'ers enforcement powers. You won't have the manpower, especially when you think about the fact that RP servers are the minority of server types. It's just a retarded idea to ever think it could be enforced. You won't have the manpower.

If manpower is the problem they could set up a special volunteer counselor program to help people RP correctly and to enforce things when rules are broken...
Train Wreck
Contributor
Posts: 796


Reply #13 on: February 23, 2005, 12:51:14 PM

Also, the people on RP servers seem to have a better grasp of english. As in, they can actually type a coherent sentence every so often

I hadn't noticed.  U, ur, hlp plz, and cuz are especially prolific.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2005, 12:56:40 PM by Train Wreck »
ahoythematey
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1729


Reply #14 on: February 23, 2005, 05:29:38 PM

Were you bashing RPers or people in this forum?

A little from column A, a little from column B.  It's sort of hypocritical, since I was/am both of those at one time or another.
Train Wreck
Contributor
Posts: 796


Reply #15 on: February 24, 2005, 01:21:15 PM

Sometimes the fights between RPers and gimps can be amusing, mostly from seeing just how much the former lets the later get under their skin when all they had to do is type "/ignore Obnoxiousfucktard" like the other 40 people in the zone managed to do without a word.

It's too late for Blizzard to enforce its RP servers, it even if they wanted to.  If it were up to me, I would enforce names, but that's about it.
Numtini
Terracotta Army
Posts: 7675


Reply #16 on: February 27, 2005, 10:06:54 AM

I've just never understood why people go to RP servers and then ignore the rules. There's plenty of regular servers out there.

I'm all for enforcing the rules with a big big stick. I just don't get what the issue is. Don't want to deal with it? Think the rules are stupid? Then don't play on an RP server.

It's like rolling on a regular server and then whining that you can't PK people.

Having said that, I'd love to see two levels of RP servers. One that's basically removal of the dood names and that kind of thing. And another for, well, RPers. Charge an extra buck a month or something for the latter.

If you can read this, you're on a board populated by misogynist assholes.
Kail
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2858


Reply #17 on: February 27, 2005, 03:14:43 PM

Not one of those Arrr-peeee fags should ever use General chat. NOT FUCKING ONE. There is no goddamn ARRR-PEEEEE justification for it. Every single zone-wide AND peer to peer chat should be fucking turned off, including /tell. Every fucking one. Now THAT'S roleplaying.

Of course, you can't do that, because the RP fags would bitch and it would dramatically alter the game. However, the trend of setting up special RP servers is retarded.

Yeah, I've got to admit, I don't really see the point of roleplaying in something like World of Warcraft, because your character actions are just so limited that it doesn't seem possible to play a character.  It's like trying to roleplay in Quake or something.  I suppose you could roleplay the part of a violent warrior, or something, but the whole thing is set up as such an obvious "Game" world that it seems a bit redundant.  In World of Warcraft, at any rate, identical quests are hand-fed to you at a predetermined rate, so the only way I can see someone "roleplaying" a specific character is to decline quests that don't fit with their character concepts.  There isn't any way to say "I want to play a character who does X" and then go out and do X; if Blizzard hasn't coded a quest that incorporates it, you can't do it.

In general, the only "roleplaying" I've seen on roleplaying servers is that some players type with an accent (E.G. "Ach, dinnae anyone want tae be buyin' an axe with 56 DPS?"), while other players jump in to make fun of people typing in character, other people yell at people who aren't typing in character, and still other people yell at people to stop yelling at everyone and just enjoy the game.  Maybe it's just the places I've been, and in other areas, people are weaving elaborate dramas of tragedy and dreams, or whaveter, but I really doubt it.  If someone's looking for actual roleplaying, I'd suggest getting out of World of Warcraft altogether.  There are a number of ways to encourage roleplaying in a computer game, and Warcraft does almost none of them.

On the other hand, some people join RP servers in the belief that there are fewer annoying people there.  Personally, I find the bickering in general chat about roleplaying to be worse than the miscellaneous bickering in non-RP servers that it replaces, but I can see why other people might prefer the opposite.  If someone was to switch off the general chat, though, I don't know how they'd tell the difference between the two.

As to the topic question, I don't know that roleplaying should  be enforced.  If a company wants to encourage roleplaying in their game on a large scale, they should design that game to encourage roleplaying, not try to hammer a square peg into a round hole by penalizing people who play the game they designed.  In World of Warcraft, anyone on any server could be argued to be roleplaying, technically.  In a world where you could broadcast your thoughts across the nation, you could instantly see the precise numerical effectiveness of any item or ability, death was a mild annoyance, and every task you are given has already been completed by hordes of other people, I have no doubt that things would end up looking very similar to World of Warcraft.  If you want people to act like characters from Lord of the Rings, then make your game world similar to Lord of the Rings.  There's more to this than putting orcs and swords in the game.  Aragorn doesn't pick up a sword and say "Hmm, this sword deals eleven point two average per strike with six fire damage, but has a two round recycle," because that information isn't available to him.  He might comment on the heft, the sharpness, the balance, the craftsmanship, something like that, because that information is available to him.  He doesn't run off to fight Sauron because he's got nothing better to do, he does it because his world is genuinely in trouble.  People react in fairly standard ways (loosely speaking) to standard situations, and the game designers create those situations.

Of course, making such a game would be difficult, and making it fun to play may well prove to be virtually impossible.  But, for what it's worth, it would have role-playing.
Litigator
Terracotta Army
Posts: 187


Reply #18 on: February 27, 2005, 05:57:46 PM

I think RP is unappealing in general and is just the stupidest thing imaginable in a game like World of Warcraft.  Frankly every nerd on the planet thinks he can write "fantasy," every nerd who dreams of having magical powers seems to write about it, and even the people who do it professionally do it badly. The unsolicited fantasy and sci-fi manuscripts arrive at publishing houses in stacks, and are usually passed straight into the recycle bin still in their original envelopes.  Exposure to the amateur "fanfics" is a violation of the Geneva Convention. 

Blizzard's aesthetic for Starcraft, Warcraft and Diablo is to take an aesthetic with a lot of cliches and to try to construct a world that includes all of them, in a sort of tongue and cheek manner.  The lore is as generic as it can be and is designed to pack as many cool video game encounters as possible. But it's much too convoluted to have anything approaching a compelling fantasy narrative (which are always, at their core, parables about the individuals coping with massive social instability). RPers don't seem to understand that the alien-ness of fantasy worlds is a device which allows for comment about real issues. I can't imagine anything worse than reading the fantasy writings of anyone who doesn't understand that the Hobbits' motivation in "Lord of the Rings" has something to do with the Luftwaffe strafing the ever-loving shit out of Tolkien's beloved English countryside. 

You can't have that kind of focused narrative in a world with dragons and demons and zombies and elves and orcs and dinosaurs and giant alien bugs all going at each other. But it makes for a hell of a video game, because there is a bunch of different stuff to kill and a bunch of different stuff to look at. In order to provide varied content, the storyline has to become convoluted, and, from any narrative or thematic viewpoint bad.  WoW at least is self-consciously bad, taking the notion of epic fantasy conflict to hyperbolic  absurdity, and then packing in references to every movie they've ever seen on top of it. If you try to teke the World of Warcraft seriously, the joke is on you.


In general when I'm playing video games, it's perfectly acceptable just to be playing video games.  I don't need to be immersed to the point that I actually want to pretend to be a moonwalking elf.  I feel like you must have to really hate your life to want to subsume yourself in one of these characters. Hardcore RPers must be really sad individuals, and rules that restrict annoying names don't justify having an unusual concentration of these people. I play on a PvP server. 

schild
Administrator
Posts: 60345


WWW
Reply #19 on: February 27, 2005, 06:09:03 PM

WoW at least is self-consciously bad, taking the notion of epic fantasy conflict to hyperbolic  absurdity, and then packing in references to every movie they've ever seen on top of it. If you try to teke the World of Warcraft seriously, the joke is on you.

This is the same reason I don't like Buffy the Vampire Slayer and by extension most Whedon stuff. When I play a game or watch a sci-fi/fantasy/drama show, I want to take the world seriously and as such, expect them to take the world seriously. I don't need schlocky b-movie campiness. If I did, I'd play schlocky b-rate games and watch schlocky b-rate movies.

Of course, I don't find Norrath all that compelling either - and they take it very seriously. Pendulum swings both ways and no one has found that happy grey area inbetween the extremes. The only way to find it is through experiementation - which neither SOE or Blizzard will be doing. It's unfortunate too. I can only think of a couple games where that happy medium was found and most of them are first-person shooter/rpg hybrids (Deus Ex, Thief, System Shock, platformers like ICO and Beyond Good & Evil, on a VERY rare occasion an RPG (Planescape, Baldur's Gate 1 & 2), and very old adventure games (Grim Fandango, etc).
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #20 on: February 28, 2005, 03:30:44 AM

Roleplaying in WoW is like trying to roleplay in Diablo 2.  Sure you can technically do it, but the range of expression is so limited that the gameplay will be dictating your character rather than the other way around.  You had better not have a character concept in mind that doesn't fall neatly into one of the pre-determined class/race combinations.  For example, I decided I wanted to play something of an evil bastard human.  In UO, this might entail training necromancy/poisoning/whatever, dressing in black, and running out into the woods to murder innocent pixies and unicorns until it says "the vile" next to my name.  Maybe that's not really roleplay in itself, but it is an example of the gameworld letting me define my character as being distinct from all the noble paladins out there.  Meanwhile, back in World of Warcraft, all I could really do was complete heroic quest after heroic quest while saying "I'm not really heroic!  I'm a bastard who does it for the shinies!"  But really, as far as the universe was concerned, I was yet another noble hero in actions and appearance.

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
Calantus
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2389


Reply #21 on: February 28, 2005, 04:24:23 AM

I never would have guessed you like to play the asshole Windup. No, really.
Signe
Terracotta Army
Posts: 18942

Muse.


Reply #22 on: February 28, 2005, 06:49:27 AM

Me either.  I'm shocked. 


Ok... I'm over it.

My Sig Image: hath rid itself of this mortal coil.
Ironwood
Terracotta Army
Posts: 28240


Reply #23 on: February 28, 2005, 07:01:48 AM

For example, I decided I wanted to play something of an evil bastard human.  In UO, this might entail training necromancy/poisoning/whatever, dressing in black, and running out into the woods to murder innocent pixies and unicorns until it says "the vile" next to my name.  Maybe that's not really roleplay in itself, but it is an example of the gameworld letting me define my character as being distinct from all the noble paladins out there.  Meanwhile, back in World of Warcraft, all I could really do was complete heroic quest after heroic quest while saying "I'm not really heroic!  I'm a bastard who does it for the shinies!"  But really, as far as the universe was concerned, I was yet another noble hero in actions and appearance.


Um, then call me stupid, but maybe you should be playing and Undead Warlock ?  Just a thought.  I'm an undead Rogue and I have no end of bastard quests.

In fairness, I see what you're saying - your talking about changing things beyond the 'norm' of the class - a peaceful and content undead warlock, for example.  The trouble with that is that the warcraft world is pretty black and white along those lines, as you say - but the other trouble is that when you give people the chance to do stuff like this, they tend to flock to be the 'dreadlord horrible person' while still taking advantage of a 'good' race.  If you gave Paladins the option to be 'bad' for example, then you have to start rationalising WHY holy light works.  What the fuck is up with your God, if that's the case ?

Also, bear in mind that pushing the norms and bringing together polar opposites is how we get thiings like Good Dark Elf Rangers.

With that in mind :  Fuck That.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Train Wreck
Contributor
Posts: 796


Reply #24 on: February 28, 2005, 10:49:37 AM

You can't have that kind of focused narrative in a world with dragons and demons and zombies and elves and orcs and dinosaurs and giant alien bugs all going at each other. But it makes for a hell of a video game, because there is a bunch of different stuff to kill and a bunch of different stuff to look at. In order to provide varied content, the storyline has to become convoluted, and, from any narrative or thematic viewpoint bad.  WoW at least is self-consciously bad, taking the notion of epic fantasy conflict to hyperbolic  absurdity, and then packing in references to every movie they've ever seen on top of it. If you try to teke the World of Warcraft seriously, the joke is on you.

That's probably why almost all of the Ar-peeing I've seen in WoW so far has been very tongue-in-cheek, including my own limited participation.  It's inclined to be more like Monty Python or SNL than LotR, but at least it's entertaining.  In fact, I prefer it that way.  The reason the Warcraft world has always appealed to me was because it's a breath of fresh air when compared to fantasy worlds that take themselves ultra-seriously.  You gotta love it when a dwarf with a mortar and a bad Scottish accent shouts, "Hey you!  Catch!"

It even has a /silly command.  "Moo.  Are you happy now?", or the unapologetically irreverent "I'm going to relieve myself behind this bush.  Cover me!"

I guess I can see why people that want to be Keithineolin the Exiled Elven prince, complete with a website that documents his ongoing search to find his family and true love, may detest a world like WoW.  But as for me, I'm in my element.
WayAbvPar
Moderator
Posts: 19268


Reply #25 on: February 28, 2005, 10:53:33 AM

Quote
Also, bear in mind that pushing the norms and bringing together polar opposites is how we get thiings like Good Dark Elf Rangers.

AAAARRGGGGHHH!!!!


Sorry...flashback to my last UO resub. By that time, I would venture that fully 1/5 of every fucktard I ran across was named Drizz't or Raistlin or some bastardization thereof. It was enough to make Baby Jesus shit his nappy.

When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM

Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood

Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #26 on: February 28, 2005, 01:33:12 PM

Um, then call me stupid, but maybe you should be playing and Undead Warlock ?  Just a thought.  I'm an undead Rogue and I have no end of bastard quests.

Then I'd just be Undead Warlock Bastard #3612, my character still completely undifferentiated as I slide down the linear set of rails put there by Blizzard for my race/class combo.  All humans are good, all undead are bad, and there won't be any conflict beyond simple wordless violence because the two can't even speak to one another.  That isn't an RPG at all.

Quote
In fairness, I see what you're saying - your talking about changing things beyond the 'norm' of the class - a peaceful and content undead warlock, for example.  The trouble with that is that the warcraft world is pretty black and white along those lines, as you say

I just don't know why Blizzard put RP servers in place, when the game clearly isn't designed for RP at all.

Quote
but the other trouble is that when you give people the chance to do stuff like this, they tend to flock to be the 'dreadlord horrible person' while still taking advantage of a 'good' race.  If you gave Paladins the option to be 'bad' for example, then you have to start rationalising WHY holy light works.  What the fuck is up with your God, if that's the case ?

Well in UO, the effectiveness of paladin abilities is modified by karma.  So if you want to use those abilities to go out and slaughter innocent peasants or whatever, you can, but you'll be getting weaker with each kill.  On the other hand, the use of Necromancy depletes your karma so much that it's almost impossible to keep it in the positive range.

Quote
Also, bear in mind that pushing the norms and bringing together polar opposites is how we get thiings like Good Dark Elf Rangers.

That's the fault of the hack writer who created an "evil race" in the first place.

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
Jayce
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2647

Diluted Fool


Reply #27 on: February 28, 2005, 01:47:39 PM

Well in UO, the effectiveness of paladin abilities is modified by karma.  So if you want to use those abilities to go out and slaughter innocent peasants or whatever, you can, but you'll be getting weaker with each kill.  On the other hand, the use of Necromancy depletes your karma so much that it's almost impossible to keep it in the positive range.

What if I want to be a paladin that slaughters innocent villagers but because of my pact with dark powers I still manage to keep all my strength?

I mean come on, you could just as easily say that you are sliding down the rails UO gives you because they won't let you be a powerful paladin and still be ev0l.  Just because the quest structure is less straightforward and effect based rather than having you specifically accept a charge to go do something good doesn't mean it's any different.

I don't think it breaks immersion at all for a clergyman of "The Light" to ask a young paladin to go off and do great deeds.  And you don't have to do a single quest to play WoW - you can go kill bunnies for all the game cares.  The quest system is just there to give you a direction if you so desire it.  Just so happens, most reasonable people do desire it (ones without an axe to grind about how The Old Stuff is Better).

Witty banter not included.
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #28 on: February 28, 2005, 08:35:56 PM

What if I want to be a paladin that slaughters innocent villagers but because of my pact with dark powers I still manage to keep all my strength?

I mean come on, you could just as easily say that you are sliding down the rails UO gives you because they won't let you be a powerful paladin and still be ev0l.  Just because the quest structure is less straightforward and effect based rather than having you specifically accept a charge to go do something good doesn't mean it's any different.

WoW gives you no input into your character at all, outside of straight advancement.  A warlock and a paladin don't really do anything different in the world, besides their class-specific quests, and the world doesn't react to either of them differently.  On the other hand if you and I are both plain vanilla warriors in UO, except yours has butchered one too many gypsy encampments and is down into negative karma, and we bump into an angel?  It'll rez me if I die, but it'll chase after you and kick your ass.

Quote
I don't think it breaks immersion at all for a clergyman of "The Light" to ask a young paladin to go off and do great deeds.

You clearly missed the point, which is this:  The deeds aren't all that great when they're the only ones you can do.

Quote
And you don't have to do a single quest to play WoW - you can go kill bunnies for all the game cares.  The quest system is just there to give you a direction if you so desire it.  Just so happens, most reasonable people do desire it (ones without an axe to grind about how The Old Stuff is Better).

Yes, a hardcore masochist could play the game without quests.  But there still wouldn't be any character differentiation, just a slower rate of advancement.

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
Ironwood
Terracotta Army
Posts: 28240


Reply #29 on: March 01, 2005, 01:03:31 AM


That isn't an RPG at all.



Yes, Yes - you're right.  And ?

The problem comes from calling them RP servers.  I have no idea why they did that.  All I know is that those particular servers have really cut down on stupid names and stupid people (European Earthen Ring, anyways...)


"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Jayce
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2647

Diluted Fool


Reply #30 on: March 01, 2005, 03:04:17 AM

On the other hand if you and I are both plain vanilla warriors in UO, except yours has butchered one too many gypsy encampments and is down into negative karma, and we bump into an angel?  It'll rez me if I die, but it'll chase after you and kick your ass.

You are essentially talking about faction. WoW has that.  And, that wasn't in UO when I was playing.  So it's a recent addition. WoW has it at launch.

Quote
You clearly missed the point, which is this:  The deeds aren't all that great when they're the only ones you can do.


Yes, a hardcore masochist could play the game without quests.  But there still wouldn't be any character differentiation, just a slower rate of advancement.

I didn't miss the point.  They aren't the only ones you can do, but even in real life do you think a goody two-shoes could walk into a crack house and ask them if they want something done?  First they'd say, hi Mr Cop and second he'd find himself in a shallow grave.

And I have a friend who refuses to quest.  His rate of advancement is faster if anything, but probably about comparable.  It's just more fun to watch grass grow than to grind like that (IMO) as we all know from countless games of this genre.  He is new to it though, so that's probably why he doesn't care.

Witty banter not included.
Merusk
Terracotta Army
Posts: 27449

Badge Whore


Reply #31 on: March 01, 2005, 03:52:21 AM


That isn't an RPG at all.

Yes, Yes - you're right.  And ?

The problem comes from calling them RP servers.  I have no idea why they did that. 

Behold the power of noisy lobbists and the company that just wants them to shut the fuck up.

From the time in Beta that the PvP servers were announced up until the RP servers were announced there were at least 2 5+ page threads a week asking why Blizzard was 'catering' to one demographic while ignoring the other.

Ah, how I love the "me" generation redux.

The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
AOFanboi
Terracotta Army
Posts: 935


Reply #32 on: March 01, 2005, 04:42:19 AM

The problem comes from calling them RP servers.  I have no idea why they did that.
In the same way the PvP servers draw the battle.net griefer crowd away from normal servers, the RP-flagged servers attract "roleplayers". (For "roleplayers" read fantasy literature psychos who build their entire persona around someone else's IP whether it's Tolkien, Salvatore or Weis/Hickman.)

They are there to make the Normal servers playable. And for that I thank them.

Current: Mario Kart DS, Nintendogs
Ironwood
Terracotta Army
Posts: 28240


Reply #33 on: March 01, 2005, 04:52:43 AM

The problem comes from calling them RP servers.  I have no idea why they did that.
In the same way the PvP servers draw the battle.net griefer crowd away from normal servers, the RP-flagged servers attract "roleplayers". (For "roleplayers" read fantasy literature psychos who build their entire persona around someone else's IP whether it's Tolkien, Salvatore or Weis/Hickman.)

They are there to make the Normal servers playable. And for that I thank them.


My Point was, it doesn't appear to be doing that, at least as far as I can see.  Hardcore 'Roleplaying' is not in evidence.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
blindy
Terracotta Army
Posts: 32


Reply #34 on: March 01, 2005, 07:35:59 AM


Yes, a hardcore masochist could play the game without quests.  But there still wouldn't be any character differentiation, just a slower rate of advancement.

Grinding, if anything, is faster than questing, especially at 30+, though it does depend on your class to some extent.  The absolute fastest way to level is a mix of questing and grinding, where you do a selection of quests that are all in the same area and that you can do at the same time and then top it off with grinding till you're ready to move to the next area.
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 Go Up Print 
f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  World of Warcraft  |  Topic: To what extent should RP servers be enforced?  
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.10 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC