2012 College Football

[Chimpy]

Too much money in the Big Ten for them to give the death penalty to a school in the conference.

[ghost]

Hit em in the wallet, take away their TV revenue.

That's an option.  They're talking "unprecedented penalties" and I suppose that could mean anything.  I suspect it will be more than the typical reduction in scholarships and bowl ban nonsense.  I was thinking that if you really wanted to send a message take away their ability to offer athletic scholarships for a few years.  That would certainly be worse than the death penalty. 

[ghost]

Okay, so the Penn State Sanctions:

1.  60 million dollars paid into a fund to prevent child sexual abuse
2.  Vacating all wins back to 1998 (Paterno's record changed to represent)
3.  4 year bowl ban
4.  10 scholarship reduction from 25 to 15 for 4 years.


This is a big deal.  While it's still not as big of a deal as the death penalty, I think it's pretty fair.  I would have tacked on another year for the bowl ban and scholarship reduction, personally.


Addendum-  this now makes Bobby Bowden (who, along with Miami, took cheating in football to another level in the '80s and '90s) the D1 leader for wins in a somewhat paradoxical twist of fate. 

[Montague]

Okay, so the Penn State Sanctions:

1.  60 million dollars paid into a fund to prevent child sexual abuse
2.  Vacating all wins back to 1998 (Paterno's record changed to represent)
3.  4 year bowl ban
4.  10 scholarship reduction from 25 to 15 for 4 years.


This is a big deal.  While it's still not as big of a deal as the death penalty, I think it's pretty fair.  I would have tacked on another year for the bowl ban and scholarship reduction, personally.




Addendum-  this now makes Bobby Bowden (who, along with Miami, took cheating in football to another level in the '80s and '90s) the D1 leader for wins in a somewhat paradoxical twist of fate. 

There's more than that. In addition to the 10 schollies per signing period lost,  they also are reduced to 75 scholarships total this year, and for the next four years afterward are reduced to 65 total. Also, all PSU players may transfer immediately without sitting out a year, and any team that signs a PSU player doesn't have to count him against the 85 scholly limit.

The Big 10 piled on and said all shared bowl revenue PSU would normally get will be donated to charity for the next four years, lifted all transfer restrictions to other member schools, and formally censured them (whatever that means).

Instead of the death penalty, they're getting put on life support for four years. Not sure which is worse.

[Paelos]

I am so very very very happy they allowed the kids to transfer.

This gets them completely out of a poisoned program. Fuck Penn State, anybody who was worried about the players got a very clear message that the NCAA wasn't going to hold them hostage.

[ghost]

I doubt there will be enough spots for all of them.  Some of the kids will be fucked unless they want to go 1-AA or D2.

[Paelos]

I doubt there will be enough spots for all of them.  Some of the kids will be fucked unless they want to go 1-AA or D2.

There are 120 schools. They will find homes if they want to go. Also, if they are there and want to get an education there are plenty of schools with worse football programs and better academics.

[01101010]

Vacating previous wins is completely silly in regards to a sanction against any football team. I get it, the NCAA wants to relegate Paterno to a footnote of a bad memory - but the kids that played on that team for those years know the games they won... so does the rest of the nation with all the vids and books and what-not. By the book, Bowden has the record... but I'd like to think at least he knows Paterno still has a better record, symbolic penalties aside.

As for the rest of the sanctions... Basically putting PSU into a coma for the next few years and then the recovery period after of another 5 years. I can go with that I suppose, but the precedent being set here by NOT giving them the death penalty really puts the NCAA in a bind. If this situation didn't do it, then really... I can't see anything trumping it so the death penalty comes off the table as a sanction.

As for the transfers... yeah, these kids will find a home and good on Emmertt for suspending the 1 year waiting process for them. It is not like PSU has been nationally relevant in a long time outside of the scandal. Good seasons, but nothing to keep them in the top 10 consistently.

[Montague]

Like I said above, the NCAA isn't counting Penn State players towards scholly limits. The NCAA didn't come right out and say it, saying only "we'll work with schools not to restrict these players' options", but that's basically what it means.

[ghost]

Like I said above, the NCAA isn't counting Penn State players towards scholly limits. The NCAA didn't come right out and say it, saying only "we'll work with schools not to restrict these players' options", but that's basically what it means.

Good for them.  Glad to hear the NCAA finally did something sensible. 

[Paelos]

I wonder what the over under is on new recruits bailing out. I don't see any reason to play for an institution where you:

1 - Will be universally hated next season.
2 - Can't play in any bowl games or championship for your entire college life
3 - Lose the chance to be competitive due to lower scholarships.
4 - Have to deal with the fact that if you're there for an education, your diploma just took a huge PR hit.

[Threash]

A lot of people thought "death penalty" meant "kill the football team at penn state forever" and see this as a slap on the wrist.  Something like that was never ever in the cards, what they got is as bad as it gets.  The death penalty might be more symbolic but it really is not as harsh, their team will not compete for the next decade.

[Chimpy]

They will probably still beat Illinois though 

[Paelos]

They will probably still beat Illinois though 

Maybe this year since Illinois has a brand new coach. However, I think Tim Beckman is a great coach for that team. He started with a job in the SEC, worked his way up to the DC at OKst, and did a HELL of a job with a program at Toledo that hadn't been to a bowl game in 3 years before he showed up.

[ghost]

They will probably still beat Illinois though 

And definitely Indiana.

[caladein]

I am so very very very happy they allowed the kids to transfer.

This gets them completely out of a poisoned program. Fuck Penn State, anybody who was worried about the players got a very clear message that the NCAA wasn't going to hold them hostage.

ESPN: "Under NCAA rules covering postseason bans, players are allowed to transfer without sitting out a season as long as their remaining eligibility is shorter than or equal to the length of the ban."

So that's at least one bit of standard procedure the NCAA followed .

[Ginaz]

A one year "death penalty", like what Southern Methodist got in 1987, probably would have been better than this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Methodist_University_football_scandal

[Ingmar]

They should probably extend the transfer amnesty to all the athletes in other sports that are going to be fucked by football income crashing, too (which would be basically everything besides men's basketball probably.)

[01101010]

A one year "death penalty", like what Southern Methodist got in 1987, probably would have been better than this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Methodist_University_football_scandal

Still to be determined. SMU was a top flight football program that was completely erased from the national scene for ~30 years because of it.

[ghost]

A one year "death penalty", like what Southern Methodist got in 1987, probably would have been better than this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Methodist_University_football_scandal

Still to be determined. SMU was a top flight football program that was completely erased from the national scene for ~30 years because of it.

In all reality, SMU was a program that wouldn't have existed without cheating.  They were pretty much a .500 team until they figured out about paying players from 82-86.  PSU has a long, storied history with national titles and undefeated seasons. 

My general question about this whole deal is what is the NCAA going to do about people that are actually (and flagrantly) violating its rules?  What about the Cam Newton incident, in which Mississippi State was actively trying to purchase a player for a LOT of money?  Are they going to say that "it's not in our rulebook" when the next incident like this comes up?  Of course covering up child molestation isn't precisely in the rulebook either.  What about Miami that has been paying players for going on 30 years?  Or what about tOSU which has that envelopes of money for players issue going on?  This is the NCAA's hour to prove that it's not a hypocritical and greedy organization but I suspect that this is just a power play by Mark Emmert to show that he's in charge.

[Paelos]

Miami and UNC are next to get the smackdown

[ghost]

Miami and UNC have been skirting the rules with SMU type abandonment.  UNC has been using a professor to teach sham classes for athletes since 1999.  Miami has been paying players since the early '80s.  Miami has been on probation and needs to be shut down for a couple of years.  They are the prime example for everything that is wrong with college football.  The UNC thing is huge (particularly for them, considering UNC's academic reputation) and smacks of the shit going down in the 1980's with Kentucky basketball.  They need to have a penalty similar to what PSU got and there needs to be a thorough investigation into what has been going on with their basketball team.  

[Chimpy]

If they knock UNC basketball please please please vacate their title win against Illinois so we can get out first major sport title (even if it is tainted :p )

[Threash]

Vacated wins don't go to the losing team.

[ghost]

Vacated wins don't go to the losing team.

Just let him have his fantasy.   

[ghost]

Apparently Moody's may downgrade Penn State's credit rating.  This isn't all that shocking, I suppose, but what absolutely floored me is that the university has about $1 billion in debt.  What sort of deal are we running where a public university can have that kind of debt?  That's absolutely insane. 

[Abagadro]

They are sitting on 1.8 billion in their endowment, so still in the black on a balance sheet basis. My guess is most of that is financed construction. Not all that unusual.

[ghost]

Yes, but how much of that endowment is liquid enough to deal with nonsense like Jerry Sandusky? 

[ghost]

Sounds like Penn Stare was going to get a 4 year death penalty if they didn't take the sanctions that they got.  The NCAA was going to open a full investigation and it sounds as if there was more stuff there than we've heard about.

[Ingmar]

Rage:

http://www.sfgate.com/collegesports/article/Cal-Big-Game-bonfire-tradition-doused-3745370.php

 

[Paelos]

Write a letter and cancel your season tickets (if you have them).

That's the only way to get these schools to stop pulling this shit. I've already told UGA this season that it will be my last as a season ticket holder if they continue to schedule 3 bullshit games, in addition to having to put up with Missouri suddenly in the conference. That'll be a home game next year, whoopdefucking do.

[Ingmar]

Thing is, I can't really blame Cal for this, the Pac-12 forced the scheduling on us over our (and Stanford's) protests. And I don't have season tickets, just Big Game tickets... and skipping Big Game would be like skipping Thanksgiving, it is so not an option for me.

[Paelos]

I feel the same away about Georgia/Florida in Jacksonville.

[ghost]

I gave up my Texas tickets 2 years ago (and I actually think UT is doing things reasonably well with their scheduling).

[Paelos]

I'm just getting tired of the monetization of the sport. All decisions are based on money rather than what's best for the fans or the game. In addition, the games themselves have become so bad when you watch one team, that there's no reason to go to them. Why would I waste my time travelling 2 hours in traffic to Athens, going to a noon kickoff against a shitty school, watch a blowout for 3.5 hours with commercial timeouts, and then spend 2.5 hours in traffic getting back to Atlanta? I'll have spent 8 hours and over $100 in tickets and gas to watch us kick the shit out of some charity program as a cash grab.

In that time, I'll have probably missed 3 good matchups on TV, not paid $5 for a Coke, or $10 for parking, and I can do it in my PJ pants with the screen door open letting the breeze in.