Would you attempt to help in this situation?

[Gutboy Barrelhouse]

WATERFORD, Calif. -- A woman died Saturday evening after her car veered off Yosemite Boulevard in Waterford and into a wastewater pond, according to the Stanislaus County Sheriff’s Department.

Deputies received a call about a hit-and-run on Saturday shortly before 7:15 p.m. on Yosemite Boulevard near Western Avenue. Upon arrival at the scene, deputies determined that the unidentified woman somehow drove off the roadway and down a 100-foot embankment.

Two witnesses were in the sewage pond trying to rescue the driver who was still inside the car when deputies arrived. The two deputies and a Stanislaus firefighter also entered the sewage pond, but were unable to rescue the driver after several failed attempts.

The two witnesses, two deputies and the firefighter were decontaminated and taken to area hospitals as a medical precaution.

"This particular pond is raw, untreated sewage. It is highly toxic and hazardous," Waterford Public Works Director Matt Erickson said.

A tow truck, assisted by public works crews, pulled the car from the wastewater pond at about 1 a.m.

The coroner’s office was working on identifying the woman and contacting next of kin. A cause for the accident and for the woman's death were not immediately determined.

[Nebu]

Yes, I would. 

Nice to see others would as well.  Gives me a little faith in humanity.

[gryeyes]

Ive involved myself in far more shitty situations.

[Merusk]

I'd want to but would be physically unable to.  I've gagged just walking into the bathroom at work at times, so I figure raw sewage would put me on the ground heaving.

[NiX]

Ive involved myself in far more shitty situations.

Seriously? Don't be such a douche, you unfunny prick.

[climbjtree]

So all the 9/11 jokes are okay but not a play on words about a car accident?

Both are terribly unfortunate, obviously, but if we have standards let's enforce them across the board.

[Goreschach]

So all the 9/11 jokes are okay but not a play on words about a car accident?

Both are terribly unfortunate, obviously, but if we have standards let's enforce them across the board.

I think that was a douche joke. Otherwise NiX is just being a pussy.

[Signe]

I would even though I'd probably drown in shit.  When I was at university, I volunteered at a zoo and worked nights in a lab for an environmental agency - all at the same time!  I've smelled some potent stink and learned not to be squeamish at nasty smelling goopy things, although sometimes I pretend.

[pxib]

The most dangerous ponds at wastewater treatment plants are the aeration ponds. The sewage in them is less dense than water so a human body naturally sinks in it, even with lungs full of air... then it's difficult to get enough purchase on it to swim  upwards to safety. If her car fell in that, no... I wouldn't jump in after her. She's already dead.

This was probably just a sludge pond, and as gross as the idea is they're no worse than walking through a feed lot, and tend to smell better. The difficult part isn't how disgusting it is, or even potential exposure to pathogens, it's that the water is very difficult to see through. Working underwater is tough enough, working underwater and blind is almost impossible. Still worth a try.

[gryeyes]

How does sewage end up less dense than water? Regardless of the possibility of a survivor you still have to try to save someone. I don't care if that amounts to retching on the shore,you gotta at least try.

[climbjtree]

Good question. I was wondering the same thing.

Maybe how like oil separates and settles on top of water? I guess this could be a similar situation.

[Oban]

I would call a tow truck and call 911 repeatedly until someone showed up from emergency services.

Otherwise, I would not attempt to help by jumping in to the raw sewage.

[schild]

Would you attempt to help in this situation?

No.

Any other questions?

[Signe]

Why would you not try to help?  For fuck sake, throw a rope or a rock or something.  What the heck is wrong with you?  At least scream like a woman!

[Sir T]

When I was growing up one of the most serious things we were told was stay away from slurry pits. Kids died from falling into them. The problem is that they form a hard crust on the top so they look solid but will collapse under you if you step on them and the stuff will suck you down.

[Venkman]

I would help. Just because that's the human thing to do.

But aside from that, the sewage poses no problem to me. My first career was climbing inside of industrial boilers to clean, refurbish, and repair them. Sewage, tar roofs, oil slicks, rank-smelling bathrooms have nothing on 10 year old firebrick that was just recently doused because the super decided to turn the boiler off six hours before our arrival rather than the requested twelve.*

* Pre-emptive anti-rant: And yes, I know twelve hours a bitch for the tenants/occupants. But the work gets done a lot quicker when you can start right away.

[Miasma]

The most dangerous ponds at wastewater treatment plants are the aeration ponds. The sewage in them is less dense than water so a human body naturally sinks in it, even with lungs full of air... then it's difficult to get enough purchase on it to swim  upwards to safety. If her car fell in that, no... I wouldn't jump in after her. She's already dead.

This was probably just a sludge pond, and as gross as the idea is they're no worse than walking through a feed lot, and tend to smell better. The difficult part isn't how disgusting it is, or even potential exposure to pathogens, it's that the water is very difficult to see through. Working underwater is tough enough, working underwater and blind is almost impossible. Still worth a try.

I'd try and help but this is what I would be worried about.  I remember reading a story about people who tried to help someone who fell into a fish broth vat and since that is also less dense than water they just sunk and couldn't get out, horrifying way to go.

There was another story posted here about a family who tried to help someone who passed out from methane in a pig sty and each person who went in died too, horrible.

I also remember that episode of mythbusters and a car door is almost impossible to open if submerged until the pressure equalizes.  Plus most car doors lock automatically when you put it in drive nowadays and I doubt someone would have the selfcomposure to unlock the car after such an accident.

[NiX]

So all the 9/11 jokes are okay but not a play on words about a car accident?

Both are terribly unfortunate, obviously, but if we have standards let's enforce them across the board.

You're defending Gryeyes. Don't throw yourself away like this.

[schild]

Why would you not try to help?  For fuck sake, throw a rope or a rock or something.  What the heck is wrong with you?  At least scream like a woman!

"Help" here implies jumping in and risking myself to save someone else. Not throwing a rope or rock or something.

Edit: Here, this post is a good example.

I would call a tow truck and call 911 repeatedly until someone showed up from emergency services.

Otherwise, I would not attempt to help by jumping in to the raw sewage.

I would do the former, which probably isn't very helpful imo.

[Sheepherder]

How does sewage end up less dense than water? Regardless of the possibility of a survivor you still have to try to save someone. I don't care if that amounts to retching on the shore,you gotta at least try.

Good question. I was wondering the same thing.  Maybe how like oil separates and settles on top of water? I guess this could be a similar situation.

The most dangerous ponds at wastewater treatment plants are the aeration ponds. The sewage in them is less dense than water so a human body naturally sinks in it, even with lungs full of air... then it's difficult to get enough purchase on it to swim  upwards to safety. If her car fell in that, no... I wouldn't jump in after her. She's already dead.

This was probably just a sludge pond, and as gross as the idea is they're no worse than walking through a feed lot, and tend to smell better. The difficult part isn't how disgusting it is, or even potential exposure to pathogens, it's that the water is very difficult to see through. Working underwater is tough enough, working underwater and blind is almost impossible. Still worth a try.

Also: professional divers generally work by touch, it's entirely possible to get someone out even without vision, it's just not likely for people used to being able to see underwater.  Ironically, it's quite common for clients to request video footage of work by commercial divers, even when they're forewarned that it will be fifteen minutes of brown.

[Ingmar]

I can't really swim, let alone in sewage. So calling 911 or whatever is about the best I could do.

[climbjtree]

You're defending Gryeyes. Don't throw yourself away like this.

I don't know Gryeyes, and I'm not defending him. I'm just pointing something out and I'd hope you'd do the same for me!

It's like Bubba and Forrest. I'm gonna lean up against you, you just lean right back against me. This way, we don't have to sleep with our heads in the mud.

See? So in turn, I'm actually supporting you.

[Cyrrex]

In most situations I can reasonably imagine, I would help....but I've got to admit that I wouldn't be able to in this one.  I am mediocre swimmer at best, and the though of having to do it in raw sewage...I would want to, but pretty sure I wouldn't be able to.  I feel bad about myself now, thanks for the thread.

[Signe]

Oh, ok, as long as you don't just stand there and watch.  My cousin once fell through a hole in the floor of an old abandoned paper mill we used to sneak in to play.  She was screaming and I didn't know what to do so I jumped in after her.  We both got rescued and I broke two fingers!  I still have a problem about thinking before I act.  Now if someone fell off a ferry, I'd probably spontaneously explode.  

(I don't swim, by the way, not for decades.   )

[Brogarn]

I like to think I'd help, but I'm not sure. I can see me gagging and incapable of helping. I can see me trying to get down there to help. I can also see me just phoning someone for help and being unsure of what to do while staring down at sewage and knowing I could catch horrible fucking diseases if I dived in.

In short: I don't know. Adrenalin might take over. Nausea could as well. I'm stumped.

[tazelbain]

(I don't swim, by the way, not for decades.   )

Because you are a zombie.

[Cyrrex]

(I don't swim, by the way, not for decades.   )

Because you are a zombie.

I'm pretty sure zombies float in poop.

[Lantyssa]

What I didn't see mention was if the car was submerged or not.  If it was fully under in that kind of environment then I doubt I would try to physically help.  If they managed to get out and were struggling, or had a sunroof and I could climb on the car, it might be a little more likely.

If it only meant wading into it, maybe.  If they weren't conscious, there wouldn't be much point since I couldn't lift them and pulling them out of the vehicle would just increase their chances of drowning.

Really though, I'd be more useful standing on the side of the road so any emergency responders could pin-point the location.  I'd feel helpless and terrible, however it would be more effective.  (And have done so in the past.)

[MahrinSkel]

How does sewage end up less dense than water? Regardless of the possibility of a survivor you still have to try to save someone. I don't care if that amounts to retching on the shore,you gotta at least try.

Aeration ponds, the water is full of air bubbles, so the density is lower (think of a jacuzzi, or the water at the base of a waterfall, or whitewater rapids).  Less mass displaced, less mass moved by swimming motions, and more turbulence, it all adds up to walking at the bottom of the pond.  I have unusually dense and thick bones, even before my car accident I could barely float on full lungs of air, now I can sit at the bottom of a pool (reduced capacity in one lung moved me from just barely under to just barely over water density).  So I am used to having to work at staying afloat, but in a bubbly environment I wouldn't have a chance.

--Dave

[Sheepherder]

Incidentally, this is how the tales of sinking sinks sucking people under have came about.

[Sky]

I may have been able to hook up the chains I keep in the back of my truck and pull her out, depending on the car and the layout of the hole. Maybe even just gotten the car into a better position to attempt a rescue.

Once I upgrade to a winch in the bumper, the chances for a rescue would greatly increase, since they're made for stuff like pulling vehicles out of ponds.

[Cyrrex]

Wouldn't somebody reasonably have died from poop-inhalation/drowning that point?  How quick would you be able to rig up something like that?

[Sky]

Depends on what was available to hook up to. Too little info to go on, really. Doesn't take long to wrap a chain around something, especially when it's an emergency and damage to the car doesn't matter. Where I grew up, pulling people out of ditches with a chain was a normal thing. My first 'driving' experience was probably sitting in a car being towed by a chain.

[gryeyes]

You're defending Gryeyes. Don't throw yourself away like this.

No, they are pointing out you are a sandy twat. Its not the same thing.

Aeration ponds, the water is full of air bubbles, so the density is lower

Yeah I just didn't figure sewage plants were churning with bubbles,thought it was more a slow trickle of air. Im not sure at what % by volume is required to make swimming impossible but its got to be pretty high.

[apocrypha]

I don't know if I would help or not - I don't think we always react rationally in crisis.

But I'd try and get some awesome photos