Guild Wars 2

[Ratman_tf]

I've quite liked all their previous more substantial videos but this one just kind of made me go  . I think it was the sort of forced enthusiasm from the designers that did it.

I'm now tired of hearing NCSoft talk about how immersive and awesome GW2 is going to be. It's all jibber jabber that other companies have done. Let's play the game already, so we can tell if they're full of crap or not.

[tmp]

Also, I noticed boob physics.

Female characters should get bigger boobs that jiggle more as they level up.

LotRO-style deed grinds for +1 cup size.

[UnSub]

Also, I noticed boob physics.

Female characters should get bigger boobs that jiggle more as they level up.

LotRO-style deed grinds for +1 cup size.

New EE-cup jiggle physics are interfering with new jump physics. Plz fix.

[Velorath]

I've quite liked all their previous more substantial videos but this one just kind of made me go  . I think it was the sort of forced enthusiasm from the designers that did it.

I'm now tired of hearing NCSoft talk about how immersive and awesome GW2 is going to be. It's all jibber jabber that other companies have done. Let's play the game already, so we can tell if they're full of crap or not.

Isn't that (and similar complaints about PR for other games) more a result of a lot of people here following every bit of news about particular games or MMO's in general?  What I'm saying is that sure, when you've watched every video and read every substantial article to this point, you're going to get tired of hearing them say the same thing over and over again.  For the people who clicked on it because it was the top headline on IGN's PC site that day, it might snag their interest though.

At this point, most of us have already decided we're going to at least try the beta.  We are no longer the main target for their PR.

[Zzulo]

yeah that video looks spectacular

the water dragon swimming past at the end, after the credits, made me giddy too. I guess I am a sucker for underwater monsters

[Tarami]

I'm never going to be able to leave my bunk long enough to play the actual game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeBMTBgdG60

PS: Can't someone fix so that the pop-up respects time skipping?

[Stormwaltz]

New EE-cup jiggle physics are interfering with new jump physics. Plz fix.

Most MMGs can't even get cloak physics right...

[Mrbloodworth]

Upon more research, I think the boobs are just canned animations. This was a serious issue that I thought required more research.

[Ingmar]

yeah that video looks spectacular

the water dragon swimming past at the end, after the credits, made me giddy too. I guess I am a sucker for underwater monsters

I still wince and have TOA flashbacks whenever I see underwater stuff, so anytime I see it it doesn't help my enthusiasm for a game. It is my one big fear about Cataclysm too.

[Paelos]

ToA turned an entire generation of gamers against anything related to water. I have the same fears.

[Rasix]

ToA turned an entire generation of gamers against anything related to water. I have the same fears.

EQ didn't help either with Kedge Keep.

Edit: I don't really like water or boat activities in games for the most part.  In UO it was OK because there was no z-level. 

[Numtini]

Add me to the list please. I have yet to see anything underwater that wasn't a total irritant.

[Paelos]

I liked Pirates! but they could never implement boats in an MMO that wouldn't have me getting all stabby.

[Ingmar]

I liked Pirates! but they could never implement boats in an MMO that wouldn't have me getting all stabby.

The boat part of PotBS was actually pretty cool, it was the EVERYTHING ELSE ABOUT THE GAME that ruined it.

[HaemishM]

EQ didn't help either with Kedge Keep.

Kedge Keep was awesome, the kind of awesome devs don't even bother to try anymore because MMOG players are whiny douches with sandy vag syndrome that can't take anything with a little bit of a challenge.

Sure, water-breathing requirements meant you'd probably die at least once in the night, but if you could get a decent group, it was as challenging or more challenging than planes runs.

[tmp]

New EE-cup jiggle physics are interfering with new jump physics. Plz fix.

Most MMGs can't even get cloak physics right...

Cloaks are harder to make. Breasts don't go all way past the knees and flap around in the wind.

Well, most of them don't, anyway...

[Rasix]

EQ didn't help either with Kedge Keep.

Kedge Keep was awesome, the kind of awesome devs don't even bother to try anymore because MMOG players are whiny douches with sandy vag syndrome that can't take anything with a little bit of a challenge.

Sure, water-breathing requirements meant you'd probably die at least once in the night, but if you could get a decent group, it was as challenging or more challenging than planes runs.

It was mostly challenging because of how poorly implemented it was.  AOE spells, derp derp derp. 

[Koyasha]

Kedge Keep was great after they fixed the main problems with pathing and such.  It always had some little hiccups, but eventually it turned out pretty ok.  I think a lot of people that tried it early on got the horribly bugged version stuck in their heads and don't remember that they patched it a few months later and made it much improved.

For most of the times I went down there, I liked the place quite a bit.  If you knew the zone it posed a reasonable but not excessive challenge, and was easy to move around in, doubly so because invis worked against everything in the zone except a few of the seahorses around Phinigel.  If I remember right, even boss-fish himself couldn't see invis.  (Either that or the other way around - he could and his seahorses couldn't).  The exp that everything in the zone gave was boosted considerably to make up for the underwater environment, so it was actually a great place to go.

A well-done underwater environment is nice.  Poorly done ones suck.  We haven't seen any that are really well done to my recollection, and even Kedge Keep which was good in my opinion (after the fixes) was only moderately well done.  Hopefully if they do have underwater environments, they will be as well done as Kedge was, or ideally, much better.

[Pyran]

Its not the underwater that's the problem, its the z-axis.  Developers are not used to design for and players are not used to dealing with z-axis navigation.  They could remove "underwater" and call it a zone where you can fly around like Superman and you'd still have the same issues.

[patience]

Pretty much that's the problem. Remember your first experience trying to play Descent?

[HaemishM]

EQ didn't help either with Kedge Keep.

Kedge Keep was awesome, the kind of awesome devs don't even bother to try anymore because MMOG players are whiny douches with sandy vag syndrome that can't take anything with a little bit of a challenge.

Sure, water-breathing requirements meant you'd probably die at least once in the night, but if you could get a decent group, it was as challenging or more challenging than planes runs.

It was mostly challenging because of how poorly implemented it was.  AOE spells, derp derp derp. 

You just described most of the content in EQ. Mistmoore pathing trains to the zone anyone?

[Nebu]

I enjoyed Kedge and thought it was novel enough to be interesting (at the time).

Mistmoore was bad and Unrest was similarly hilarious.  I have fond memories of pulling the rooms above and below a floor because they hadn't figured out how to deal with z-axis aggro. 

Good times.

[HaemishM]

Despite the fucked up pathing, I liked both Unrest and Mistmoore. Now Guk, there was a loathsome set of dungeons if ever there were one.

[Nevermore]

New EE-cup jiggle physics are interfering with new jump physics. Plz fix.

Most MMGs can't even get cloak physics right...

Say whatever else you will about CoX, but the capes in that game are awesome.

[Paelos]

Its not the underwater that's the problem, its the z-axis.  Developers are not used to design for and players are not used to dealing with z-axis navigation.  They could remove "underwater" and call it a zone where you can fly around like Superman and you'd still have the same issues.

Absolutely, but it's a catch 22 for developers. You can make something "underwater" where everyone walks around on the ocean floor, and the physics are exactly the same as everywhere else. You can also make underwater where everyone can swim around at will. In the former, it begs the question of bothering with the design if it's exactly the same as your other zones with some seaweed. In the latter, there's no physical way you can implement that in a non-collision, non-twitch game that won't absolutely drive the players to revolt. The sticky wicket in all that is the z-axis underwater shit sounds cool with so many design possibilities, but none of them bear out well in practice.

[Goreschach]

Given that most of these people are going to be wearing heavy armor anyway, and wouldn't float, you could handwave it by having people able to swim around as a replacement for jump, with people that don't keep swimming inevitably sinking to the floor where they walk and attack like normal with some kind of slow effect. This would keep combat and most travel stuck on the xy axis, while still allowing some 3d design to the layout of the level.

[Malakili]

Given that most of these people are going to be wearing heavy armor anyway, and wouldn't float, you could handwave it by having people able to swim around as a replacement for jump, with people that don't keep swimming inevitably sinking to the floor where they walk and attack like normal with some kind of slow effect. This would keep combat and most travel stuck on the xy axis, while still allowing some 3d design to the layout of the level.

Hey, just like a normal zone except I have a slow effect on me all the time, sound fantastic.   I remember hoping Champions Online might manage to do a good water zone because a game where you can fly at level 5 is designed with the vertical in mind.  Nope, same shit as always.  Disorienting, can't use your normal travel power, melee is horrible.   What it comes down to is that its a gimmick.  Gimmicks suck.  Vehicles sucked in WoW becaused they were gimmicky, underwater zones suck because they are gimmicky.   Just stick to your solid game mechanics, if I'm playing the game to begin with its because I like playing the game, you don't need to randomly change how the game mechanics work for a level/zone.  Its the same reason vehicle levels end up sucking so often.

[Fordel]

Water levels have sucked since SMB1 and will continue to suck for many years to come.

[Rendakor]

Water levels have sucked since SMB1 and will continue to suck for many years to come.

This.

[Nightblade]

First actual gameplay video:

http://multiplayer.it/video/guild-wars-2-per-pc/guild-wars-2-gameplay-gamescom-2010.hi/

[Zzulo]

more gameplay, with the necromancer I think;

http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/30947
http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/30949

[Fordel]

I'm sold, here's my money Arena Net!

[Outlawedprod]

First actual gameplay video:
http://multiplayer.it/video/guild-wars-2-per-pc/guild-wars-2-gameplay-gamescom-2010.hi/

This is probably the same thing but I can't get that site to load.
Cam footage.  Canons fired 2:55.  Map at 3:34 looks nice.  Map transition to the live field is sweet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXgTFsrNseE

[Outlawedprod]

fighting dragon on livestream
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/ncsoft-west

[statisticalfool]

Given that most of these people are going to be wearing heavy armor anyway, and wouldn't float, you could handwave it by having people able to swim around as a replacement for jump, with people that don't keep swimming inevitably sinking to the floor where they walk and attack like normal with some kind of slow effect. This would keep combat and most travel stuck on the xy axis, while still allowing some 3d design to the layout of the level.

Hey, just like a normal zone except I have a slow effect on me all the time, sound fantastic. 

Exactly.

I'm not holding out hope for great water levels, but the only way it seems like it would work is to make it more fun: design a game that can do 3d combat well (large draw distances, good targeting, meaningful radar), and then have your intro questgiver say: "Swim? Of course we don't expect you to swim, you're saving our civilization! Take this free ultra-fast underwater jetpack that does barrel rolls!"