Guild Wars 2

[Gunzwei]

Ranger vid got me hot in the pants.

That ranger looks like hotness. I may have to pick this up after all, is there a release date yet?

Q1 2011 with a beta possibly towards end of 2010 is what I've read.

[Draegan]

Read where?  Because it sounds like you're confusing this with Rift.

[Gunzwei]

Read where?  Because it sounds like you're confusing this with Rift.

http://dailygamesnews.com/2009/11/guild-wars-2-wont-release-until-2011.html

Speaking to investors, NCsoft CEO Jaeho Lee has hinted that Guild Wars II will not release until 2011, but a BETA for the MMO will arrive in 2010:
“I believe there will be certain public events in the year 2010, at least a closed Beta test for those titles. Commercialization will be expected, at this point, probably some time in the year 2011.”

Like anything with release dates take it with a grain of salt. My personal guess would be more like spring/summer 2011.

[Draegan]

Yea but you said Q1.  The article say "sometime 2011".  I knew that it would launch sometime in 2011.

[Jamiko]

Progression and Leveling in Guild Wars 2

Our goal with Guild Wars 2 is to flatten out the leveling curve, keeping progression simple and straightforward. We expect everyone to make a reasonable amount of progression with each play session. It shouldn’t take days of playing before you feel like you have made any progress, and you definitely shouldn’t have to kill a bunch of creatures or do a bunch of repetitive tasks just to see what’s over that next hill. We want our progression to keep up with your play style. If you’re a causal gamer who plays for a few hours here and there, why should you feel like it’s going to take you a decade to finish your character? If you’re a hardcore player, why shouldn’t you be able to blast through the game with skill and speed, trying to experience every last bit of content?

So how did we accomplish our goals, you ask? Good question! First off, we set the level cap for the game at 80, but we made the time between levels rather short. Instead of taking longer and longer to reach each level, it takes about the same time to go through each level. It’s pretty simple; if we expect you to level up every few hours, then why shouldn’t it be that way all through the game?

[Draegan]

Cool.

[ghost]

They're saying all the right things about this game.  Of course we all know what that means. 

[kildorn]

They're saying all the right things about this game.  Of course we all know what that means. 

gw2.exe?

[HaemishM]

Do want. Funny you reference sb.exe. Shadowbane was actually one of the few games that had a flat experience curve, IIRC.

[Der Helm]

Do want. Funny you reference sb.exe. Shadowbane was actually one of the few games that had a flat experience curve, IIRC.

One of the best things about SB was the leveling experience... Or rather the shortness of it. In a full (powerleveling) group, it was almost enjoyable.

[Lantyssa]

It's too perfect.  There is something that has to be fundamentally flawed with GW2.

[Typhon]

Their business model certainly lends itself to this part being true - after you've bought the box, they have all the money they are going to get from you for that set of content.  Making the leveling rate match the amount of content they have makes the most sense.

[Ingmar]

...level 80? That's a big difference from before.

[kildorn]

...level 80? That's a big difference from before.

Have to keep up with the Joneses.

[DLRiley]

Scrubs have been asking them for years to raise the level cap.

[jakonovski]

Can I express my hatred of the word "scrub" here? It invariably leads to ONLINE GAMING IS SRS BSNS

[DLRiley]

Yes you can, as long as I still get to use it for groups of people who deserve to be call that.

[Shatter]

This iis like the hot chick everyone wants to date but we all know she will have herpes and other shit wrong with her.  Too perfect, something has to give. 

[DLRiley]

This iis like the hot chick everyone wants to date but we all know she will have herpes and other shit wrong with her.  Too perfect, something has to give.  

This is more like the hot chick everyone wants to date and says she is on the pill.

[HaemishM]

Please stop talking.

[Ratman_tf]

It's too perfect.  There is something that has to be fundamentally flawed with GW2.

How meaningful is it going to be to have 80 levels? Are they just ding achievements? Did they divide all the advancement stuff by four and spread it out?

[Nebu]

There are no reasons at all to have levels in guild wars.  None.

[Hawkbit]

It really doesn't make much sense for levels.  Gate the content is some other way, by difficulty or whatever... but levels just seem unnecessary.

[Typhon]

Please, for the love of god, not this conversation again

[Nebu]

Please, for the love of god, not this conversation again

These forums are nothing but rehash.  Eliminate these conversations and you're left with game reviews and politics! 

[DLRiley]

There are no reasons at all to have levels in guild wars.  None.

Meh most people who have been following this have know they will raise the level cap, apparently they have some none asshat way of doing it besides making the grind less grindy...in this i don't trust them not to piss me off.

[Typhon]

Please, for the love of god, not this conversation again

These forums are nothing but rehash.  Eliminate these conversations and you're left with game reviews and politics! 

I like your Jackalope. 

I'll allow myself to be convinced by your argument and I'll choose to combat you premise that levels are inapproriate for GW2 with these arguments:

1) For PvE, I like the feeling that my character is progressing in some way.  I realize that it's an illusion, I'm ok with that.  That said, I'd be willing to try a game that tried to break new ground and have the point of doing PvE combat be for "something" else (empire building, getting better costume options, forcing a story to go a certain direction)
2) I think that gating effective participating via levels or gear in PvP is not fun.  I'm currently struggling with WoW PvP because I'm 1 to 2 shot by folks with good gear and I don't find that fun at all.  I'm not really interested in "paying my dues" to get to the point where the PvP stops sucking just so that I can play with my friends.
3) I think that you can have a game that has levels for the PvE, but doesn't have (significant) gating to being a relevant participant in PvP.  That sentence is very terse/hard to read.  Basically I mean that I think you can have a game that has PvE levels/gear, and they even everyone out for the PvP portions of the game to make it skill-based.
4) If they chose 80 levels because, "people won't leave WoW unless we have as many levels", then I think they are making a big mistake
4.1) If they created a bunch of content, and then said, "how many levels, playing at rate x, does this much content equal?  74?  Ok, let's make it 80", then I'm ok with that.

[Nebu]

Did you play GW? 

Levels are meaningless in GW because a) gear is pretty easily obtained and b) your character progresses through abilities obtained during encounters... not through levels. 

Even henchmen levels become a pretty tedious and worthless grind.

Adding levels to GW 2 adds nothing but a grind.  Nothing. 

[DLRiley]

Its even more pointless because the content is designed around mostly being end game content. 20 levels meant that 80% of the game was still a challenge to the player and hence replayable unlike WoW where reaching max levels means that only 10% of the game now still matters to you. 

[Fordel]

The levels in GuildWars, especially the two expansion versions, were more like a tutorial then "leveling up".

[DLRiley]

The levels in GuildWars, especially the two expansion versions, were more like a tutorial then "leveling up".

which is the way leveling should be.

[Typhon]

Did you play GW? 

Levels are meaningless in GW because a) gear is pretty easily obtained and b) your character progresses through abilities obtained during encounters... not through levels. 

Even henchmen levels become a pretty tedious and worthless grind.

Adding levels to GW 2 adds nothing but a grind.  Nothing. 

I played the first game, and no other.  I didn't like the invisible walls, I didn't like the henchmen, I didn't have any friends playing it and I didn't like the GW community.

The combat itself and the storylines I liked.  It had a different feel than any other MMO, which I also like.

I remember getting new spells that were not really more powerful (in general) than the spells I already had.  I remember getting more "talent" (using that word because I cannot remember what they called them) points which would make my choice of equipment and spells more powerful.  I remember purple gear that was better than the shit I was slogging around in.  I remember it dropping randomly, and I don't remember thinking, "wow, this is easy to get".  I think that I remember that the amount of health that I had staid static as I leveled.

So I guess what I'm focusing on are those "talent" points.  I had a warrior, he'd got a purple hammer. I had been focusing on swords till that point, but I respecced into hammer, and swapped my spells out for hammer-focused spells.  At that point he was more powerful.  A big part of that were the talent points, which were alotted by level.  Therefore I came to the conclusion that levels mattered and they made my character feel more powerful.  I thought it was a decent system, I'm assuming that they are doing more of the same.

Is my assumption wrong?

[Lantyssa]

In Prophecies it took you a lot longer to reach 20, and there were two quests you had to do to gain those two final chunks of 15 attribute points.  Because of that, it did seem to take a while to "power up" which is what you are remembering.  They made it so you get past that point a lot faster in the other two campaigns.  Once you've done the first 4-5 missions and are on the mainland, you're done with levels and getting more attributes.

Your feelings on getting new spells and skills and the occasional item drop that was better is more along the lines of normal play.  There are runes and inscriptions which can change your health, though it takes a while to build them up and on average your health will be about the same.  There isn't a huge power curve with most of your increases.  You might find a neat synergy or get a nice item, but most things are minor increases or side-grades.

[kildorn]

I liked the rune system and the "well, you're going to kick more ass... but at a health penalty" choices.

I didn't like the escalating costs to buy all your possible skills.

[Lantyssa]

It caps at 1 platinum.  I rarely buy anything except capture signets though.  If I need a skill for my hero then I just run the Arena against NPCs a few times.