Google OS

[HaemishM]

This isn't about what damage is going to be done to them in 2 years, but what the implication is 6-7 years from now.  Microsoft will see that and will start taking steps to address it.

What do you think they've been doing for the last 6 years?

The XBox line - an Internet enabled entertainment box for your living room.

We've been through this before. Wake us up when you can run a browser on an (unhacked) Xbox.

Why the fuck would Microsoft want to do that? They want CONTROL of what apps you run on their boxes. Shit, if they could keep XP from running other word processors or other web browsers, they would.

[Delmania]

I have been saying to my friends that I think the OS is going to basically become a browser, and everything is going to be done in a cloud. This seems like the first step towards that.

Microsoft has been quietly and not so quietly been working on that for years, ever since they integrated IE into the Windows interface and the changes in the desktop app licensing structure they've made over the years. They'd be farther along if 1) the anitrust suits hadn't slowed them down and made them sort of decouple IE from the OS, and 2) their IE programmers didn't suck such copious amounts of cock.

3.) Building Gazelle.  I think, despite what their marketing department claim, the company knows IE is a piece of trash.  Just like they did with XP and Vista, they are trying to make a clean break, I'd wager.

[Quinton]

I'm still failing to see why MS will shit themselves over netbooks. I'd imagine the profit to them for the OS installed on them, if there is one, is marginal.

The cost of netbooks is low enough that the cost to install a msft OS becomes a significant percentage of the bill of materials.  Thus you have all these netbook vendors looking at linux solutions, etc, to try to be more competitive price-wise.

If you believe that netbooks are going to eclipse PCs, microsoft should probably worry.  If not, then maybe not so much worry. 

[stray]

So far, they've dismissed the idea.

How do you "know" this?

Because I skimmed a few articles of this sort last month.

http://digitaldaily.allthingsd.com/20090519/apple-rim-no-netbooks/

Asked about Apple’s interest in the category during a late-April earnings call, COO Tim Cook said the company has none.

“When I look at netbooks, I see cramped keyboards, terrible software, junky hardware, very small screens,” he explained, noting that it’s “a stretch” to call a netbook a personal computer. “It’s just not a good consumer experience and not something we would put the Mac brand on….it’s not a space as it exists today that we are interested in, nor do we believe that customers in the long term would be interested in. It’s a segment we would choose not to play in. That said, we do look at the space and are interested to see our customers’ respond to it. People that want a small computer so to speak that does browsing and e-mail, might want to buy an iPod Touch or they might want to buy an iPhone. And so, we have other products to accomplish some of what people are buying netbooks for and so, in that particular way we play in an indirect basis.”

[schild]

“When I look at netbooks, I see cramped keyboards, terrible software, junky hardware, very small screens,”

I see he's never used an Apple keyboard before.

[Prospero]

The new chicle keyboards on the Macbooks are anything but cramped. I totally agree the old Apple keyboards were ass, but the new ones are really lovely. The keyboard on the 17" Macbook was actually a bit too spacious for my liking.

[schild]

but the new ones are really lovely.

I JUST used one like 10 minutes ago at Fry's.

As someone who uses a Model M 10 hours a day, I can confidently say that Apple keyboards are still cramped chicklet ass. Schild no likey gooey shallow keys, no matter how much sleek brushed aluminum is around them.

[Prospero]

I can see how if you like the big daddy Model M you wouldn't be a big fan. Compared to other laptop keyboards and the crappy keyboards that used to ship with Mac Pros, they are awesome.

[MahrinSkel]

I still swear by these keyboards.  I bought one for $25 in 1996, and have used it with every computer I've owned since (I'm screwed if the PS/2 keyboard port ever goes away the way it has on some mobos for mice).  I can *use* a standard keyboard, or even a notebook/netbook chiclet keyboard, but not for hours on end without getting cramps in my wrists.

--Dave

[stray]

I might have used one of those model-m's back in the day, I don't know. My real complaint about current Macs (desktops at least..) is the fucking mouse. You literally can't get any worse. If anything, because of the scroll wheel. It doesn't stay clean... nor are they easy to reassemble if you try to clean them.

[Prospero]

I hate the "Mighty Mouse" with the fire of a thousand suns. I'm not sure what it is about Apple and mice; they are incapable of making a usable one. If nothing else, the fact you can't hold down the left and right mouse buttons at the same time is just maddening. I makes Maya really unpleasant to use.

[Teleku]

I still swear by these keyboards.  I bought one for $25 in 1996, and have used it with every computer I've owned since (I'm screwed if the PS/2 keyboard port ever goes away the way it has on some mobos for mice).  I can *use* a standard keyboard, or even a notebook/netbook chiclet keyboard, but not for hours on end without getting cramps in my wrists.
--Dave

You realize that you can always just use a PS2/USB converter to connect it to anything you want, right?  

I've been using what ever Microsoft's current ergonomic keyboard is for several years now and love it.  I really have a hard time going back to anything that isn't ergonomically shaped now.

[Sky]

I laughed when we got in the chiclet keyboard, but I'm a convert. It's fucking awesome and finally broke me of my love of the old IBM style. I'm shocked at myself.

[Checkers]

3.) Building Gazelle.  I think, despite what their marketing department claim, the company knows IE is a piece of trash.  Just like they did with XP and Vista, they are trying to make a clean break, I'd wager.

I haven't worked with IE as a developer since IE 6 (*shudder*).  As a regular user, IE 8 is impressive and by no means a piece of trash.

[Yegolev]

As a regular user, IE 8 is impressive and by no means a piece of trash.

[Fabricated]

Asked about Apple’s interest in the category during a late-April earnings call, COO Tim Cook said the company has none.

“When I look at netbooks, I see cramped keyboards, terrible software, junky hardware, very small screens,” he explained, noting that it’s “a stretch” to call a netbook a personal computer. “It’s just not a good consumer experience and not something we would put the Mac brand on….it’s not a space as it exists today that we are interested in, nor do we believe that customers in the long term would be interested in. It’s a segment we would choose not to play in. That said, we do look at the space and are interested to see our customers’ respond to it. People that want a small computer so to speak that does browsing and e-mail, might want to buy an iPod Touch or they might want to buy an iPhone. And so, we have other products to accomplish some of what people are buying netbooks for and so, in that particular way we play in an indirect basis.”

"A fully functional computer for under $400? ...How is that possible? Nah, it isn't. It must suck. Buy our overpriced shit folks."

Goddamn I wish Apple would go out of business.

[schild]

Apple should make a mini-mac-mini just for iTunes and call it the iMini.

It would sell fucking gangbusters. Maybe even put a flip up LCD on it and some sleek tiny metal ball with a button to use as a mouse. An all in one unit.

[Prospero]

Isn't that pretty much an iTV?

I tend agree with Cook. I looked to get a netbook but realized by iPhone does everything a netbook can, or at least everything I need a netbook to do. I do see there being a need for them, but I think a real laptop is a better value proposition for most people. I wouldn't want to manage my photo library on an iPhone any more than I would want to do so on a netbook.

[schild]

Isn't that pretty much an iTV?

Not even a little.

[Prospero]

K. So is it an iPod then? What does it do that makes it different? An iPod touch can do pretty much anything a Mac Mini with just iTunes could do.

[schild]

K. So is it an iPod then? What does it do that makes it different? An iPod touch can do pretty much anything a Mac Mini with just iTunes could do.

I meant for syncing and storage of a library larger than 32GB but without all the other fiddly unnecessary bits. I suppose they could just attach a screen to a mac mini so you could bring it with you on vacation easily.

Basically, a limited functionality netbook built for one express purpose, media and app downloading/transfer.

[Prospero]

So an iPod Touch with a big ass hard drive.

[schild]

So an iPod Touch with a big ass hard drive.

With DVI out as an option for semi-permanent home placement that has the same GUI as iTunes when hooked up to a monitor, sure.

[HaemishM]

As a regular user, IE 8 is impressive and by no means a piece of trash.

IE8 is a bloated, overprotective piece of shit with a UI that was designed by a half-blind Mr. Magoo fuckhead with a hardon for the iPeen.

[Delmania]

I haven't worked with IE as a developer since IE 6 (*shudder*).  As a regular user, IE 8 is impressive and by no means a piece of trash.

Firefox 3.5
Chrome
Safari

3 good reasons not to use IE8.  I have it installed and I will occasionally use it to see if the suck has been diminished.

[Trippy]

Apple should make a mini-mac-mini just for iTunes and call it the iMini.

It would sell fucking gangbusters. Maybe even put a flip up LCD on it and some sleek tiny metal ball with a button to use as a mouse. An all in one unit.

http://www.apple.com/appletv/

No LCD, though.

Edit: NM, schild wants a bigger HD.

[schild]

Apple TV doesn't have ALL the functionality of iTunes. It is, in fact, altogether half-assed.

[Trippy]

What iTunes functionality is it missing that you need?

[schild]

I don't know what's unclear about this.

I want the full app with full iphone/ipod connectivity. Apple TV has no meaningful connectivity at all. Basically I want an even cheaper Mac Mini where the OS is basically iTunes and nothing else. Not some stripped down media portal like Apple TV and not some full blown, yet technologically gimped thing like a Mac Mini. Something built from the ground up as iTunes.

Though, honestly, this tangent has gone on far too long as it's pure wankery and I know there isn't an available solution for such a thing.

[Prospero]

Yeah, but the Google OS doesn't come out for another year, so we have to have something to talk about until then.

[Sheepherder]

If you believe that netbooks are going to eclipse PCs, microsoft should probably worry.  If not, then maybe not so much worry.

They have no reason to panic regardless.  It's not like they're incapable of gutting their OS until it's effectively only good for internet browsing and media apps and then selling CD's at a loss just to fucking spite Google and maintain their brand identity enough that Google cannot threaten them in other ventures.

[Delmania]

If you believe that netbooks are going to eclipse PCs, microsoft should probably worry.  If not, then maybe not so much worry.

They have no reason to panic regardless.  It's not like they're incapable of gutting their OS until it's effectively only good for internet browsing and media apps and then selling CD's at a loss just to fucking spite Google and maintain their brand identity enough that Google cannot threaten them in other ventures.

http://research.microsoft.com/apps/pubs/default.aspx?id=79655
What do you think Gazelle is?

By the way, transforming your web browser into an OS is more than just tube surfing.  You also need to be able to run applications that were developed native, hence Google's Native Client.

There are rumors that on Monday, Microsoft is going to announce an online version of Office to compete with Google Docs.

[fuser]

There are rumors that on Monday, Microsoft is going to announce an online version of Office to compete with Google Docs.

You mean http://workspace.officelive.com/en-us/office-web-applications

[Krakrok]

Time travel!

And creating a custom GUI shell for Linux isn't as difficult as it seems especially if your own app is a browser. XP clone attempt from 5 years ago. I submitted code for Notepad and Calc to it .

[Quinton]

If you believe that netbooks are going to eclipse PCs, microsoft should probably worry.  If not, then maybe not so much worry.

They have no reason to panic regardless.  It's not like they're incapable of gutting their OS until it's effectively only good for internet browsing and media apps and then selling CD's at a loss just to fucking spite Google and maintain their brand identity enough that Google cannot threaten them in other ventures.

But if it's only good for internet browsing, why would anyone want to pay anything for it if there's a perfectly good free internet browsing solution (especially if the free internet browsing solution is a better experience).

Windows is a threat to the non-windows netbooks because people want to run their existing programs.  See: consumer frustration about linux alternatives and returns due to this.  If they have no need to run windows software and are happy with just a browsing and media player experience, there's no advantage to having windows.