Combining random and static content.

[Ratman_tf]

Yo. I am wondering just how much of a hurdle it is to incorporate static and random content in a MMOG? I love Anarchy Online's mission system. I love running through the same brown sewers in Hellgate: London. I love Telenguard and Roge's random content.
But I also love me some scripted content as well. Doing a raid or encounter and learning the patterns to Victolly!

So I'm wondering if random and static content are exclusive, or if a hypothetical MMOG could have a random mission system running side-by-side with static content as well.

I mean, as an armchair designer, it's as easy as "Random dungeons for WoW!" or "Raids for Anarchy Online!" (Yea, I know Shadowlands+ is AO with static content. It also seems that AO abandoned the random mission system in it's later expansions.) But what's the big hurdles?

[Koyasha]

That's pretty much what Lost Dungeons of Norrath was, sticking in instanced random missions.

[Sheepherder]

Ratman, did you skip both Diablos and Daggerfall?

The largest hurdle is distributing the dungeon layout to everyone, assuming it's 3D and built using prefabricated sections which are stored client-side prior to entering the dungeon the file size would probably be no larger than ~1 MB of data unless it has an exceedinly large number of objects.  Pretty much everything not satellite or dial-up can handle that, especially if you have means to preload it in advance of the actually entering the dungeon.  Actually making a pathable dungeon is not to dissimilar to a pathing AI conceptually, so that's also covered.

[Tarami]

My theory? Random content stinks. Especially if it co-exists with hand-crafted content. I don't think that's going to be accepted in anything but a niche game which can afford to experiment.

[Typhon]

My theory? Random content stinks. Especially if it co-exists with hand-crafted content. I don't think that's going to be accepted in anything but a niche game which can afford to experiment.

I'm Yin to your Yang.  I liked Diablo more then Dialbo 2 because there weren't only random mobs and maps, it had random quests and the random drops (books) also dictated (to an extent) what type of character you ended up playing.  I like MOM and all the Civs because of random starting conditions.

I think in-game stories, by and large, are pretty poor.  MMO stories, universaly, suck.  The whole gaming experience (i.e. the audience is an active participant, not a passive witness) is not conducive to telling a story in any traditional sense.  The "gaming exeperience" is more conducive to palyers creating their own "stories" via interaction with NPC and locations.

Unfortunately, given the amount of progress that we've seen in AI, it'll probably take another 30-40 years for that to get to the point where the dialog and interaction come remotely close to what you would think of as a "story".

[Ratman_tf]

Ratman, did you skip both Diablos and Daggerfall?

I played the shit out of both Diablos. Never tried Daggerfall.

[Ratman_tf]

My theory? Random content stinks. Especially if it co-exists with hand-crafted content. I don't think that's going to be accepted in anything but a niche game which can afford to experiment.

I'm Yin to your Yang.  I liked Diablo more then Dialbo 2 because there weren't only random mobs and maps, it had random quests and the random drops (books) also dictated (to an extent) what type of character you ended up playing.  I like MOM and all the Civs because of random starting conditions.

I think in-game stories, by and large, are pretty poor.  MMO stories, universaly, suck.  The whole gaming experience (i.e. the audience is an active participant, not a passive witness) is not conducive to telling a story in any traditional sense.  The "gaming exeperience" is more conducive to palyers creating their own "stories" via interaction with NPC and locations.

Unfortunately, given the amount of progress that we've seen in AI, it'll probably take another 30-40 years for that to get to the point where the dialog and interaction come remotely close to what you would think of as a "story".

Me too. I stopped playing Mass Effect because the story really didn't interest me at all. And without the Epicz Storie! Mass Effect is just a kinda boring FPS/RPG hybird.