Noblegarden

[ezrast]

Ah, just like how every white civil rights protester in the '60s just wanted to be able to bang black people, and everyone speaking out in favor of civil unions must actually be gay, right?

edit: After this gets moved I'm going to have posted in a Politics thread. Doh.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Guilt is a powerful thing.

[Sutro]

Actually, thanks. I appreciate those comments.

Saying that a man's only out to get laid if he thinks about things from a female's perspective just proves every point I'm trying to make.

[Ingmar]

Ah, just like how every white civil rights protester in the '60s just wanted to be able to bang black people, and everyone speaking out in favor of civil unions must actually be gay, right?

edit: After this gets moved I'm going to have posted in a Politics thread. Doh.

Hey man, those gay people should be happy we don't let them get married, at least we're not throwing them in prison or killing them like in other countries!

[Hindenburg]

And Itto, shut the fuck up.

It's entirely possible for a dude to, you know, consider sexism a bad thing that still exists, girlfriend or no.

Doubt anyone is retarded enough to think that it will ever stop existing. We do work towards minimizing it and making it possible for the offended to make the offender pay, and there are tools available for that purpose.

Also:

[Xanthippe]

I really don't want to get into a big ol' feminist fight with you, because this is not the place to really get into it, but yes, here in the USA in 2009, women are still oppressed. Rape victims are still generally considered to be lying tramps asking for it. Women are still uniformly objectified and considered the sex class. They are not trusted to make their own goddamn medical decisions because it will hurt their poor lady brains. And yes, they absolutely still get fucked over in pay and promotions in male-dominated fields (hi, remember the Supreme Court ruling a few years ago that EXTRA fucked women over as far as even suing for equal pay went?), and female dominated fields are simply not valued as highly. And I'm sorry, my own experience in my male-dominated work place DEFINITELY contradicts this happy fairy tale of women being totally equal with men in the eyes of Americans.

I'm not saying we're not much better off than we were in the 1920's or something, but to insist women are a protected class with out a care in the world is sticking your head in the sand.

To insist that women have special problems that create oppression in 2009 is silly.  Shall I complain about the fact that women dominate education in this country, and that elementary school education has become completely feminized?  How is it that this doesn't oppress men?

If people want to insist on victim mentalities and oppression, then by god, the facts won't get in their way.  But you're right, this isn't the place.

[Numtini]

Women do not still suffer from sexism? That's so farcical it doesn't even deserve an answer. I can understand the argument that boyish fun that's sexist shouldn't be taken seriously, but to honestly deny that sexism exists in our society is simply ludicrous.

As to this kind of thing, if you wonder why women are underrepresented in video games. It's stuff like this. And it's not the women who are getting bent and activisty about it, it's the others that roll their eyes and dismiss the entire genre as dominated by man-childs.

[Lantyssa]

We can have gender equity problems on both sides.  One doesn't invalidate the other, especially when looking at different age brackets.

I'll end my participation on the argument in this thread by saying: 28 tenued or tenure track faculty.  Two are women.  One without a Ph.D. as her field is Chemical Education and has been here 50 years.  The other was hired three years ago.  Of the technical/scientific support staff, I am the only female.  Of the business staff we've had two males, one whom left to join his mentor after she went elsewhere.

[Samprimary]

Women do not still suffer from sexism? That's so farcical it doesn't even deserve an answer.

Well, yes it does. Namely, the answer is that women remain a social minority in every country on earth and that our habits as human beings assure that you are about as likely to ever fully eradicate sexism as you are likely to fully eradicate racism.

in effect, not at all.

[Paelos]

So this event is over tomorrow. If yall are done whining about oppression in a gaming forum now, I'd like to point out the following things about this event.

1 - This was worse than the valentine's day thing. I said it wasn't originally, but I was wrong. It brings all the fun of kill stealing, loot grabbing, and spawn camping into one frankenevent that shouldn't be.

2 - Massive amounts of random drops in events suck ass.

3 - Finding x race with y criteria just means we sit in Dalaran waiting for them to ride by, which is boring, or we get one of our buddies to grab a low lvl alt and port it to Dalaran, which defeats the purpose.

4 - Seriously? Spawn camping? WTF were you expecting with thousands of players needing hundreds of drops and only 10 spawn points in a town? Fuck you Blizzard.

[Modern Angel]

I boycotted this one. Every time they roll something out recently it feels more and more like they're off their game, maybe permanently.

[Khaldun]

It was definitely the C team's work. As is Argent Tournament. Game really does feel like it's in a holding pattern now, which makes perfectly good economic sense from their standpoint, particularly given that no one has even the faintest idea how to launch a competitive product.

[SurfD]

4 - Seriously? Spawn camping? WTF were you expecting with thousands of players needing hundreds of drops and only 10 spawn points in a town? Fuck you Blizzard.

I could easily count at least 25 egg spawns in Brill.

and during off peak hours, i was managing to average about 1 egg every 10 seconds just running a loop around town, and that was with about 15 people still there getting eggs at the same time.

[Paelos]

Fine, 25. When you run the math it still sucks. Let's assume 3000 people per server give a damn about this, and they need 250 eggs a pop to get all their shit. That's 750,000 total eggs needed for those folks. Now we have 8 zones with 25 spawns a piece, that's 200 spawns. Assume they spawn every 2 minutes. That's 6000 total eggs to be picked up per hour. You would need 125 hours or 5 days and ~5 hours of pure nonstop gathering to satisfy everyone at that rate.

Some will say, hey it's less than a week so that's ok. Others will say WTF do we have to spawncamp shit all the livelong day to get things done?

[Gobbeldygook]

Some will say, hey it's less than a week so that's ok. Others will say WTF do we have to spawncamp shit all the livelong day to get things done?

Have you considered that the eggs might have had dynamic respawn timers, like the dynamic mob respawns?

[Sheepherder]

Yes, he also forgot that most players don't have eidetic memory and that each egg will not have been activated immediately upon spawning if their location is sufficiently remote or the players involved sufficiently proactive to their own detriment.  Even with a half minute respawn a single person camping a single egg will need ~62.5 motionless minutes of hyper-alertness for something to click on to completion.  That's just fucking insane for a game in 2009, not that it's particularly onerous, per se, but it's just so fucking grindcore to camp a motherfucking egg object in a starting zone for an hour, and that's assuming that the 2 min. figure is not entirely accurate.

[Lantyssa]

I had a spot with three eggs in reach without moving and a couple more nearby that were not camped half the time.  I was not done after two hours because of crappy drop rates for the special items like the dress, or the expense of things like the bunny, which never dropped for my main after 250+ chocolates gathered.  Of course my alt got two when I was just trying to get her a set of bunny ears, but BoP, so they were useless.

[Ingmar]

Its hard to say what the egg spawn timers were like, but when I did it the first night I was between two egg spawns that spawned anywhere from instantly after looting to maybe a minute tops. The rate of spawning was very variable, sometimes one of them would spawn 3 or 4 times quickly before the other one repopped, then later it would switch, etc.

[SurfD]

From what i could gather, the eggs had a fixed NUMBER of eggs in a zone that had to be spawned at any given time.

so for example, if there were 25 egg locations in Brill, at any given time, there HAD to be 5 up.

This meant, that as soon as you looted one, another one would spawn instantly in any of the free locations.

So if the area was camped, and ALL spots were taken, and every egg was looted as soon as it spawned, there would be something like 5 eggs per second spawning constantly.

I guarantee you, there was never a time in Brill, even when it was completely camped, that someone, somewhere was not looting an egg.

Heck, im pretty sure my estimate of 25 eggs spawns in brill was prob pretty low, i mean, off the top of my head, there were 13 places around the Inn building alone, just hugging the inn walls, where eggs could spawn.  Might have been closer to 50, but i would have to go back to Brill and count every place i saw an egg spawn.

Also, some people just SUCKED at spotting eggs.  I easily counted 3 or 4 spots in brill that at least a half dozen people that were there with me just never picked up on.  They would just zoom right past the eggs, constantly.  (Such as the eggs that spawned on top of the two Lamp Posts)

[Lantyssa]

Certainly.  My spot was one of them because it was under a bridge in Dolanaar.

[Fordel]

Also, some people just SUCKED at spotting eggs.  I easily counted 3 or 4 spots in brill that at least a half dozen people that were there with me just never picked up on.  They would just zoom right past the eggs, constantly.  (Such as the eggs that spawned on top of the two Lamp Posts)

Oh man, tell me about it. I was doing laps in Falcon Wing square on my BElf, I started to feel bad for some of these people after awhile. After I was done with my chocolates etc, I gave a egg finding tour of the town.  

[Lakov_Sanite]

Ha! the lamposts and well in brill were always up. Thing is though brill was actually the most populated of the starter towns, really should have gone to thunderbluff but I, like many others were too lazy.

Still, got all the noblegarden achievements done in three hours so, not as horrible as advertised.

[Vash]

Still, got all the noblegarden achievements done in three hours so, not as horrible as advertised.

Three hours of mind numbing and pointless camping/clicking in a lowbie village + a retarded run to Un'goro + finding people to put ears on, all for achievements and a flying mount I could care less about is decidedly more than horrible enough to keep me away from Blizzard's evil "holiday" treadmill.   

[Fordel]

What isn't mentioned is 2.5 hours of that time was looking for a female orc. 

[SurfD]

strangely enough, i got all my female horde toon requirements done before i even got out of Brill.  I just randomly asked in chat every 20 eggs or so "anyone here a female X" and usually got a hit within seconds.

And the Ungoro run was easy, once you figured out you could just go down on a flightpath with a friend and a branch and zap each other into rabbits.

[Fordel]

There was a lineup to tag our servers apparently only female orc in Dalaran.

[Lantyssa]

Thunderbluff was terrible.  The eggs were spread out and it didn't have a lot of interesting hiding places like elsewhere.  Razor Hill wasn't much better.  I think Falconwing was the best of the Horde areas.

[DevilsAdvocate25]

Thunderbluff was terrible.  The eggs were spread out and it didn't have a lot of interesting hiding places like elsewhere.  Razor Hill wasn't much better.  I think Falconwing was the best of the Horde areas.

You mean Bloodhoof Village. Did you check between the stairs? Or on top of the meat smoker? or in the boats behind the tent? We saw a lot of people miss those eggs.

[Lantyssa]

Couldn't remember the name and Thunderbluff is a bull's charge away.

I found a few of those spots.  But they were still so spread out and I was only there to get my bunny some action that I didn't invest a lot of time.  They being spread over an area at least three times the size of anywhere else was my point though.

[Kitsune]

I did all of my early egg hunting in Terokkar.  There was literally nobody there, so I just flew around between trees and picked up eggs at leisure.  Later on in the event when I needed eggs for non-flying alts, things had calmed down enough in the starter towns that people had stopped spawn camping, so I just trotted circles around the towns and picked eggs.  No yelling or crying, just the laid-back egg hunting that the holiday SHOULD have been, if Blizzard had been wise enough to put out twice as many towns with eggs.  There are plenty of level 20-ish towns out in the world that would've been great egg sites and would've taken off lots of the crowding pressure.

[K9]

wtf, there were eggs in Terrokar?

I thought it was just the starter towns....

[Kitsune]

Yeah, most people didn't know that eggs were around Shattrath as well as the starter towns.  Even when I went around telling people, some of them didn't believe me, thinking I was trying to trick them into leaving their egg camp.

[Lantyssa]

I tried going there, but at 48 my Druid was too low level.  It was easier to compete with other players than to get one shot by mobs.

[Righ]

I read Sutro's blog post, and some of the following comments. I'm not going to register to post there but this comment was golden:

"Historically Succubi and Incubi are both rapists"

Yeah? Historically? Nutter alert.

[DraconianOne]

I'm with Lantyssa - Falconwing Square for Horde was the place to go.  Kept doing loops of that place and could get 20 eggs in 5 minutes (for daily). It was better on the second day of the event when fewer people turned up and those people who were camping were definitely doing it wrong.  I can understand why people found it tedious but tbh, after a while, I found it strangely addictive.

The Un'goro trip I decided to be a little more adventurous about. I got turned into the rabbit by an egg, hearthed back to Dalaran and took the portal to the Caverns of Time then hopped all the way to the Hot Springs. Took 20 minutes or so and yeah, would have been easier and quicker not to do so but I wanted to see how possible it was.