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July 19, 2025, 04:55:25 PM

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As a Cleric I've found that it generally requires that I get a lag spike or fuck up seriously to lose 1v1. Templars and Clerics make for.. long fights. Whether a duel or a 1v1 in open world PvP(had a lot of them recently as I out-leveled most people on my server, so when I hit 30 it was just a few of us up there; so we got together, Asmodian and Elyos alike, and did 1v1s for a bit for the hell of it) I've not come close to losing to Templars; they just don't have the damage spike necessary to kill me.

Fights against Clerics simply boil down to whomever gets more crits with Divine Spark.

Only class I've had any trouble at all 1v1 has been Spiritmasters, and that's simply because of Fears when I'm not prepped to deal with it. Only lost twice; both times to the same Cleric who must shit and piss lucky charms.

Its nice being so durable, but it can be easy to get focus-fired down in group PvP if you don't have another healer or two who is on the ball. Even at 4.1k health currently I can get dropped surprisingly quickly (in part because the only other healer I run with is inept at not getting drawn out of range or fails to pick up healing as needed).

Leveling's been a huge pain, however; its not until the higher levels that our dps catches back up with a lot of the mob health/damage gains, and our big damage dealing ability is a 3rd chain ability with a 20% proc rate, and I rarely have anyone I know in the same level range as me.

Between Game guard and login screen issues, I've only had about a half hour with this game this week Mob

So, I've got a few questions about classes, since the lands beyond the opening meadow area are terra incognita to me. Right now, I'm wavering between a Templar and a healer. For healers, I'm not clear on the difference between Clerics and Chanters; I'm hearing Clerics are OP, which makes me reluctant to roll one, but I don't know what the actual difference between the two classes is. Which would be better for just plain healing? I'm also kind of vague about the difference between Templars and Gladiators. All this talk about Templars being unkillable makes me guess their DPS is in the gutter; would Gladiators be much better? Are they competent tanks? How do Templars do solo?

Cleric is heal proficient.
Chanter is party buffer.

Templar is a sword and shield type. Lowest DPS makes partying a more 'tolerable' grind.
Gladiator is hard hitter with two handed weapons.

Quote from: Kail on September 12, 2009, 08:10:20 PM

Between Game guard and login screen issues, I've only had about a half hour with this game this week Mob

Yeah, there've been a lot of issues in this OB; although I've had a great run personally other than the first day when I couldn't loot fuck-all in Verteron (I could loot once, then I'd have to relog or not "see" any loot on mobs/gatherables).

As to the class question...

There's a few notable differences between Clerics and Chanters; Chanters are more DPS orientated (they are best used in melee, on mobs, in groups, due to how a lot of their buffs work), offer a wider variety of buffs (of which many are very, very nice), and their heals are more HoT based (Chanters HoTs are stronger than the Cleric HoT, but Clerics have more direct heals that are also stronger). Chanters solo much better (deal more damage, more interactive; Clerics push two buttons and pray shit doesn't resist or things'll drag on).

In groups Clerics and Chanters go well together, so no worry there, but most Chanters I've met had trouble keeping groups up solo i the elite areas, but a good player will find it a bit harder as a Chanter rather than impossible (though certain bosses will make you punch a kitten as they have notable AEs.. before even the Cleric gets their group heal). In PvP.. personally and from what I've seen first-hand, Clerics are more robust than Chanters; although Clerics tend to be focus-fired moreso than Chanters. They also play a bit differently there; as a Cleric is all about wearing one's enemy down and outlasting them, or simply healing/rooting the enemy. Chanters can be more offensively minded, but its easier for their healing to be overcome in groupvgroup.

So if pure healing is what you're looking at, Cleric is the clear choice; though if you aren't grouping heavily while leveling expect it to suck from ~22-42. Some spots in that range aren't too bad. Our damage abilities are spread way too far out. We even go 11-18 without a single skill increase in our damage lines. Clerics aren't OP, however. Its just most are inept at killing them. Stuns and similar effects are crucial to it, though.

From what I've seen/read, Templar damage is a bit worse than Gladiator, but are harder to kill. Their damage isn't as bad as a Protection Warrior's was in WoW for a long time or anything, just notably lower than a Gladiator. Templars and Clerics are among the lower damage-dealing classes, I believe and both can be some-what slow in the leveling, compared to if you'd gone with a different class (but much easier to get groups as them, and the elite areas are great for experience). Templars have some nice skills, though. Gladiators can, unless things have changed drastically, tank decently enough if they make sure to grab the equipment for it. While leveling up I found using a Gladiator as a tank in the elite areas a pain in the ass as a healer; a Templar made things far, far easier. Its was doable with a Gladiator, though, I just made sure I never had to, even in PuGs.

I'm sure others will point out anything I missed or got wrong.. I havn't leveled anything but my Cleric and a Sorc.

Here's a copy paste from FoH that might actually be of some use:

Quote

A sum-up of the classes from what I've read/seen until now, probably will update in a month or so as we get closer to release. Have PvP and PvE ratings, with both solo and group explanations. Rating goes from A to C, no +-, some might change with time and C doesn't mean total shit, just one of the worst comparatively, but the game is made so even classes that are the worst at something still do fine enough. The ratings are also mostly weighted toward group efficiency, since solo isn't quite as important, especially in the PvE part.

Templar

PvE=A

A good PvE class, solid leveling, a bit slow in the first 25levels but gets better as you level up, especially when you start getting physical crit items and ends up at good killing speed with almost no downtime.

Very powerful class for group pve, they're the best tank by far, while Gladiators can tank about everything too, they have many tools that lets them not get killed if shit is going wrong(like your healers dieing to AEs, silenced or having adds on them). The pull is also very good for Ranged mobs, and their Provoke can be used on CCed mobs so they come directly for the Templar when the CC breaks instead of raping the CCer.

PvP=C

For solo PvP, they lack tools to guarantee a kill if the opponent starts running, so they're not very good at ganking. Stunning Strike(the pull) gets resisted an awful lot which is why they're not good at that. They are however very powerful in a 1vs1 where your opponent won't run, in fact they're probably one of the best if not the best 1vs1 class.

For group pvp they lack utility, while tanks in WAR had Guard, Templars only have a Guard type ability on a 2mins cooldown with 30secs duration and a short range, the pull suffer the same issues as during solo pvp(resisted a lot) and the DPS is nothing to be crazy about. You'll basically be ignored until the end of the fight, but sadly you won't be able to do much during that time either, besides being a minor annoyance to healers and such.

Edit: Probably a better class in 1.5 for group pvp, Stunning Strike resist seems pretty low now, and they gain a stigma that adds a ranged stun. Probably bumped to a "B"

Gladiator

PvE=B

Gladiators are solid levelers, nothing crazy in terms of speed, but it's steady and they will hardly die to adds and such since they're a tank class yet also have good AE damage.

In groups, they can act as a tank, and even though they're not as good as Templars in the role, they're not bad at all when properly geared(parry set with a polearm or good DW weapons). When not tanking they're average DPS, doing good steady damage, as well as the best AEing in the game, which as far as I know isn't terribly useful, and can break CCs. The fact they can offtank adds is a big plus for group pve. Their DW DPS is also higher than polearm DPS assuming you use 2 good weapons, and it puts Glads in the top3 DPS classes.

Edit: DW dmg was nerfed indirectly, but 2h DPS was buffed, so their DPS potential should be unchanged, but DW DPS shouldn't be much higher if it is at all. Still a "B"

PvP=A

While soloing, gladiator's big weakness is getting kited. Besides templar, no class is able to beat a glad in melee range, so you mostly have to look for the ranged DPS. They have a few tools to help them not getting kited, but it's not that great, however if they can reach their targets, it's not uncommon to be able to one round the opponent(air shackle to ground attack combo is devastating).

Group PvP is where they shine, they have AEs to put pressure on multiple targets, a non dispellable root(the only in the game afaik), very powerful burst DPS potential and a random chance to knockdown and stun people that can't be resisted(linked to melee attacks). They also have one advantage over other melees, polearms have a bigger range so they don't suffer as much from fighting people while flying. Adding all these offensive abilities with their plate armor and defensive abilities make them a good choice for group pvp.

Assassin

PvE:A

While they start a bit slow because they don't have many tools at low level, assassins quickly become very good at soloing, and after 25-30 become pure grinding machines. They also have a 20%speed toggle that lets them quest faster by reducing running times and such.

In groups, they are the best DPS in the game, both combining high burst and sustainability. They're a bit squishy so they do need to worry about their aggro, but they have a few tools to avoid AEs for example(dodge the next hit or resist the next 2 spells abilities). They have very little utility however, but their DPS alone is enough.

PvP:A

Kings of ganking, assassins own at killing people 1vs1. They start from stealth which as usual is a big advantage, and can "stun lock" people until they die. Their stuns however are magical, and are not always guaranteed to hit even not taking into account resists, so it can also fail miserably, but they'll still DPS hard. They do better in rifts zones but do ok in Abyss due to their increased speed while flying which lets them catch up runners.

In group pvp, they're also very good, mostly for the burst they provide but also because they're surprisingly tough to kill if played right. Their Focused Evasion and Contract of Evasion lets them buy time when retreating, they can toggle their speed buff to move out of range of people and in last resort they can AE blind everyone around them. Combined with Ambush and Hide to get to their targets fast, they're excelent at hit and run tactics and can take out most squishies before they can even get healed.

Rangers

PvE:C

As assassins, they start a bit slow while leveling, but they quickly become very efficient too, and can solo about anything. The worst levels are 10-16, luckily, this only takes a few hours of play.

In groups, they're only average. Their sustained DPS isn't all that high, they're more about burst DPS, they're about polearm gladiator levels, without the AEing. They do have utility, but it's not that great. Their Sleep Arrow is in 3mins cooldown for example, so they don't make very good CCers, their root is a trap so it need to be placed in the right spot and isn't ranged, only their Silence arrow is better than other classes(18secs cooldown).

Edit: Probably a better class in 1.5, Attack Arrow chain cooldown reduced by 33%, this should bump them to an acceptable level, "B".

PvP:A

Again as assassins, they're very good at soloing and ganking people. They also have hide(even though it's a weaker version) but they can easily gank from the air or unreachable spots. Their design, which is a very high burst followed by a period of low damage is excelent for ganking, since you can unload all you have on an opponent and kill him before he reacts. They also have many tools in case the opponent doesn't die right away, like instant cast snare, silence and sleep, or various traps, as well as surprisingly powerful melee attacks.

In group PvP, they perform the same way as assassins, with 2 major differences. First, while they do their damage from range which is a bit safer, they're also much more susceptible to being killed. They don't have many "outs" once they're getting targetted and have low armor/hps. The 2nd difference is they do have a lot more utility though. Their Silence, Stun and Sleep arrows(18s, 12s, and 3mins cd) let them lock down a healer easily, or even 2 if played right. Combined with their deadly burst, they're an excelent group pvp class, and Abyss flight is no problem for them since they are a ranged class.

Sorcerer

PvE:A

Soloing, they're a very good class. They have steady high DPS, meaning they kill fast, their only issue being, if the mob gets to them, they get trashed hard. They do have many tools to prevent that however, and they can easily handle elites or multiple mobs at once. Do need to use potions for chain efficient grinding.

In groups, they're the best CC class, as well as providing the second best DPS(after assassins). They have a reliable sleep(20s duration, 15s cooldown) and a polymorph(20secs duration, 30secs cooldown) as well as an instant cast root and a short cast AE root. All these combined makes it easy for a sorc to CC one mob, possibly 2 every pull. Their DPS is also very high, but they need to be careful about aggro, especially if they're CCing, because 2elites on them will usually end with an instant death, even with their absorb shield.

PvP:A

For ganking, while they don't have stealthing shenannigans, they have a very high burst potential from range, like rangers, but it's also a steady burst(rangers can get unlucky and get low numbers on their burst, sorc always hits for the same). They can either open with very high burst with delayed damage spell(cast the spell but it does damage a few seconds after, letting you cast another spell and finish casting before both spells hit at the same time) or open with a CC if they get jumped to get time to prepare for the burst. They can also "reset" their burst simply by CCing and doing it again, but unlike wow, targets don't get hp back for CC.

For group PvP, their powerful CC and high damage combined obviously make them a good class. They can take down people in a few seconds, which makes it hard for healers since they can sleep, polymorph and silence(8secs). They have instant cast roots and snares too, which makes it hard for melees to stick to them, and while they have terribly low hp and armor, their absorb shield basically double their hp. Their only weakness is their DPS isn't very high if they can't stop to cast, but if they stop even only for a couple of seconds, they can unleash hell. Usually a prime assist target, which makes the "Ice Block" stigma(immune to all damage for 8secs but can't do anything) very useful.

Spiritmasters

PvE:C

They're an awesome class for soloing, their pets let them bypass their inherent low armor and hp, while they can stand back and nuke. They also have a very good first DP for grinding, since it makes grinding faster for the whole duration while most DP have short durations. They can handle anything, and don't really need gear upgrades as much as other classes, Abyss soloing can be annoying however with all the pet summoning, and their mana efficiency is also pretty low.

In groups, they're decent to low DPS, but their CC(fears) aren't very good for pve content since they pull more mobs. They do have their base class root but this alone makes them subpar for CCing. Not a very good group PvE class in the end, but assuming they stigma for it, they have some good group buffs through their pets for specific encounters. The pets can also cause trouble with pathing, aggroing stuff it shouldn't and such, usual mmo issue.

PvP:B

SMs are excelent for rift PvP, since it's all ground based, so their pets work np, but their big weakness is flight combat, since pets don't fly, meaning they lose a big chunk of their DPS(as well as some utility). They do have some anti flight abilities, like Wing Rot(reduces the max flight duration on the target, forcing him to land/crash) and Crash, a pet based ability that cancel wings(have to be timed right so target isn't out of range). They can still manage in Abyss, but most fights are 50/50 or worse for the SM against semi competent players.

In group PvP, their utility compensate for their lack of DPS. Fear is an excelent CC, and they get 3 different fears(instant cast, normal cast and PBAE), feared opponents will often run out of range of their healers(or if the healer is feared, he'll run out of range of everyone else). They have a decent silence ability, but their best tool is Wing Rot, which forces opponents to stay on the ground, or at least not go too high, which helps melees a lot. They also have an offensive dispel to strip powerful buffs from people, especially useful to down Templars using cooldowns, to counter Assassins using offensive cooldowns to burst someone down or on Sorcs/SM absorb shield to kill them. They're a support dps class, and most of their job is oriented toward debuffing and controlling, and maybe adding a bit of DPS. If the fight takes place on the ground however, they can also add a good chunk of DPS through their pets, and become quite resilient(they can transfer all their dmg to their pet).

Cleric

PvE:A

Soloing, they're basically slow and steady and they'll rarely if ever die, very much like Templars. They can solo about everything, even though it'll take time.

In groups, they're the kings of single target healing, and a healer in general, so that makes them very sought after. Most groups will take a cleric first because if they have to go with only one healer, it's much much better for him to be a cleric than a chanter. Optimally a group will have both, but clerics have priority(at least until endgame, when the tank is overgeared a single chanter is more efficient). They also have a self rez for these crappy wipes recoveries which chanters don't have. They can also CC in a pinch, since they have an instant cast root like mage classes, but using a CC while healing makes it very hard if not impossible for the tank to get aggro back fast.

PvP:A

Soloing, while they're not impressive with big numbers and stuff, they're one of the best 1vs1 class. They are very very hard to kill due to their heals, and have decent DPS on their own, mostly in forms of dots, but also good spell chains when they can afford to cast them. They also have a melee chain. If played correctly, they can beat every other class, minus other Clerics where it's basically a draw unless you can unload a DP attack after a lvl3 spell chain, and the only way to lose really is on a huge burst.

In groups, they're obviously just as good, since they heal very well and can easily keep any class under focus fire if they're not silenced. They're also tough to kill, and have a defensive dispel which is vital for any form of group pvp, since it dispels dots and CCs(most of them at least). They also get a healing reduction debuff which is important to kill your opponent, and they can slip some powerful burst between heals if they're not being attacked. A required class in any serious PvP group.

Chanter

PvE:B

They solo very well, but not very fast. They have no downtime however, and can solo about anything, faster than clerics. They have a 10% speed buff which makes questing a bit faster too.

In groups, they're usually a good addition since they improve the rest of the group, but they're not necessary for anything. They'll also rarely be the only healer in a group unless the tank outgear the content because their healing isn't quite as varied and powerful than a cleric. They're usually a very good addition in any group though, since they can DPS and offheal, while bringing powerful buffs and some good debuffs for other classes(physical def reduction mostly).

PvP:B

They're not a very good solo pvp class, they do fine, and can usually beat most other classes, but it's usually fights of attrition and a bad silence/stun can get you killed. Because their single target healing isn't so good, they have to spend a lot of time healing themselves against other DPS classes, which means they don't put any kind of pressure on their opponent during that time. They also don't have any self dispels so they can get kited easily, only being able to rely on their ranged stun to close the gap. Their do have good stun combos though, so they can do very high bursts, and if they proc a knockdown, they have an extremely powerful attack that can very well seal the deal.

In groups, they're very useful. They have powerful group short buffs(absorb, spell absorb+heal, hot, -50%cast time) as well as their usual permanent group buffs which are very good(flight speed and run speed are especially interesting for melees). Their stun chains, including the ranged stun, are good at supporting DPS, and being a healer, they're also good for backup healing if the cleric is getting assisted or CCed. A very good class to finish an optimal PvP group, but not as vital as a cleric due to the lack of dispel or good single target healing.

Quote from: Zane0 on September 13, 2009, 07:57:07 AM

Here's a copy paste from FoH that might actually be of some use...

Awesome, that was very helpful. Thanks!

I got given a free open beta code but I have no intention on using it. Anyone who wants it drop me a PM and ill send it to you.

Open Beta ended this morning. Headstart is this weekend.

Anyone up for an Euro legion? Or anyone with a cool Euro legion I could join?

Quote from: IainC on September 14, 2009, 05:58:26 AM

Open Beta ended this morning. Headstart is this weekend.

Ahh, well then! That shows how much I've been following this and how organized they are at giving out open beta keys why so serious?

Falconeer if you want to play in NA you can join my Legion.

I know Draegan, and I thank you again for that, but I preordered EU swamp poop

Since no one else posted this yet.

NA server list and their respective timezones (all are physically located on east coast)
They made a mistake with this list originally but it should be accurate now.
http://na.aiononline.com/en/news/serverlist.html

No official word on the specific fortress times. Someone has been linking this around (it's based on the times noted in the Korean 1.5 patch notes)
http://www.legionthirteenth.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/BG1.jpg

There seems to be a push from some guilds for Azphel to be "the #1 East pvp" server and Siel for the west.

Quote from: Falconeer on September 14, 2009, 07:42:35 AM

I know Draegan, and I thank you again for that, but I preordered EU swamp poop

As far as I know the client isn't region specific.

Quote from: Outlawedprod on September 14, 2009, 08:51:56 AM

Thats for the Dredgion. It's a PVPVE instance that you can play once a day.

Quote from: Outlawedprod on September 14, 2009, 08:51:56 AM

There seems to be a push from some guilds for Azphel to be "the #1 East pvp" server and Siel for the west.

Ummm, yeah that will work out sooooo well. swamp poop

Quote from: Draegan on September 14, 2009, 09:52:11 AM

As far as I know the client isn't region specific.

I think the keys are. I would imagine if one actively wants to switch it couldn't hurt to ask their support dept. If you purchased direct they might be willing to do this.

Exactly.
I should have said "I paid for a EU key, Draegan swamp poop

Frankly I want this game to come out and bomb so we can all stop talking about it. With all the focus on this game it felt like it should have been out months ago.

So are we doing any flavor of Bat Country on this game? I know Nonentity was trying to get everyone on Zikel at one point a few pages back, but nothing seemed to go anywhere, and Draegan is recruiting for his guild (but I'm not looking for srs bizness). Are we going to do this proper and run it into the ground together or what?

Actually I'm not recruiting anymore. I offered Falc a few months ago and that invitation is still open of course. I've got 50 or so members and that's a little much right now. Not sure how many will stick around after the first week and first month. We'll see.

What are the legion population caps for a rank 1/2 legion?

Rank 1 is 30 people, which costs 12k Kinah.
Rank 2 is 60 people, which costs 120k Kinah (or so).
Rank 3 is 90 people, which costs some Abyss Points and stuff.

Quote from: 01101010 on September 14, 2009, 10:39:46 AM

Quote from: Outlawedprod on September 14, 2009, 08:51:56 AM

There seems to be a push from some guilds for Azphel to be "the #1 East pvp" server and Siel for the west.

Ummm, yeah that will work out sooooo well. swamp poop

It worked out too well in WoW, not sure how WAR went since I stayed away. East coast proves they are retarded as usual though, you never pick the first or last server alphabetically. Fucking noobs. The only reason to play this game would be if you were going to play with all the big been going for years pvp guilds, they may be mostly asshats but they know how to play and they will be pvp'ing constantly. I miss playing with Regulators SIN et all after SB and WoW sometimes, but I really just can't level up in another boring as fuck combat system. Also Lineage, lol, you people are crazy as fuck.

Quote from: Hoax on September 14, 2009, 12:42:58 PM

Also Lineage, lol, you people are crazy as fuck.

The allure of the PvP Diku is like the allure of sweet, sweet crack. Minus all of crack's redeeming qualities.

I am allured by this:

Cloth
Leather
Chain
Plate

Screenshots don't do them any justice, and these are just the basic vendor armours. I froth at the higher tiers stuff.

So, I'm a whore? Who cares.
Fashion plus PvP and I am sold for a few weeks.

Quote from: amiable on September 14, 2009, 12:46:18 PM

Quote from: Hoax on September 14, 2009, 12:42:58 PM

Also Lineage, lol, you people are crazy as fuck.

The allure of the PvP Diku is like the allure of sweet, sweet crack. Minus all of crack's redeeming qualities.

Yea, lol DIKU, but it's not nearly oppressively grindy and punitive as Lineage. That and its sequel make launch day EQ1 look like current day WoW.

Quote from: Falconeer on September 14, 2009, 01:14:33 PM

I am allured by this:

I'm getting a full set of the level 7-ish green chain set just because it looks so awesome. I'm hoping the appearance alteration applies to any armor so I can make my plate look like that chain set.

Oh, sister! I knew I wasn't alone in this... DRILLING AND WOMANLINESS

Not all armor can be altered, but it looks like most of it can. It can only be altered within its own type, however (no putting chain appearance on plate, for example, or leather on chain). A few armors can't be altered at all. Abyss armor seems to be able to be altered, but I can't be 100% certain (only tried once, and that was a cross-type alteration, so I'm not sure if it could have been altered had I tried to alter it to the same type). Abyss armor cannot be dyed, however. The account-bound Daevanion armor cannot be dyed (and looks like a frilly pink dress, in chain, on female Asmodians, which ensures I will never wear it).

I like some of those Elyos sets better than the Asmodian ones, but I like others better in Asmodian. I do wish I could find a page showing all armor sets that wasn't as annoying as that one page that's around for it. It's kind of slow and too segmented by individual armor set, instead of showing entire groups of armor at once.

My dreams are crushed. Cry

I'll still keep a set around. It's a great looking set of chain, and being purple, black, and silver just enhances the look.

I'm not trying to rally people together to make a guild, I'm just trying to be a guiding force to have everyone on one server. So if guilds break up or whatever, we have a larger common player pool.

I don't really think they pushed the creative boundary very much on the cloth, but at least it doesn't look like the "why am I taking any damage at all?!" quasi-plate nonsense of WoW

My legion will be playing on Azphel if that helps anyone corralling in any specific direction.