Beta Writeup: World of Warcraft [2: Margalis]

[schild]

Don't shoot the messenger.

[ahoythematey]

Decent writeup, Margalis.  Here's my take on the game:
While I would I would agree that WoW doesn't aim particularly high as far as innovation is concerned, I think what is currently there is ample foundation for some fantastic things in the future, as long as the live team follows through.  My play experience was limited to level 18, so I can't speak for most of the middle/endgame content, but it seemed to me that WoW had removed some of the "DING LEVEL UP YEAH WHOO" focus away from super items and carried it over to skills.  There are some nice random drops on occasion, but when I was looking forward to leveling up, it was typically because I wanted to train some particular skill, or return to some area that totally kicked my ass and try again.

The thing that sticks with me most, however, is I was rarely actually "trying" to level.  The significant majority of my playtime was spent focusing on trying to complete quests.  It was also spent spamming the duel option and watching that wonderful standard fall to the ground.  Similar to D2, WoW's PVP just plain grabbed my attention and refused to let go, even when I was horribly outclassed.  It was even cooler when I learned one night that some Alliance was trying to "raid" Undercity, and for the next half hour it seemed like all the level 10-through-20s were concentrated in that one spot, having fun regardless of the fact that no number of level 20s are going to survive past the city guards.

I actually enjoy the tradeskills.  I don't have to chalk up a hundred "Failure" messages for 3 "Success", and even better, on the rare occasion that I do "fail", no items are consumed in the process, only my time.

I also enjoyed the atmosphere of the game.  Regardless of how one feels about the technical quality of the graphics, I consider it a hard sell to say the game doesn't have a definite style about it's artwork and environment.  Particularly when you look at the instanced areas.

All in all, I think WoW is the best MMO-at-release, and I believe that once a good deal of the currently unimplemented stuff is in, it will be the best MMO.

That is, however, my opinion, and I am biased on the matter.

[Monika T'Sarn]

Most of the criticism here is about the low level game, and is not at all valid for the higher levels.
Equipment looks better at higher levels.
Item drops get more varied - you still have the random stat drop items, but you have items with special effects as well. Check thottbott.com for long lists of magic stuff.
Most of the high-end content requires groups, especially the instances. You can level to 60 alone, but to see all content and get the best equipment you need groups.

[Margalis]

Fair enough, which is why I put my level at the very top of my review.

I would say that playing Anarchy Online I saw a ton of item variety just fighting in the newbie junkyard, and at no point in either FFXI or AO (or hell, AC2 even) did I get armor that literally just changed the color of my skin. (And my boots showed up yay)

I don't really feel like suffering through low-level content to get to the fun part - I already have a job in real life. At some point the "you just aren't playing right" where right is "enough" excuse is going to get old. When I play a game I expect to have fun from the get go.

To be fair, I did have fun playing WoW. Just a very mild sort of fun. It was pleasant but there was nothing compelling about it either.
---

I would agree that the foundation for a much better game is there. In that respect, not doing anything horribly wrong makes a huge difference. (Case in point: FFXI is unfixable without redoing a lot of the classes. Every goup has to have a white mage, whereas nearly all the damage dealer classes are basically interchangeable.) Building on a solid foundation is great. However, I'm not going to project and review based on my expectations of the future. When the future arrives, hopefully it will kick ass. Until then, I'll review the game I'm being asked to pay for. I imagine that in 6-12 months WoW could be a really compelling and interesting game - right now it isn't in my eyes.

I didn't find myself actively trying to level, but I did find myself actively trying to kill 12 Harpies and 8 Super Harpies, which in my mind is 6 of one, a half dozen of the other. When I quit playing I had a mission that was to kill 60 (!) Quillboars. At that point I would rather just have a mission that was "go up a level." At least then I could choose what and where to fight.

[Soukyan]

When I play a game I expect to have fun from the get go.

Yes.

[Paelos]

I think it's fairly obvious by the review that you are carrying a torch for FFXI, which doesn't necessarily appeal to the same type of player that WoW would. That aside, you hit some points I agree with. You are right about money being the inhibitor over levels, I noticed that as well. You are right about the grouping aspect, but where you see that as a detractor, I see it as a triumph for the non-catass. You are also right about the character customization. Sorry Blizzard, but you missed the boat here and it shows; take some notes on the world of gaming around you next time.

The quest system is the strongest point of the game in my view, simply because the emphasis of skilling up is based on completing newer, harder quests. Also, the ability to see rewards up front and choose various items on completion goes a long way to satisfy my problems with quests in other games. It's certainly not "inspired" questing everytime, there is a lot of kill x mobs for y items. However, the epic quests are very cool, and some of the delivery quests are very neat. I had a quest once that started with my looting a talking severed head off a mob. That led me to finding his body at a nearby grave, and transporting the remains to a harder to reach area. It was a neat little feeling that drew me in.

Also, I liked the exploration aspects of the game that give you minor experience and show up on your overhead map. It plays well with that crowd. Tradeskills are pretty cool, easier than most to skill up, and not a pain in the ass. Fishing was a fun thing for me to do to pass the time when I was bored of slashing stuff.

The biggest problem of the game is the PvP issues that will arise with retail, and the community itself. Hopefully the Night Elves will catch most of the morons and contain the stupid, but I doubt it.

[Fargull]

Margalis,

Nice write up.  I experienced about the opposite of what you did.  I will easily admit though, that I really like the world design that blizzard has done with Warcraft.  I rarely get to play with sound anymore since I have to be mindful of my son and have an ear out for his needs when he is sleeping.  That has made me pay far more attention in games to the nuance of animation and graphics.  I am not looking for photo-realism, but more of color and character.  WOW provides color and character.  The one point I can see dragging me down though is the fact of the day-night cycle, since I will find myself spending to much time in the darkness.

Thanks for your input.

Fargull

[HaemishM]

My experiences in WoW do not reflect the same feelings, while my experiences in EQ2 could be summed up by your review. Perception is a bitch.

I thought the world of WoW felt incredibly immersive. The terrain felt very lush and real, as opposed to EQ2's coldly "photorealistic" approach. Maybe it was because I could run WoW with almost full options and shadows on without trouble and couldn't run EQ2 on wireframe without stuttering.

Despite agreeing with most of what you said about WoW, I still enjoyed the game. Perhaps it is the fact that I am not dependent on other players for the most part that made it fun for me, similar to City of Heroes. I felt the quests, while essentially boiling down to kill x or deliver y, were still fun, and I never lacked for something to do. Often, I found myself saying "Let me just get this quest done, then I'll log off" and then continuing on after that.

There is backstory to the world, and it's often told in the quests, at least for the Taurens.

[Signe]

I've also enjoyed playing WoW despite agreeing with some of the points made.  I found that even after my shiny new character was broken in a bit, the quests were better and my level of interest was increasing.  Starting a new game is always very fun for me.  I like all the sparkly newness and sorting out how to play.  Sometimes that and a good character creation is all the fun I have before I quit.  SoR was that way for me.  WoW is different...  it becomes more immersive and interesting the more I play.  I can usually tell within a couple of weeks or so if the game is going nowhere for me and I definitely don't get that feeling with this game.

The fact that you can solo in WoW is a huge plus for me.  I don't enjoy grouping much with strangers and I play odd times of the day.  When I do group, I find it to be a good experience overall.  I didn't make the same conclusions as you about grouping at all.   I found most of the grouping I did to be effective in achieving a particular goal and I've been in groups where we just roamed around, looking for trouble.  I've never had a problem finding a group if I wanted one or with the group breaking up prematurely.

I agree about the 24 hour clock.  It's not a major detraction but I would have definitely gone for something a bit shorter.  I also agree about tradeskills.  It's not awful, but definitely could use some tweaking.

I am surprised you didn't discuss the UI which, in my opinion, is dreadful.  Most of the windows can't be moved or resized.  You have to manually edit to add in things like quest fading and extra action bars.  Obviously even Blizzard agrees as they don't disallow the use of UI mofifying utilities.  Thank God.

I don't know how long WoW will last for a fickle person like me, but I'm convinced it'll take me past my usual 3 months or so.  Maybe even beyond the first expansion, though that's pushing it for me.

[Nebu]

Nice write-up.

I played beta fairly early on and tried again during the open beta period.  The thought that kept reappearing in my mind was: Why are there so many raving fanbois for this game?  Let me digress.

Solo-friendly:  I believe that all games should allow for solo play.  Yelling "LFG" for an hour is a sure fire way to lose subscribers despite what anyone at SOE would tell you.  Where I begin to struggle is when the game is so solo friendly that there is no reason to adventure as a team beyond a) fulfilling some quest_for_uber_sword or b) because you want to hang out with friends.  Give players a reason to establish social networks.  Give them adventuring rewards (i.e. improved experience, better drops) such that the assembly of a group is worth the trouble.

Graphics: I could let this slide as the graphics fulfilled their objectives.  They were a nice attempt to capture the Warcraft world while being simple enough to maintain fantastic performance.  The main issue I had was in the fact that there was little to no character customization.  It doesn't take photo realistic graphics to afford a large variance in characters.  I'd really like my character to look unique enough that I could turn the names off and only recognize people by appearance.  SWG did it, CoH did it...

Gameplay: I cant really put a finger on it, but the overpowered classes combined with the skill sets made this game seem too easy to be interesting.  The combat was light and enjoyable, but I never really felt challenged by an encounter.  This isn't to say that I didn't die on occasion, but I never felt any degree of urgency during combat... the kind where choosing the wrong tactic at a critical moment could cost the battle.  The game really feels like a console game to me... a game that is more a first-person game shared in a world with many.  I felt this to the point that I would have enjoyed WoW much more as a single player game than as an online mmog.  The comparison I've made in the past (while admittedly not the best) is that WoW is to mmog's what Diablo is to Morrowind.  Both Diablo and Morrowind are great games, they just attract people from different crowds for different reasons.  Personally, I'll take Morrowind.  This game lacks depth, it lacks challenge.  For WYSIWYG fun, WoW delivers... it doesn't attempt to be anything other than what it is and while I don't care for it, I respect their choice.  

The other part of gameplay that I find interesting is that the game is trying so hard to appeal to everyone that I fear it will become a paradox fo itself.  The low level game is fun and fast-paced.  There are many quests and interesting places to explore.  This gives way to the high end game that I fear will become the same raid_to_pwnz that we saw with EQ.  I'm not sure how Blizzard will retain the more casual folk while catering to the hardcore.  Sadly, I don't have much faith in their ability to release new content quickly.  As for PvP, I think it will become a frustrating nightmare once there are several max-level players from a few of the uber guilds.  They will monopolize the best areas and equip themselves with the best equipment.  With PvE being the standard by which the game was established, I have little hope that the PvP game will be more than something to dabble in when not actively raiding some 8 bazillion hp mob for the sword_of_leetness.

In summary, I agree with many of the points in Margalis's review.  As an mmog built to appeal to the masses and those new to the mmog genre, the game is simplified to the point that it will succeed.  For anyone wanting a richer and more social gaming experience, I don't see WoW doing more than entertaining them for a couple of months.  Maybe we're all jaded to the point that all we can expect from an mmog is to be entertained for a month or two... I still like to hope that someone will break the mold and give us a little more.

[sinij]

I hate lack of character and avatar customization – as of stress test you couldn’t even assign your stats so this results in level 50 warrior being functionally nearly identical to any other level 50 warrior in the game.

I hate game controls – you can’t easily bind keys to abilities and spells, you can’t easily move with just your mouse, it is pall possible but requires some in-depth file editing. Interface in WoW is severely lacking.

I love how travel in WoW done. I love that crafting in WoW is not really a grind.

[Krakrok]

If you want to live more on the edge take off some of your armor.

I ran into mobs that cast AEs (a dungeon by the dwarven Loch area) and powerful poison mobs (spiders mainly).

I don't really care about character customization so that wasn't all that important to me. The character isn't me.

Yes, the textures and for the most part the player poly counts suck ass. All of the textures are 256x256. And yes the capes are napkins. That being said, I like the style of the graphics.

The PvP is fucked until they fix the exploits (namely GEAR and invisible client side walls/terrain).

Leveling still sucks ass no matter how you cut it. I was starting to feel the grind at 14. Without quests giving out huge exp I wouldn't have made it past 10.

Solo friendly was good. Pickup groups formed to complete quests. Past that I don't care about grouping at all. And no I don't want to play a single player game; I like watching people make fucktards of themselves.

I really liked the tradeskills (mainly mining). This was mostly because of the abilities Find Treasure and Find Minerals. It was an additional "quest" I was always on the lookout for.

Oh and that video floating around where the 50 people "raid" stand around trying to kill the dragon for 10 minutes and then all get fried, looks in three words, boring as shit. I could have had 5 8v8 random PvP sessions in Guild Wars in the same amount of time.


If I do buy WoW I doubt I will ever level a character past 20 based on grindiness. So anyone claiming "OMG the fun is at high level" can go fuck themselves. Right now though I don't have any plans to buy it.

[AcidCat]

"The game is without character and flavor"

I couldn't disagree more. I know this kind of thing is hard to quantify, and relies on personal taste, but I think the game's main strength is its character, its atmosphere, its handcrafted feel. I also totally disagree about the characters, I think all the races are well done and have a ton of personality - in fact they are all so cool I'm having a hard time deciding on 2 or 3 to play for retail.

[sidereal]

The broad brush summary is that 'WoW doesn't do anything fantastically well, but manages to avoid doing anything horribly wrong'.  I agree with that sentiment 100%.  Where we differ is that you believe a game that doesn't do anything fantastically well isn't worthwhile, whereas I believe that a game that doesn't do anything horribly wrong is one of the best ever built.  The problem with MMORPGs in general is that they aim so high, they end up dicking up half the game.  WoW is an exercise in aiming medium and executing on it as well as possible.

That has two benefits.  One, you manage to avoid the ridiculous frustrations other games cause when they break, which (at least for me) more than make up for any joy I get those few times when their ambitious vision works out.  Two, it's much easier to build on.  Broken games by and large can't be fixed.    Shallow games can be improved.

[schild]

Sidereal, if we're going to look at it like that...the only game people should be playing is City of Heroes. They aimed higher than WoW and have added more depth to their game than most games add with retail expansions (more loot, more areas, more levels!!!). While playing EQ and all the other buggy unfun games that have come down the pipeline, it doesn't make me want to play an unbuggy version of them. I guess that's where I draw the line with WoW. They didn't even aim medium. They aimed low. Despite roots in an RTS, there is no player housing, no 'real' social interaction (the cantinas in SW:G still rule that roost), and no real reason to play. I don't really give a shit how big Onyxia is. She's still got 3 polygons for toes and is just a giant dragon stuck in a cave with a ho-jillion hitpoints.

[Paelos]

Yes I too see the road for improvement with WoW much easier to accomplish than with say, SWG. The difference is that the foundation of the game is rock solid, and really at launch that's all you need. If it takes three months to work in battlegrounds that's ok as long as you have some high level content for those hardcores to dick around with, like raids. Now the only thing they need to do is to avoid the Trials of Atlantis type downfall of complete PvE fuckups.

[Margalis]

I also agree with comments about the strong foundation. I feel like WoW needs some content patches, but not some fixes to some things fundamentally broken.

In a lot of ways I do think FFXI is bettter than WoW, but it has some severe problems that are nearly unfixable. I had some truly great times in FFXI (like running around in the Gusgen mines with a party full of idiots getting slowly bumped off by a never-ending horde of bloodthirsty undead) But the looking for group problems are severe and just get worse and worse, and are unfixable without a huge change to the game.

I love a lot of things about FFXI, but in the end I can't play it because I don't want to spend 80% of my time travelling and looking for groups.

What is in WoW is good overall, it just needs more stuff in my opinion. More enemy differentiation, more looks for items and equipment, some animation tweaks, etc etc.

[Rasix]

Despite it's overall Excell spreadsheet popularity, comparing something to FFXI isn't going to make people here take you seriously.  That game was one of the least enjoyable MMORPG experiences I've ever had.  Well done, but god, I think I had more fun in AC2 getting dragons caught on pixels.

Perhaps that's where even though I agree with many of your sentiments, I like the game.  It's almost done perfectly with regards to the casual player that solos a bit more than they group.  The seasoned MMORPGer that wants the hardcore grouping experience isn't going to get that until at least level 20 when you engage your first instance quests.

I think the item variety will mature.  These games can always be further itemized to provide more variety.  DAoC, EQ, and even to a point AC weren't exactly stellar with regard to item variety on launch.

The game changes somewhat I've heard at a higher level, but that won't likely ever be an issue for me.  I'm not joking when I think it'll probably take me half a year to hit max level and by then they should have a more complete pvp experience in place (one can hope).    

Friends just confirmed they're playing. So I'll be there.  I was considering going back to CoH, but most of the interesting stuff they've seemed to have added lately is for a level range I'll likely never get to in that game.

Edit: The true test for this game will be how much they get done during the first 3-6 months of release.  They quite simply just need to deliver on stuff they've promised but won't be able to deliver upon release day.

[HaemishM]

Sidereal, if we're going to look at it like that...the only game people should be playing is City of Heroes.

I agree with that sentiment.

[Viin]

I hate lack of character and avatar customization – as of stress test you couldn’t even assign your stats so this results in level 50 warrior being functionally nearly identical to any other level 50 warrior in the game.

Talents and equipment are meant to set you apart.

I hate game controls – you can’t easily bind keys to abilities and spells, you can’t easily move with just your mouse, it is pall possible but requires some in-depth file editing. Interface in WoW is severely lacking.

You can bind keys, but you are right, it would be nice to bind spells easierly. There's another thread going around about the interface and there are a few options to fix that.

As for moving around with just the mouse: all I do is hit MOUSE4 (autorun) and then hold the right mouse button down to turn my character.. seems pretty easy to me.

Edit: oh, and there's click to move (diablo style?). What else are you looking for?

I love how travel in WoW done. I love that crafting in WoW is not really a grind.

I agree with both of these. Just a note: some stuff has changed since stress test. Didn't get a chance to play the open beta?

[Resvrgam]

That game (FFXI) was one of the least enjoyable MMORPG experiences I've ever had.

I agree with Rasix.  FFXI was the most punishing, un-fun and downright frustrating game I had ever played (no wonder I despised LevelQuest 2: feels just like it…with higher polys).

It seems from your observations and comments that you’re just a different type of player who enjoys certain aspects of games that I find aggravating.  I found FFXI’s combat pathetic and their “emulation” (not a port) of a console game was giving me earth-shattering headaches when I tried to move in first-person (the scan lines were unbearable).

As far as customization goes: were we playing the same game here? Did “Chains of Promathia” add more options to FFXI’s PC avatars after I ditched the game?  If not: WoW’s character customization (or lack thereof) was no worse (and in some cases; actually had more options) than FFXI’s.

I also found it frustrating to try and play a forced-grouping game with the majority of the players (online during my playing hours) who either spoke horrible Engrish or hated the western world.  It’s kind of hard to type Japanese when you lack a keyboard that supports Kanji, Katabana or whatever the third alphabet containing 1600 characters is (Hiragana, I think?).   My Japanese is a little rusty and since this was clearly a Japanese game ported to the states/Europe as an afterthought with those cheesy macros with brief translations that just couldn’t break through the language barrier, I couldn't play enjoy it.

WoW also doesn’t “level down” and have random uber-mobs go aggro on you from across the map (effectively resetting your treadmill every now and then and completely making a few hours of gaming meaningless as you start over again).  My biggest gripe with these types of games was addressed and remedied in WoW: the zones.  It makes exploration a chore and really took me out of the world when I entered new places only to watch loading screens.  With the streaming technology, I never really get upset when I need to trek to a different destination.

I’m not a Blizzard fanboy by any stretch of the imagination and, for those who know me, know I have a pretty good reason to hate this company.   But, I actually enjoy WoW and it will be the first MMOG I’ll be playing beyond the free 30-day trial (if it gets boring in the “end game” I cancel it…plain and simple, but I’ll enjoy it up until then).  Despite WoW’s shortcomings, they seem like less of a punishment to customers over other games’ flaws.

All in all, there were a lot of great points you made in your write-up and I respect your points of view, I just happen to have a few views that differ in some regards.   Thanks for the write-up.

[geldonyetich]

Personally, I liked Final Fantasy XI.  

However, it should be made clear, it was an EQ-Alike, and one hampered by an awkward console-based interface.  FFXI didn't innovate all that much in terms of trying to find new and interesting ways that the MMORPG genre could go.   Instead, it took EQ, and it endeavored to improve upon it.

Once you get past the GUI hurdle, you'll find that improve EQ FFXI did indeed.   The Renkai system as well as the general well-balancedness of the game made it so that fighting mobs actually required some level of active thinking.   This is an achievement that many EQ clones fail to reach.    The trade skill system worked quite well and tied into a very active economy that established a real sense of value between players via the auction house.   The cutscenes on the quests/missions as well as good ol' Squaresoft craftsmanship really bought the game alive.

I had resubbed to FFXI not too long ago and kept playing it for a considerable amount of time between last Summer Quarter and this Fall Quarter.   When I canceled it, my reasons where mostly financial.   I can't afford to subscribe to more than 1 MMOG at a time, and I wanted to try out Planetside's BFRs.  Then, after I got bored of Planetside's BFRs (before I actually managed to earn the 10 cavern hacks to get my own, yet), I gave City of Heroes another spin.  

Now, with a World of Warcraft obligation looming near, that's where my single MMOG financial commitment is going.    Personally, I heavily suspect that EQ2 will beat out WoW in terms of long term playability, but a friend of mine is playing WoW, so that is that.   I suspect that, much like City of Heroes, World of Warcraft is going to be a good game, but not so good of a MMORPG due to lack of compelling feeling of purpose within the game mechanic, mostly due to their passing over on social emphesis.    However, time will tell if I'm wrong here.   I hear that, post level 15ish or so, WoW actually gets to be quite socially dependant.   Of course, I've already elaborated at length about that.

[MrHat]

I also enjoyed FFXI quite a bit.

I thought that the combat was fun, the enemies were varied, and that economy was one of the best I'd ever seen.  You could actually be a trader if you wanted, buying low in one area, and selling high in another.

But it wasn't money that was the problem (apparently that's growing on trees), it was the aforementioned 80% of time travelling/looking for groups.

[Venkman]

I love when new games launch. It's amazing how different people can feel about them.

I've already decided I'm going WoW, but not because EQ2 sucks. It's mostly because WoW doesn't piss me off like EQ2 did, and that's it. Even comparing then is tough, really, because they are shades of the same game system. EQ2 offers more compulsion to group and guild. WoW is just straight up more fun and casual.

I disagree with WoW being for Soloer's though. The game simply eases players into groups slower than EQ2 does. By the late teens for some classes and the mid-20s for the rest, you'll be grouping, either for quest situations or for raids.

The player cultures are also different. Half of WoW's 40 open beta servers were marked PvP+. That alone is quite telling, though I imagine this is indicative of Blizzard's appeal. All of their other games perpetuate for their PvP aspects.

There is backstory to the world, and it's often told in the quests, at least for the Taurens.

This is true of all the races I experienced (oddly, all except Taurens...). Between the quest micro-stories, the random NPC dialog, and the interactive books scattered around the world, I was pleasantly surprised by the amount of depth there was in WoW. EQ2 had all that already, though I expected it. Even Undead have a compelling back- and ongoing story. Any game that makes Orcs appear honorable but misunderstood is doing something right in my book.

– as of stress test you couldn’t even assign your stats so this results in level 50 warrior being functionally nearly identical to any other level 50 warrior in the game.

Talents came a bit later, but have been the primary means of character customization (not look though, which I agree is lacking).

[Righ]

WoW is certainly nothing revolutionary, nor does it even attempt to significantly evolve. It's more fun at the outset than most in its genre, EQ2 included, and it is short of serious flaws. From what I have seen this year, that is about as good a deal we can expect from an MMOG at present.

Where I significantly disagree with the review is in the conclusion. I did find moments in the game that I was impressed at some of the cool and clever flourishes. The dwarven artillery on Kharanos road were funny, the town of Thunder Bluff with its elevators was very cool. I also feel that a decent but unremarkable game is better value than an occassionaly brilliant, but as equally ugly game. For that I have SWG.

[Hanzii]

WoW is nice. Not amazing, just... nice.

I completely6 disagree with you on the lack of backstory and character to the world - I really like to go exploring in hard to survive zones, just to enjoy the scenery. Travelling to the other continent at level 10 was a great achievement - useless way to spend an evening xp-wise, but fun, because there was stuff to look at.
The backstory is there for those interested - just play all those other games with Warcraft in the title. Actually I'd say there's more backstory than in EQ or EQ2. Not that I'm enough of a roleplayer to care.

I agree completely with your views on the looks of characters. It's a great shame that all look so much a like... at least give my Warlock a demon in a different colour and a decent cape instead of that freakin' napkin.

I like that I don't need other people to play. I hope that the there will be some reason to group, but it's probably enough for me, that there's a social reason. I allready have several rl friends joining this game, so I don't really need to be forced to group with strangers.

I hate hate hate the day/night cycle. I agree completely. Winter is coming here... it's allready prettu dark, cold and grim most of the day here, don't fucking force me to play a game where it's dark all the fucking time. It's depressing.

My conclusion is, that as long as the quests are coming and I enjoy the scenery and the new things to whack, I don't feel like I'm grinding and just enjoy playing - the minute it feels like a grind, I'll quit... or the minute I feel like shooting myself because of the perpetual night.

[Venkman]

Travelling to the other continent at level 10 was a great achievement - useless way to spend an evening xp-wise, but fun, because there was stuff to look at

I totally agree. I would further say that being able to do this at level 10 at all is a nice way to ensure all of your friends don't need to start as the same race. My guild has Humans, Dwarves, and Night Elves. The first two are just a free tram ride apart. The third is clear across the world. In beta I did the run to assess the difficulty. Except for one death (my Voidwalker couldn't hold alligator aggro), it was just heart-pounding, but not impossible.

I liked it because I haven't been that concerned about travelling for a very long time in these games. Not since EQlive Kithicor Forest and Dreadlands. I was, of course, a niave newb for a long time prior to trying these zones. I just kept hearing how bad-ass they were, and believed it. Plus, Kithicor is spooky as heck, even with low end graphics.

EQ2 has some nice zones for spookiness too. I liked Down Below/Vermin Snye (same basic design, different levels), Peat Bog, Stormhold, and Thundering Steppes. SOE still proves they know how to make stuff look good, evil, safe, or spooky. The combination of sounds and imagery is really very well done.

WoW does as well. Blizzard proved to me that seamless landscapes don't need to be bland and repetitive. Undercity freaks me out, as does the run to Menethiel Harbor. The Bat/Gryphon flights show me lands that make me glad ground-archers aren't take pot shots at low-flying mass transit. Kudos to their team for pulling this off in a Warcraft 3 era engine.

As long as I can explore, it's all good. When I can actually get that same heart-pounding feeling of taking a chance in a place I otherwise have never been, and which looks and sound dangerous, that's even better.

[HaemishM]

EQ2 has some nice zones for spookiness too. I liked Down Below/Vermin Snye (same basic design, different levels), Peat Bog, Stormhold, and Thundering Steppes. SOE still proves they know how to make stuff look good, evil, safe, or spooky. The combination of sounds and imagery is really very well done.

See, that I don't get. I thought Down Below and Peat Bog were both some of the most lackluster, shitty zones ever designed. I had more fun in DAoC dungeons at release. Peat Bog especially was just a badly done "here's a place to bash bags of xp" zone.

[doubleplus]

"The sweet is never as sweet without the sour." I'd rather see something with a larger roller coaster ride, or at the very least SOMETHING incredibly well done. Is it evolutionary when everything boils down to "eh"?

[WindupAtheist]

All I've played is UO, which I've liked a lot, but is getting old.  Should I move on to WoW, SWG, or EQ2?  Keep in mind that I think required grouping = teh sux, and I consider things like being able to sit in the chairs important.

[HaemishM]

You can sit in chairs in WoW. I think you can in EQ2, but I never tried.

SWG is supposed to be the most UO like. Except with wookie hair dressers or something. WoW and EQ2 are both EQ version 1.5.

[Samwise]

SWG also has chairs you can sit in.  Mind you, you'll frequently slide out of the chairs and mysteriously be sitting in midair.

[Samprimary]

I'm thinking at this point that there is a huge disparity in the appropriate application of character style and game background, between the different races. Some of the races seem cobbled together, others seem to have been given sufficient care, story, and good visual distinction.

Playing as a Tauren works, so far. They have the sense of 'community' that other races apparently lack. I guess that Blizzard spared with the pretense and very overtly styled them in a cultural imitation of the North American Indian, in an intriguing way - some sort of hybrid combination between Plains/Great Basin Indians and the Northern coastal indians. Who knows, if RP actually works, we may see some Potlatches. So, a lot more thought and design distinction went into the creation of items. First race yet that seems as well tailored to leatherwearing as it could be to the gothic armoring. No clothing seems inappropriate or lame yet - I mean, they are nomadic tribesmen.

So, quality and mileage may vary by race. I think that Tauren are winners, so far - any distinct losers? Gnomes, maybe?

[Lurk]

Personally, I love the graphics and the animations. From what I saw the game bleeds tender loving care. Both my level nine open beta characters went through two or three different looks. The sound effects are fine. The camera rotates around the character and can be set to first person. You can actually remap the keyboard! Enemies are at least as varied and interesting as any other MMORPG I've played, and I've played a lot. DAoC was a game with utility first in mind, WoW feels like the complete opposite - bland is the last word I would choose. Every race has a backstory, which you can find out about on the website, in the intro movies for each race, and in game through quests and other means. The NPCs have lots of flavor. Have you seen the crazy cat lady near the human starting area? You can buy a cat pet from her, which serve no purpose at all except to add flavor to your character and to the world. There are about a dozen other choices if you don't like cats. How about the goblin sachel charges that do almost as much damage to you as they do to anyone else. Exploding sheep? Mechanical chickens? There are quests that go far beyond kill x of y, even at low levels. I was collecting items in dangerous territory, exploring small dungeons (and getting experience for the exploration as well as for the quest), and smoothing over relations between feuding farmers. WoW has more "oh cool" moments than most other MMORPGs put together, and that's just in the few hours that I fucked around with it in open beta. The one thing Wow has done best is feel. More character and flavor than any MMORPG since EQ.

But, that's just my opinion, based on playing the open beta for a few hours. It's not like my opinion means much, I mean I never got above level nine, never did tradeskills, never PvPed, never did instances, never even took a gryphon ride.

Oh yeah, the original "review" is a total joke.

[MrHat]

Personally, I love the graphics and the animations. From what I saw the game bleeds tender loving care. Both my level nine open beta characters went through two or three different looks. The sound effects are fine. The camera rotates around the character and can be set to first person. You can actually remap the keyboard! Enemies are at least as varied and interesting as any other MMORPG I've played, and I've played a lot. DAoC was a game with utility first in mind, WoW feels like the complete opposite - bland is the last word I would choose. Every race has a backstory, which you can find out about on the website, in the intro movies for each race, and in game through quests and other means. The NPCs have lots of flavor. Have you seen the crazy cat lady near the human starting area? You can buy a cat pet from her, which serve no purpose at all except to add flavor to your character and to the world. There are about a dozen other choices if you don't like cats. How about the goblin sachel charges that do almost as much damage to you as they do to anyone else. Exploding sheep? Mechanical chickens? There are quests that go far beyond kill x of y, even at low levels. I was collecting items in dangerous territory, exploring small dungeons (and getting experience for the exploration as well as for the quest), and smoothing over relations between feuding farmers. WoW has more "oh cool" moments than most other MMORPGs put together, and that's just in the few hours that I fucked around with it in open beta. The one thing Wow has done best is feel. More character and flavor than any MMORPG since EQ.

But, that's just my opinion, based on playing the open beta for a few hours. It's not like my opinion means much, I mean I never got above level nine, never did tradeskills, never PvPed, never did instances, never even took a gryphon ride.

Oh yeah, the original "review" is a total joke.

Ah yes, the Human Quests always were the best.  Make an orc and you won't have nearly as much flavor.