SWTOR

[Velorath]

I think if there were going to be Day 1 DLC releases, they likely would have been included in the Collector's Edition at least.

[Lakov_Sanite]

I think if there were going to be Day 1 DLC releases, they likely would have been included in the Collector's Edition at least.

Collector's edition IS the day 1 DLC or do you not understand that people are paying $20+ for digital shinies?

[Amaron]

Overall I think raising the sub fee to $16+ would probably do more damage to long-term sub rates than paid DLC. $20 a month is $20 a month; you don't have to buy DLC.

Oh there will be DLC but the "lol companion as prelude to raid gear cash shop" conspiracies are ridiculous.   EA suits probably barely comprehend the difference between sparkle ponies and pay2win.   If competitive advantage items make their way into the game it's going to be because the designers themselves thought it was a good idea and pitched it.

[Stabs]

The history of paid downloadable content is a history of one way traffic with occasional bumps in the road. The horse barding in Obsidian, adventure packs in EQ2, the $10 horse in Runes of Magic, the Sparkle Pony in WoW and most recently monocles in Eve were all genuine problems at the time for the games companies. However each battle has seen some players capitulate and any internal dialogue must be shaped by "some players hate it for a while, once that settles it's free bonus extra money for sod all work".

And there are just as many, if not more, cash shop items that have slipped in with scarcely a murmur from the affected players. Experience potions are pay to win if leveling is the game (for most players it isn't), PLEX in Eve is totally pay to win and most players consider it to improve the game.

Also every battle that is won in any game wins it for every game. Sparkle ponies? The purists have fought that battle and lost. PLEX? The purists have fought that battle and lost. As long as you make it clear that your cash shop stuff is non-contentious standard fare not ground-breaking innovation people will swallow it.

Does anyone seriously think SWTOR players would object to purchased experience potions in a large way? They're in every MMO that has levels now except WoW and WoW has triple exp recruit-an-alt. If a vigorous and expansive cash shop is not doing a roaring trade in SWTOR by the end of its first year I'd be astonished. This stuff isn't contentious, it's normal now.

[Amaron]

How astonished?  Can we get a promise that you'll eat your shorts or something when it turns out the only thing they have in a year is harmless sparkle ponies and the like?

[apocrypha]

Make it interesting, turn it into a wager. If there stabs is wrong he eats his shorts. If he's right YOU eat his shorts. 

[Margalis]

Gamasutra recently ran a piece by I think EA the point of which was selling power makes players mad but it still makes money and the angry players keep playing and paying despite their protests.

[Merusk]

The EA Presentation on slideshare about Company of Heroes that was linked 2x already (Here's #3) made the same point.  In fact, while forum posters will bitch to high heaven and back, they'll also shell out more than 10x the average per user.  So they're hypocrites or simply junkies knowing they're about to be offered a fix they can't resist.

I fully expect it.  I know it's going to be the wave of the future.  I also know that as soon as it becomes mandatory to achieve or the game is as grindy as the F2P games without the xp and  healing potions I'm done with the genre.  The question is how far away is that date.

[Threash]

People are currently paying almost as much for a permanent gun as a full game costs in APB, and that game is in beta and not very popular.

[Kirth]

The EA Presentation on slideshare about Company of Heroes that was linked 2x already (Here's #3) made the same point.  In fact, while forum posters will bitch to high heaven and back, they'll also shell out more than 10x the average per user.  So they're hypocrites or simply junkies knowing they're about to be offered a fix they can't resist.

Favorite slide from that presentation: 78% of players don't use the forums, 20% never post and only 2% post.

[Murgos]

We always sort of knew that listening to people on forums was a waste of time.   

[SnakeCharmer]

So in other news...  Bat Country.  PvP or PvE server?

[Malakili]

So in other news...  Bat Country.  PvP or PvE server?

It says RP server on the guild page.

The EA Presentation on slideshare about Company of Heroes that was linked 2x already (Here's #3) made the same point.  In fact, while forum posters will bitch to high heaven and back, they'll also shell out more than 10x the average per user.  So they're hypocrites or simply junkies knowing they're about to be offered a fix they can't resist.

Favorite slide from that presentation: 78% of players don't use the forums, 20% never post and only 2% post.

Yep.  I think thats the sort of thing that divides people from making game a hobby and just gaming cause they like playing games.   The difference is being willing to put in time aside from the actual doing of the thing (speaking generally about hobbies).   For example, I watch sports, but I don't really spend time outside of the actual sports watching doing anything with it (maybe once in a while I poke my head into the sports forum here).  The (obvious) thing being that the hobbyists are the most devoted to your game in the first place, so you actually have to do the least to keep them doing it.

[SnakeCharmer]

So in other news...  Bat Country.  PvP or PvE server?

It says RP server on the guild page.

No shit, Sherlock.  Dont be so obtuse.

[eldaec]

RP PvE seemed to be the consensus.

[eldaec]

How astonished?  Can we get a promise that you'll eat your shorts or something when it turns out the only thing they have in a year is harmless sparkle ponies and the like?

In the end we'll still be having this argument because by the time a year is up even age of innocence games such as EQ would have released an expansion, which is not qualitatively different to Warden's Keep in the sense that they both sell themselves by offering gear and levels, but justify it with a content wrapper.

In the end the balance between content and power is a matter of degree, but I would be amazed if EA don't try to push the envelope on this. Especially given how well it has worked for them on other games.

[Malakili]

Bioware says SWTOR will be running in 2025 - with 500 planets!

No, serously.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/07/25/bioware-swtor-will-still-be-going-in-2025/

“We want to add dozens of worlds. Hundreds of worlds eventually. In 2025, we’ll hopefully have 500 worlds.”

[Merusk]

RP PvE seemed to be the consensus.

Yes.  Because any meaningful PVP is going to be in instanced spaces and open world pvp will just be "gank the lowbies" -  which is most likely to be us.

[Malakili]

So in other news...  Bat Country.  PvP or PvE server?

It says RP server on the guild page.

No shit, Sherlock.  Dont be so obtuse.

Sorry I wasn't aware there were RP PvP and RP PvE servers.

[Rendakor]

So in other news...  Bat Country.  PvP or PvE server?

It says RP server on the guild page.

No shit, Sherlock.  Dont be so obtuse.

RP implies PVE, RP PVP servers are designated separately (if they even exist in SWTOR).

[tmp]

“We want to add dozens of worlds. Hundreds of worlds eventually. In 2025, we’ll hopefully have 500 worlds.”

That'd mean roughly two planets made every month.

needs a bigger

[jakonovski]

I predict that SWOTR will be a game that will always be the best game ever, once they sort out the problems, in two years time, honest.

[Reg]

I thought your incredibly knowledgeable Finnish buddies told you that EA was sending SWTOR to die and just taking advantage of the hype? You aren't doubting your incredibly knowledgeable Finnish buddies are you?

[jakonovski]

I thought your incredibly knowledgeable Finnish buddies told you that EA was sending SWTOR to die and just taking advantage of the hype? You aren't doubting your incredibly knowledgeable Finnish buddies are you?

No, that was the cynical people at RPS.

[SnakeCharmer]

So in other news...  Bat Country.  PvP or PvE server?

It says RP server on the guild page.

No shit, Sherlock.  Dont be so obtuse.

RP implies PVE, RP PVP servers are designated separately (if they even exist in SWTOR).

No the hell it doesn't.  Every MMO in the last several years has PvP, PvE, RP-PvP and RP-PvE.  WoW, EQ2, AoC, Rift, Aion...

[Paelos]

There's PvP servers? What the hell is the point of that in a story game?

[Malakili]

There's PvP servers? What the hell is the point of that in a story game?

Because if they don't have them they would hear all manner of hell from the people who think they fun of the game will be pwning newb jedi.

[SnakeCharmer]

/neckbeard swtor fan
see, there's a treaty, but it's a tenuous one.  there are, occasionally skirmishes that break out from time to time, but in so far have been ONLY skirmishes and not full out war.
/unneckbeard swtor fan

I need a bath.

[Merusk]

You're thinking too hard.  Just pull a page from the WoW-must-be-open-pvp-folks who were around in 2004.

"There's WAR in the title, duh, noob."

[Reg]

I thought your incredibly knowledgeable Finnish buddies told you that EA was sending SWTOR to die and just taking advantage of the hype? You aren't doubting your incredibly knowledgeable Finnish buddies are you?

No, that was the cynical people at RPS.

Ah that's right. Your incredibly knowledgeable Finnish buddies were the first to put you on to the well known fact that when you get in to the early launch depends on the quality of your preorder purchase. I bet they all had to download 150 gig to play in the beta too.

[Paelos]

I don't want to be on the pvp server. It doesn't sound like the point of this game at all.

[Rasix]

The design of the game makes me want to be bothered by people even less.  Killing me or failing to kill me counts as bothering me.

[Malakili]

The design of the game makes me want to be bothered by people even less.  Killing me or failing to kill me counts as bothering me.

PvE servers are superior just because you get to choose in my opinion.  I leveled a character on my RP server in WoW a few years back, just flagged the whole the time just to see what it would be like.  Obviously not as much PvP as people would find on a PvP server for what are obvious reasons, but it seems like it lets the people who want to flag flag, and the rest can go about their business without the bother, as you say.   Sure, I got "bluewalled" a few times, but no big thing.  People say they want PvP servers because they like the tension of possibly being attacked at any given time, but I suspect most people like attacking more than being attacked, especially when you can get the former experience on a PvE server just as easily by choosing to flag yourself.

[eldaec]

As others have basically said, if the game was fundamentally built around PvP, then fine, but its not and I don't need it getting in my way.

[Stabs]

PvE servers are superior just because you get to choose in my opinion. 

But that's just it - some people want non-consensual pvp.

Not me, I'm with the crowd in thinking getting ganked while playing a choose-my-own adventure would not improve the experience. But seeing as how this is structurally the same game we've seen in WoW, AoC, Conan and Rift I don't see how anyone can be surprised they've have pvp and pve servers and that some players prefer one over the other.