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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  Warhammer Online  |  Bat Country (Moderator: tazelbain)  |  Topic: Ironbreaker builds 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: Ironbreaker builds  (Read 10023 times)
Oz
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on: October 01, 2008, 08:38:46 AM

so i can't access any build sites while at work, so i'll get the opinion of those here.

What are thoughts on what does and does not work for ironbreaker builds.

Was thinking of going heavily in path of stone, with a little path of brotherhood.

any thoughts?
Righ
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Teaching the world Google-fu one broken dream at a time.


Reply #1 on: October 02, 2008, 08:45:10 AM

What is your primary play focus? Solo PvE, group PvE, solo RvR or group RvR?

Path of Stone has a couple of wildly good things in it, but they're fairly high up - Shield Mastery and Oathstone. Oathbound is also strong and worth it if you regularly put yourself in the line of fire to be a focused target. Along the way, you'd certainly want Oath of Vengeance and Furious Reprisal. Avenging The Debt is weak, and I would skip it. That leaves you seven points for Runic Shield and Avalanche in Brotherhood, which are good against casters. I can't see a reason to lose anything in Stone for the three more points needed for Punishing Knock - I'm assuming anybody that wants to build a control tank would use a Vengeance/Brotherhood hybrid.

The camera adds a thousand barrels. - Steven Colbert
Phunked
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Reply #2 on: October 02, 2008, 08:57:40 AM

Until you're level capped, I don't see a point in going anything but vengeance.

2H solo grinding is much faster, you can still tank perfectly well and the massive burst is just amazing for PvP.

Stone, and tanking in general, is useless until they fix the window dragging teleport exploit.
Righ
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Teaching the world Google-fu one broken dream at a time.


Reply #3 on: October 02, 2008, 09:19:24 AM

If all you want to do is grind to 40, then you should spec vengeance from the off, pick up a 2h axe and never change - although taking the final morale 4 ability would be a waste, even with that single-minded focus. If you want to learn the mechanics of the three paths, you should respec and respec often.

Although window dragging is a pain, and detracts from some of the tank's abilities, your conclusion is absurd. Stone, Brotherhood and tanking in general still have their uses in keep defenses.

The camera adds a thousand barrels. - Steven Colbert
Zetor
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WWW
Reply #4 on: October 02, 2008, 11:54:04 AM

The 'cookie cutter' builds seem to be 8/0/10-based, with 7 points left over. This way you pick up
- Vengeance line: Powered Etchings. Yes, it's worth dumping 8 points into the tree to get it, it's just that good. Works with a 1h too.
- Brotherhood line: Avalanche [ DRILLING AND MANLINESS for flag running combined with hold the line], Runic Shield (optional, but eh, it's only one point), Punishing Knock [vital].

You can either spend those 7 points on going deeper into veng, picking up greataxe mastery, cave-in, and ancestor's fury OR go 6 into stone for Oathbound OR go 11/0/13 with Earthshatter (also crucial), and get cave-in / ancestor's fury in veng (but not greataxe mastery). The latest option seems to be the most popular of them all atm.

When leveling, you should probably dump everything into veng until Powered Etchings, then go up the brotherhood line.. that's what I'm doing, anyway.


-- Z.

Phunked
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Reply #5 on: October 03, 2008, 06:20:46 AM

If all you want to do is grind to 40, then you should spec vengeance from the off, pick up a 2h axe and never change - although taking the final morale 4 ability would be a waste, even with that single-minded focus. If you want to learn the mechanics of the three paths, you should respec and respec often.

Although window dragging is a pain, and detracts from some of the tank's abilities, your conclusion is absurd. Stone, Brotherhood and tanking in general still have their uses in keep defenses.

Err... learn the mechanics of the three paths?

Sure I guess if you want to see what each ability looks like, you should try it once or so. But the notion that this game is somehow complicated enough to require lots of experimentation to learn is completely unjustified. If you've ever played any other MMO with PvP, you should have an intuitive idea of how the stuff works.  It isn't hard to tell that adding aoe knockback and snare to an ability that you'll use every cooldown is pretty  DRILLING AND MANLINESS

I'm not saying you should grind to 40 with vengeance and never look back, I'm saying that vengeance is one of the more useful trees with the current role of the IB and PvP in general, especially in scenarios. I never said that tanking PvE mobs was useless or that you shouldn't spec for it, but tanking PvP players is difficult, because I get skillported through every match. And yes, the same goes for keep defense.

Vengeance can turn you into a pseudo MDPS class, and turn your MDPS oathfriend into a killing machine for eating up healers and squishies in the backline. Stone on the other hand (which I've also tried) is very handy for not dying, but suffers from the "we'll ignore you and your oath buddy faster than you can switch it" and "we can let you run around our backline all you want, you'll never do any damage"
rk47
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Reply #6 on: October 03, 2008, 08:16:00 AM

Leave the mass crowd control to swordmasters with their 30ft Knockback tactics every 10 second while you concentrate on single target CC & Damage. I personally feel this is how Mythic wants Elf & Dwarf tank to play in RvR.

Colonel Sanders is back in my wallet
Righ
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Teaching the world Google-fu one broken dream at a time.


Reply #7 on: October 03, 2008, 08:56:02 AM

Err... learn the mechanics of the three paths?

Sure I guess if you want to see what each ability looks like, you should try it once or so. But the notion that this game is somehow complicated enough to require lots of experimentation to learn is completely unjustified. If you've ever played any other MMO with PvP, you should have an intuitive idea of how the stuff works.

I'm obviously not as good at games as you are. Even though its pretty apparent what things do, I have to actually try them out and 'rehearse' to become adept at using them quickly and instinctively.

As for tanking not being worthwhile in PvP, I'm not finding 100% of players to scroll-warp through me. Probably closer to 2-3%, which makes tanking the rest of them on keep stairs a valuable defense asset. Some people warp through, others jump to find gaps, but the bulk of them are right there in front of the line of tanks getting wasted.

The camera adds a thousand barrels. - Steven Colbert
Phunked
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Reply #8 on: October 03, 2008, 11:10:03 AM

I happen to notice that the stuff conforms pretty closely to the abilities I was using in WoW (on multiple characters, not a direct port from warrior to IB for example), which I've spent hundreds of hours using at high end arena levels, so I suppose my experience is atypical. I do admit that it took me a bit to figure out reasonable rotations for some of the stuff but once you get all the core career stuff (around level ~16 or so), the other stuff is just situational.

As for the warping through, my major issue is not even so much that, but the fact that a well timed knockback can totally negate your tanking. I do this myself to other tanks, but with how easy it is to use (30 grudge 15 sec cooldown), you can be made useless by a single chosen.

Which I guess is how they wanted it, otherwise you'd just have rock-em-sock-em robots between tanks all day.
Oz
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Reply #9 on: October 03, 2008, 11:17:32 AM

I focus on group RvR.  currently i tend to act as the pain in teh ass on the field.  Put my fat ass between mdps and our casters/healers.  snare them so the squishies can run away.  Kill healers and casters on the destruction side, make liberal use of shield bash to knock down casters and prevent them from casting.  I've actually not used a 2hander a single time so far...weird, i know.  So far i tend to be top 1 or 2 on both number of kills and damage in scenarios, but i also know its only T2...so maybe i'm doing something right for now.
rk47
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Reply #10 on: October 04, 2008, 04:22:34 AM

Anyways does anyone know if knockbacks can be blocked/parried? if that is the case then Hold the Line! Might have some value for what it's titled.

Colonel Sanders is back in my wallet
Phunked
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Posts: 249


Reply #11 on: October 05, 2008, 10:01:20 AM

They can be both parried and blocked. However I do not believe you can parry or block  from behind, as my knockbacks on squishes are almost always effective (and I hit from the ass).

Hold the Line is great if you can get everyone behind you and the enemy hitting you and just you. Usually though, a single skilled sorc pairing on the other team will blow you up before you get everyone in place, or an enemy tank will smack you away. That and you usually have to burn juggernaut  to even get to the front like that (otherwise, have fun sitting in a root for 10 sec) as well as HtL, which are both lengthy cooldowns.
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