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Author Topic: Dr. Who  (Read 624507 times)
Ironwood
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Reply #1085 on: September 13, 2012, 02:53:45 AM

He gave Solon every chance.  That bastard was MENTAL.

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Signe
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Muse.


Reply #1086 on: September 15, 2012, 01:37:09 PM


My Sig Image: hath rid itself of this mortal coil.
Khaldun
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Reply #1087 on: September 15, 2012, 07:55:06 PM

Ok, so

Tale
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Reply #1088 on: September 29, 2012, 01:03:06 AM

Advance spoiler from the Dr Who twitter account:

Khaldun
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Reply #1089 on: September 30, 2012, 05:16:57 PM

I thought that was a pretty bad episode, and I've liked the others this season. I had a higher resistance to Moffat's tropes than some but they're becoming really obnoxious and a serious impediment to good storytelling. He's just fucking lucky that he has about the best actor to play the main character in the entire history of the show or things would be much worse.
Evildrider
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Reply #1090 on: September 30, 2012, 08:00:42 PM

I really liked Eccleston, I wish he would have done another season or two.
Ironwood
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Reply #1091 on: October 01, 2012, 01:21:55 AM

Yeah, but he had to go off and be fucking awful in GI Joe.  Priorities, man.

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Surlyboi
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Reply #1092 on: October 01, 2012, 03:08:17 PM

Tennant was still better.

Tuned in, immediately get to watch cringey Ubisoft talking head offering her deepest sympathies to the families impacted by the Orlando shooting while flanked by a man in a giraffe suit and some sort of "horrifically garish neon costumes through the ages" exhibit or something.  We need to stop this fucking planet right now and sort some shit out. -Kail
Tale
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Reply #1093 on: October 01, 2012, 08:57:34 PM

I can't get past the increasing, boring, self-celebratory campness. Potentially exciting plot points are ever more layered in waffle about how marvellous the Doctor and Britishness are.

I'd love an actual sci-fi story, like those delivered in the Rose Tyler and Martha Jones eras despite the pantomime stuff.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2012, 09:06:03 PM by Tale »
apocrypha
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Reply #1094 on: October 01, 2012, 11:59:57 PM

Yeah this episode was shite. The story made no sense, was full of loose ends and had no impact. The previous episodes in this series were far better, not having been written by Steven "Shitehawk" Moffat.


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Ubvman
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Reply #1095 on: October 02, 2012, 03:11:12 AM

Yeah this episode was shite. The story made no sense, was full of loose ends and had no impact. The previous episodes in this series were far better, not having been written by Steven "Shitehawk" Moffat.


I didn't hate it that much but I found it a bit silly. The time travel "rules" do not seem to have been well thought out and everyone seems to have completely lost their minds in the end.



Evildrider
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Reply #1096 on: October 02, 2012, 03:40:29 AM

Sir T
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Reply #1097 on: October 02, 2012, 05:34:54 AM

The Eccleson Doctor pretty much killed someone in the second episode by transporting Cassandra back to the room after she beamed out, but without her flunkies that were moisturizing her, then basically sat there and watched as she shriveled up and popped. "Doctor Who?" was a throwaway gag line in the first episode as well, but was not used again.

And Eccleson rocked as the Doctor. I really wish he had done another season.

I have to admit I haven't watched this doctor at all. I know its petty but I cannot get past how this guy looks and the big floppy hairstyle.

Oh and as for the Daleks I remember watching "Dalek" and going "Holy shit. No wonder the Doctor is shit scared of this thing" It was literally like a tank. Sadly no episode since has captured the sheer menace of that episode.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2012, 05:49:17 AM by Sir T »

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Sky
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Reply #1098 on: October 02, 2012, 07:22:13 AM

I don't really post in here because I like the new Doctor (my second favorite after the 1st) and didn't like the last two, so I'm in the minority (hated Eccleston completely). But yeah, that was a pretty throwaway ending to the Ponds, who I really enjoyed. And the episode started out really well, I like the statue enemies quite a bit, so creepy. But then they just kind of threw away the opening plot entirely and went off the rails.
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Reply #1099 on: October 02, 2012, 08:48:22 AM

I'm about a season behind. With Davies and Tenant, this was at the top of our queue, but we generally find the series unwatchable since Moffat took over and the current cast arrived. Loathed the Ponds, hate River Song and not big on Matt Smith. Mostly though, it's the writing. There have been some outstanding standalone episodes, but overall I find the long plot arcs convoluted and overblown, but at the same time trivial and dull. I'll be interested in the next season to see if losing the Ponds increases our interest.

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Reply #1100 on: October 02, 2012, 09:14:23 AM

Matt Smith has been one of the best Dr's to date.

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Reply #1101 on: October 02, 2012, 03:07:54 PM

Khaldun
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Reply #1102 on: October 02, 2012, 06:48:06 PM

I honestly think Smith has the best take on the character in just about ever, and he's had a mostly good group of characters to work with. (River Song had potential but it's gone very badly south). But he's had uneven scripts. This season has actually been quite lovely until this one which was really just crap.
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Reply #1103 on: October 02, 2012, 09:13:36 PM

Matt Smith has been one of the best Dr's to date.

I would rate the post 2005 Drs.: Tennant > Smith > Eccleston.

Eccleston's Doctor was a bit too glum IMHO and I had a hard time deciphering his accent.

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Reply #1104 on: October 03, 2012, 07:39:04 AM


The whole "fixed point in time" thing should be nuked from orbit. If a person is in a fixed point in time, that means his/her birth was fixed, and his/her parents, and their parents, etc. That makes the past pretty static, yes? Or maybe I'm just being parochial, given that apparently Elizabeth Warren and I are  blood relatives  why so serious? (part NA on my mom's side and given the amount of red hair on her side probably some Caucasian as well)
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Reply #1105 on: October 03, 2012, 02:02:09 PM

I buy "fixed point in time" as certain events.  (As in the Mars episode with Tennant near the end of his run.)  I don't quite buy it as something that can happen to time travellers in the course of their travels, that seems to fuck up the whole idea of time travel & the Doctor. I think there are other ways to have handled this--say, that Amy and Rory were sent back into the past in such a way that they are invisible to the Doctor and the Tardis (if Captain Jack can be 'deleted' from time so that he lives almost forever, why not something similar), that the Angels do something to 'poison' Amy and Rory for time travel such that the Doctor can't take them on the Tardis away from 1938 without killing them, etc. The point is that the story shouldn't be so driven by an exotic series of plot contrivances whose main intent is to take Amy and Rory off the board without giving them an unhappy ending--just do that and focus instead on the characters and the situation. Timey-wimey stuff is very very hard to do right, and any time travel story or series that isn't always fundamentally about time travel, using a very hard and explicit set of rules is going to end up sooner or later in the same place that Star Trek TNG ended up with tachyon particle beams and proton generators and baryon projectors and whatever other technobabble was allowed to drive the plot in the worst episodes.
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Reply #1106 on: October 03, 2012, 02:24:40 PM


Yah, but if Water of Mars is fixed so are a lot of things. Like the earth existing to that point; and not just existing, but basically having the same people existing throughout time and space to that point. Although that does kind of explain the Doctor's breezy confidence in the face of what could be universal destruction: it can't possibly occur, so he just has to figure out how it was stopped.
Tebonas
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Reply #1107 on: October 04, 2012, 12:31:16 AM

Just saw the finale and man do I wish I hadn't. Emotionally manipulative and stupid at the same time. With plot holes the Statue of Liberty Angel could walk through.

Weren't the Angels supposed to be Aliens that just happened to look like a particular kind of statue (Angelic statues to be exact)? Now they are what? Evil ghosts possessing existing Statues, regardless of form?

And thats just the first thing coming to mind. I don't want to analyze this further or I begin to openly weep. Moffat may be talented in other ways, but he is absolutely poisonous to the Dr Who franchise. The actors work their asses off, but its hard to overcome the limitations of the script.
Ubvman
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Reply #1108 on: October 04, 2012, 01:02:33 AM


The whole "fixed point in time" thing should be nuked from orbit. If a person is in a fixed point in time, that means his/her birth was fixed, and his/her parents, and their parents, etc. That makes the past pretty static, yes?
...

I don't mind the establishment of certain rigid rules and restrictions on Dr. Who time travel. Without restrictions - absolutely nothing can phaze or affect a crazy man in a time traveling box. No danger or bad outcome cannot be undone if the Doctor wishes it.

That said, if you do establish a rigid rule/restriction to rein your character in, don't F*-ING carelessly break the rules when you've written yourself into a corner. You just don't write yourself into a corner in the first place.

Bad episode, it could have been much better given the importance of that particular episode as the last appearance of the Ponds.

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Reply #1109 on: October 04, 2012, 02:04:54 PM

Just saw the finale and man do I wish I hadn't.
Good news: you didn't!
apocrypha
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Reply #1110 on: October 07, 2012, 01:32:30 AM

Slight tangent...

Watched Men In Black 3 last night. Time travel & multiple possible futures story telling handled about a billion times better than Steven Moffat could ever hope to do. I know it's different being a single story with a simple arc as opposed to a long running series but even so, someone should strap Moffat into a chair and do a Clockwork Orange on his eyelids and force him to watch MiB3 several times until he gets why his stories suck cock.

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Reply #1111 on: October 07, 2012, 11:04:50 AM

Matt Smith has been one of the best Dr's to date.

I would rate the post 2005 Drs.: Tennant > Smith > Eccleston.

They've all been great, my only problem with Smith and Tennant is they don't remotely work as characters with the emotional maturity and experience of all the previous incarnations added together. They could have been convincingly presented as 'prequel' doctors.

In fact I have now chosen to assume that because of freaky time shit, timelords experience their 'regenerations' in reverse. They have some factual memory of prior regens (so they remember companions and are intellectually aware and even scared of bad shit that has happened) but they grow as characters and gain experience in the opposite direction.

How can this possibly work? A wizard did it.

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Numtini
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Reply #1112 on: October 07, 2012, 06:33:06 PM

Really? I thought Tenant got the entire "I'm worn down by living too long" down pretty well. Not quite as well as they did with Captain Jack on Torchwood, but definitely above other doctors.

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Tebonas
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Reply #1113 on: October 07, 2012, 11:50:22 PM

Just saw the finale and man do I wish I hadn't.
Good news: you didn't!

Oh sorry, let me correct this error.

Just saw the last episode before the winter break and man do I wish I hadn't.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2012, 11:51:54 PM by Tebonas »
Khaldun
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Reply #1114 on: October 08, 2012, 05:18:44 AM

Matt Smith has been one of the best Dr's to date.

I would rate the post 2005 Drs.: Tennant > Smith > Eccleston.

They've all been great, my only problem with Smith and Tennant is they don't remotely work as characters with the emotional maturity and experience of all the previous incarnations added together. They could have been convincingly presented as 'prequel' doctors.

In fact I have now chosen to assume that because of freaky time shit, timelords experience their 'regenerations' in reverse. They have some factual memory of prior regens (so they remember companions and are intellectually aware and even scared of bad shit that has happened) but they grow as characters and gain experience in the opposite direction.

How can this possibly work? A wizard did it.


It's long been established that regenerations remix the Doctor's personality to some extent, which actually makes some degree of sense given the degree to which personality derives partly from brain structure, etc. So his arc of character development, if you buy that basic premise, is always going to be somewhat indirect and specific to each regeneration. If you're going to get huffy that he doesn't seem to accumulate maturity and emotional understanding over time, you couldn't possibly accept the progression from Troughton to Pertwee to Baker, who don't have anything remotely like a consistent, singular emotional arc. Davison's Doctor could be seen plausibly as an emotional reaction/growth to the late Baker, I guess, but Colin Baker's Doctor, even IF the characterization had worked out better, doesn't seem at all like a person who had just given his life to save a companion. You can't make the Doctor out to have a linear progression of experience and maturity over time at any point in the character's existence, which I think is for the better.

*All* of the nuWho actors have done a pretty job, imho, at portraying the Doctor as a 'old' being with a lot of accumulated knowledge and emotional baggage. In particular, they've done a good job getting across his weariness about his burdens and a sense of PTSD from the Time War. Smith and Tennant generally have done a good job with the old soul in younger body thing generally, though--I honestly don't see how you could possibly think otherwise. The only actor in the history of the show who has played the character as a naif was really Davison. Pertwee's version also seemed in certain ways to have a youthful braggadacio even if he didn't look particularly young.
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Reply #1115 on: October 08, 2012, 05:40:58 AM

I can't think of any Doctor who didn't do the 'youthful inside' part of the character.  Tom Baker was probably the best at it, with Colin Baker (and arguably McCoy) being Godawful at it.  Even Eccleston managed it by being constantly excited and keen about everything.

Pertwee and the first Doctor were the most interesting, to be honest, because they both looked so damn old and still managed it.

I think if you are looking for maturity and growth, you're looking at the wrong character.  The Doctor just doesn't do that.  Sure, he can be serious, even stately at times, but at heart he's Peter Pan.  He stole a TARDIS because he was bored and never grew up.  
« Last Edit: October 08, 2012, 06:09:26 AM by Ironwood »

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Reply #1116 on: October 12, 2012, 10:30:31 AM

This has been making the Facebook rounds today, so I'm sure everyone's seen it.  In case you haven't though:

P.S.:   What happened to The Ponds and Rory's Dad?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=XWU6XL9xI4k

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Reply #1117 on: October 21, 2012, 12:16:56 AM

This has been making the Facebook rounds today, so I'm sure everyone's seen it.  In case you haven't though:

P.S.:   What happened to The Ponds and Rory's Dad?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=XWU6XL9xI4k


You know... fuck Stephen Moffat. Fuck him in the goatass.

I was OK with the Ponds getting a sendoff of some sort, though it did get a bit treacly and maudlin. I really loved them as characters. They deserved a helluva lot better deaths/exits than BLINKPUNKBITCHES! But that video... IT MAKES NO FUCKING SENSE. If they were trapped in a "fixed point in time" until they died, HOW CAN THEIR SON MOVE FORWARD IN TIME!!!!!!?Huh?? If he could leave, why couldn't they? Let's not even get into the idea that if they are moving forward in time and could have a fucking yard, there'd be about 50 billion timey wimey ways to get out of the trap. Or that the Doctor would ever give up trying to find a way to get them back so long as they were alive.

The character bits they've done with the Doctor and the Ponds were really good, but like I've said a billion times before, the stories are complete shit.

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Reply #1118 on: October 21, 2012, 01:56:02 AM

This whole thing is idiotic, no discussion about that. Don't get me started on that "fixed point in time" nonsense, that is retarded beyond comprehension. The only fixed thing was that Amy and Rory had to die in set year at a certain age. They could have done whatever they liked as long as they still returned to (die and) get buried there and then. Time doesn't care about the details, the "Robot doctor death" proved that.

But the grandson didn't move forward in time, he just stayed in his normal timeline and aged until he met his Grandfather. No Timetravel involved.
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Reply #1119 on: October 21, 2012, 11:19:57 AM

This whole thing is idiotic, no discussion about that. Don't get me started on that "fixed point in time" nonsense, that is retarded beyond comprehension. The only fixed thing was that Amy and Rory had to die in set year at a certain age. They could have done whatever they liked as long as they still returned to (die and) get buried there and then. Time doesn't care about the details, the "Robot doctor death" proved that.

But the grandson didn't move forward in time, he just stayed in his normal timeline and aged until he met his Grandfather. No Timetravel involved.

I don't remember there even being a set year...
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