Against all odds...

[WindupAtheist]

...WUA has hit max-level in a Diku MMO!

Filthy XP bar, sitting there on my screen telling me I have more work to do, you are conquered!

I guess if I'm looking for something productive to do, I should go find the Keepers of Time and try to hit Honored in anticipation of the 2.4 gear.  Either that or go try to PVP in my junk gear.  But really, I have yet to get bored of flying straight up until the ground vanishes, dismounting, then hitting bubble right before I splat.

[Tale]

Congratulations. The next step is astonished disillusionment with the total refocus of gameplay now that you've hit max level, a failed attempt to level an alt, then a month or two of quitting. Then you start to think what you could do to progress with a level 70 character and return, playing happily for months until you either quit again because it's eating your life or become a WoW obsessive.

[Arrrgh]

Grats

[MrHat]

I blame your so called friends.

[rk47]

...WUA has hit max-level in a Diku MMO!

Filthy XP bar, sitting there on my screen telling me I have more work to do, you are conquered!

I guess if I'm looking for something productive to do, I should go find the Keepers of Time and try to hit Honored in anticipation of the 2.4 gear.  Either that or go try to PVP in my junk gear.  But really, I have yet to get bored of flying straight up until the ground vanishes, dismounting, then hitting bubble right before I splat.

Hm try every Battleground. Then proceed to try some 5-man raids? Lots of casual stuff to do, and before you know it you're already tilting into the hardcore area by spending 2-3 hours daily.

[WindupAtheist]

AV is fun.

[Fabricated]

...WUA has hit max-level in a Diku MMO!

Filthy XP bar, sitting there on my screen telling me I have more work to do, you are conquered!

I guess if I'm looking for something productive to do, I should go find the Keepers of Time and try to hit Honored in anticipation of the 2.4 gear.  Either that or go try to PVP in my junk gear.  But really, I have yet to get bored of flying straight up until the ground vanishes, dismounting, then hitting bubble right before I splat.

Go do Old Hillsbrad and Black Morass. They're great fun and just doing the quests for those two instances will put you way over honored I think.

[Nonentity]

AV is fun.

Once every hour and a half, yes.

Queue times are fucking retarded, at least on my battlegroup.

[Chimpy]

AV is fun.

Once every hour and a half, yes.

Queue times are fucking retarded, at least on my battlegroup.

It really depends on your battlegroup. Reckoning has max 8minute queues on alliance.

[Azaroth]

Congratulations. The next step is astonished disillusionment with the total refocus of gameplay now that you've hit max level, a failed attempt to level an alt, then a month or two of quitting. Then you start to think what you could do to progress with a level 70 character and return, playing happily for months until you either quit again because it's eating your life or become a WoW obsessive.

Congrats. You saved the princess.

[Xanthippe]

AV is fun.

Once every hour and a half, yes.

Queue times are fucking retarded, at least on my battlegroup.

It really depends on your battlegroup. Reckoning has max 8minute queues on alliance.

Vengeance is almost instant, all the time, for alliance anyway.

Blizzard should really mix up the server clusters every so often.  Some of the queue times and bg records are horribly out of balance.

[Phred]

AV is fun.

Once every hour and a half, yes.

Queue times are fucking retarded, at least on my battlegroup.

It really depends on your battlegroup. Reckoning has max 8minute queues on alliance.

Vengeance is almost instant, all the time, for alliance anyway.

Blizzard should really mix up the server clusters every so often.  Some of the queue times and bg records are horribly out of balance.

You do realize that Horde causes their own queues right? I would prefer to keep our horde thanks :)

[WindupAtheist]

Already bored.  Tired of BGing when all the alliance does is lose.  In some guild where nobody talks to anybody.  Time for UO.

[Azaroth]

I was amused because raiding wasn't even mentioned as an option for gameplay.

What's more amusing is that it isn't.



What a horribly bunged up MMO.

[WindupAtheist]

Raiding doesn't even begin to sound fun.

[Xanthippe]

I fired up Diablo 2 yesterday again.

[Arrrgh]

Already bored.  Tired of BGing when all the alliance does is lose.  In some guild where nobody talks to anybody.  Time for UO.

Try spamming trade for a BG premade. You'll lose less.

You could also grab another undergeared newb and start a 2v2 arena team. You might like it. Note that a new team starts at 1500 (average) so you'll lose a lot at first till your score drifts down to the right range for undergeared people who just started doing arena.

[Paelos]

Raiding doesn't even begin to sound fun.

Pretty much every UOer in my guild has said the same thing. That's why I had to go to a raiding alliance. Raiding is definitely way too linear and repetative for most people who liked UO a lot i've noticed.

[Azaroth]

Of course, that leaves WoW as being BGs and Arenas - which are just as repetitive. You just do them more.

My point was, though, that there's actually no reason to raid anymore in the game. Unless your goal is to see the raid content. And that's pretty stupid.

Gear is acquired more easily through BGs and Arenas, and PvE gear just isn't useful in PvP.

All in all, the game is fucking stupid.

[Paelos]

My point was, though, that there's actually no reason to raid anymore in the game. Unless your goal is to see the raid content. And that's pretty stupid.

Well, that and actually enjoying the company of the people you raid with. I think that's the biggest mistake raiding guilds make and why they implode. They haul ass through content with people they don't actually give a rat's ass about aside from being Mage #2, and then wonder why it's no fun. It's never going to be the gameplay in an MMOG that makes it long-term fun. It's always going to be the people you play with.

[Ratman_tf]

Of course, that leaves WoW as being BGs and Arenas - which are just as repetitive. You just do them more.

My point was, though, that there's actually no reason to raid anymore in the game. Unless your goal is to see the raid content. And that's pretty stupid.

Gear is acquired more easily through BGs and Arenas, and PvE gear just isn't useful in PvP.

All in all, the game is fucking stupid.

Playing for gear is fucking stupid. That kind of cockthirsty mentality is why we have raiddrama queens and guys who smell like cat boxes frothing on internet forums about their goddamn .00005 DPS nurf.

[Jayce]

Unless your goal is to see the raid content. And that's pretty stupid.

Seriously.  Do you realize you just essentially said that playing the game for fun is stupid?

Unless your idea of fun is getting great gear... for what, exactly?

[Azaroth]

Okay, how about this:

I don't consider spending my entire night in a raid very fun. Especially when it's multiple times a week. Especially when it's just so I can see what Kael'Thas looks like.

Personally, I'd rather google a picture and then get my fat fucking ass out of the computer chair and go hang out with real people. Maybe doing real things.

Once again. Raiding to see content is fucking stupid. And a waste of time. Or does it get fun and become a wise time investment the 75th time you've cleared SSC?

Now, I didn't say raiding for useful gear wasn't fucking stupid. But at least there's some benefit provided beyond staring at your computer and repeating the same encounters for the third time this week.

I also never said I played entirely for gear, or was a gear whore, or cockthirsty, or enjoyed being teabagged by men in leather, or whatever the fuck else was just said about me because I dared to disparage your little WoW raiding addiction. I spent precisely two months in a "hardcore" raiding guild, and that's back whenever the hell people were raiding Molten Core and Blackwing Lair. I quit doing that because raiding is fucking stupid. Raiding for no reason other than to hang out with people in ventrilo all night is far more fucking stupid.

If you disagree, enjoy. But if you ever ply your folds out of that chair and manage to run across me in a place where sunlight is visible, try to avoid calling me "cockthirsty".

[Miasma]

I only start mocking how other people have fun in their spare time when it starts to involve costumes of any sort.

[Azaroth]

Which is a fine general rule.

However, the entire cast of extras from Trekkies 2 jumped down my throat for expressing my opinion on the direction of the game.

Now, if you enjoy that particular direction? Fine, again, go ahead and enjoy. I'll go ahead and enjoy expressing my personal opinion that certain things about the game are stupid.

When people start evoking level 9000 nerd rage and flipping little insults about rusty trombones around, I may or may not subsequently tell you to go eat shit from a hat while sitting squarely in the middle of the largest highway within shambling distance.

Beyond that...

Seriously.  Do you realize you just essentially said that playing the game for fun is stupid?

No, I said that raiding was stupid.

Seriously.

[Paelos]

That's all well and good, except you are expressing your opinion about a game sucking in that games subforum.

I find Eve pretty mindnumbing, but I don't wander over there to talk about how much I think it sucks. I quit, moved on, and I don't talk about it anymore. Were you shocked by the reaction? Before we eat shit out of your hat, you might want to consider where you shit in the first place.

Opinions from people that have quit the game often mean diddly and shit to those that are still playing it, or so has been my experience.

[Azaroth]

Fair enough. Except this thread was created by a player disenchanted with his options for endgame play, and then quit to go back to UO.

I do certainly apologize for throwing my two cents in on the topic and upsetting the diehards. Also, WUA, please delete your thread. Your opinion means diddly and shit to those who still play.

[Ratman_tf]

Wow, Azaroth. Want a manly hug and a beer? 

Srsly man. Some people like raiding. Some people like to strip their NE down and dance on mailboxes. I don't care, inasmuch as it doesn't really affect what I do in the game.

I'm currently in a guild and am looking to level a new toon for raiding. Because that's the endgame content that I haven't seen yet.
I don't do it for teh gearz, or teh epeen bragging rights. I want in because this is a good guild that I want to raid with.

Saying "Raiding is stupid" is like saying "line dancing is stupid"... wait... I need a better analogy...

[Fabricated]

Raiding doesn't even begin to sound fun.

Well, if you enjoy doing 5-mans, Karzhan isn't a huge jump from that outside of requiring mildly clueful people. You'll probably get sick of doing it every week for 1-2 months (and that's a low-ball estimate) before completing it though if you go in with a group that isn't geared already. Also it has shit for loladin gear ignoring the two Tier 4 pieces and the two-hander.

Until you've ran it for the kabillionth time it's a really fun instance. There's a pretty irritating amount of trash after the Curator but the boss fights are cool. The Opera is the coolest fight in the place overall, with Aran and Moroes being the next ones after it. Aran pisses me off a lot but it's a wacky fight and I like Aran's voice acting for some reason.

[Jayce]

There's a difference between putting in your two cents, and saying something is "fucking stupid".  I hate to have to spell it out for you, but explaining to someone that their main hobby is "fucking stupid", they may take it personally.  if I said that reddish avatars smoking cigars are fucking stupid, you'd probably assume it was aimed at you and take it personally too.

The funny thing is that I'm on this side of the issue, but I have about as much raiding experience as you.  The only difference that I can see is that I enjoyed it and often miss it, and would do it again if I had time.

[Tale]

Raiding doesn't even begin to sound fun.

Yet millions of people enjoy it. If you're going to complete this diku experience you've finally built yourself, it would be a bit of a waste to miss the opportunity to see what kept people playing EQ1 and pre-expansion WoW for years.

Reaching max level means you're now a level 1 diku player, so your opinions on what higher level diku players do and see are pretty worthless at the moment.

(Disclaimer: I'm a cynical jaded hack who is over it all, haven't been a WoW player for a couple of years, but I spent many years as a diku raider.)

[WindupAtheist]

Sorry, but it would have to look fun, or maybe sound like it could theoretically be fun, before I could be bothered.  "Your opinion on watching paint dry is pretty meaningless until you've done it!" doesn't carry much weight.  I'd rather go back to UO for a while and not spend half an hour LFG before getting to go inside a dungeon.

[Tale]

"Your opinion on watching paint dry is pretty meaningless until you've done it!" doesn't carry much weight.

Nobody watches paint dry. But millions of people raid in dikus. Almost none of them ever use the LFG tag.

[Tarami]

Honestly, raiding isn't fun even with 24 Very Funny Guys in the raid, besides yourself. If you like their company, you can do something else that is far less frustrating and more relaxed than raid. It's like playing poker with people you like, in long sessions and over considerable amounts of cash. You are very likely not going to remain good friends for very long. Saying it takes a special breed of people to create raid drama is short-sighted. Some more than others, yes, but everyone is a potential drama whore. It doesn't take that much when you mix in greed and prestige.

And I agree with Azaroth, in general terms, that raiding to "explore" is as disillusional as raiding for gear. You go there, wipe on the boss a few times and then you're pretty much done with all the exploring you can do, yet you've subscribed to wiping another twenty times just so you can go see the next boss. Not to mention the endless reiterations you'll have to suffer every week just to catch up to the point where you stopped "exploring". I don't really see the correlation between exploring and hitting my forehead against a brick wall until I can see what's beyond.

[WindupAtheist]

So I'm back on at least a minor UO kick now.  Planning some suit upgrades, and you know what I like?  There's no such god damned thing as soulbound items.  If I want a particular item, all I really need is the cash to buy it.  If I want to make that cash by farming, or crafting, or selling some pieces I don't use anymore, I can do that.  I kill a boss that gives me an artifact I don't need?  I just sell it to someone who does need it, and buy what I want.  How novel.