Deus Ex 3. I shit you not.

[Threash]

It's very liberating to do a "fuck everyone up" playthrough after beating the game in stealth mode. I didn't realize how many explody things are around when you want to get creative.

[Thrawn]

It's very liberating to do a "fuck everyone up" playthrough after beating the game in stealth mode. I didn't realize how many explody things are around when you want to get creative.

I'm doing a run through right now to get "Foxiest of Hounds" and I'm doing everything as quickly as I can with no combat, skipping side quests, no exploring etc. and finding you can really be a dick to people when you turn down quests or use the CASIE aug.

[Threash]

That's what i always did, i didn't realize there was a "nicer" option heh.

[Zetor]

It's very liberating to do a "fuck everyone up" playthrough after beating the game in stealth mode. I didn't realize how many explody things are around when you want to get creative.

I'm doing a run through right now to get "Foxiest of Hounds" and I'm doing everything as quickly as I can with no combat, skipping side quests, no exploring etc. and finding you can really be a dick to people when you turn down quests or use the CASIE aug.

That also has some consequences later on...

[apocrypha]

Hurrah! Steam returned it to my library. No update on my support ticket, no notification, nothing... just there it is.

Damn, I've forgotten how to play it now.

[rk47]

It's very liberating to do a "fuck everyone up" playthrough after beating the game in stealth mode. I didn't realize how many explody things are around when you want to get creative.

I'm doing a run through right now to get "Foxiest of Hounds" and I'm doing everything as quickly as I can with no combat, skipping side quests, no exploring etc. and finding you can really be a dick to people when you turn down quests or use the CASIE aug.

That also has some consequences later on...

Yeah, the same reaction I got when I figured I could just punch anyone I want after I'm done working with them

'Tank u mr jensen for herping me and my fren.'

Yeah, good bye, mei.

*punch.*

[SnakeCharmer]

Bought it.  The story is decent, the graphics are purty, but man the gameplay is clunky as hell.  Having trouble getting into it.

[rk47]

Bought it.  The story is decent, the graphics are purty, but man the gameplay is clunky as hell.  Having trouble getting into it.

play it like a cover shooter. stick to cover n pop to shoot.

[KallDrexx]

Fuck boss battles.  Just dealt with the horribly annoying-ness of the cloaking woman, and I'm now annoyed with the game.  Yes, after 2 deaths I finally figured out the "trick" of the boss battle, but god damn whoever thought that was a fun thing to put in the game needs to be ostracized from the games industry.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Whoever is bitching about these boss battles needs to grow a pair.  You died two whole times?! The sheer horror!

Yes these boss battles are hard and....?  Every one of them seems to have multiple ways of doing things, I never knew you could shoot the cables on the second boss myself.  The fights are no more difficult than many games like it, MG::S comes to mind actually, how many times did you die on psycho mantis? As cheap as that fight, or the second to last boss fight in deus ex are it doesnt make them less fun.

[Tebonas]

Except the rest of the game is a walk in the park and the Boss Fights work against expectations.

[tgr]

Whoever is bitching about these boss battles needs to grow a pair.  You died two whole times?! The sheer horror!

Yes these boss battles are hard and....?  Every one of them seems to have multiple ways of doing things, I never knew you could shoot the cables on the second boss myself.  The fights are no more difficult than many games like it, MG::S comes to mind actually, how many times did you die on psycho mantis? As cheap as that fight, or the second to last boss fight in deus ex are it doesnt make them less fun.

I see you understand what the complaining is all about, to a tee.

[Kitsune]

I never died in a boss battle, and that's with my sneaky pacifist playthrough.  The moment I saw cloaky lady I thought, "Oh look, footprints in the water.  Hello, cloaky lady.  Meet EMP grenade.  There you are!"  Then I unloaded a combat rifle in her face while she made the twitchy dance.

[Kail]

Whoever is bitching about these boss battles needs to grow a pair.  You died two whole times?! The sheer horror!

Yes these boss battles are hard and....?  Every one of them seems to have multiple ways of doing things, I never knew you could shoot the cables on the second boss myself.  The fights are no more difficult than many games like it, MG::S comes to mind actually, how many times did you die on psycho mantis? As cheap as that fight, or the second to last boss fight in deus ex are it doesnt make them less fun.

It's not that they're super difficult; I played the game on hard, so a few deaths are not that shocking.  It's that they're not fun or interesting at all, and they don't have the same degree of choice as the rest of the game.  Being able to shoot the cables on the second boss does not turn it into a dynamic and engaging experience.  It's still either a tedious slog as you bullet her to death or a cheap pointless non-fight as you stun/typhoon cheese her to death, and neither of those are fun experiences.

Comparing it to MGS, I'd say MGS actually has a fairly good model on how to do boss fights that DX doesn't.  In MGS, you can't spec heavily into sneaking and hacking only to find out they're useless for the boss fights.  In MGS, if you run into a boss without having a weapon that works well on him, the game gives you one.  In MGS, ammo isn't hard to come by, and inventory space doesn't force you to throw out weapons you don't know you'll need.  In MGS, the bosses have a huge variety of different attacks, each of which can be countered or evaded.  In MGS, if you have problems, you can call the support characters for help.  It feels integrated with the rest of the game, the same rules apply, just now you're going up against stranger and more difficult enemies.

With Deus Ex, it feels like the sewer section in Vampire: the Masquerade Bloodlines.  It's not impossible if you know what you're doing, but if you built your character around social and financial skills and the game throws you into a sewer level fighting zombies for an hour, it feels cheap.  Yeah, it's winnable, yes, there are tricks to getting through it, but when a game built around choice and freedom suddenly takes all that away from you and turns into a crappy Quake clone, it feels like a let down.  If these were boss fights in any generic FPS, they'd be boring.  In a game like Deus Ex, they're boring and out of place.

[Demonix]

Whoever is bitching about these boss battles needs to grow a pair.  You died two whole times?! The sheer horror!

Yes these boss battles are hard and....?  Every one of them seems to have multiple ways of doing things, I never knew you could shoot the cables on the second boss myself.  The fights are no more difficult than many games like it, MG::S comes to mind actually, how many times did you die on psycho mantis? As cheap as that fight, or the second to last boss fight in deus ex are it doesnt make them less fun.

I didn't know about that either...but I did discover that the X-ray eyes shows her, cloaked or not.  I would sneak up on her, tase her, and fill her full of bullets.

Honestly, I hated the boss fights because you couldnt fight in them the way the game was designed;  they were run and gun encounters while the game was designed for stealth and cover based gameplay.

[Kitsune]

I never found any clever alternate ways to deal with the third boss, but I wasn't really looking too hard.  Each of the other bosses have ways to defeat them that don't involve slugging it out directly, so I don't really see the problem.  Unlike Bloodlines where the game didn't mind completely fucking you by sticking you in a room with a horrible monster of death after you'd spent all of your experience on seduction.

[KallDrexx]

Whoever is bitching about these boss battles needs to grow a pair.  You died two whole times?! The sheer horror!

Yes these boss battles are hard and....?  Every one of them seems to have multiple ways of doing things, I never knew you could shoot the cables on the second boss myself.  The fights are no more difficult than many games like it, MG::S comes to mind actually, how many times did you die on psycho mantis? As cheap as that fight, or the second to last boss fight in deus ex are it doesnt make them less fun.

It has nothing to do with dying.  I've died a shit ton of times throughout the progress through the game and I didn't care, because I knew I messed up, and looked to find a way around that.  Up until that boss battle I was fighting encounters heavily using cover, and then I was in a boss battle where I couldn't use cover at all.  So I charged the footsteps and used a whole 200 ammo shooting my heavy rifle at her and somehow she didn't die.  I then tried to use a take down, failed the take down (I didn't expect a 1 hit kill but god damn they could have let me do some damage) and she killed me before I got control again.

I found out about the cables merely by accident the 3rd or so time attempting it, and just stood in front of her shotgunning her in the face until she died. 

It's just fucking retarded and not fun at all. 

[Malakili]

Whoever is bitching about these boss battles needs to grow a pair.  You died two whole times?! The sheer horror!

Yes these boss battles are hard and....?  Every one of them seems to have multiple ways of doing things, I never knew you could shoot the cables on the second boss myself.  The fights are no more difficult than many games like it, MG::S comes to mind actually, how many times did you die on psycho mantis? As cheap as that fight, or the second to last boss fight in deus ex are it doesnt make them less fun.

It has nothing to do with dying.  I've died a shit ton of times throughout the progress through the game and I didn't care, because I knew I messed up, and looked to find a way around that.  Up until that boss battle I was fighting encounters heavily using cover, and then I was in a boss battle where I couldn't use cover at all.  So I charged the footsteps and used a whole 200 ammo shooting my heavy rifle at her and somehow she didn't die.  I then tried to use a take down, failed the take down (I didn't expect a 1 hit kill but god damn they could have let me do some damage) and she killed me before I got control again.

I found out about the cables merely by accident the 3rd or so time attempting it, and just stood in front of her shotgunning her in the face until she died. 

It's just fucking retarded and not fun at all. 

This is pretty much exactly my experience.  I don't care about difficulty, I care about it being shitty compared to the rest of the game.

[tgr]

This is pretty much exactly my experience.  I don't care about difficulty, I care about it being shitty compared to the rest of the game.

Nah. You just need to harden the fuck up, ya babby.

[Kitsune]

Holy shit, Kotaku just posted a video on beating the third boss.  I can honestly say that method never occurred to me.  Okay so I amend my earlier statement, every boss in the game has a clever trick for beating them.

[Threash]

Well, what was it?

[Ironwood]

Guys, I'm about to do an awesome post about how to keep idiots in suspense.

Watch This Space !   Fucking BE THERE.

[Kitsune]

For people too lazy to go to Kotaku to find it themselves:

[Trippy]

Why would we want to go to Kotaku?

[Lantyssa]

The time I tried to punch him didn't end well for me.

[rk47]

Whoever is bitching about these boss battles needs to grow a pair.  You died two whole times?! The sheer horror!

Yes these boss battles are hard and....?  Every one of them seems to have multiple ways of doing things, I never knew you could shoot the cables on the second boss myself.  The fights are no more difficult than many games like it, MG::S comes to mind actually, how many times did you die on psycho mantis? As cheap as that fight, or the second to last boss fight in deus ex are it doesnt make them less fun.

Comparing it to MGS, I'd say MGS actually has a fairly good model on how to do boss fights that DX doesn't.  In MGS, you can't spec heavily into sneaking and hacking only to find out they're useless for the boss fights.  In MGS, if you run into a boss without having a weapon that works well on him, the game gives you one.  In MGS, ammo isn't hard to come by, and inventory space doesn't force you to throw out weapons you don't know you'll need.  In MGS, the bosses have a huge variety of different attacks, each of which can be countered or evaded.  In MGS, if you have problems, you can call the support characters for help.  It feels integrated with the rest of the game, the same rules apply, just now you're going up against stranger and more difficult enemies.

So the proper way to do boss fight is...

1. Give the player a weapon that is effective against the boss.
2. Let the player stock up on EVERYTHING, so he need not make a decision between a bulky sniper rifle or a quiet SMG.
3. Give the player LOTS and LOTS of Ammo. Pay attention to 2, we don't want players to agonize over 2 EMP grenades or a box of rifle ammo.

I agree with other points but fuck man, 1,2,3 is just too much hand-holding.

Just give a hacker some option to let loose gas or discharge EMP or something. Or activate turrets to kill the boss for you etc. It's all part of the options.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Or they could you know, fill every boss room with enough weapons to kill said boss. 

[eldaec]

Equally, they could suddenly remember this is Deus Ex and not have boss fights.

[Lucas]

New patch released: tech fixes and a few "quality of life" ones for the PC.

[

[Lucas]

New patch released: tech fixes and a few "quality of life" ones for the PC.

http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=121897

[K9]

Equally, they could suddenly remember this is Deus Ex and not have boss fights.

DX1 had setpiece fights with Anna Navarre, Gunther and Walton Simons. The difference was that they weren't quite so disparate in difficulty from regular troops as the bosses in DX:HR.

[kildorn]

Equally, they could suddenly remember this is Deus Ex and not have boss fights.

DX1 had setpiece fights with Anna Navarre, Gunther and Walton Simons. The difference was that they weren't quite so disparate in difficulty from regular troops as the bosses in DX:HR.

IIRC they were all skippable as well, the complaint with DX:HR is that the boss fights forget that it's a game where everything has multiple solutions, and makes open combat the only solution for 3 set pieces.

[eldaec]

They were not boss flights, they were plot decisions. And you pretty much won immediately assuming you were trying to kill them.

[MisterNoisy]

New patch released: tech fixes and a few "quality of life" ones for the PC.

http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=121897

In-game advertising has apparently been turned on with this patch as well.  One could perhaps argue that this is a 'quality of life' change, I suppose.   

[Lakov_Sanite]

I never asked for this.