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Author Topic: The Black Lantern!? FUCK NO!!!  (Read 8870 times)
schild
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Reply #35 on: August 25, 2004, 02:09:28 PM

Quote from: SirBruce
For example, originally he didn't fly; he just had super-leaping.


Yes, true. And now it's just said he can fly.

Quote
When people wondered how come his costume never got a scratch from an exploding tank shell, it was explained that his costume was actually sewn (with the help of SuperBoy's powers, of course) from the waddling cloth that came with him from Krypton.


And now it's said that anything touching his skin (within x amount of space) is invulnerable as well.

Quote
When people wondered why his heat vision didn't melt Clark Kent's glasses, the glasses were made out of special crystals... etc.


In Lois & Clark he tilts his glasses down to shoot his heat ray. Otherwise the glass would melt.

Comics have the same rules as Calvin Ball. Which is to say the rules are invented and changed as necessary.

I to was raised on comic books. But I don't see any reason to believe that stories once told have to remain true forever. If you feel the need to cling to the original Lore of a fucking comic book, do yourself a favor and hop in a furnace.
SurfD
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Reply #36 on: August 25, 2004, 11:12:51 PM

My interpretation of Superman (which also stems somewhat from my history of playing psychic characters in the RIFTS PnP RPG) is that most of his powers come from the fact that he is a super powerfull self focused Telekenetic Psychic.

- He can fly because he psychicly wills himself to fly through the air
- he is invulnerable because he is surrounded by a telekenetic aura that stops most incoming damage

The main reason I came to this conclusion is because it is the ONLY way he could concievably do many of the insane feats of super strength he pulls off.  For example, realisticly speaking, if a single being tried to save a sinking ship by getting under it and then "lifting" (which Sups has done numerous times), the sheer force he would be exerting on that tiny surface area would cause him to punch right through the ship, regardless of the fact that he could actually lift its entire weight.  Instead, the ship maybe bends a little bit around the point he is lifting on.  My conclusion is that he is telepathicly "lifting" the entire vessel, spreading some kind of mental field around it when he contacts it, so as to distribute the force while lifting.

Darwinism is the Gateway Science.
Ironwood
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Reply #37 on: August 26, 2004, 05:51:59 AM

It's one thing to lift an icy Lake 'Kamooga' (or whatever), it's entirely another for a sheet of ice that large not to snap under it's own weight.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Alluvian
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Reply #38 on: August 26, 2004, 06:39:07 AM

Things like the lifting of ships and such that would crumble under their own weight was one of the reasons I liked spiderman more than things like superman, but then spiderman does just as many dumb physically impossible things.

Mainly with his webbing.  I cringe every time he does something like make a webbing fucking hang glider (in mid fall mind you) or some stupid thing like that.  How the same webshooters can make string, shields, nets, hang gliders, parachutes, domes, etc... is way beyond me.  I am waiting for the issue where he shoots out his webs and it forms a fully functioning car that he then hops in and chases the baddies with.
Boogaleeboo
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Reply #39 on: August 26, 2004, 08:25:55 AM

This is why Batman is the better hero. Rather than "Has super powers" the out is "Is rich, white sociopath genius.".
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Reply #40 on: August 26, 2004, 09:13:44 AM

Quote from: SurfD
I rather liked the whole organic webs and finger barbs thing.  It ties in very nicely with the whole DNA tampering vs Atomic radiation update they did to the character background.

Besides, in the origional backstory (radioactive), did the EVER explain how peter manages to cling to walls?  I know his radioacive blood gave him super human strength and agility, but how does that let him stick to walls?


Geek alert. Feh.

Static electricity was how he was able to cling to walls. Something Electro took advantage of once, when he figured it out.

End of Geek Alert.
Ironwood
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Reply #41 on: August 26, 2004, 09:33:23 AM

Quote from: Grelf
Quote from: SurfD
I rather liked the whole organic webs and finger barbs thing.  It ties in very nicely with the whole DNA tampering vs Atomic radiation update they did to the character background.

Besides, in the origional backstory (radioactive), did the EVER explain how peter manages to cling to walls?  I know his radioacive blood gave him super human strength and agility, but how does that let him stick to walls?


Geek alert. Feh.

Static electricity was how he was able to cling to walls. Something Electro took advantage of once, when he figured it out.

End of Geek Alert.



Hmmm, that's triggering a big 'my arse' detector.

(For the explanation, not at you Grelf...)

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Ironwood
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Reply #42 on: August 26, 2004, 09:36:40 AM

Quote from: SirBruce
 
Of course, how those manage to work THROUGH A COSTUME, well...


Fuck that - How the hell did it manage to work THROUGH HIS NIKES ???

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
ahoythematey
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Reply #43 on: August 26, 2004, 11:43:51 AM

I have a really hard time deciding whether or not big changes from canon are bad or good.  If done right, a big change can avoid the need of a large and unwieldy explanation of how things came to be, but on the other hand a big change done wrong could actually ruin the entire movie series' chances.

The rumored venom plot for Spiderman3 could be a good thing, since trying to explain the secret wars and all the baggage that comes with that would turn off all but the strictest of comic fans, but then if they replace it with something else that is supremely stupid(such as that nonsense in Supes where one script called for Lex being an alien) it won't matter, canon or not: the movie will suck.
SurfD
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Reply #44 on: August 26, 2004, 04:37:03 PM

Eh, Venom is still best explaned in movie context in much the same way they handled it in the animated TV series:

Jameson's son finds funky looking rock on asteroid/moon during one of his space trips, and brings it back.  Rock turns out to have been frozen Alien Symbiote, which thaws out on shuttle, attacks crew, causes crash, and winds up bonded to Parker when Spidey saves shuttle crew from reck.

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HaemishM
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Reply #45 on: August 27, 2004, 09:23:37 AM

But then you'll have to spend 5 minutes or so explaining what the fuck a symbiote is to the general public in a movie theater. I really hope they don't put fucking Venom in Spidey 3.

ahoythematey
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Reply #46 on: August 27, 2004, 11:46:26 AM

Likewise.  I think hobgoblin/green goblin v.2 and "Lizard" would be much better for Spidey3, since there is slight foreshadowing in both movies of seeing Lizard, and the obvious foreshadowing of Harry Osborne taking his father's place.  Plus you get to have more Parker angst since he would be up against two people close to him.

EDIT: God.  I'm such a fucking nerd.  I was just thinking, "and it's a damn good thing to stay away from Venom because otherwise they would open themselves up to having Carnage in one of the movies."
SurfD
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Reply #47 on: August 27, 2004, 03:59:48 PM

As I stated in one of the other Spidey related threads, if Venom DOES show up in the 3rd movie, it wont be a character appearence, but rather a character background thing, setting up for a character appearence in the 4th movie.

IE:  Symbiote arrives on earth (through whatever means you want)->Symbiote gets attached to Pete->Pete experiments with new powers (symbiotes for dummies course is presented to audience)->Pete uses Symbiote suit to defeat the movies chosen villian(s) in an near fatal fight->Pete realizes Symbiote is corrupting his personality and drives it out of his body->end movie with foreshadowing of Symbiote finding Brock (or whoever)

Darwinism is the Gateway Science.
Triforcer
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Reply #48 on: August 28, 2004, 09:08:25 PM

Quote from: ahoythematey
Likewise.  I think hobgoblin/green goblin v.2 and "Lizard" would be much better for Spidey3, since there is slight foreshadowing in both movies of seeing Lizard, and the obvious foreshadowing of Harry Osborne taking his father's place.  Plus you get to


Do we REALLY need another Green Goblin Spiderman movie?  Is the Spidey universe that bereft of interesting villains?  Why not cast him alongside the supervillainess Rita who was accidentally released by astronauts and can only be stopped by teenagers with attitudes and fucking give up?

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ahoythematey
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Reply #49 on: August 28, 2004, 11:15:33 PM

Well...apart from the fact that the previous movies have foreshadowed the appearance of both Hobgoblin/green goblin and the Lizard, there is also the sticking point of just how far past "reality" they can go with their villains(or heroes, for that matter) before things turn from supernatural to overly silly.  Seeing shit like Sandman or Mysterio would just kill the movies for me.
SurfD
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Reply #50 on: August 29, 2004, 12:29:13 AM

Actually, Mysterio would be a kickass villian.  After all, there is nothing "mystical", "supernatural" or "over the top" about him at all.  He is a criminal genious and a kickass special effects wizard, who just happens to have the bad luck to be wearing a fishbowl on his head.  It wouldnt be nearly as bad as trying to introduce the Lizard or Vulture or similar character.

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Reply #51 on: August 29, 2004, 01:01:26 AM

Quote from: SurfD
Actually, Mysterio would be a kickass villian.  After all, there is nothing "mystical", "supernatural" or "over the top" about him at all.  He is a criminal genious and a kickass special effects wizard, who just happens to have the bad luck to be wearing a fishbowl on his head.  It wouldnt be nearly as bad as trying to introduce the Lizard or Vulture or similar character.


I agree. Makes me wonder though: Who would do a better job at that? Sam Raimi or Tim Burton?

As for Sandman, I think they'd definitely have to change a lot of background for that character, since he's basically just a stupid thug in the comics. His powers kick ass though. A lot more cinematic than most of the other villians at least.
daveNYC
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Reply #52 on: August 29, 2004, 11:32:10 AM

Quote from: SurfD
IE:  Symbiote arrives on earth (through whatever means you want)-

Screw this alien symbiote stuff, just make the Venom suit a variation of the tenticles that Dr. Oct(k?) had.  Some stupid living geneticly modified living exoskeleton armor thing that develops intelligence.

Anyway, the potential villain for Spider 3 doesn't bother me.  The fact that Marvel might insist on having a crossover with one of its other franchises bothers me.  You know it's coming.
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Reply #53 on: August 29, 2004, 11:36:22 AM

Quote from: daveNYC


Anyway, the potential villain for Spider 3 doesn't bother me.  The fact that Marvel might insist on having a crossover with one of its other franchises bothers me.  You know it's coming.



Marvel Vs. Capcom?
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Reply #54 on: August 29, 2004, 12:40:56 PM

Quote from: daveNYC
Quote from: SurfD
IE:  Symbiote arrives on earth (through whatever means you want)-

Screw this alien symbiote stuff, just make the Venom suit a variation of the tenticles that Dr. Oct(k?) had.  Some stupid living geneticly modified living exoskeleton armor thing that develops intelligence.

Anyway, the potential villain for Spider 3 doesn't bother me.  The fact that Marvel might insist on having a crossover with one of its other franchises bothers me.  You know it's coming.


Similar to how Venom worked in "Ultimate Spider-Man" then?  In Ultimate the 'symbiote' was a goo that was designed by Peter's dad and a friend of his to cure cancer.  It would merge with your genetic code and then absorb the cancerous cells or somesuch.  It was never tested before they died, and turned out to augment psyical traits and feed off emotions.  So peter touches the stuff and it gets all over him.  He uses it to defeat a few villians and then realizes that the suit is pushing him over the edge when fighting the bad guys and goes about getting it off with the help of connors I believe (connors knows he is spiderman in ultimate).  The brock character is a childhood friend of peter who is also the son of peter's dad's partner.  Peter gets caught by brock stealing the goo in order to desroy it in an incinerator.  When caught peter spills his guts to brock about who he is and what the goo did to him.  Brock pretends to agree with him, but in reality he is jealous of peter and pissed off that he lied to him and that he wanted to destroy his father's life work.  Brock is aware of another set of goo and sticks his arm in that.

Venom fights then sortof happen as brock tries to control the goo without much success.  In the struggles the suit with brock get eletrocuted on power lines, peter is distracted by something and then when he turns back brock and the suit are gone.  Carnage was later introduced to the Ultimate universe as well, but I didn't read those so I don't know if it involved any more info on venom or not.
daveNYC
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Reply #55 on: August 29, 2004, 01:51:52 PM

Quote from: MrHat
Quote from: daveNYC


Anyway, the potential villain for Spider 3 doesn't bother me.  The fact that Marvel might insist on having a crossover with one of its other franchises bothers me.  You know it's coming.



Marvel Vs. Capcom?

I'm more worried about a special guest appearace of Wolverine.  Although it's more likely The Hulk would show up, considering he's nothing but CGI.
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Reply #56 on: August 29, 2004, 02:01:51 PM

Why does this worry you?  Spider-Man/Hulk was one of the first Marvel crossovers, IIRC.  Spider-Man/Fantasic Four was also around the same time.

Bruce
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Reply #57 on: August 29, 2004, 08:03:47 PM

Spiderman was crossing over with fab four by the fourth issue I think (or was it even the first?  I can't recall, but he was even on the cover.  Human torch has been part of spiderman on and off from the beginning, with hulk being the next most common I can recall.
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