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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  Magic: The Gathering Online  |  Topic: MTGO 3.0 Beta 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: MTGO 3.0 Beta  (Read 34818 times)
eldaec
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Reply #70 on: July 19, 2007, 12:55:55 PM

For absolutely no reason whatsoever, does anyone have any ideas on how to make this UI not suck balls?

Why yes, actually...



...wotc do.

"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular ­assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson
"Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
schild
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WWW
Reply #71 on: July 19, 2007, 01:03:32 PM

What in the holy hell is that client? I want to play that.
eldaec
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Reply #72 on: July 19, 2007, 01:08:39 PM

Well you can't. It was scrapped for being too playable according to the blog on page 2.

"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular ­assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson
"Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
schild
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Reply #73 on: July 19, 2007, 01:11:03 PM

Well you can't. It was scrapped for being too playable according to the blog on page 2.

...

Amazing.
Yegolev
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2/10 WOULD NOT INGEST


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Reply #74 on: July 19, 2007, 03:55:34 PM

WotC is truly retarded on a scale I had not previously imagined.  Jeepers.

Why am I homeless?  Why do all you motherfuckers need homes is the real question.
They called it The Prayer, its answer was law
Mommy come back 'cause the water's all gone
Mike_Lescault
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WB Games


Reply #75 on: July 20, 2007, 12:30:43 AM

Well you can't. It was scrapped for being too playable according to the blog on page 2.

Tsk tsk. You've said that several times now. I'm unsure whether you're trying to be wry and clever, or if you're trying to confuse people into thinking the dev team intentionally wants something unplayable. Maybe you're secretly crying out for clarification over something you don't understand and it hasn't yet gotten through my thick skull. If so, show me the quote that has you confused and I'll try to explain. =)

Margalis
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Reply #76 on: July 20, 2007, 01:26:45 AM

Edit: Bah, I can't even talk about it without being mean. You guys have no clue, that is all.

vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
Ironwood
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Reply #77 on: July 20, 2007, 03:29:45 AM

Well you can't. It was scrapped for being too playable according to the blog on page 2.

Tsk tsk. You've said that several times now. I'm unsure whether you're trying to be wry and clever, or if you're trying to confuse people into thinking the dev team intentionally wants something unplayable. Maybe you're secretly crying out for clarification over something you don't understand and it hasn't yet gotten through my thick skull. If so, show me the quote that has you confused and I'll try to explain. =)



Or, you could just try and explain.  I for one have no idea what quote he's talking about, but I'd be interested how the client went from that up there (Which looks Good) to the other Jpg's on this thread (which look like tasty fried ass).

Go on.  Give me a thrill.  I'll be nice.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Raging Turtle
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Reply #78 on: July 20, 2007, 09:09:59 AM

I think people complained that it looked too futuristic, so they went to brown.  Because there's no brown in the future.
bhodi
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No lie.


Reply #79 on: July 20, 2007, 09:14:18 AM

Whatever the story, that looked really good. Dig it back up, I might even try it if it was that interface.
eldaec
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Posts: 10869


Reply #80 on: July 20, 2007, 11:30:39 AM

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=magic/magiconline/IIIlaunchblog

Quote
The duel UI lay-out is ugly/inefficient.

The duel UI has gone through many different iterations. Some iterations were focused more on playability without capturing the right visual feel of the game, while others have been more artistically focused without necessarily addressing all the playability issues we'd like.

Yeah, I'm twisting words a bit because my version is funnier, not least since....


Quote from: Margalis
Edit: Bah, I can't even talk about it without being mean

I often feel this way about v3.

You really have to talk about it as if it is a joke at this point.


I mean, it is a joke.... Right?


EDIT:
Surprisingly good thread about mmog UIs going on here: http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=10423.0 . It's relevant to just about any non-twitch computer game with long-term players. Someone (I think it was Lum, can't be arsed to check) mentioned the awfullness of the v1 EQ1 UI in there. I hadn't thought of the connection before now, but EQ1 at launch is exactly what v3 looks like. Tacky "stone" textures everywhere, and itty-bitty game world space.

EDIT2:
Magic website article from yonks back, about the development of the playmat used in pro tours etc.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/arcana/212
The simplicity of the protour playmat compared with the 'ahem' unfortunate state of the v3 interface would appear to tell you something about how the cardboard people understand the game, wheras the online team, not so much..
« Last Edit: July 20, 2007, 12:18:11 PM by eldaec »

"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular ­assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson
"Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
eldaec
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Reply #81 on: July 26, 2007, 04:52:34 PM

Beta now pushed bavck to next week.

Also, on not-Beta, Nix Tix drafting this weekend.

"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular ­assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson
"Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
Mike_Lescault
Developers
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WB Games


Reply #82 on: July 27, 2007, 03:17:50 AM

Beta now pushed bavck to next week.


I know Worth said Monday, but I'm more skeptical. I don't think we'll know for sure if it'll be ready for Monday until Monday morning. Either way, I think it's very likely it'll reopen sometime next week.

-Mike
Margalis
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Reply #83 on: July 27, 2007, 03:20:42 AM

If you won't know until Monday that means it won't be ready Monday.

Is the kicker going to at least work properly? Last time to get it to update I had to manually delete files each time. It was really annoying so I gave up.

vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
Mike_Lescault
Developers
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WB Games


Reply #84 on: July 27, 2007, 11:49:33 AM

If you won't know until Monday that means it won't be ready Monday.

It very well could end up being ready on Monday, but I tend to be overly cautious about these things.

Quote
Is the kicker going to at least work properly? Last time to get it to update I had to manually delete files each time. It was really annoying so I gave up.

It really annoyed me as well, and I don't blame you for giving up. We definitely focused on addressing a lot of annoying problems this round.  But to be honest, when it comes to online game development, there's just no shortage of ways things can go wrong. We need to get the newest build done and up, flick the switch to let people come in, and see where we stand. So you won't see me making any promises as to what will or will not be fixed when the V3 beta returns next week. =)

-Mike
Mike_Lescault
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WB Games


Reply #85 on: July 31, 2007, 04:17:17 PM


The V3 open Beta is up now. You can get the details here: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=13257211#post13257211

-Mike
eldaec
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Reply #86 on: August 01, 2007, 05:53:26 PM

As promised, the readability of cards really has improved. And they've copied across the live accounts, so you can play with your own collection on beta now, which is nice.

Beyond that, nothing has changed.

The UI still looks terrible, still cramped, dated, messy, hard to figure out etc.

"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular ­assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson
"Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
schild
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Reply #87 on: August 01, 2007, 06:17:38 PM

Sigh.
Morat20
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Reply #88 on: August 02, 2007, 11:12:59 AM

As promised, the readability of cards really has improved. And they've copied across the live accounts, so you can play with your own collection on beta now, which is nice.

Beyond that, nothing has changed.

The UI still looks terrible, still cramped, dated, messy, hard to figure out etc.
They really need to hire some UI experts. Or hire different ones. A UI should be transparent and flexible. It should basically get out of the way of the bloody game. The cards and the play are "the game".

That interface isn't the worst I've seen, but it's pretty bad. Given how this development went, there's not a lot of excuse for it. Wasn't this all about putting a better interface on it? Why isn't there one?
Margalis
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Reply #89 on: August 02, 2007, 03:06:59 PM

Wizards forums are shitting all over it. I really just do not get it. RECOLOR THE MOTHERFUCKING TEXTURES! God damn it would take a couple of hours. They really are clueless.

They did about 2 days worth of work in the last month from what it looks like.

vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
Ironwood
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Reply #90 on: August 03, 2007, 05:01:23 AM

I FAIL TO SEE THE FUCKING PROBLEM.  THE UI AT THE TOP OF THIS VERY PAGE IS TOTALLY FINE AND FIT FOR PURPOSE.


Seriously, I'd like to purchase a clue, Carol.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
tazelbain
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tazelbain


Reply #91 on: August 03, 2007, 12:28:05 PM

I believe they have outsourced this project to the Mole Men and the delay is the time it takes the drill machine to ferry the requirements to them and code back to the surface.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2007, 03:15:34 PM by tazelbain »

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Margalis
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Reply #92 on: August 03, 2007, 03:14:10 PM

I could do better by myself. It really bugs. For the love of god, hire some people who know how to program and some people who know how to do software development.

vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
eldaec
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Reply #93 on: August 03, 2007, 05:17:20 PM

Regarding the 'readability has improved'.

I've changed my mind, playing a few more games with cards I actually have to read to remember, I'm noticing the mana/tap symbols are illegible, and the smaller sizes where anti-aliasing kicks in are still totally unreadable for all text.

It is better than it was, but not really good enough yet.

"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular ­assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson
"Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
Margalis
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Reply #94 on: August 03, 2007, 05:24:58 PM

The solution there is so obvious: simply do not scale down the tap/mana symbols past a certain size, no matter how small the card is rendered, even if it means the symbols extrude past the card border.

I wish I could claim I had this brilliant idea myself, but I got it from looking at how they did it in version 2!

vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
Raging Turtle
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Reply #95 on: September 06, 2007, 03:13:35 PM

eldaec
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Reply #96 on: September 10, 2007, 02:45:38 PM

Promises promises...

Quote from: the wotc man
MO V3 UI Strike Team Mini Update

The team has been improving the UI for the past two months concentrating primarily on global display issues such as the display of magic cards, and the display of text.

In September I expect the following changes to appear on the beta client:

- Considerable improvement to card text alignment and legibility.
- Improved tool tip display.
- Significant reduction in the horizontal space used by the window frame.

Over the course of September and October I expect the following changes:

- Textures more appropriate for use as a background for text.
- Improved card art scans.
- Reduction in client download size
- More responsive client

While some of those will be ongoing efforts, I expect that starting in October to have more scene-by scene progress. Some scenes need some adjustments to have larger text or larger cards. Two scenes in particular need to be redone:

- In October I expect a new home page to be completed.
- In November or December I expect an expert-view duel scene to be completed.

I appreciate your continued feedback. It definitely makes a difference.

Erik


If that means what it should mean....

.... we can but hope.

"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular ­assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson
"Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
Margalis
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Reply #97 on: September 10, 2007, 09:09:46 PM

Why does it take them a month to do 2 days of work?

vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
Kitsune
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Reply #98 on: September 11, 2007, 01:18:01 AM

All team projects take about ten times longer than they ought to, it's the way the universe works.
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