Console Lineup: The Year Ahead

[Calantus]

That does look really nice. Although the first screeny has waaaay too much going on to be anything but painful. Pretty. But painful.

[Riggswolfe]

Freespace is real old (almost as old as the last WC), but I've never played the sequel (or the mods).

FS2 was '99 (I remember playing it at Turbine the day of release), but it went open source a few years back, and it still under active development. The most recent versions have been updated to include modern video card effects.

http://scp.indiegames.us/news.php

*sighs* This conversation makes me pine for Wing Commander again. I was more pissed about it going away than Ultima when Origins became nothing but UO.

[Moaner]

Those Trusy Bell shots look great.  The story sounds pretty compelling too.  I'm really looking forward to it and Blue Dragon. 

I hope these games catch on in Japan so we get more JRPG love on the 360.

[schild]

Doesn't matter. Blue Dragon and Trusty Bell are already getting released here. Trusty Bell is coming out here as Eternal Sonata. Big JRPGs are pretty much a lock for this generation.It's one of the categories that Microsoft and Ninty lagged in, as such, they're going to fight the real fight this time on that front. Sony will retaliate by releasing everything and eventually, it wouldn't shock me if English was on the japanese discs due to being region free.

Edit: What I meant was that JRPG performance [in Japan] doesn't matter much this time around. Most stuff is getting an NA release announcement long before JPY release these days.

[stray]

JRPG's are actually very hit and miss with me.

Scratch that, RPG's in general.

I'll play them, but I'm really just blown away by the technology here. Everything should be cel-shaded, if that's what it can look like.  I'd love to see a BG&E, JSRF, or Killer 7 on the 360 or PS3. Or even another attempt at 3D Street Fighter (maybe the time is right now).

[Riggswolfe]

I like cel-shading but it depends on how it was used. It was awesome in Rogue Galaxy but it only added to the childishness of Zelda: Wind Waker. Some genres should only rarely, if at all, have cel shading IMO. Shooters for instance should rarely have cel shading, if ever.

[stray]

I like cel-shading but it depends on how it was used. It was awesome in Rogue Galaxy but it only added to the childishness of Zelda: Wind Waker. Some genres should only rarely, if at all, have cel shading IMO. Shooters for instance should rarely have cel shading, if ever.

Yeah, but imagine Zelda if the quality was like Eternal Sonata.

...

Note: Just talking about quality, not style. Eternal Sonata might have what some would consider a kiddie style.

Just imagine Zelda with proportional bodies and heads, but with the same high quality cel-shading. ;)

[Margalis]

Peolel are complaining about kiddie looking games without picking on Blue Dragon? I don't see the appeal of that game at all.

http://media.xbox360.ign.com/media/728/728023/img_3928659.html

WTF. Seriously. I don't mind kiddie graphics or Akira Toriyama character designs in general but this is too far. I'd be embarrassed to even play this by myself. It looks like "My First RPG."

[Yegolev]

Time to go get that 360.  Also Valkyrie Profile while I am thinking about it.

[Riggswolfe]

Peolel are complaining about kiddie looking games without picking on Blue Dragon? I don't see the appeal of that game at all.

http://media.xbox360.ign.com/media/728/728023/img_3928659.html

WTF. Seriously. I don't mind kiddie graphics or Akira Toriyama character designs in general but this is too far. I'd be embarrassed to even play this by myself. It looks like "My First RPG."

I totally agree and yet it alone made 360s sell in Japan. Different strokes and all that. I bought Eternal Arms and I doubt I'll touch Blue Dragon.

[stray]

I think Blue Dragon looks great. To heck with you haters.

Though I think it looks more like game art than Trusty Bell. Trusty looks like an interactive cartoon.

Generally speaking though, it appeals more to me than Trusty (game/team/story wise etc).

...

It isn't selling as many copies in Japan as MS would like. Basically, the 360 has little hope for Japan. It'll probably appeal more to American and Euro gamers with a liking for Japanese sensibility than it will in Japan. Which is strange when you think about it. I don't think that's ever happened before.

[Riggswolfe]

Blue Dragon's main character looks like a 8 year old. My 8 year old spends her time playing with Barbie and on the computer. Not saving the world. Blech...

[Margalis]

You have to understand that JRPGs are to Japan as FPS games are to the US. An average FPS game in the US will sell pretty well. Same with an average JRPG in Japan. It is just a genre they really like over there. So the fact that Blue Dragon moved some 360s doesn't say anything to me.

[stray]

Blue Dragon has sold something like 140k. Mentioning 360 sales should be avoided. It's quite sad. Considering who's developing it. A game like that would sell at least three or four times as much on another system by now (including the PS3).

[edit] You're right about shooters though. Absolutely abysmal. Gears of War has only sold about 50,000 copies. Dead Rising and Lost Planet near 60,000. And those are the good numbers.

[Margalis]

I don't think who is developing Blue Dragon is all that impressive. Yeah, it is the "Final Fantasy guy" but at Square he had a hands-off role for years in part because people thought he had lost it a bit.

The last game he was heavily involved in was one of the SNES ones.

[schild]

You're confusing him with the guy who actually lost it - the FFT director.

Yea, he was heavily involved with the best games they ever made. Sakaguchi has wanted to deviate from the FF name for a while.

And seriously, Sakaguchi, Uematsu, and Toriyama is a dreamteam for the vast majority of RPG types who were around during the SNES period.

[stray]

I know this isn't the best example to mention here (since not everything is attached to a console purchase), but many RPG's in Japan, even without name backing, tend to sell 200 or 300k just on the first day. Big ones hit a million. 140k is pretty much unacceptable even if he wasn't that impressive (though he is).

[Trippy]

Blue Dragon has sold something like 140k. Mentioning 360 sales should be avoided. It's quite sad. Considering who's developing it. A game like that would sell at least three or four times as much on another system by now (including the PS3).

Microsoft has said they are in this for a long haul. As long as they are showing improvement they are happy. They sold a little more than half as many Xbox 360s in Japan compared to the PS3, which doesn't sound great but it's more than an order of magnitude better than what the Xbox has sold compared to the PS2 in Japan. If Microsoft and its partners can continue to release quality games that the Japanese like to play they will continue to gain ground in Japan given how badly the PS3 is performing there right now (it's being heavily discounted since retailers are having trouble selling them).

[schild]

Without name backing, RPGs do not sell 200-300k. There are companies there that WISH they could sell that much and they make solid games.

If by big ones you mean Dragon Quest, Tales, FF, and uhmmmmm, yea, that's about it. Those hit 1M+.

[stray]

Sorry, I meant without the name backing of....Well...Basically the three you mentioned. Heh. There are quite a few jrpgs that do pretty well besides them (then again, some of those other titles are still published by big name publishers, so...).

Basically though, I can see what MS was trying to accomplish here. Everything about that game makes complete sense. It should be doing more, so the results must be extremely disappointing to them.

Microsoft has said they are in this for a long haul. As long as they are showing improvement they are happy.

You think? I mean, I hear their PR people say they're happy all the time, but I can't believe that. They're losing wads of cash. And this is well beyond saying "It's a good start". They "started" long ago. They're actually at a mature stage right now.

It's not just racism either. Even a great core selling point of the 360, like Live, doesn't register with the Japanese market (and yeah, online isn't the biggest deal for Nintendo and Sony either). Sometimes it's all their fault for turning people off there. The same goes for Asia in general.

[Trippy]

Microsoft has said they are in this for a long haul. As long as they are showing improvement they are happy.

You think? I mean, I hear their PR people say they're happy all the time, but I can't believe that. They're losing wads of cash. And this is well beyond saying "It's a good start". They "started" long ago. They're actually at a mature stage right now.

It took Microsoft Word nine years to supplant WordPerfect as the number one selling word processing package. Yes they are in it for the long haul. The $289 million the Entertainment group lost last quarter is a drop in the bucket to the almost $3 billion Windows made for them last quarter and that doesn't count the over $2 billion Office made either. Microsoft can continue to lose hundreds of millions of dollars every quarter on the Xbox as long as their OS and office suite monopolies hold up.

[stray]

Fair enough. It's possible. Mind you, I don't want to see them fail. They have a lot of good companies that would fail with them.

I just think it's pretty bleak for them is all. They'd probably be making oodles of cash in Japan if they were just a game publisher though (then again, they'd still need to work on their marketing techniques).

Also, it should be mentioned that Word vs WordPerfect was at a time when Microsoft had a better reputation. Also, it's not games. Much more fickle, generally shitty bunch than people who care about word processors (just to point out the obvious).

[schild]

Stray, the odds of Microsoft failing or pulling out at this point are roughly the same as one of Geldon's crackpot theories coming true.

[stray]

No, I don't think they'll pull out. I just think they have a fat chance of ever gaining popularity enough in Japan to make a difference. Japan will always remain something they'll just write off as a loss, and hope other regions compensate for (and on that note, Europe should probably be a bigger concern to them than Japan).

The only way they would pull out completely is if they failed everywhere else, like XBox1. Which, almost definitely, won't happen again. Or, if some miracle happens where they realize that losing money is a bad thing, and their funds actually aren't unlimited (which could be a slight possibility if other things fail, like Vista). Probably won't happen either though.

One way I do think they could win the favor of Japanese gamers though (instead of that awful commercial) is impressing the arcade market first -- and then make those games exclusives on the 360 (or whatever future platform they release). That would be a longterm enterprise too though.

[EDIT] Or what I mean is, maybe they shouldn't try to force their way into RPG's and cute puzzle games just yet. Or shooters. Or Live. Basically, they need to do something on the level of reinventing themselves as Sega for people to give a shit about what they're doing. They need some street cred, man. 

[schild]

See, you're continuing under the assumption that Japan is important. In 2006, 1.4M PS2s were sold in Japan - total. In America, we did the same amount in December alone. Total, we did just under 5M PS2s in 2006. The biggest story in Japan is the DS/Lite obviously. We're pretty close to Japan in that and thrashing them in every single other system on the market. We're absolutely wrecking them in everything else. PSP? It took us 4 months to do what they did in a year. We do more 360s every month than they do in a year. Hell, we did 70,000 Gamecubes in December. They did 74,000 GCs in 2006. You think Japan really matters to American companies other than a couple more mouths to feed with games? Microsoft is going for world domination here. And honestly, at the end of the day, they very well could write off MS. Not that it matters, we're going to see lots and lots of games hit America first soon here.

It's tough to argue a country as being important for install base when the total number of gamers in Japan is less than you can find in one state in the union (OK, so I'm picking one of the more popular states. My point still stands.)

Edit: They don't need street cred. You can buy that. Raiden IV is a 360 exclusive. Cave is making a 360 game. Grev has a 360 game already - Senko no Ronde. Which is also coming out here. And that's just shooters off the top of my head. Seriously, the 360, if Microsoft keeps writing checks - could become the PS2 of this generation, unless the PS2 keeps selling like purified water.

[stray]

Buying street cred is pretty much the antithesis of gaining street cred.

I think Japan is important, if only because Japanese tastes are important. Disregard Japan, and you eventually disregard Japanese games that are also favored by many non-Japanese gamers. I'd rather see them trying to appeal to Japan and failing than not appealing to them at all -- Because that would eventually lead to a market saturated with only American games (i.e. if they gave up on Japan on that level, they'd end up not bothering with any of these cool games at all for American and Euro buyers).

[EDIT] As for street cred. I'm not trying to make a big deal out of it really. Street cred is needed anywhere you go. You can't just waltz into an existing market and try to push yourself around. That's like some jackass who invites himself to a party he wasn't even invited to. It has to be more from the ground up than that.

[Big Gulp]

That's like some jackass who invites himself to a party he wasn't even invited to. It has to be more from the ground up than that.

And somehow Sony was "invited to the party"?  Bullshit, these companies are in this business for the same damned reasons, to turn a profit, and that's the end of the story.  And for that matter, I'd say MS has been a hell of a lot more responsive to their customer-base than Sony has.  MS has been leaps and bounds ahead of anything Sony's done concerning community outreach, while Sony has been busy making retarded statement after retarded statement, putting their former dominance even further out of reach this gen.

Damn, man, can you not see it?  Sony's entire attitude for the past year has been "We've got umpteen million loyal followers from the PS2 who'll mindlessly follow our next system".  Hasn't seemed to have worked out too well for them, has it?

[stray]

The problem with Sony is price. It's not any more complex than that. Yes, Sony was invited to the party. A long time ago. People do actually want their machines (but they get pissed because they just can't or won't shell out that much). Sony doesn't have a problem with reputation per se, not in the games space at least (but I wouldn't disagree that they're being foolish and arrogant on how far they can ride on that).

[edit] Wasn't trying to get into a this vs that debate though. Just pointing out some problems with Microsoft's approach in Japan (regardless of what anyone else does).

[Strazos]

How about Japanese gamers just don't like change. Or they don't know a good thing when they see it.


And if Microsoft pulled the 360 out of Japan, that would not mean we would stop seeing any games at all come out of Japan. Those developers are not going anywhere.

[Riggswolfe]

Fuck you EA!

Wing Commander dogfights take place in a three dimensional environment, though the ships are constrained to a 2D playing field. The camera is fixed behind your ship with two levels of zoom for you to survey the area.

2D? Wing commander in 2D? Screw that. ::sighs::

Sorry, had to get that out of my system. Back to the Japan topic.

[stray]

Posted that on the last page.

Yeah, that sucks.

[stray]

Some new Heavenly Sword footage

Lookin hot

[stray]

Motorstorm -- Great, not fantastic. But probably the start of something fantastic. The racing engine itself is fun, visuals are pretty much the best any racing title has to offer so far, but as you've might have heard already, it's pretty slim in tracks and features. Hopefully DLC will help alleviate that, but I expect this franchise to only come into it's own if/when they release a sequel.

Haven't played online yet. This could change my opinion (for better or worse).

Still in the top tier of games to get if you have a PS3 though (the other two being Resistance and VF5). Three great games isn't too bad at this point imho.

Just to even out the post (and not just make it about Motorstorm):

PS3 Home video demo. Pretty much as expected... Habbo meets XBL meets Mii. Free of charge, but with micropayments (I'm assuming virtual Bravias?  ). 360 like achievements will be knick knacks in your virtual trophy room. There will be a third party effort in creating content as well. You get the rest....

Won't be out until Fall.


Little Big Planet -- Some neat looking platformer thing (from the Rag Doll Kung Fu guys). I'm guessing a PSN title.

..

Oh, and...

New Killzone 2 vid forthcoming! 

[schild]

So, despite all of my bitching about the situation SURROUNDING home. It's going to be AWESOME.

Heyaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. </littlejon>

[MisterNoisy]

PS3 Home video demo. Pretty much as expected... Habbo meets XBL meets Mii. Free of charge, but with micropayments (I'm assuming virtual Bravias?  ). 360 like achievements will be knick knacks in your virtual trophy room. There will be a third party effort in creating content as well. You get the rest....

Won't be out until Fall.


Little Big Planet -- Some neat looking platformer thing (from the Rag Doll Kung Fu guys). I'm guessing a PSN title.

Home i'm kind of on the fence about - I can see it being a big 'sticky' feature for some, but I don't think it'll be a huge deal for me personally - particularly if they end up sprinkling it heavily with ads to cover some of the costs - virtual Minority Report ftl.  LBP looks to be about a billion shades of awesome though.