Apple announces Apple TV and iPhone

[stray]

You guys crack me up.  :-D

[Trippy]

That phone looks fricking awesome.

I'm bummed, however, about the name change My first computer was an Apple ][+ and they will always be Apple Computer, Inc. to me.

[Big Gulp]

Taking a company from near bankruptcy to profitability is a feat, yes.  It's on the same order of magnitude as what Lee Iacocca did with Chrysler.

Taking a company from a garage software developer to an all encompassing juggernaut that controls every aspect of modern computing is a little bit more impressive.  Giving away billions to fight basic diseases in the third world (and outclassing the UN at the effort, to boot) is pure gravy.  What's Jobs done with his billions?  Apparently he's defrauded shareholders and enriched himself greatly through Disney.  But he's the "noble" guy.  My ass.

[Trippy]

Taking a company from a garage software developer to an all encompassing juggernaut that controls every aspect of modern computing is a little bit more impressive.  Giving away billions to fight basic diseases in the third world (and outclassing the UN at the effort, to boot) is pure gravy.  What's Jobs done with his billions?  Apparently he's defrauded shareholders and enriched himself greatly through Disney.  But he's the "noble" guy.  My ass.

Who said he's the noble guy?

[Big Gulp]

Who said he's the noble guy?

Not you, just paraphrasing the usual hosannas that are sung to Jobs while people talk about Gates like he's the scum on a peep show floor.

Look, I like the iPod and I like OSX.  I do not like Apple, and I do not like their business practices which I consider to be even worse than Mircrosoft's.  Their one saving grace is that they are not the ubiquitous computer company.

[stray]

Not to take anything away from Gates (because I do admire him), but just because you don't hear any press releases about Jobs' philanthropy doesn't mean he isn't charitable.

[naum]

Not to take anything away from Gates (because I do admire him), but just because you don't hear any press releases about Jobs' philanthropy doesn't mean he isn't charitable.

You guys do realize that the Gates Foundation is a colossal tax dodge that gives away only 5% while funneling money into oppressing the very people it claims to help...

[Big Gulp]

You guys do realize that the Gates Foundation is a colossal tax dodge that gives away only 5% while funneling money into oppressing the very people it claims to help...

The LA Times???  Why not just quote Pravda?

[Trippy]

I grew up in the Valley so the stories about Steve Jobs throwing tantrums and ripping into people and generally just being an unstable meglomanical control freak are part of the lore here. There are also stories about how like when he acquired Pixar he basically screwed over almost everybody in terms of their previous share ownership except for some key people. Of course if he hadn't bought them out they wouldn't be here today so there's something to be said for that. On the other hand his famed "reality distortion field" doesn't seem to be diminishing even though he's mellowing a bit with age (and having a bout with cancer) so people tend to buy into whatever it is that's he's trying to sell at the moment.

[naum]

I grew up in the Valley so the stories about Steve Jobs throwing tantrums and ripping into people and generally just being an unstable meglomanical control freak are part of the lore here. There are also stories about how like when he acquired Pixar he basically screwed over almost everybody in terms of their previous share ownership except for some key people. Of course if he hadn't bought them out they wouldn't be here today so there's something to be said for that. On the other hand his famed "reality distortion field" doesn't seem to be diminishing even though he's mellowing a bit with age (and having a bout with cancer) so people tend to buy into whatever it is that's he's trying to sell at the moment.

Steve Jobs is an A-hole. No argument there... ...and I admit he makes Gates look like a choir boy...

Just challenging the foolish notion that Bill Gates is deserving of sainthood...

[Margalis]

I like guys like Jobs and James Cameron, maybe because I can identify with them. Crazy, angry, competent perfectionists.

[naum]

Favorite Jobs story was when a journo asked him, a while back during his first run at Apple Computer, about the networking capabilities in the new Apple machine rolling out. To which he responded by throwing a floppy disk and hitting the questioner smack in the face and then responded "Here's your goddamned network"...

[bhodi]

Will the iPhone backdate my apple stock?

[Viin]

Oh the woes of humanity.

Naum, I take it you only run Macs? Or do you have a Linux desktop you want to stream audio/video from?

[WindiaN]

80GB iPod? What the heck are you putting on there?

I have 55gb of music on my non-video iPod. If you have been in college in the last 2 years and been able to take advantage of shared iTunes networks you'd know how easy it is to get 10gb of music in a day. As soon as I can put videos on there that shit will at least need to double so I'll probably need a 120gb. Although I don't need to have all my videos on my iPod all the time whereas I'd like to have all my music on there so 80 might suffice as long as I don't expand my music collection.

[Strazos]

Yeah, easy to get if you steal it. And I was in college, and graduated, within the last 2 years Thankyouverymuch.

I don't steal music. Period. I support the artists I really like. Because of that, my collection of ripped music amounts to under 3GB. Which matters not a wit to me, as I don't listen to those songs much when I'm not in the car. And half the time, when I'm listening while at the PC, it's internet radio stuff.

/tangent_off

[stray]

I've been buying albums since I was 8 or 9 (Licensed to Ill being the first heh). And CD's for longer than 10 years. Even counting the crap I discarded or lost, sold or gave away, that would still be over a thousand albums of music and audio. This goes without mentioning going absolutely crazy when eMusic first came out (they used to have a flat fee). I've filled up smaller iPods, and still have almost 2 CD's spindles' worth of ripped audio laying around besides that. I don't even keep everything on my hard drive.

[naum]

Oh the woes of humanity.

Naum, I take it you only run Macs? Or do you have a Linux desktop you want to stream audio/video from?

Macs only, though I have one Linux box.

I already stream music via AirTunes/AirportExpress (and all my Macs can talk to eachother and share back and forth even without the Airport unit)… …can also plug in my iPod to TV easily, but the encoded video way too compressed for showing on 56" screen… …the Apple TV is of interest because it will let me stream HD and higher res video along with any other ripped video/audio (I  am dumping satellite and going to go with just budgeting money to buy shows online or get 'em from the library or discount bins…)… …I didn't realize XBOX 360 was capable of streaming HD video from my computer, or even that it was capable of streaming wireless audio… …of course, that seems an excessive price for a device to just do that as I haven't seen much in gaming offerings to sway me to buy one… (thought about it but then discovered Madden and FIFA games had less teams on XBOX 360 version and to me, it's all about the gameplay, not the graphics…).

Can XBOX 360 do 802.11n?

[stray]

Yeah, through an add on card.

[naum]

Yeah, through an add on card.

Probably need to splurge on remote control unit too - I don't see it listed as coming in the box…

[stray]

Yeah, it doesn't come with any of the systems.

It's this little adaptor thing here (it's USB based, not a card actually).

[Margalis]

One thing interesting here is how MS has been trying for a decade to get an all-in-one media-center thing going, and Apple comes in and pulls out the rug from under them in their first attempt. MS has tried XBox, WebTV, MS Media Center crap, etc...none of it has stuck though.

[stray]

Sony is trying to get in on the same game too. With the PS3, and they're also adding in a module that attaches to their Bravia TV's.

With all of Apple's ties to content providers though (at least so far with music), they might have the best chance at winning.

[Margalis]

Apple has ties to content providers, good software and good hardware. They make stuff you want to use, whereas MS makes stuff you can tolerate using.

[Jeff Kelly]

How does the phone work, do you have to subscribe to a service from Apple or can you just move a GSM chip from your current phone into the iPhone?  If the latter I'm sure the mobile companies will be tripping over themselves to subsidize the price in return for a two or three year commitment.

"Cingular has a multi year exclusive contract with Apple Inc." as has been stated on the Keynote by the Cingular CEO. iPhones will only be sold with Cingular Service through Apple Stores or Cingular Stores.

[Jeff Kelly]

Everybody that rips on the iPhone should just watch the Keynote presentation.

Basically the iPhone, as far as usability and features is concerned wipes the floor with any Smartphone offering out there while being the same price as a treo or Windows Mobile 5 device.

You might not like Apple or its CEO but that thing seems to be really good, but the exclusivity deal with cingular sucks big.

And keep the Gates/Jobs is God/devils' incarnate out of this thread, that's what politics is for.

[Tebonas]

But that restriction is only true for the US market. Lets see how things will unfold in Europe.

[schild]

Wanna know where they got it wrong?

SMS
iPhone includes an SMS application with a predictive QWERTY soft keyboard that prevents and corrects mistakes, making it easier and more efficient to use than the small plastic keyboards on many smartphones.

Worthless phone. Sorry. With exclusivity with Cingular, the only result of this would be I buy a blackberry or sidekick if I was going to switch carriers. People can yammer about this thing as much as they want about its beauty, its design, whatever. But this motherfucker is not utilitarian in the least bit.

2 years ago I'd be fighting myself big on the whole SMS thing. But it's damned amazing how much more useful that is than integrating a goddamn camera or video into a phone. Or even an MP3 player. How often can I sit around and shut off the world while listening to music anyway. As such, my next phone needs to have a full sized keyboard that slides out to the side, pops open like the sidekick, or replaces the standard keypad (yes, one of those small ones would work). T9Word sucks my balls. I'll take cramped space over that shit. On that note, Apple provides me with none of that. But it does provide me with a phone that would get scratched to all hell and guaranteed broken within a year. I'm careful with my phones as I am with most electronics. But it would be a damn lie to say that I've never dropped my phone while trying to put it back in my pocket or while taking it out to receive a call. I suppose Apple would be full of themselves enough to think everyone would get a bluetooth mic so they can be hip.

[Trippy]

There are only two GSM carriers in the US -- Cingular (now AT&T) and T-Mobile and T-Mobile has a much smaller network (though they can share AT&Ts with no roaming charges) so really who else is Apple going to partner with?  This is meant to be an international phone* -- as in quad-band GSM -- so none of this (mostly) US-only CDMA crap (I say this as a person so likes being able to use my GSM phone in the US *and* other countries) so Verizon and Sprint need not apply.

*Edit: for those who haven't been following the details the plan is to release in Europe by the end of 2007 and in Asia sometime in 2008.

[Trippy]

Everybody that rips on the iPhone should just watch the Keynote presentation.

Basically the iPhone, as far as usability and features is concerned wipes the floor with any Smartphone offering out there while being the same price as a treo or Windows Mobile 5 device.

Yeah I just finished watching the keynote and I'll repeat what I said earlier: that thing is fricking awesome.

I don't even care about the phone features -- what I've been wanting since I first used the WAP browser on my old Sprint phone is a true pocket-sized Internet browsing device. Unfortunately it may be a whee bit early in terms of usability. EDGE isn't so hot and the 3G network is still being built out here in the US. If you have Wi-Fi access everything is great -- otherwise the user browsing experience probably isn't so hot. Maybe in another year when they introduce a 3G version of the iPhone and they build out the network some more things will be better at least around where I live.

[Big Gulp]

of course, that seems an excessive price for a device to just do that as I haven't seen much in gaming offerings to sway me to buy one…

Umm, it's the same price as Apple TV, does everything the Apple TV does, but with a DVD drive and it plays games...  What exactly is overpriced again?

[stray]

What exactly is overpriced again?

The Microsoft product is $299 and YOUR SOUL.  :-D

[Trippy]

One thing interesting here is how MS has been trying for a decade to get an all-in-one media-center thing going, and Apple comes in and pulls out the rug from under them in their first attempt. MS has tried XBox, WebTV, MS Media Center crap, etc...none of it has stuck though.

As others have saying the Xbox 360 + Media Connect can do similar things as the Apple TV except that Media Connect from what I understand only streams, you can't store/sync content through Media Connect onto the Xbox 360 (you can presumably manually copy some of that stuff over) while the Apple TV has a built-in hard drive (which the Core doesn't have) so it's "self-contained" once you load it up with suff -- i.e. you don't need to have your PC running at the same time if the Apple TV hard drive has the content.

However I don't get the impression that Microsoft has been promoting Media Connect much for some reason, though that will presumably change now with Apple's announcement.

[naum]

of course, that seems an excessive price for a device to just do that as I haven't seen much in gaming offerings to sway me to buy one…

Umm, it's the same price as Apple TV, does everything the Apple TV does, but with a DVD drive and it plays games...  What exactly is overpriced again?

No it's not.

Extra money for 802.11n. ($99)

Extra money for remote control.

Extra money for HD (and HD 2x smaller). ($99)

Add those "extras" up that come with Apple TV, and that's almost double the price...

[Big Gulp]

Add those "extras" up that come with Apple TV, and that's almost double the price...

You don't need the remote with the XBox's Media Center, the controller works just fine with it.

Add a DVD drive to Apple TV...  Oh wait, you can't.

Add gaming to Apple TV...  Oh wait, you can't.

Add the free On Demand set up they'll be rolling out shortly in conjunction with cable companies...  Oh wait, you can't.

Christ, I hate Appletards.