Wii Q&A Thread

[Margalis]

Have to agree with Schildy here. There's been no issue with getting Wiis here since, you know, Christmas.

This last weekend was the first time Wiis have been widely available in the greater Boston area.

Anyway I do hate it when companies re-release and "remix" games. Just include a classic, unchanged mode! I don't want a new translation, some new systems, some new characters, etc. Sure you can include that junk but give me a choice to turn it off and play the game I want to play.

[Velorath]

I just got burnt by Nintendo.

Though it'll probably hit the PS3. Guilty Gear XX Accent Core (the last of the Guilty Gear series it would seem, final revision if you will, until a true sequel) was just announced for the Wii in today's Famitsu.To say the very least, they had BETTER come out with a motherfucking Hori or Sanwa-based joystick or I will put my Wii through a glass door.

From IGN:

Following up on last week's announcement of Guilty Gear X2 Accent Core for the Wii, we've learned that Arc System Works is planning on including waggle controls! With this control scheme, you use the nunchuk analog stick to move your character and guard. The nunchuk and Wiimote can be shaken to perform standard attacks. You perform specials by holding buttons while shaking.

Don't worry purists. The game will also support the Classic Controller.

Fans of Guilty Gear will likely be interested in the new mode of play Arc is adding for the Wii version. Now, when you select your character, you can also select a battle system. The game lets you switch between the battle systems from previous Guilty Gear titles.

The Wii gets its first 2D fighter on 7/26. We'll let you know how it feels to shake for special moves.

An action/adventure Soul Calibur game with Wiimote sword fighting has also been announced today.


Edit:  And back on the subject of Square for a minute, while I think their recent output hasn't been particularly great, I'm interested in hearing more about The Last Remnant (especially since it's supposedly going to be on the 360 as well as the PS3)

[Azazel]

Have to agree with Schildy here. There's been no issue with getting Wiis here since, you know, Christmas.

This last weekend was the first time Wiis have been widely available in the greater Boston area.

Anyway I do hate it when companies re-release and "remix" games. Just include a classic, unchanged mode! I don't want a new translation, some new systems, some new characters, etc. Sure you can include that junk but give me a choice to turn it off and play the game I want to play.

I was agreeing that it's an artificial crock, IMO. Not that they haven't been consistantly hard to find in the US. I agree wholeheartedly on your remix comment, though. Well, except I don't mind a meeting of the two as a third option - unaltered original gameplay with updated gfx.

An action/adventure Soul Calibur game with Wiimote sword fighting has also been announced today.

Well, that's something I could get into. If it skips all of the upfront bullshit that both Zelda and that shooter-with-sword (red steel?) game have.

[schild]

I commented on Soul Caliber on another forum.

Another example of a series where a lot of the appeal was how gorgeous it was - and it ends up on the Wii.

Meh.

Edit: Wiimote won't be fast enough to make Soul Caliber fun, so sorry. Just Not Even Remotely Realistic.

Edit2: It won't even be fast enough for a Soul Caliber Action game. Everyone will just be throwing their arm around. Especially if it focuses on Siegfried.

[Velorath]

You don't like the Wii.  We get it.

[schild]

You don't like the Wii.  We get it.

Actually it's much like the DS. I love the DS now because it's functionality is used in ways that make sense for the system. Right now the Wii is just being used to shoehorn in some bullshit and to make cheaper games. It's basically the poor man's next gen system at this point. Only it's not next gen AND it's overpriced.

[Margalis]

You don't like the Wii.  We get it.

You'll have to copy/paste that about a thousand more times.

[HaemishM]

An action/adventure Soul Calibur game with Wiimote sword fighting has also been announced today.

If I was a big girl, I'd go SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

[Furiously]

So pretty much you're going "SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!"?

[HaemishM]

My pigtails are certainly twitching with anticipation.

[Velorath]

A new Rygar game for the Wii just got announced too.  That's not as big as the Soul Calibur announcment, but I loved Rygar on the NES (was better than the arcade version to me), and the PS2 game was pretty cool also.

[Azazel]

I commented on Soul Caliber on another forum.
Another example of a series where a lot of the appeal was how gorgeous it was - and it ends up on the Wii.

Because, of course, the Wii can't put out visuals as good as the PS2 or XBox...

[Margalis]

The PS2 Rygar was pretty cool though far too short and repetitive. (Odd combination)

[schild]

I commented on Soul Caliber on another forum.
Another example of a series where a lot of the appeal was how gorgeous it was - and it ends up on the Wii.

Because, of course, the Wii can't put out visuals as good as the PS2 or XBox...

Even with the green I'm commenting on this. When Soul Caliber 1 came out, it was A REVELATION. When Soul Caliber 2 hit the Xbox, it was simply incredible looking. It wasn't until Soul Caliber 3 that things went downhill and even then, it was the best looking PS2 game - period. It still is. I can understand the reason it went to the PS2 and I'm OK with that. Install base. Now, this isn't a main part of the SC timeline, but rather just an action. But still, it makes me wonder if this is just Nintendo being thrown a bone, or if there's an actual problem here - since Nintendo has neither the nicest visuals or the largest install base...

[stray]

I'll end up being happy with the Wii especially if some developers start developing more Adventure games like they've been doing on the DS. Or ideas like Lost in Blue or Trauma Center (which is slowly happening). I'd like to see a repeat of some of the original thinking that was put into some GC titles as well (like Animal Crossing).

Basically, I'm after quirky and/or innovative software (or at the very least, neglected gameplay genres). Having a unique control scheme will contribute to new ideas for games, but hardware isn't exactly why I bought a Wii. I bought it because Nintendo seems to do a good job at encouraging unique gameplay ideas, funky controller or not. So I look forward to when more of these titles start getting cranked out.

I don't care too much for party games. And I don't care to play games like the ones that I'll be seeing on the PS3 or 360, except downgraded and with a neat controller. I'm pretty sure that the only exception I can make in this category is Metroid Prime sequels. Those are pretty much guaranteed to kick ass.... Because even though they may resemble a thing or two about shooters and action games on other platforms, they're also marked with ideas that other games don't have.

As for Soul Calibur third person action/adventure games? Nah. I would rather see it somewhere else, with new gen visuals. Played with a normal gamepad. If I could get a story based Soul game with high production values, then I'd easily take it over a less pretty Wiimote version. Maybe I'm lacking imagination on what exactly is possible with a Wiimote in that genre, but I just don't see any real benefits it has over a hypothetical PS3 or 360 version with a gamepad.

[stray]

it was the best looking PS2 game - period. It still is

Derail, but I disagree 




Runner Up (at least in motion):




[EDIT] Oops! That GG shot was an arcade screen. Oh well. We'll just say it was the best looking game on Dreamcast hardware then. 

[schild]

Guilty Gear looks much better on a NAOMI set than the PS2. I was wondering why it was so crisp.

And honestly, I think SC3 looks better than ZOE2.

[stray]

I'm a sucker for particle effects, I guess.

I mean, I was able to praise Shadowbane, of all things, because of them. 


I still think GG on PS2 is better than anything 3D.

[Velorath]

Even with the green I'm commenting on this. When Soul Caliber 1 came out, it was A REVELATION. When Soul Caliber 2 hit the Xbox, it was simply incredible looking. It wasn't until Soul Caliber 3 that things went downhill and even then, it was the best looking PS2 game - period. It still is. I can understand the reason it went to the PS2 and I'm OK with that. Install base. Now, this isn't a main part of the SC timeline, but rather just an action. But still, it makes me wonder if this is just Nintendo being thrown a bone, or if there's an actual problem here - since Nintendo has neither the nicest visuals or the largest install base...

Games like God of War, MGS, and FF have a lot of focus on graphics too, but I'm not going to get upset everytime they put games in those series on portables.  The fact that I can't stand staring at a tiny screen will keep me from ever playing God of War: Chains of Olympus , or Final Fantasy: Dissidia, but I'm not going to go around bitching everytime a game that sounds interesting gets announced for a portable because... well, because that shit gets old after a while.

[Azazel]

Even with the green I'm commenting on this. When Soul Caliber 1 came out, it was A REVELATION. When Soul Caliber 2 hit the Xbox, it was simply incredible looking. It wasn't until Soul Caliber 3 that things went downhill and even then, it was the best looking PS2 game - period. It still is. I can understand the reason it went to the PS2 and I'm OK with that. Install base. Now, this isn't a main part of the SC timeline, but rather just an action. But still, it makes me wonder if this is just Nintendo being thrown a bone, or if there's an actual problem here - since Nintendo has neither the nicest visuals or the largest install base...

[schild]

Even with the green I'm commenting on this. When Soul Caliber 1 came out, it was A REVELATION. When Soul Caliber 2 hit the Xbox, it was simply incredible looking. It wasn't until Soul Caliber 3 that things went downhill and even then, it was the best looking PS2 game - period. It still is. I can understand the reason it went to the PS2 and I'm OK with that. Install base. Now, this isn't a main part of the SC timeline, but rather just an action. But still, it makes me wonder if this is just Nintendo being thrown a bone, or if there's an actual problem here - since Nintendo has neither the nicest visuals or the largest install base...

Games like God of War, MGS, and FF have a lot of focus on graphics too, but I'm not going to get upset everytime they put games in those series on portables.  The fact that I can't stand staring at a tiny screen will keep me from ever playing God of War: Chains of Olympus , or Final Fantasy: Dissidia, but I'm not going to go around bitching everytime a game that sounds interesting gets announced for a portable because... well, because that shit gets old after a while.

Yea, well, that's good that you don't like portable systems. I do, and I don't see the value in Final Fantasy 4 GBA being released with FInal Fantasy IV remade for the DS being released a year later. I want the story of fucking Cecil the Dark Knight on my motherfucking PS3 or 360.

[stray]

The PSP isn't that far off from the PS2's graphics capabilities (of course, it's doing it at a lower resolution, so that isn't to say it's actually as powerful as the PS2). There's less of an argument there as far as games like God of War being "downgraded" with that system than there is with the DS.


Mind you, I still think DS is a better handheld than the PSP any day, but I thought that needed to be pointed out.

[Velorath]

Yea, well, that's good that you don't like portable systems. I do

Which is more or less the point.  I don't like portable systems, but other people do, hence why when someone mentions a DS or PSP game around here I don't make a point to comment about how it would be so much better on a console.  Likewise, whenever a game gets announced for the Wii, I think it's silly to go on about how much better the game could be if they made it for the PS3 or the 360.  There's a point where one just has to accept that there are other people whose tastes are being catered too by developers as well.  People apparently like the Wii and developers are announcing games for it.  It's something you're just going to have to get used to.

This isn't a response to the whole Final Fantasy IV thing.  It's a response to how when games like Nights, Guilty Gear, Soul Calibur Legends, get announced for the Wii, you get upset.  Even the rumor of Mikami and Kojima making a Wii game set you off.  You started off complaining largely about how there was going to be a lack of 3rd party stuff just like with the GC.  Now you seem to be complaining that developers should be moving all their crappy franchises over to the Wii and leave the good stuff on the PS3 and 360 because the Wii is just incapable of doing any of it justice.

[schild]

While everyone else is pussy footing around saying how great the Wii is, at least I realize it's just the cheap-underperforming underdog that's slowing down the natural progression of things by a few years. Guilty Gear should have gone to the 360, XBL enabled, and with hi-res 2D sprites. Everyone knows Arc System Works knows how to do them - and well. Great Graphics are a hallmark of the SC series, and given the install base and prior releases for the xbox, SC whatever should have gone to the 360 as well. And the PS3.

As for Mikami and Kojima, simply put, I think it's a waste of their talents and unless they're making a rail shooter, I don't see anything they make benefitting more from the Wiimote than they would with hi-def graphics..

And I do want third party stuff on the Wii. Most definately. Just not stuff that doesn't belong there. I think every arcade shooter from Sega and Namco should end up on the Wii. It makes sense. Though the Wii might not be able to handle Lindbergh graphics, I'm still shocked Time Crisis 4 was announced for the PS3 before a single rail shooter was announced for the Wii. But fighting titles and games super heavy in fast action content? They simply don't belong there. The system isn't built for it.

[stray]

My two cents: It's king of hard "getting used to" this whole "other people's tastes" thing simply because we've never really been faced with a situation like this before. A situation where one of the new consoles is, technically speaking, in the same power range as consoles from the past. And not only that, where that console is the most likely candidate to be the dominant one.

What I mean is, before, it didn't really matter as much whether something went to the Xbox or PS2 or Gamecube (or even DC to an extent). You didn't have these strange excuses like "other people's tastes have to be taken into account" when it game to game licenses you were looking forward to. You didn't have to worry about the "next Soul Calibur title" being on a less powerful system. All the systems were roughly the same, no matter which one you preferred. They were all capable of producing the same results. If you were looking forward to a Soul Calibur, then you were going to get it as good as it was going to be no matter where you went. The grass was never greener on the other side of the fence.

This is the way consoles have been before that as well. Roughly equal power between the different systems on the market is a standard expectation I've grown to expect with each console generation.


That isn't to say that I (and I bet even Schild) won't get used to it (at least I know I'm able to appreciate good game design, no matter what hardware it's on), but you can't expect gamers to just roll over about it like nothing happened. It's a legitimate complaint -- for the reasons that I said above: That Nintendo has broken tradition as far as how upgrade paths go. When things have been done the opposite way for decades, then we have a right to complain when someone departs from that. There's nothing unreasonable/asshole-ish about it.


[EDIT] As for Guilty Gear, this is where I disagree with Schild. Sure, it'd be fantastic with HD sprites and XBL, but I can still be quite happy with it on the Wii. I'm sure it'll still look quite fine in 480p ws.

Besides, like I said earlier in this thread, I'm digging that little Classic Controller anyways. So it'd be a bonus if I could use that in a fighting game. :-D

[Margalis]

It's not like they are going to completely redraw GG anyway. It makes zero difference what system it is on. If it were to come out for the PS3 or 360 it would use the same sprites that it does in the arcade, which are the same sprites it has used for the past 5 years. It really makes no difference at all. It's a 2D game with all the sprites drawn at a fixed resolution.

Also GG isn't exactly technically demanding...it could be done on any system from the Dreamcast up.

[stray]

The art wouldn't change, of course, but high definition televisions do benefit from having the sprites in higher resolutions.

480p still isn't bad though. It's just that it could be done better (besides that, it'd be better to start from the ground up in HD, and then downgrade to 480 for a Wii port imho).

In the end, the difference will be told between the SF 2 Turbo that's being cooked up for the Playstation and XBox and this new GG game.

[EDIT]

On the other hand, I can see why they'd want to postpone upgrading Guilty Gear for now. Too much work, and more than likely, little payoff for the time being.

Capcom has to redraw all of the Street Fighter artwork from scratch. Accent Core really just has to recycle all of previous resources from older GG games --- and they'll probably make as much or more cash than Capcom selling SF2 over the 360's and PS3's online stores.

[Azazel]

This thread's latest turn amuses me.

[stray]

What happened now?

[schild]

Stray the reason I said the Wii just isn't fit for fighting titles at this point (aside from the obvious graphics/sound issues) is I have 2 DOA 4 sticks for the 360 and I have a HRAP for the PS3. That's to say, a d-pad isn't going to cut it. Particularly not in Guilty Gear.

[stray]

I understand. Personally speaking though, I prefer a nice gamepad. At least nowadays I do.

I wouldn't expect anyone else to though.

[Velorath]

That Nintendo has broken tradition as far as how upgrade paths go. When things have been done the opposite way for decades, then we have a right to complain when someone departs from that. There's nothing unreasonable/asshole-ish about it.

Nintendo pretty much had to brake tradition.  They aren't Sony or MS.  Hell, how many years has MS been in the console business now, and they're saying that next year might finally be the year that they make a profit?  How many other businesses do you think can operate like that?  Beyond that, look what Sony and MS have brought to the market this time around.  One gave us a console with a $600 price tag sure to alienate half of the user base it built up with its predecessor, and the other gave us a $400 console, that even a year after release still has issues that cause it to just up and die on people.  Rather than Nintendo holding things back, it looks more like Sony and MS tried to move too far ahead, too quickly.

Don't get me wrong, I love my 360.  Sure I've got to treat the thing like the Bubble Boy and try to shield it from everything that might harm its frail body lest it go to sleep one day never to awake, but I love the games.  I don't even own a Wii, and I'm not in any particular hurry to get one.  I still think it's a good thing for the market in general though in that it's drawing people in at a time when the other two consoles are doing their best to push people away, and if good games keep getting announced for it, so much the better.

[Margalis]

GG Accent Core is a port of an existing arcade game. There is no chance in hell they would redraw the sprites for a home system release - it is an absolute non-issue.

As far as gamepad/stick goes, you can get adapters that make sticks work for different systems.

[stray]

It's also going to PS2, I believe. So.... If you have sticks for that, that's another option.

[Alkiera]

The Wii is a pop culture smash of such dimensions that Nintendo still can't make consoles fast enough

I love that sentence. Everyones using it today.

It's such a crock of bullshit.

There is nothing about the Wii that would create a problem with production. It is complete and utter press made bullshit.

Have to agree with Schildy here. There's been no issue with getting Wiis here since, you know, Christmas. Sure we're a much smaller market, but still...

People at retail locations here in Rochester, NY, (Hit BB, TRU, Target today) are still saying they sell out in under half an hour.  The TRU guy said they expect them to be difficult to get for the next year or so, which is INSANE.  Someone mentioned WiiHunt.com here before, and they only seem to know about Circuit City in this area, none of the other retailers are listed.  I've also never seen it say that CC has them in stock.

As to why they are so hard to produce in numbers, I don't know.  It's not the Wiimote, 'cause there's a bunch of those on shelves.  The rest of the internals aren't all that special, with the possible exception of the slot-loading optical drive that accepts multiple sizes of disc.  I've had slot-loading drives in my PC for awhile, and haven't yet seen one that will accept the smaller non-standard CD/DVDs.  Maybe that's what it is.

For me, the Wii is about all the games that aren't the big sellers.  I can't stand trying to FPS with a thumbstick.  I'm less interested in team sports titles than you can imagine.  I'm not very good at 3rd person action/adventure titles, so the 'zomg hard!!11' ones are a big lose with me.  I've not been really interested in where Square has gone with the jRPG genre post FF7, either.  Stuff like Super Mario 64 I really enjoyed.  What I've seen of Paper Mario (yay, emulators) was a lot of fun.  Super Mario RPG was enjoyable.  I've enjoyed Zelda in several incarnations.

Sure, I'll miss out on the big exclusive titles, or have them cut down visually for the Wii...  but I'm playing on a standard def 20" CRT... and have no plans to upgrade any time soon.

If I got another console, I'd always feel I should be buying these other titles, because other people are, even when I don't like playing them.  With the Wii, I can avoid that, because the titles I don't care for mostly aren't available, or are so changed that they might be interesting.

Between that, and good BC to game cube games, I'm sold.

--
Alkiera
(I expect this post will make schild's head explode.  Oh well.)