Online Gambling/Gaming Crackdown?

[Issele]

Where this is basicly having to do with regulating online gambling:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/5397920.stm

Shares of online gaming firms have plunged after the US Congress passed a bill cracking down on internet gambling, threatening their business.
Shares in Partygaming were down 58% at close of London trade, while shares in 888 Holdings tumbled by 26%.

Sportingbet shares dropped by 64% while Empire Online shares slid by 25%.

Several firms have said they could stop taking bets from US customers if the bill is signed into law by President George W Bush in the next two weeks.

The law, part of a sustained clampdown on online gaming in the US, would make it illegal for banks and credit card firms to process online gaming payments from the US.

"Company's can no longer except US Credit Cards or paypal for on line gaming-- On friday under the disguise of a homeland security port security bill the government supported by house majority leader Bill Frist placed in that no US online gaming including video games and gambling outlets can except US credit cards or online payment methods such as paypal or another"

This quote stated gaming in general:

"The law, part of a sustained clampdown on online gaming in the US, would make it illegal for banks and credit card firms to process online gaming payments from the US."

     

[Abagadro]

Why is this in "Useless" news. This is actually a big deal. They stuck it into the Port Security bill over the weekend. It therefore took most people by surprise that it passed.  The poker forums are going nuts.

[Issele]

Why is this in "Useless" news. This is actually a big deal. They stuck it into the Port Security bill over the weekend. It therefore took most people by surprise that it passed.  The poker forums are going nuts.

Maybe on of the Mods could move it to the Gaming Forums.   

[Nebu]

Similar post found in Politics.

[Sky]

Isn't gambling illegal?

[Llava]

Not if you were to fly to the countries in which these businesses are centered and just do your gambling there.  The end result is the same if we can do it remotely, except that we don't have to shell out hundreds of dollars on a plane ticket.

Basically, the government's complaint here is that it's too convenient.

[tazelbain]

So you want to be governed by the laws of the country the website you are visiting not the laws of the country you are in?

[Sky]

That'd make things a lot nicer for kiddie porn.

[Llava]

So you want to be governed by the laws of the country the website you are visiting not the laws of the country you are in?

Fair enough point.

But let's not forget that gambling is a far cry from kiddie porn.

That I'm a libertarian in many ways causes great frustration for me over the illegality of gambling, which I'd label as less destructive to society than alcohol.

[Nebu]

My guess is that this isn't being born out of the evils of gambling.  It's an issue of lost revenues and lobbying interests. 

[Sky]

I tend to agree with Nebu's assessment. Same thing as marijuana, it's not that it's worse than alcohol, it's just harder to monetize and control and frankly, it's lobby group is fucking ridiculous (I used to be active in NORML, it's pathetic).

Gulf War 1 vet buddy of mine will probably be doing time for ten plants in his yard, his personal stash. The 'worst' part was two ounces in the freezer, they're pushing felony intent to distribute  Blows my mind that a hardworking vet could do hard time for growing a fucking plant.

His neighbors ratted him. I told him to tell them he'll put in a meth lab next. But seriously, he's now leaving the state to move somewhere with laxer legislation and considering leaving the country he risked his life to defend. That's fucked up.

Sorry for the minirant.

[Nebu]

There are two reasons for the illegalization of marijuana: the tobacco and liquor lobbies. 

[Samwise]

Wasn't the cotton lobby also involved at some point?

[XboxGod]

Online gambling has always technically been illegal, this bill just makes it illegal for banks to process transactions to and from these sites. Unless they do something to prevent transactions to middlemen like Neteller and Firepay, this bill is esentially useless, as most credit card companies have long declined these transactions. What a bunch of bullshit. Just another example of how our government has become the moral gustapo.

[Llava]

So here's a question.

This is federal, right?

So if I live in Vegas, that would make it illegal for me to gamble online, right?

If so, uh, why?

[Cyrrex]

Just a speculation on my part:  There are gambling commissions that regulate things in casinos, such as the payout rates on machines and so on.  Would it not be a problem for them to regulate the myriad of online offerings to ensure that the average joe isn't getting cheated?

[tazelbain]

Only if the site was in Vegas also. Otherwise it is interstate or international commerce and federal government has clear jurisdiction.

If they start hauling average folks in to jail over this I'd be against it.  But additional banking restrictions to encourage people to follow the law seems usually even-handed for congress (probably for politcal reasons).

[Llava]

So it's legal where I live.

And it's legal where it's taking place.

But because the information crosses over an area where it's illegal, the whole thing becomes illegal.

Ooooooookay.

[tazelbain]

So it's legal where I live.

And it's legal where it's taking place.

But because the information crosses over an area where it's illegal, the whole thing becomes illegal.

Ooooooookay.

Since money can be transfered as information, yes.
Gambling is legal in Neveda if you follow the laws and regulations.

[Yegolev]

"Company's can no longer except US Credit Cards or paypal for on line gaming-- On friday under the disguise of a homeland security port security bill the government supported by house majority leader Bill Frist placed in that no US online gaming including video games and gambling outlets can except US credit cards or online payment methods such as paypal or another"

Jeez, what star journalist wrote that piece of excellent copy?

[HaemishM]

So it's legal where I live.

And it's legal where it's taking place.

But because the information crosses over an area where it's illegal, the whole thing becomes illegal.

Ooooooookay.

It makes about as much sense as my state's law that stated gambling was illegal, unless it was on a boat that was floating on an international body of water (which apparently included the Mississippi River 50 miles inland and directly on the Gulf Coast, which is not outside the 3-mile international waters line) or an Indian reservation. Thankfully, this idiotic law has been changed because of the damage inflicted on the casinos from Katrina. That's the one good thing to have come out of that disaster.

[Yegolev]

So, Mississippi is now a real gambling state rather than a gimped one?

[HaemishM]

I think so. Of course, it may still be that you can only build the casinos where you could before (as in, you couldn't put one in Jackson, you'd still have to be beside the body of water), you just don't have to locate the actual gambling area on water. Before, the casino parts were on water, but you had to build a hotel along with the casino and the hotel could be on land. Now I think you can combine the two into one land building.

[XboxGod]

Neteller has officially released their statement-
http://www.gambling911.com/NETeller-100206.html

[bhodi]

Top Banks Ordered to Hand Over Records Related to Online Gambling

THE US Department of Justice has ordered the world’s biggest investment banks, accountants and law firms to hand over all e-mails, telephone records and papers connected with internet gaming firms as part of an investigation into illegal online gambling in America.

...

One source said: “To say the situation is sensitive is the understatement of the decade. The problem is, even if you know you have done nothing wrong, you have no powers of resistance.”

He added: “You can quickly go from being a bystander to a target, so even if you are bomb- proof, you have to assume you are subject to hostility.”

The source went on: “The Department of Justice has taken a shotgun, not a rifle approach in relation to lots of gaming companies and has just asked everyone to hand over all the information they have.”

The request could force banks and other advisers or former advisers to the gambling companies to hand over hundreds of thousands of e-mails and files to American investigators.

[WayAbvPar]

Give me a fucking break. Instead of spending hundreds of millions of dollars chasing ghosts, why not legalize it, regulate it, and tax it? That is a giant income stream to tap.

[Riggswolfe]

Give me a fucking break. Instead of spending hundreds of millions of dollars chasing ghosts, why not legalize it, regulate it, and tax it? That is a giant income stream to tap.

Because gambling is immoral and God will send you to hell for it.

[WayAbvPar]

Give me a fucking break. Instead of spending hundreds of millions of dollars chasing ghosts, why not legalize it, regulate it, and tax it? That is a giant income stream to tap.

Because gambling is immoral and God will send you to hell for it.

I bet you he won't!

[HaemishM]

Holy fuck, in times when the US AG is testifying to Congress that we are at more danger from external threats like terrorism than at any other time in our history, we are pissing about with an investigation into how many people play poker on the computer in their fucking scivvies?

What a bunch of fuckheads. Go Go Justice System! Thataway to protect the Abramoff interests.

[Sky]

Give me a fucking break. Instead of spending hundreds of millions of dollars chasing ghosts, why not legalize it, regulate it, and tax it? That is a giant income stream to tap.

Worked well for marijuana.

[tazelbain]

I am fine with the ban, but this witchhunting stuff is too much.  Arresting *former* executives of Netteller is double too much.

[SnakeCharmer]

So it's legal where I live.

And it's legal where it's taking place.

But because the information crosses over an area where it's illegal, the whole thing becomes illegal.

Ooooooookay.

Interestingly enough, you can't transport slot or any sort of gambling machines (empty, no power, etc) on roads in states with antigambling legislation without permits out the ass and a police escort.

[Evangolis]

Friend of mine has five grand in limbo because of this.  Wonder how long before RMT gets tangled with this.

[WayAbvPar]

A couple of glimmers of hope for online poker players- Exemption?

And in WA state-

In-home recreational internet gaming shouldn’t be a felony, says Strow

10th District legislator introduces bill to provide an affirmative defense to the Class C Felony created by 2006 internet gambling bill



Rep. Chris Strow, R-Whidbey Island, today announced his legislation, House Bill 1243, to quash the felony charge language in last year’s legislation addressing in-home internet gambling.

“My goal with this legislation is to correct an element from last year’s online gambling bill, Senate Bill 6613, that made it a Class C Felony to gamble recreationally in one’s own home if it is done online,” said Strow.

“While I do see the need for protecting our citizens from online gaming that may be scamming innocent victims, I do think that there is also a level of accountability, as an adult, to do as he or she chooses in his or her own home,” said Strow. “Most certainly choosing to gamble, or play a game of skill such as poker, should not have been made a crime equivalent to possessing child pornography or threatening the Governor.”

House Bill 1243 is currently awaiting a hearing in the House Commerce and Labor Committee.

“While I have requested a hearing on the bill, people need to call and write the Chairman of the House Commerce and Labor Committee, Representative Steve Conway, and ask him to schedule a hearing for House Bill 1243,” said Strow. Rep. Conway can be reached at (360) 786-7906 or Conway.steve@leg.wa.gov.

“There’s a certain point at which policy can be perceived as ‘nanny stateish.’ I think we reached that point with last year’s legislation and I’m aiming to make amends,” said Strow

A-fucking-men.

[Margalis]

I have about $300 locked away right now. Fucking US government!