Useless Conversation

[ghost]

Some CFOs and CEOs are top notch, no doubt.  A lot of it depends on the situation though.  Look at the guys from Google.  They're absolutely fucking brilliant on every level.  Same with Jobs.  I'm sure they know how their companies run down to the smallest mundane activities but they were intimately involved with their company's inception.  But some, like the CEOs from GM in the '80s, are the very definition of "shit floats".  CEOs in existing companies that rise through the ranks by beating the rat race seem to depend more on social graces, and the cutthroat mentality that Nebu mentions.

[Cheddar]

I interact with all levels within my company.  I can tell you from first hand experience that our current senior executives are eerily bright. 

Mind you, we have been in a constant downsize state for like 2-3 years and many, many, many have "retired" with a 30 day notice in that time.

[Merusk]

Depends on the company, really.  I know several execs at the companies I've worked for who were bright and several who were simply jackasses who'd been there a long ass time and were good at the politics of position.   My comment wasn't meant to be a reflection of their intelligence, just that there's a ton who don't know what their employees do on a day to day basis. 

Hell, in the 12 person division office I was just in, there's no way the execs could have done a single job of any of their office staff.  They simply did not know the systems or the software at all.  This was reflected in the many times they asked for a report that couldn't be run, or decided to create an excel spreadsheet to track stuff that the systems were already reporting, but they had no clue about how to retrieve.   

Then again, they changed procedures on a monthly basis (and had to be reminded, "No, we can't do that because it's ILLEGAL" by the Office Coordinator a number of times) so I wonder if they even knew what was up on any end.  Example: Wanting to have the person who's doing costing also be the one taking bids and entering all the info in the system, AND also be the one taking checks. 

[Cheddar]

The higher up in an organization one goes the fewer decisions one makes but the larger impact.  In addition the spectrum of focus changes.

A CSR makes what - 40 to 60 decisions a day.  They impact 1 person.  He is honed on 1 aspect of the company and expected how to do that task.

A supervisor has 20-40 CSR's they deal with.  They, between normal paperwork, make 20-30 decisions a day (coaching, info transfer, help with issues, etc).  This impacts 800-2400 customers every single day.

A manager has what... usually 4-20 supervisors.  Plus support personnel.  As you go up the chain you, by nature of position, will not know the inner workings of those 3 steps below you. 

[Lantyssa]

Carly.  Fiorina.

[Ingmar]

As you go up the chain you, by nature of position, will not know the inner workings of those 3 steps below you. 

So basically they're modrons.

[Cheddar]

As you go up the chain you, by nature of position, will not know the inner workings of those 3 steps below you. 

So basically they're modrons.

Nice.  Do not get it twisted.  What I am saying is that as you move up the ladder focus changes.  Same thing happens in the military.  A Major of a unit will not know how a special made torq wrench works on a fighter aircraft.  But he DOES understand what the maintenance value of that person is.

Same with Corporate world.  A manager is knee deep in cost per call, keeping supervisors down to earth (aka in the bush with their direct reports), budgets, etc.  Are they familiar with a CSR's primary function?  Yes.  Can they open a trouble ticket/explain a bill/handle a collection notice?  Maybe.

[Ingmar]

I was just making a modron joke.

Each modron is aware of and recognizes other modrons of the same or lower caste, as well as those of the nexthigher caste (their supervisors). Modrons more than one rank higher simply appear as incomprehensible creatures.

[Minvaren]

Holy crap, I found Cheez Balls (the Planters in a can kind) at Target.  I am a happy now, even if they do taste slightly stale.

[Sand]

Nice.  Do not get it twisted.  What I am saying is that as you move up the ladder focus changes.  Same thing happens in the military.  A Major of a unit will not know how a special made torq wrench works on a fighter aircraft.  But he DOES understand what the maintenance value of that person is.

Same with Corporate world.  A manager is knee deep in cost per call, keeping supervisors down to earth (aka in the bush with their direct reports), budgets, etc.  Are they familiar with a CSR's primary function?  Yes.  Can they open a trouble ticket/explain a bill/handle a collection notice?  Maybe.

This discussion seems eerily familiar.

[Sky]

I feel dorky because I got the modron joke.

I still think I'd be a hell of a manager, because my strong point is putting the right people in the right place, and for the most part have them happy about it. Back at walmart I only had twelve people technically under me, but in reality the guys above me were shit managers so I ran the entire store during the overnight shift. The nice thing about a place that big is you can find a place for absolutely everyone but those who really didn't want to be there and were un-motivatable. I only came across two of those in three years.

My biggest failing as a manager is that I like to work, too. Got that out of road construction, where you earn respect by doing the most grueling job better than anyone else.

[Cyrrex]

Road construction is a funny thing, at least to those of us who drive by it an observe it from afar.  It's a group of 4 to 10 guys, who all surround and watch one guy who is doing all the work.  I'm guessing you were that one guy.

Maybe that's not the reality, but that's what it always looks like.

[Paelos]

Maybe that's not the reality, but that's what it always looks like.

No it is the reality. I've had to get road construction done on our regular developments at the old job. The building would always be done well before the roads because contractors know their asses are subject to expectations. Road contractors know there are just more roads to do when you're done.

[Sky]

There are lots of reasons why you see that. There's a lot of strict division of labor to start, a guy being paid flagger scale can't shovel. Sometimes the laborer needs to finish something before the skilled guys can dig in. One guy might be a foreman who is just there to supervisor, another might be the engineer who can't do any physical work.

At the city level you see a lot more of the mayor's cousin being paid to be a laborer but just leaning on a shovel kind of thing, in my experience.

The first summer I worked on the road it was mostly as a flagger, but it drove the supervisor nuts because I kept getting into labor scale and they'd have to split my paycheck between flagger scale (14/hr) and laborer (8/hr). And he never understood why I'd bust my ass for 6/hr less (I like hard work). Not the way I'd do it now  but I was 18 without any bills.

[Chimpy]

So the University had a "Office Support" mass interview because a number of departments are all trying to fill positions with the same classification. They brought in the 30 or so highest people on the civil service register for interviews today. I got to sit in a room for 4 hours to have one 10 minute interview.

Some of the people had like 7 or 8 departments ask to interview them in that time.

Alas, not a very productive day (unless of course that one interview lands me a job).

[ghost]

Anybody need a cat?

[Sky]

I just saw another reason for work crews standing around on the way in to work this morning, forgot I had an ongoing example two blocks from my house. Guy has to reinstall his plumbing to the street, which involves the plumbing company, subcontractors (excavators) and the city. So there's a lot of the city sitting around, mostly the water dep't just making sure nobody fucks up anything under the street or takes shortcuts on the property. Two trucks were sitting around today (four guys) just waiting for the gas company to show up and mark out another couple lines.

Usually LOTS of waiting around for someone else to do something that holds up everyone else. So you see the one guy doing something because he's the lowbie and was given some busy work.

[Merusk]

Oh, Facebook. How I love you for showing me just how fucked up some of my former high school classmates continue to be.

[RhyssaFireheart]

Stupid selfish little internet brats.

"I hope the earthquake doesn't mean our manga aren't going to be released next week!"

Little fuckers.

[bhodi]

Yeah, don't search openbook for "Japan" if you want to remain sane.

[Ingmar]

Yeah, don't search openbook for "Japan" if you want to remain sane.

"pearl harbor" is even worse.

[Ard]

Days like this really makes me think the eugenics guys were on to something.

[Chimpy]

Fuck the fucking fuckers who decided to extend Daylight Savings Time a few years ago. I thought I was losing my mind this morning when I got up at 10:15, took a shower, sat down at my desk and promptly saw the clock on my computer and the one on my desk (auto switching) saying it was 11:30.

DST should be first weekend of April-last weekend of October. That is the natural order of things (though none at all is REALLY the natural order).

[RhyssaFireheart]

Fuck the fucking fuckers who decided to extend Daylight Savings Time a few years ago. I thought I was losing my mind this morning when I got up at 10:15, took a shower, sat down at my desk and promptly saw the clock on my computer and the one on my desk (auto switching) saying it was 11:30.

DST should be first weekend of April-last weekend of October. That is the natural order of things (though none at all is REALLY the natural order).

I simply love all the news people going on about how the days are longer now.  No they're fucking not.  It's lighter to a later time in the evening, but now it's darker for an extra hour in the morning.  And last I checked, the day was still 24 hours, more or less, depending on the earthquakes.

[Sky]

DST needs to go away. I only have three clocks that aren't on network time servers, so I didn't get surprised. But really, when I'm sucked into a movie at night and look at the clock expecting to see 2:30am and see 3:30am, my first thought is, "holy shit, this movie is better than I thought!" Then... 

[Samwise]

Uuuugh I hate the darker morning.  I feel so much better about getting up when the sun is shining in my face for some reason.   

[Cyrrex]

Uuuugh I hate the darker morning.  I feel so much better about getting up when the sun is shining in my face for some reason.   

I do too, but I LOOOVE the longer evenings.  And besides, it won't be long before the mornings are bright again.

[ghost]

I like this time so much better.  I hate getting home in the dark.  I don't mind leaving in the dark.  For some reason it seems to make the traffic more bearable. 

[Sky]

Just grabbed the wireless minikeyboard and magic mouse from the newest iMac I'm configuring. Can't put them out for the public, they'd walk off in minutes. Really wish the keyboard had a number pad, I don't think I'll keep it past my first budget proposal, but the mouse is really slick. Going to take a bit of retraining my muscle memory, but having multi-touch on the surface of the mouse is really, really slick.

[Merusk]

I like this time so much better.  I hate getting home in the dark.  I don't mind leaving in the dark.  For some reason it seems to make the traffic more bearable. 

Sun delays.  I hate leaving when it's light in the morning because there's always those few douchebags who don't know what their sun visor is for so they go 35 on the highway because they can't see.  I don't blame them when the sun's just peeked over the horizon and is in everyone's face, but when it's at a 15-20* angle.. use the goddamn visor.

[Cyrrex]

I like this time so much better.  I hate getting home in the dark.  I don't mind leaving in the dark.  For some reason it seems to make the traffic more bearable. 

Sun delays.  I hate leaving when it's light in the morning because there's always those few douchebags who don't know what their sun visor is for so they go 35 on the highway because they can't see.  I don't blame them when the sun's just peeked over the horizon and is in everyone's face, but when it's at a 15-20* angle.. use the goddamn visor.

Yes.  Sun glasses are also brilliant for solving this problem.  Visor + glasses = Fucking fantastic

While I'm solving commute issues, I feel the need to get this one off my chest:  Toyota owners...I don't know what your problem is, but Get.  Out.  Of.  My.  Way.  Seriously, why so damn slow?

[Sand]

My commute bitch. Driving at or below the speed limit in the left hand lane. Who then REFUSE to move to the right lane when its clear, forcing me to pass them on the right.
If I had a instantaneous vaporizing death ray attached to the front of my car I would use it on these people mercilessly.

[ghost]

Hey, when your car can take off wildly at any moment, accelerating out of control despite your best efforts to control the vehicle, it makes perfect sense to start out slow. 

[Sky]

Toyota owners...I don't know what your problem is, but Get.  Out.  Of.  My.  Way.  Seriously, why so damn slow?

Hi! I drive the speed limit. Sorry it's hampering your ability to break the law. Have a nice day.

[Cyrrex]

Toyota owners...I don't know what your problem is, but Get.  Out.  Of.  My.  Way.  Seriously, why so damn slow?

Hi! I drive the speed limit. Sorry it's hampering your ability to break the law. Have a nice day.

Haha, I knew I'd get you to bite on that one.

Speed limit's fine (assuming your not in the left lane).  I'm mostly talking about those that take forever to do anything, including:  getting up to speed, changing lanes, parking, reversing from a parking space, turning corners.

And okay, sometimes going the speed limit bugs me to.  When everyone else on the tollways is going 75 and you're going 55?  You're the danger.