Useless Conversation

[Abagadro]

They were filming a Steven Seagal movie outside my office window all day today so that was fun. His Doughiness wasn't there though.

[WayAbvPar]

They probably have to get special permits and reinforce all the buildings nearby to deal with his gravity field.

[Strazos]

Having grown up in cold weather areas and lived in the tropics, I take the cold every time.

[Teleku]

Or skip both options and move to a place like California that just has great weather.   

After my tour in Moscow I will have been 4 years in Eastern Europe.  I'm bidding on a tropical countries only next, no matter how bad they are.

[Samwise]

Or skip both options and move to a place like California that just has great weather.   

Ignore this advice.  We're at capacity.  Earthquakes are scary, don't come here!

[schild]

Or skip both options and move to a place like California that just has great weather.   

Ignore this advice.  We're at capacity.  Earthquakes are scary, don't come here!

Also, inexcusably douchey and overpriced.

[Trippy]

That too.

[Samwise]

We really could use a good quake to scatter the cockroaches.  I know more people in SF from New York than I know people in SF from SF at this point.  It's becoming intolerable.

[Trippy]

The bubble will burst (again) soon

[Rasix]

Or skip both options and move to a place like California that just has great weather.  

After my tour in Moscow I will have been 4 years in Eastern Europe.  I'm bidding on a tropical countries only next, no matter how bad they are.

California would require me to get a job that pays large sums of money before moving there. I don't think my current salary would cut it.

That San Francisco real estate market is downright frightening.

[Trippy]

Not all jobs are in Hipsterville, yet.

[Bunk]

You could move to Vancouver and rent a place from a guy in China, as that is now the only remaining option here.

[Khaldun]

My dad was born in California and was always irritated about the rising numbers of arrivals. We used to watch the Rose Bowl each year and he'd always say, "Well, the game's on national TV and the weather is good, so here comes another 100,000 assholes tomorrow."

[Bunk]

That's the thing, they don't even come here - they just buy everything before its even built and then rent them out. Everything.

[Morat20]

Dear Cigna,

Your fucking automated voice system DOES NOT SAVE YOU MONEY. It just ensures I am as pissed off as fucking possible when I finally get a real person on the line.

Sincerely,
The Customer You Fucking Gouge.

Seriously, does everyone else just start shouting "REAL GODDAMN PERSON" the second the stupid phone wants you to say shit? I don't want to tell my SSN to a fucking computer that struggles with "yes" and "no".

Also, apparently my wife's minor surgery (I paid 3k up front, since I hadn't hit my deductible) hit my insurance as 24,000 dollars from an out-of-network surgical center. The surgical center is INSIDE her doctor's office. Literally, you go into the doctor's office than walk through a door. Apparently the doctor is in-network but the surgical center run by her and situated entirely INSIDE her office is not. According to Cigna.

I'm pretty sure the 24,000 dollar charge is a fat-fingered mistake. (IE, the charge was 2400, and someone hit an extra zero when filing it. Seriously, I realize you get weird numbers, but it was a 10 minute procedure under general anesthesia that required absolutely nothing complex. I was told the CASH price, no insurance, was 2300 with no complications or I could pay 3k and it'd cover any biopsies and other small things that often cropped up and could be fixed at the same time. ). The in-network, out-of-network thing is gonna piss me the unholy hell OFF because those are two separate deductibles, so that's gonna get the living shit appealed out of it under the rubric of "WTF, it's inside the same goddamn office" and "nobody told me" and "Fuck this 'it's my responsibility' it's the same goddamn doctor INSIDE HER GODDAMN OFFICE".

God I hate the American healthcare system.

[Ingmar]

I barely ever have trouble with voice recognition stuff. Clearly you need a new accent.

[Morat20]

I barely ever have trouble with voice recognition stuff. Clearly you need a new accent.

I never call for shit like "The balance in my account" or "What is my bill".

I call for shit like "Okay, I've got this complex question about X that's not covered on your website where I can get all the information your dumb-ass phone system spits out. WHY WOULD I USE THE PHONE WHEN YOU HAVE A WEBSITE UNLESS I NEEDED TO TALK TO AN ACTUAL PERSON".

[WayAbvPar]

I barely ever have trouble with voice recognition stuff. Clearly you need a new accent.

I never call for shit like "The balance in my account" or "What is my bill".

I call for shit like "Okay, I've got this complex question about X that's not covered on your website where I can get all the information your dumb-ass phone system spits out. WHY WOULD I USE THE PHONE WHEN YOU HAVE A WEBSITE UNLESS I NEEDED TO TALK TO AN ACTUAL PERSON".

Exactly. God I fucking hate phone trees.

[Teleku]

As someone who has to program them, I also have a new found hatred for them.

[Chimpy]

I learned from the AT&T one years ago that if you string three or four "fucks" or "shits" or "goddamns" together in an angry voice that gets you queued straight into a real person with no "did you mean x?" questions.

[Samwise]

I learned from the AT&T one years ago that if you string three or four "fucks" or "shits" or "goddamns" together in an angry voice that gets you queued straight into a real person with no "did you mean x?" questions.

Yuuuup.

Feels good, too.

[Morat20]

So, just to illustrate how fucked up American healthcare is.

The surgical center, physically encapsulated in the doctor's office, is out of network while the doctor's office is in-network. They share the same name, not just the same floor space! (Facts which are going on my inevitable appeal).

Second, I was charged 3k which covered every bit of the surgery. They knew I wasn't going to hit my deductible. That's literally ALL the money they're getting. They still -- correctly! -- billed my insurance for 24,000 dollars. Again: All the money they're getting? My 3k. Charge to insurance? 24,000 dollars. Just for...paperwork, I guess. It doesn't actually earn them an additional penny.

So now, as soon as my claim is processed, I get to throw myself on the mercy of Cigna (sorry, I mean "file an appeal") to move that 3k from my "out of network" deductible to my "in-network" deductible (chances of success: Pretty low) on the logic of "IT WAS NAMED THE SAME AND PART OF THE SAME FUCKING OFFICE AS THE IN-NETWORK DOCTOR WHO DID THE DAMN SURGERY" followed by "And no one clearly communicated 'It was not in network' instead focusing on exactly how much I owed them given my deductible, which was LESS than what I owed on my in-network deductible, so in short I'd have scheduled the fucking thing elsewhere if I had known and you fucking know it".

Seriously, best healthcare system on the planet my fucking ass. And this is insurance from a giant ass company on the S&P 500.

Hilariously, I used this is an example (to my teenager) of how so much of the work in maintaining a household is not clearly visible yet eats up time like a motherfucker.

[Abagadro]

You are lucky they aren't going to "balance bill" you for the rest of the 24k.  In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if they still try to do that.

[Morat20]

You are lucky they aren't going to "balance bill" you for the rest of the 24k.  In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if they still try to do that.

Thankfully, while the whole "in network/out of network" thing wasn't disclosed (or if it was, it got completely lost in the million other things or otherwise confused) they were very clear that the adjusted costs wouldn't meet my deductible, that I could either pay 2300 + a certain amount for each (if any) biopsy OR I could pay 3k which would cover any number of biopsies, plus any common complications and that would be the max I would pay as it fully covered their costs.

I went with the 3k because given the reason for the surgery, because given the medical reasons in place there were certainly gonna be a few biopsies 'just to be sure'. I'd rather just pay the extra 700 that I thought would go to my in-network deductible and come close to hitting it than 2300 since I was virtually certain I'd end up pushing to 3k or more anyways.

I spoke again to them on the phone. They were adamant that 3k discharged ALL my responsibilities, and that they didn't expect the insurance company to pay them a dime (you know, deductible. Fucking high deductible plans) and that the ridiculous numbers were entirely for billing purposes. 3k was what they'd charge someone cash to do the procedure. Cash up front, fully covered.

Which was one reason I was so surprised to find out it wasn't in-network. They've always been perfectly clear, straightforward, and pleasant to deal with bill wise -- indeed, one reason i chose them was a few years ago we saw them for some stuff that WASN'T covered under insurance, and that was something we liked. We knew exactly how much before we walked in, every time. Pricing was clear.

[Yegolev]

While discussing the health insurance industry with someone recently laid off from Aetna, turns out that all of the health insurance companies are so flush with new business that they have decided to just shit-can all of their staff that handled the 1-50 individual accounts.  Apparently because the top people and owners really need to hang onto those extra millions instead of pay people.

[Abagadro]

I'd get that statement that you don't owe them more than the 3k in writing.

[Morat20]

I'd get that statement that you don't owe them more than the 3k in writing.

We do. It was in the stuff we signed. There's certain complications that didn't cover, but none of them came up.

Still, I can't get over that a 3k bill (cash, to me) balloons to 24,000 dollars to the insurance company who, if they paid, would probably fork over 2k at most.

In "good news for the inevitable appeal" I found that my wife's doctot does not use ANY in-network facility for surgery. There aren't a lot of specialists of that type in my plan, so I might be able to leverage that as well. "Your in-network doctor does NOT do surgery at any in-network places, just her own attached surgical center" might help.

[Xanthippe]

My dad was born in California and was always irritated about the rising numbers of arrivals. We used to watch the Rose Bowl each year and he'd always say, "Well, the game's on national TV and the weather is good, so here comes another 100,000 assholes tomorrow."

I'm with your dad. What is it with that? The goddamned weather is always great for the Rose Bowl.

I keep thinking I'm over my disappointment of what my state has become, and then it hits me all over again. Population is just about double now what it was when I was in high school.   

[Cyrrex]

I'd get that statement that you don't owe them more than the 3k in writing.

We do. It was in the stuff we signed. There's certain complications that didn't cover, but none of them came up.

Still, I can't get over that a 3k bill (cash, to me) balloons to 24,000 dollars to the insurance company who, if they paid, would probably fork over 2k at most.

In "good news for the inevitable appeal" I found that my wife's doctot does not use ANY in-network facility for surgery. There aren't a lot of specialists of that type in my plan, so I might be able to leverage that as well. "Your in-network doctor does NOT do surgery at any in-network places, just her own attached surgical center" might help.

For 24k, I'm hoping your wife got the most amazing boob-job ever.

[Morat20]

For 24k, I'm hoping your wife got the most amazing boob-job ever.

lol. No. Like I said -- the actual cost of the surgery was 2300 (the other 700 is biopsies). That includes general anesthesia. Straight up outpatient stuff, the actual procedure took maybe 15 minutes. That's why I can't understand the "24,000 facility fee" bit my insurance is getting charged. Which the surgical center does not expect them to pay. It's literally "We're charging you 24,000 dollars, but you won't pay any of that and we don't expect you to pay it, and we've already BEEN paid when Morat forked over his 3k, but for some unknown goddamn reason we ALL have to pretend that it cost 24,000 dollars".

That's the crazy part. The "we're all pretending it cost 24,000, which is okay, because no one is going to pay that". I wish someone here worked in medical billing to explain that sort of bizarro world logic.

[Viin]

Probably has to do with making sure Medicare/aid pays out as much as possible by showing "hey see we charge everyone else $24k you can't pay us just $2k for the same thing!"

[Rasix]

Bee infestation.  YAAAAAAAAAAAAY.  Why couldn't this have come a month later when we didn't have the house anymore?

[Chimpy]

Bee infestation.  YAAAAAAAAAAAAY.  Why couldn't this have come a month later when we didn't have the house anymore?

Because the gods are telling you something? 

[Morat20]

Bee infestation.  YAAAAAAAAAAAAY.  Why couldn't this have come a month later when we didn't have the house anymore?

Ouch. :) We had a "safety moment" in a meeting involving a bee infestation. Some guy's big outdoor grill -- he had it covered for the winter. He went to remove the cover, and hear's a buzzing sound.

It was full of bees. Big combs hanging down off the grill, just absolutely gigantic bee's nest. Idiot started to try to deal with it himself, and ended up running for the house from a swarm. (Hence the safety moment of "Call a dang professional").

[Rasix]

R.I.P. Rasix's gaming budget March 2015 - March 2015.   

We caught it early.  Doesn't mean it's less expensive, but it also means we don't have to rip out sections of our roof to remove hive.