Useless Conversation

[ghost]

Can we get a data/database management and implementation subforum or thread?   

We had to read all your clean-teeth crap.

Yes, but that is useful and intriguing.   

 

[WayAbvPar]

[Hammond]

What flavor of EMC backup are you using out of curiosity? I used the Avamar appliance a about a year ago with Oracle and it seemed to work fine.  We were only doing nightly snapshots or on demand which is a bit different than what you are talking about.

And on a side note I thank the gods I do not have to deal with Oracle anymore!  Although I now have progressdb which is a whole different animal.

[ghost]

You know it's serious when the Next Generation pictures start flying. 

[Ingmar]

So I have to take this online class to do this cert test to be able to be the tech support contact for this new voicemail product we're using, fine. Except the class is entirely lectured by their text-to-speech engine.  This is incredibly creepy and making this class very difficult for me to do for more than about 15 minutes at a sitting.

To be fair the text-to-speech is quite good, but I'm still in the uncanny valley of online learning here.

[Viin]

I hate those things. Usually you can skip to the next page after letting it talk for 1/4-1/2 of the page.

[Arthur_Parker]

Yes, I did thanks Arthur, but MS are like Blizzard.  'Coming Soon' means 'This is not gonna help you for a long time.'

To be honest, they don't even NEED to have this shit about scanning for PSTS and arranging them and all that shit.  They just need a better way to push that crap into their new product because the current way either breaks your system, doesn't work, or is just so slow you may as well wank endlessly while waiting.

.PST, Time to Walk the Plank

Today, we are happy to announce that PST Capture is now available as a free download.

[Ironwood]

Wow.

Don't I feel like a fucking asshole.

Thanks Arthur, you're a God amongst insects.

[Arthur_Parker]

No worries, it did seem like a massive hole they had to fill.

[Ironwood]

Indeed, I'm just surprised at the speed at which they did so.

I'm using this just now and it looks like exactly what I need.  It's thrown a test PST up to my own mailbox no bother and I'll do some hardcore tests later, but it doesn't look throttled for upload like Outlook is.

Hmmmm.  That could be nice.

[croaker69]

What flavor of EMC backup are you using out of curiosity? I used the Avamar appliance a about a year ago with Oracle and it seemed to work fine.  We were only doing nightly snapshots or on demand which is a bit different than what you are talking about.

And on a side note I thank the gods I do not have to deal with Oracle anymore!  Although I now have progressdb which is a whole different animal.

We've been using Avamar for a year (Gen2 running 5.1) and have started rolling it out to our AIX and RHEL Oracle dbs using their RMAN aware agent.  It's appropriate for the smaller instances but large data warehouses (EMC says around 3TB+) need their Data Domain product.  The main caveat is it does client-side deduplication so that extra bit of load is put on your server.  I have a Gen4 that I'm deploying now that will run 6.0 so I can't speak to the latest for another couple weeks.  Once I have my RDR copy up with replication we will be looking to phase out tape backups where appropriate.  That's when it starts paying for itself.  The biggest drawback is their tape-out add-on is an ESX based proxy so has the 2 TB limit on backup size and is just convoluted to setup and manage.

[Yegolev]

We are using a variety of methods, generally with some amount of home-grown crap.  The DataDomain devices, we use those for DR replication of the TSM databases, not for regular backups; this is primarily for the de-duplication ability so that we can replicate the TSM files across the country in as timely a manner as possible.  For the most part, regular backups just go straight to TSM via Various DB Backup Tech.  The prod servers that cannot tolerate the overhead of 23-hour online backups use a shell script run from cron to mirror the DB, mount the mirror devices onto another server, and run the TSM backup from there.  Works fine most of the time, but as with anything developed in-house, the support for it falls to people who have other things to do most of the time.  Or people who don't have a complete grasp of the implementation.

I'd do something about how it is set up if I could.

[Ironwood]

Why can't you ?

[ghost]

A friend of mine sent this great article to me today.  I didn't really know where to put it.  I would love to avoid a politics type discussion of it, but if a mod feels like it needs to go there feel free to move it over.  It's a letter from a former slave to his owner, and it is absolutely worth the read.  I won't spoil it for you, because it's short, but needless to say the former owner gets pwned. 

[Hammond]

What flavor of EMC backup are you using out of curiosity? I used the Avamar appliance a about a year ago with Oracle and it seemed to work fine.  We were only doing nightly snapshots or on demand which is a bit different than what you are talking about.

And on a side note I thank the gods I do not have to deal with Oracle anymore!  Although I now have progressdb which is a whole different animal.

We've been using Avamar for a year (Gen2 running 5.1) and have started rolling it out to our AIX and RHEL Oracle dbs using their RMAN aware agent.  It's appropriate for the smaller instances but large data warehouses (EMC says around 3TB+) need their Data Domain product.  The main caveat is it does client-side deduplication so that extra bit of load is put on your server.  I have a Gen4 that I'm deploying now that will run 6.0 so I can't speak to the latest for another couple weeks.  Once I have my RDR copy up with replication we will be looking to phase out tape backups where appropriate.  That's when it starts paying for itself.  The biggest drawback is their tape-out add-on is an ESX based proxy so has the 2 TB limit on backup size and is just convoluted to setup and manage.

The tape backup was the deal breaker at my new job.  When we were evaluating backup solutions we have a requirement of a long term tape storage (it is for the financials) and it was waaaaay to convoluted to justify the extra cost.  But since EMC is a storage company they really want to sell you drives not tapes I am really not surprised.  We ended up with ARCserve from CA which is not bad.  My only issue with it is it is somewhat bandwidth hungry. 

[Arthur_Parker]

CA's UK head quarters is on an amazing site, they really seem to treat their staff well with a great restaurant on site.

[Minvaren]

I find it amusing that after 3 days of working on it, my employer can't provide an accurate amount of vacation time I've accrued over the last 8 years - and won't know for another 2 days.

[schild]

2 years and 8 days from now, f13 will be 10 years old.

[ghost]

2 years and 8 days from now, f13 will be 10 years old.

And how much vacation have you accrued?

[Merusk]

I find it amusing that after 3 days of working on it, my employer can't provide an accurate amount of vacation time I've accrued over the last 8 years - and won't know for another 2 days.

This would be why most places these days say "You're allowed to roll-over 10-15 days max" and you lose anything beyond that each year.   I've known guys who've lost *months* as their companies rolled-over to such a system.

I can't wrap my head around that.  Even if the workload is greater the week before and after, the vacation has always been worth it.   At the *very* least take some Fridays or Mondays off throughout the year.

[WayAbvPar]

If the company switches policies to one that will take days away, they should be cutting checks to everyone for the overages.

[Yegolev]

Why can't you ?

Working for a company that sells my services to another company really upends the whole paradigm that I am used to as an employee.  That is to say: I could engineer something but the client isn't paying me to engineer solutions, and my bosses frown on me giving away free services.

[Lantyssa]

I can't wrap my head around that.  Even if the workload is greater the week before and after, the vacation has always been worth it.   At the *very* least take some Fridays or Mondays off throughout the year.

They won't let him take vacation.  Oh, they may theoretically let him take a day off, but they'll be calling him non-stop anyways.

[Yegolev]

Don't take your phone on vacation.

[Hammond]

Or better yet just forward it to someone and get a prepaid phone for your trip :)  Personally I have my desk phone setup to ring my cell and I only give out my desk phone.  Works pretty well all in all.

[Ingmar]

I don't even have my desk phone ring my cell. They can leave a message, I'll get it as an attachment, and nobody gets to know my cell phone (except for the rest of the actual IT department.)

[Merusk]

If the company switches policies to one that will take days away, they should be cutting checks to everyone for the overages.

 

Man, you guys live in totally different worlds from the rest of the country's economy.

You guys still get beverages other than Coffee provided, too. 

Don't take your phone on vacation.

Or just don't have one at all.   

[Selby]

If the company switches policies to one that will take days away, they should be cutting checks to everyone for the overages.

This is funny.  In a good economy, many companies would do this.  In this shitty economy, well let's just say it's "use it or lose it."

My organization cut down from 480 hours being the cap to 360, then 240 over a period of a year.  We had guys literally taking 2 months off at a time to get down below the limits without losing accrual.  Then there are the guys who have over 2500 sick hours and can't take it because of how much grief they give you if you are out sick for more than a day.

[Abagadro]

Doesn't matter about the economy as it isn't up to the company whether they have to pay accrued vacation or not. Accrued vacation is generally considered to be earned wages that the company can't just take away under the law.  This varies by state  but it is fairly common (if not the overwhelming majority) that vacation accrued pursuant to a company's policy can't be forfeited.  They can have a cap on accrual though.

[Cheddar]

You guys still get beverages other than Coffee provided, too. 

Free coffee?

[Johny Cee]

Doesn't matter about the economy as it isn't up to the company whether they have to pay accrued vacation or not. Accrued vacation is generally considered to be earned wages that the company can't just take away under the law.  This varies by state  but it is fairly common (if not the overwhelming majority) that vacation accrued pursuant to a company's policy can't be forfeited.  They can have a cap on accrual though.

What Ab said.  You can move to a new "use it or lose it" policy on too large an accrual, but any vacation accrued under the old system should be vested.  In the same way, if you get fired or quit you should be getting a check for your unused vacation time.

[WayAbvPar]

^^^^^^^
These guys said it best.

And yes, we still get free soda and coffee 

Of course, our yearly salary adjustments have been +4% or under the past 5+ years, so the beverages is literally the least they could do.

[Merusk]

Doesn't matter about the economy as it isn't up to the company whether they have to pay accrued vacation or not. Accrued vacation is generally considered to be earned wages that the company can't just take away under the law.  This varies by state  but it is fairly common (if not the overwhelming majority) that vacation accrued pursuant to a company's policy can't be forfeited.  They can have a cap on accrual though.

What Ab said.  You can move to a new "use it or lose it" policy on too large an accrual, but any vacation accrued under the old system should be vested.  In the same way, if you get fired or quit you should be getting a check for your unused vacation time.

All I know is what happened.  IT was CA 2002 in Kentucky.  *I* and a few others got a check since we were hourly - and only because we looked into it after someone else told us "hey you don't have to use it, ask them to cut you a check!"  (I had like a week over the 2 week period because of when it happened and when I was hired.)  The managers/ salaried folks were the ones who got screwed.

Plus, as with most anything.  What's legal and what the company tells you is happening aren't always aligned.  Most folks in non-professional positions don't rock that boat because - hey - doing so tends to get you fired and good luck with the lawsuit!

[Johny Cee]

Doesn't matter about the economy as it isn't up to the company whether they have to pay accrued vacation or not. Accrued vacation is generally considered to be earned wages that the company can't just take away under the law.  This varies by state  but it is fairly common (if not the overwhelming majority) that vacation accrued pursuant to a company's policy can't be forfeited.  They can have a cap on accrual though.

What Ab said.  You can move to a new "use it or lose it" policy on too large an accrual, but any vacation accrued under the old system should be vested.  In the same way, if you get fired or quit you should be getting a check for your unused vacation time.

All I know is what happened.  IT was CA 2002 in Kentucky.  *I* and a few others got a check since we were hourly - and only because we looked into it after someone else told us "hey you don't have to use it, ask them to cut you a check!"  (I had like a week over the 2 week period because of when it happened and when I was hired.)  The managers/ salaried folks were the ones who got screwed.

No.

You said yourself that you were okay.  How do you know how things turned out for managers/salaried?  They told you?  And are they on separate employment contracts from the bog standard employee, who usually are under a boiler-plate-ish admin manual?  If the managers and salaried folks lost out (and weren't just belly-aching for sympathy), then they likely did so because it was already worked into their contracts, which were probably more restrictive than general employees.

Plus, as with most anything.  What's legal and what the company tells you is happening aren't always aligned.  Most folks in non-professional positions don't rock that boat because - hey - doing so tends to get you fired and good luck with the lawsuit!

No.  Most blue collar, working class, or lower middle income employees will drop a dime on an employer to the DOL if they get slightly peeved at you....  and the DOL will come in and assess fines and penalties, and work to correct oversights.  To my knowledge, at least in NY, the DOL won't rat out the informer either.

[Merusk]

Yes, my manager said; "I'm going to lose 2 months. They won't let us (managers) do it because we're salaried."  So far as I understand they were not contracted.  I certainly never had to sign one when promoted to management and moved to salary later that year.

As for dropping a dime; this was also the same company that told us in management training not to worry about firing people because only about 1% ever actually pressed litigation.   They all threaten, few follow through.   Blue collar construction jobs aren't exactly abundant here so that's probably a contributing factor.  I think there's 2 major commercial contractors and I know that ~70% of housing is done by 3 companies.  You don't burn bridges.