Useless Conversation

[IainC]

Yesterday I got an email from my boss (who is the COO of the company) that I thought was a player issue forwarded to me from our ticketing system. Basically the guy had been playing without being connected to Gamecenter and then had connected. At this point the game asks if you want to continue this game connected to Gamecenter or if you want to start a new one connected to Gamecenter. He chose New Game and was surprised to find that it started a new game, he was back at the start of the onboarding with a beginning level base and none of the progress from the last game. I replied to my boss pointing out that this was a PEBCAK error and what kind of idiot didn't realise what New Game meant anyway?

Of course it wasn't some random player issue, it was a thing my boss had done.

[Ironwood]

...

And ?

Did he accept that he's a numb cunt or not ?

[taolurker]

His name isn't Curt Schilling (Brad McQuaid) is it?

[Signe]

Probably not.  Iain seems to work for nice creatures in mythical lands like Germany and Xanadu.

[Yegolev]

Half a good story is worse than a full bad story.

[Merusk]

Just make sure you are ready to put in 110% on that new thing they throw your way, show them you are up to more challenging work - otherwise they will just let you coast until you leave.

Places I've worked have recognized coasters and cut them, not waited until they left.  Bad reviews were the first employees cut come staff reductions.

[IainC]

...

And ?

Did he accept that he's a numb cunt or not ?

He's at GDC for the rest of the week. He insists that it's totally ambiguous however and he'll explain it when he's back.

[Ironwood]

I can imagine that explanation.

"hey, Iain, turns out I'm a dumbass."

[Ingmar]

I'm guessing he thought he was actually choosing between "continue to play offline" and "import that shit into an online game".

[Ironwood]

New Game.  It says New Game.

Shit be right in the title dude.

(wait, I don't care.)

[Signe]

I just spent nearly two hours on the phone with Blue Cross because they denied my claim even though the name of my GP is in their network.  It seems that the name of every doctor from that practice is in the provider list but they recently changed their practice name.  The old and the new practice name are both in the list but not associated with any of the doctors or something.  Geez.  I spoke to 8 1/2 people.  Everyone one had an Indian accent except the three people who were actually in a department.  Evidently I was sent to the wrong department three times.  In between, I was sent back to hold and every 10 minutes or so a new Indian operator picked up to ask me questions so they could transfer me correctly.  I'm okay with accents.  I'm good with them.  There very few accents that confuse me.  The 1/2 person just made random sounds to which I replied, "huh?", and then transferred me back to the main menu.  At that point I developed a violent headache.  The next woman who picked up, from the enrollment dept. instead of the claim dept, asked if I wanted to have a call back instead.  Why didn't they ask me that the second, third, forth, fifth, sixth, seventh, or eighth time someone picked up?  Why didn't the recording lady offer me a call back?  So it's ended. They will allegedly call me back within 24 hours.  I don't care.  It's over.  Except the headache.  That persists.  :( 

And yet, still, through the blurry veil of confusion and the mushy blob of throbbing pain that I used to call my mind, I still know what "new game" means.

[Morat20]

Just make sure you are ready to put in 110% on that new thing they throw your way, show them you are up to more challenging work - otherwise they will just let you coast until you leave.

Places I've worked have recognized coasters and cut them, not waited until they left.  Bad reviews were the first employees cut come staff reductions.

Yep. I'll find out Thursday. (I'm not too worried about layoffs though). My supervisor (ie my immediate, immediate manager/project lead/guy who has to deal with all the shit) said his formal recommendation was to keep me on assuming I shaped up. Since the guy making the call knows me about as far as recognizing my face, I suspect my supervisor's word will pull a lot of weight.

Still, manager's call. In the meantime, and assuming I am still employed next week, I've already started hassling said supervisor with the "I have cleared my bug list, I can't do any new development for several weeks per [bunch of other shit I have to wait on], I need something to do".

[Abagadro]

Hmm, so I get to help hire someone. This should be interesting since: 1) Never done it before; and 2) I'm the worst interviewee for jobs in the history of mankind.  Wonder if I am bad as the interviewer. Probably.

[Nebu]

Hmm, so I get to help hire someone. This should be interesting since: 1) Never done it before; and 2) I'm the worst interviewee for jobs in the history of mankind.  Wonder if I am bad as the interviewer. Probably.

I think you'll make a great interviewer.  You have a keen sense for bullshit.  It's a very interesting process and one that helps you become a much better interviewee.   

[Morat20]

Hmm, so I get to help hire someone. This should be interesting since: 1) Never done it before; and 2) I'm the worst interviewee for jobs in the history of mankind.  Wonder if I am bad as the interviewer. Probably.

You'll do fine, I'm sure -- I'm assuming you're hiring someone you're a subject expert in? That's a lot easier to do than, say, general manager hiring to fill a slot he doesn't really know the nuts and bolts of.

I've had to play the part of an interviewer (i was one of three people vetting a candidate), and it did give an interesting perspective on it.

[Abagadro]

I'm on a whole committee so its not just me. The job is basically to do my same job but with a different department.

[Morat20]

I'm on a whole committee so its not just me. The job is basically to do my same job but with a different department.

You'll do fine. You know the subject, so you can spot BS artists (which is where having an expert is useful). Just make allowances for nerves. I was really surprised how visibly nervous some of the people were, although that might have been because they were being interviewed by three people. I mean, I knew I got nervous, but I just thought most people were naturally just confidant in those situations.

[Merusk]

More than 1-2 unknown people puts a lot of people in "public speaking" mode which is, I believe, still the #1 fear of all people.

[Viin]

I'm on a whole committee so its not just me. The job is basically to do my same job but with a different department.

It's "easy" when its a committee - it's much harder when you are the final hire/no-hire decision maker. I hate interviewing, as I am learning recently, but I need to get better at it.

[Yegolev]

I feel the hard part is figuring out which bastard is lying the least.

[Hawkbit]

Right.  Apparently that's the expectation now.  So here's my dilemma:

I never touched a line of code until I was 35.  I went back to school three years ago for a BS in Web Development and I'm two semesters from finish, I should still be 38 when I'm graduated.  I'm building my portfolio slowly and by the end of this year I'll have a solid Git and series of pages to market myself.  I'd much rather be doing middle and backend development and I should have gone back for CIS but I know enough to get me by.  I'm also somewhat old to be starting a career in this field.

I'm starting to watch for developer newbie jobs in Seattle and very rarely do I see anything that falls into my experience range.  Sure, there's 1000 PHP or front end jobs out there but the vast majority want 5+ years experience.  I'm not one to lie about my experience.  I'd rather answer with "I don't know, yet." than tell them I know the answer when I don't. 

For example, I haven't worked with Ruby but if I had a few weeks to learn syntax I could get by.  I'm a newb, but I'm still learning and I'm not going to coast.  So how do I tell a prospective employer that and be taken seriously?

So I'm left to decide if either the market doesn't support newbie devs, or if everyone lies to get the job.  I'm guessing it's the latter.  Newbs have to be given the opportunities to grow, right?  The best part of this whole process was chatting with our VP of Technology last year.  He straight up admitted that he lied to get his first few jobs in the industry. 

Fake it till you make it, I guess.  Only I hate being a fake.  :/

[HaemishM]

Newbie devs aren't welcome in the tech field. The only way you get in is by knowing somebody or working shit jobs like support for years before getting a real job.

[Merusk]

Some project managers need to understand that "Print Services Administrator" does not mean "this guy is an admin and will sort and file documents for you."  Because my employee has better things to do than learn how to read a specification and stick the 5 pages your actual administrative assistant forgot into the set.

Yarr.

[Trippy]

Newbie devs aren't welcome in the tech field. The only way you get in is by knowing somebody or working shit jobs like support for years before getting a real job.

Yes they are, they are called summer interns or new college grads.

[Trippy]

Right.  Apparently that's the expectation now.  So here's my dilemma:

I never touched a line of code until I was 35.  I went back to school three years ago for a BS in Web Development and I'm two semesters from finish, I should still be 38 when I'm graduated.  I'm building my portfolio slowly and by the end of this year I'll have a solid Git and series of pages to market myself.  I'd much rather be doing middle and backend development and I should have gone back for CIS but I know enough to get me by.  I'm also somewhat old to be starting a career in this field.

The bolded part makes no sense. Git is a program. It's like saying "I'll have a solid Excel". Did you mean "I'll have a solid GitHub profile"?

I'm starting to watch for developer newbie jobs in Seattle and very rarely do I see anything that falls into my experience range.  Sure, there's 1000 PHP or front end jobs out there but the vast majority want 5+ years experience.  I'm not one to lie about my experience.  I'd rather answer with "I don't know, yet." than tell them I know the answer when I don't. 

For example, I haven't worked with Ruby but if I had a few weeks to learn syntax I could get by.  I'm a newb, but I'm still learning and I'm not going to coast.  So how do I tell a prospective employer that and be taken seriously?

So I'm left to decide if either the market doesn't support newbie devs, or if everyone lies to get the job.  I'm guessing it's the latter.  Newbs have to be given the opportunities to grow, right?  The best part of this whole process was chatting with our VP of Technology last year.  He straight up admitted that he lied to get his first few jobs in the industry. 

Fake it till you make it, I guess.  Only I hate being a fake.  :/

Newbie programming jobs typically go to new college graduates and the companies that are recruiting from schools don't post those jobs on the regular job boards (they have separate channels for that sort of thing) which is why you aren't seeing them.

These days showing people what you've built (preferably with source code available) is often better than listing years of job experience. If backend stuff is more to your interest my recommendation is you should build a DB-backed Web site and put the source code up on GitHub. Also look for temporary/part-time consulting jobs. Those can be a good way to get some real experience and potentially build up your portfolio.

As an real example, in the mid-2000s I had been out of the Web development arena for a few years so my skills were out-of-date. To get back into things I built a Web site that was a better version of what alexa.com was at the time (it's better now, though not by much) using Amazon's Alexa API and used that site as my reference when looking for jobs. That got me a consulting job until I found a permanent position.

[Hawkbit]

Yep, I shorthanded Git for profile.  Code examples are pretty handy to have and supplement any site work I can build.  I've been working on building a Question/Answer forum from scratch using PHP/MySQL for this class I'm in, so I'll likely put the samples on my profile to supplement. 

As far as internships, I applied for a few last year and wasn't considered due to my age.  I was actually told that by one firm.  It was unpaid and I wasn't going to take it anyways because I can't be without income.  It was fairly shocking though.  In her eyes a Jr/Sr college student at 21 or 22 is totally different than one at 37. 

That's what is tricky.  I can't afford to take an internship and I'm not going to move for it.  So it's a matter of building some stuff and trying to get my name out there, I guess.

Oh, and apparently fibbing enough to get myself in the door somewhere next year.  :/

[Trippy]

Yes ageism is definitely an issue and it's much worse if you are looking at startups or even large but relatively young tech companies like a Google or Facebook. It's not quite as bad at larger, more established companies but it can still be a negative. One thing you can look at are companies that have mostly (or entirely) remote workers. Those kinds of companies often care less about that sort of thing.

[Strazos]

Wait, passing over someone due to age isn't some kind of violation of hiring laws for you guys?

[Selby]

Wait, passing over someone due to age isn't some kind of violation of hiring laws for you guys?

Sure... but proving it is what matters.  I've been told I needed to get my salary reduced because I was "too young" to be making that kind of money and a VP didn't like having a sub-30 year old engineer working for him.  He also let go one of our senior engineers and our best technician because "they were too close to retirement."

[Strazos]

Wow, that's some Grade-A horseshit right there.

I'll just continue to not-miss the private sector, at all.

[Rasix]

It's no coincidence that the 2 people laid off in my department were the 2 oldest. The  "voluntary" retirement emails are multipart series due to the volume of names.  It's so blatant.

[Ironwood]

As far as internships, I applied for a few last year and wasn't considered due to my age.  I was actually told that by one firm.  It was unpaid and I wasn't going to take it anyways because I can't be without income. 

These sentences are not unrelated to each other.  Older people are a thousand times more likely to say 'Fuck Right Off' or 'I Can't Do That'.

[Salamok]

I was actually a bit surprised by how many old farts working for startups that I ran into at sxsw this year.  At 44 I feel like I am way past my prime as any sort of technical asset and yet the "you should check out our company" vibe I get when meeting other people in my field gets stronger every year.

[Bunk]

I'd rather have people that start out a little older. Anyone we hire under 25 is always taking the job as a getting the foot in the door position. We assume they won't stay more than two years max.
Guys we hire at 35 are usually more the - looking for something comfortable and stable. I like those guys.

[Ironwood]

Startups are different.  Old guys get in to them because they've either made their money or are looking to be partners in a big-bank winning situation.