Developer salaries

[bhodi]

Link.
(stolen shamelessly from digg.com)

New research shows up-to-date salary levels throughout the various sectors among game developers including artists, programmers and producers. The study published in the new issue of Game Developer, out this week. Research firm Audience Insights aided the study, which received 6,000 responses from game developers around the world.

PROGRAMMING

Technical Director: $104,738
Lead Programmer: $81,591
Programmer / Engineer: $73, 618

ART and ANIMATION

Art Director: $65,313
Lead Artist: $68,112
Artist: $61,065

GAME DESIGN

Creative Director: $72,125
Writer: $61,000
Game Designer: $54,777

PRODUCTION

Producer: $66,375
Executive Producer (all with more than six years experience): $127, 375

QUALITY ASSURANCE

QA Lead: $43,125
Tester: $29,722

AUDIO

Audio Director: $62,206
Composer: $60,093

BUSINESS AND LEGAL

Marketing: $76,667
Admin: $81,765
Executive: $106,590

[Viin]

And this is why working in game dev sucks.

[Sky]

Really? I'm in the salary range of a tester :) With 6 years of sysadmin experience + 25 more years of pc experience.

Public service ftl. I knew I should have stuck with sound engineering.

[Viin]

Yah but you also probably don't work 60-80hr weeks and get treated like a piece of crap by all the fanbois.

The only ones that make any money are the programmers and they definantly work 60-80hr weeks.

[Nebu]

No offense, but salaries mean nothing unless they are considered in conjunction with the cost of living proximal to where the job is.  In rural America, those are great salaries.  In Boston or San Francisco, they're pretty terrible for someone with the experience and CV to land the position.

[Merusk]

Yeah, what Nebu said.  I was boggling at those numbers, because they're so much higher than my own pay scale. (I'm around the QA Lead in a 40-hour a week job in the midwest where I actually do work 40-45 hours.)  Then I remembered the cost of living where most of them live and realized I'm better off.

[bhodi]

No offense, but salaries mean nothing unless they are considered in conjunction with the cost of living proximal to where the job is.  In rural America, those are great salaries.  In Boston or San Francisco, they're pretty terrible for someone with the experience and CV to land the position.

Since it's a world survey, chances are fairly good that they are adjusted for region. The only question is which. I don't feel like paying the $3.50 to find out.

[Nebu]

Since it's a world survey, chances are fairly good that they are adjusted for region. The only question is which. I don't feel like paying the $3.50 to find out.

I don't blame you.  I was just reminding you to consider what Disraeli told us.

[Jeff Kelly]

Programmer / Engineer: $73, 618
QA Lead: $43,125
Tester: $29,722

No wonder most games are bug ridden pieces of shit.

[schild]

Programmer / Engineer: $73, 618
QA Lead: $43,125
Tester: $29,722

No wonder most games are bug ridden pieces of shit.

The above is a 100% positively true statement. What that survey doesn't tell you is that at least 50% of QA testers are $8 an hour interns.

[Stormwaltz]

Whoo, still below the median!

...though far closer than I was at Other Companies. You know something's wrong when your supervisor asks how much you're making, and when you tell him he physically recoils and blurts, "Oh my God, you're getting screwed!"

[schild]

In a perfect world, game dev salary would somehow be nebulously based on the quality of the last game you made. For example, David Jaffee, rolling in cash. The people who made 50 Cent's Bulletproof? Flipping burgers with 50 Cent. We can call this agenda "tough love."

Edit: There would of course be a base salary of like $25k, but you can drop in experience levels from there if you're first game is REALLY SHITTY. So you might want to think twice about those life dreams of working for the American arm of Bandai.

[Xilren's Twin]

Programmer / Engineer: $73, 618
QA Lead: $43,125
Tester: $29,722

No wonder most games are bug ridden pieces of shit.

The above is a 100% positively true statement. What that survey doesn't tell you is that at least 50% of QA testers are $8 an hour interns.

Course, if you could demonstrate to the moneyhats that less bug riddled games sell substantially more, you might have a case for change.  As it is now, it just a matter of "what's the cheapest method of developing product X we can get away with".

I hereby proclaim my support for a new government agency, the Gamer Protection Agency, or GPA, to engage in product testing of all games prior to release and send the bug ridden peices of crap back to their makers until the can slap on a sticker, "GPA Approved", indicating they have less than 10% of their code containing bugs. Please note, this agency is not to be confused with the agencies responsible to checking decency standards have been followed, or gratitous overuse of the either the color "brown" or "smashable crates", or naughty words. 

[HaemishM]

Considering that video game revenue last year EXCEEDED movie ticket revenue last year, those numbers are FUCKING SHAMEFUL.

EDIT: And considering that a lot of those salaries are probably in California, where the cost of living is criminal, it's even worse.

[schild]

I don't see any "associate" titles on that list. I can only assume all associate producers, etc. were too embarrassed to list their pay level.

[bhodi]

OK I may get kicked in the crotch by some devlopers and members, or I just may be vastly underpaid, but those salaries don't seem unreasonable to me. For refrence, I work in NoVA so my living expenses are also inflated.

* Coders are right in line where they should be. Coding is hard (tm) and they work 60-80 hour weeks during crunch time. Commercial coders can make less or more.
* Game designers are a little low, but there are a lot of people who can come up with good, stable ideas as their profession, and the market is filled with eager people who love their job and are willing to work for less.
* Everyone knows QA is a cesspool that people try and forget exist.
* Everyone also knows 'execuitives' rake in the dough. Good ones can make or break a project.
* I don't know a lot about sound, but those salaries seem reasonable and in line when compared to what they could be doing - trying to make a living doing stage music, fighting long hard road doing studio development or sell your soul out to corperate doing mixing for TV/radio. You want crappy pay? Look at radio sometime.
* Art never pays for the average joe. There's a reason why we have the term 'starving artist'.
* I know nothing about business and legal, but generally as those sorts of people are fairly fungible across the spectrum of business the salaries are likely in line as well.

Your 'superstar' coder/designer/artist can command large salaries but the regular guy in the trenches is just middle class like everyone else.

[Roac]

Sounds about right.  Keep in mind those figures are averaged, so you would expect them to fluxuate between high/low cost of living areas, although on average I would expect more dev shops to be in higher CoL areas.

[Nebu]

Sounds about right.  Keep in mind those figures are averaged, so you would expect them to fluxuate between high/low cost of living areas, although on average I would expect more dev shops to be in higher CoL areas.

I agree with you completely. 

If it makes any of you feel any better, most of those salaries are higher than what I get paid as a professor at a Division I university. 

[schild]

Oh, and considering what I get paid to run f13 right now (hint: I fall into the $0-$0 category), any of those salaries seem reasonable.

(For anyone actually doing that work though, we have a phrase for them, it's "getting fucked.")

[Yegolev]

Course, if you could demonstrate to the moneyhats that less bug riddled games sell substantially more, you might have a case for change.  As it is now, it just a matter of "what's the cheapest method of developing product X we can get away with".

The problem, obviously, is that people pay for buggy pieces of shit just like they pay for solid products.  They put their resources where it makes the most difference in sales, and you can't really argue that from a business perspective.  Paying your QA team more isn't going to fix more bugs, it's just going to give more money to undeserving retards.  Hiring better QA people... maybe.

[Signe]

Sounds about right.  Keep in mind those figures are averaged, so you would expect them to fluxuate between high/low cost of living areas, although on average I would expect more dev shops to be in higher CoL areas.

I agree with you completely. 

If it makes any of you feel any better, most of those salaries are higher than what I get paid as a professor at a Division I university. 

But there's always that trade off for getting to live inside the Academic world, no?  I know people who could make three or four times the salary if they would work for a corporation, but they wouldn't even consider it because they know it would take years off of their lives.

[Yegolev]

Tolerating or even liking your job should trump salary.  Just sayin'.

[Lantyssa]

But there's always that trade off for getting to live inside the Academic world, no? I know people who could make three or four times the salary if they would work for a corporation, but they wouldn't even consider it because they know it would take years off of their lives.

It depends where in the academic world.  For in-house IT support, things are pretty cushy and I am happy with the trade-off of low stress for a lesser salary.  I could handle being a guest lecturer, but that is not a very well paying, or respected, position.  Were I a faculty member in the same research intensive department I would be absolutely miserable.  (Not that I would ever be capable of getting tenure short of having nobel quality work fall into my lap.)

[Sky]

I admit I trade low stress for salary. That and a nice 9-5 M-F work week. That allows me to post here.

I wasn't really complaining, just in the market to buy a house and depressed about it. I want to burn capitalists alive for making shelter an investment product, the motherfucking soulless ghouls.

[Shockeye]

I wasn't really complaining, just in the market to buy a house and depressed about it. I want to burn capitalists alive for making shelter an investment product, the motherfucking soulless ghouls.

If you weren't spending money on 61" TVs you'd be able to afford a house.

[Nebu]

But there's always that trade off for getting to live inside the Academic world, no?  I know people who could make three or four times the salary if they would work for a corporation, but they wouldn't even consider it because they know it would take years off of their lives.

Ok.  I'm busted. 

Yes, I took this job by choice as I value my personal and intellectual freedom above the offers I've received in the private sector. I make significantly less than I could out in industry, but I enjoy a much better standard of life.  You're dead on here. 

As for developers, I imagine they're overworked and undercompensated for their efforts. Personally, I could never put so much sweat and passion into a project only to see business people turn it into a money-making monstrocity.  That's the kind of thing that breaks the spirit of anyone that's passionate about what they do.

[Yegolev]

I wasn't really complaining, just in the market to buy a house and depressed about it. I want to burn capitalists alive for making shelter an investment product, the motherfucking soulless ghouls.

If you weren't spending money on 61" TVs you'd be able to afford a house.

I wasn't the only one to imagine a rickety "manufactured home" with a $2000 TV sitting on a milk crate, I see.

[Shockeye]

I wasn't the only one to imagine a rickety "manufactured home" with a $2000 TV sitting on a milk crate, I see.

I'm thinking it was a $4000 TV when he bought it.

[Llava]

Those are great salaries.

If you never plan on having a family.

(This assumes said salaries are in California.  Checking out the math, I would have been able to survive with me and one dependant in Austin, Texas on 35k/year.  There would be a budget, but it would be comfortable.  But we couldn't go out buying $4000 TVs or anything.)

[Yegolev]

If your sofa is an old tire with a stolen Holiday Inn towel on top, the $4000 TV is practically free.

[Merusk]

$35k a year is a very nice non-executive salary in the Cincinnati area.  It's "Mid-Middle class" so long as you and the Mrs. both have jobs.  It's Lower-middle if it's just you supporting her and yourself.  Making 42k a year I know I could support my family without selling the house if the wiffle stopped working, but we'd have to lose the amenities like cable, internet and the second car to do so.

[schild]

I could live on $1200 a month and keep f13 running and easily create more fun than half of the designers in the MMOG industry. That's right, I'm throwing that gauntlet down. Anyone notice that the bulk of the gaming industry forgot how Fun works? Eh? Is it just me? Maybe it is.

[Roac]

$35k a year is a very nice non-executive salary in the Cincinnati area.  It's "Mid-Middle class" so long as you and the Mrs. both have jobs.  It's Lower-middle if it's just you supporting her and yourself.  Making 42k a year I know I could support my family without selling the house if the wiffle stopped working, but we'd have to lose the amenities like cable, internet and the second car to do so.

To throw a reused stat up, the average US household income is $45k/yr.  I expect panhandling earns better in CA/NY, but it's a tidy sum here in SC.  Somewhere around $70-80k/yr (household) is enough to get a lake home and otherwise be comfortable, less if you wanted to be very tight with spending.

[Poseidon]

Schild wrote:

Oh, and considering what I get paid to run f13 right now (hint: I fall into the $0-$0 category), any of those salaries seem reasonable.

(For anyone actually doing that work though, we have a phrase for them, it's "getting fucked.")

www.kleenex.com
Make that your home page  :-D

[schild]

Ho ho, ZING.