Who said raiding wasn't entertaining?

[Evil Elvis]

I don't think I've ever been in an MC raid where we didn't get at least one piece of Felheart.  Hell, I've been in raids where we've had 3 Felheart belts drop off trash in the same run.  Conversely, I almost never see Arcanist drop, and Prophecy isn't much better.

As for ZG and AQ... meh.  They replaced some of the randomness with faction farming.  You can't farm zg faction outside of the instance, and twilight kill rep is only +1 per kill.  So, you're basically forced to raid the zone 10+ times before you can get the purple quest rewards.  I guess it's better than watching 9 leafs drop before you get an eye of divinity though.

[Chenghiz]

Or they could just implement a system that limits drops based on what your group needs. There's already a rudimentary form of this in place that limits Paladin plate drops to Alliance raids and Shaman drops to Horde raids.

[Threash]

Getting back to the original spirit of the thread:

http://huhuranisserious.ytmnsfw.com/

some guy discussing some loot of a boss from the new instance. 

[SurfD]

Ok serious question time.

My alliance is now at Ragnaros, haven't killed him yet, but we are looking at moving to BWL in the future, probably in about 1-2 months. Here's the question.

To be successful in BWL, could someone please do a class by class checklist of the minimum requirements needed to start trying runs there? I mean how much FR, tier one, what kind of weapons, etc each class would need to try this out. Also, any items that are necessary or extremely helpful to those classes that they should be gunning for would be helpful (ie - good warrior FR items that they should have, weapons you can't miss, etc). Thanks.

Hmm, to be honest, if you can get to Rag, and have a good expectaition of downing him, you are probably pretty good to go on most BWL encounters.

Razorgore - Cant really say much about this fight if you are alliance, as i have only experienced it from horde side.  Lots of kiteing involved, have a few someones who are intimately aquainted with controlling mindcontrolled people.  No real fire resist needed.

Vael - Good healing required, and from here on out, you are goiing to need a good bunch off tanks who are VERY on the ball.  Vael requires moderate to high fire resistance gear, unless your healers are REALLY on the ball.  Not sure what the reccomended FR for the tanks is, but probably at least whatever they would tank Ony in.

Broodlord - Minimal fire resistance, good armor on the tanks (guy hits like a truck).  Aggro management is key on this guy, and you probably want to go slow burn to kill him if your healers have the mana pool.  The clear to this guy is usually more of a pain in the ass then the actual fight.

Firemaw - High fire resist on the tanks, positioning is the key with this fight.  Also going to need tanks tradeing off aggro and eating wingbuffets in an effort to keep his dot from stacking too high.

Ebonroc - Lots of mele damage from him, shadow resist on tanks helps resist his debuff.  Be prepared for LONGASS fights to kill this guy untill your tanks get the hang of managing his targeting to minimize the debuff healing.

Flamegore - Magmadar, but as a drake.  Probably same gear as tanking for Ony, just tranq him when he enrages and he is free loot pretty much.

Chromaggus - I have limited experience with this dude, but it is one intense fight.  Much of it depends on what 2 "breath" combos you get.  The rest is positioning, debuffing, and dancing around to do dps between breaths.

Neff - Long, hard, and highly fun.  The only way to really do this fight is to experience it first hand.

oh, and Tanks should ALWAYS have ony cloaks on when fighting the drakes, and EVERYONE should have ony cloaks on when doing neff.  When in doubt, if it can cast shadowflame, put on an ony cloak.

[Jayce]

We just downed Ragnaros for the third time and it seems that we can do it reliably, so we are going to BWL now.  After reading the post above, I am TOTALLY stoked.  Thanks for posting that.

BTW, for Paelos, our MTs have about 300 FR unbuffed.  Most everyone else has in the 150-200 range.  We have an assortment of epics but people still wear some blues and greens.

[Merusk]

So how different is Rag from the rest of the MC bosses?

This weekend was our co-op's 3rd time in MC and after a VERY rough start on Friday night where we only downed Luci and had several wipes on Mag. (people act dumb when there's no Dwarf with fear ward.. how does the Horde counter this?) we managed to clear the place up to Baron, who we couldn't summon because we don't have enough folks with water yet.

 With performace like this I'm thinking we might be able to move on to BWL as soon as we've replaced all the greens the partners in our little adventure are wearing, but I want to know what to expect from Rag. and judge our ability from there.

[bhodi]

So how different is Rag from the rest of the MC bosses?

This weekend was our co-op's 3rd time in MC and after a VERY rough start on Friday night where we only downed Luci and had several wipes on Mag. (people act dumb when there's no Dwarf with fear ward.. how does the Horde counter this?) we managed to clear the place up to Baron, who we couldn't summon because we don't have enough folks with water yet.

 With performace like this I'm thinking we might be able to move on to BWL as soon as we've replaced all the greens the partners in our little adventure are wearing, but I want to know what to expect from Rag. and judge our ability from there.

The same way everyone else does - stance dance.

If you can beat domo, you have the teamwork to beat rag; All you need is the FR gear.

[Merusk]

As I thought, thanks. We've been doing the stance-dance, but once in a while the MT is slow or lags and he'll get feared. It then becomes chaos as mag eats healers and runs amok among the casters.

 I think I'm going to reccomend we try something similar to the ZG spider this weekend with Mag. (Second tank out of fear range, runs up and grabs the doggie if/when MT loses aggro, pulls it back to his spot.)  Ideally I know this is what the secondaries should be doing anyway, but since they haven't been TOLD to do it they're not.

[Rasix]

Tremor totem helps somewhat also on Mags.

Another important thing for Rags is DPS.  You're going to need lot of it.  As long as you have the DPS, everyone is over 135 FR unbuffed, and people pay attention to what they're doing (ie no one going afk during sons), you should down him with no problems.  The mods people have developed for this over time help a lot.  Being a healer though, the only thing I really need to know is when the sons are coming.

We had a really annoying Baron fight this past weekend.  We've taken to doing MC on the spur of the moment (since the GM wants more Emp attempts during the week) and it always turns out to be very few healers on, a non-full raid, and lot of people bringing their alts.  We've never been a fast clear due to simply people not wanting to pay attention and when you bring alts, apps and are 5 people short it tends to drag on a bit.  The Baron fight was just a fucking pain in the ass due to people fucking around.  Someone gets the bomb, runs over to 3 priests and explodes.  Some other jackass gets the bomb, boom, there's goes 2 mages and a hunter.  It got to the point where the raid leader had to tell people to quit fucking blowing people up because we were down like 10 people with Baron only at 50%. Heh, it's to the point where I need Earthfury more than Ten Storms and I'm going to start skipping out on Molten Core because it's done with a lack of precision and professionalism, that is not characteristic  of my guild.  Losing more people in a Shazzrah fight than in a Nef encounter is fucking annoying.  Gah, at one point fighting trash, 50% of the healers were sitting at full mana and people were actually goddamn dying. /rant_off

Edit: awkward wording in spots.

[bhodi]

In case no one has seen it, http://www.wowwiki.com/Main_Page has a variety of strategies and lays out how to beat all the current bosses in glorious spoilerific fashion. I've contributed minorly to some of the later AQ bosses and have glanced through the BWL stuff - It's all pretty solid.

Edit: Wow their Ragnaros guide is sad both in terms of grammar and in layout. It's time for a re-write...

[Jayce]

As I thought, thanks. We've been doing the stance-dance, but once in a while the MT is slow or lags and he'll get feared. It then becomes chaos as mag eats healers and runs amok among the casters.

 I think I'm going to reccomend we try something similar to the ZG spider this weekend with Mag. (Second tank out of fear range, runs up and grabs the doggie if/when MT loses aggro, pulls it back to his spot.)  Ideally I know this is what the secondaries should be doing anyway, but since they haven't been TOLD to do it they're not.

Alll warriors that are not taking Mag should be stance dancing around the time he fears - either use the CTRaid boss mod or just count out the seconds. If you do it right you will never get feared.  And then as you say, a secondary can pick him up if the MT gets feared.

[Phred]

Ok serious question time.

My alliance is now at Ragnaros, haven't killed him yet, but we are looking at moving to BWL in the future, probably in about 1-2 months. Here's the question.

To be successful in BWL, could someone please do a class by class checklist of the minimum requirements needed to start trying runs there? I mean how much FR, tier one, what kind of weapons, etc each class would need to try this out. Also, any items that are necessary or extremely helpful to those classes that they should be gunning for would be helpful (ie - good warrior FR items that they should have, weapons you can't miss, etc). Thanks.

You don't really need huge resists until you get to the drakes and then only the tanks really need it. You do all need to have ony cloaks for nef. Having a couple of warriors with piercing how will make rezorgore a lot easier so I recommend you do that.  Other than that you can get by on the fr you have for rag really.

[Phred]

It took everquest a few expansions to learn their lesson, it seems WoW already learned it judging by ZG and now AQ sets.  The "random drop for any class" system of raid loot is incredibly frustrating, you can go months at a time without seeing a particular piece while other guilds are disenchanting it and wishing they had your drops.  I heard tales of people doing the planes for months in EQ and not getting their particular drop.  Thankfully luclin introduced the "generic armor piece" style of raid loot for set armor, the same thing thats being used in ZG and AQ.  Intead of a 1 in 10 chance for your class you get a piece of generic loot usable by several classes that redeemable for your epic lewts. 

Now if they'd just learn from EQ and put resists on epic pieces so I didn't have to carry around 2 backpacks of nature grear and lose 400 atk power to do tougher fights I'd be happy. This farming nr gear from L45 intances blows chunks.

[SurfD]

My guess is that the lack of high end NR gear was actually an oversight in their raid progression.  MC gear seems to mostly have the Resists you want when procieding to BWL, and BWL gear would mostly have the resists you want when heading into their next instance, which was probably origionally intended to be Naxxramus.

I believe they said something about adding in some new craftable NR gear soon.  Cloth is really hurting for NR.  About the only classes with good NR gear at the moment are Mail wearers, due to the silithid craftable stuff.

[Phred]

My guess is that the lack of high end NR gear was actually an oversight in their raid progression.  MC gear seems to mostly have the Resists you want when procieding to BWL, and BWL gear would mostly have the resists you want when heading into their next instance, which was probably origionally intended to be Naxxramus.

I believe they said something about adding in some new craftable NR gear soon.  Cloth is really hurting for NR.  About the only classes with good NR gear at the moment are Mail wearers, due to the silithid craftable stuff.

Even with a full set of MC gear your resists would suck for BWL. I'd love it if gearing up in one instance geared you up for the next but that's not the case here. If Naxx is going to be shadow resist like so many think, the BWL gear still doesn't have much shadow resist on it either, so I don't think there's any forethought at all in this direction.

[Calantus]

I believe Blizz stated it was a mistake to put the resisitances on tier 1/2 gear due to its impact on PVP. So... yea, I think the days of gear that doubles as main and resist gear are over.

[Phred]

I believe Blizz stated it was a mistake to put the resisitances on tier 1/2 gear due to its impact on PVP. So... yea, I think the days of gear that doubles as main and resist gear are over.

Yay. let's fuck up the pve game for the sake of pvp balance.

[HaemishM]

I believe Blizz stated it was a mistake to put the resisitances on tier 1/2 gear due to its impact on PVP. So... yea, I think the days of gear that doubles as main and resist gear are over.

Yay. let's fuck up the pve game for the sake of pvp balance.

The pendulum has to swing the other way somedays.

[Strazos]

I believe Blizz stated it was a mistake to put the resisitances on tier 1/2 gear due to its impact on PVP. So... yea, I think the days of gear that doubles as main and resist gear are over.

Yay. let's fuck up the pve game for the sake of pvp balance.

Boo fucking hoo, cry some more.

[Threash]

I believe Blizz stated it was a mistake to put the resisitances on tier 1/2 gear due to its impact on PVP. So... yea, I think the days of gear that doubles as main and resist gear are over.

Yay. let's fuck up the pve game for the sake of pvp balance.

You say that like its a bad thing...

[Tale]

Onyxia wipe: the animation

http://www.partingvisions.com/onywipe/onyxiawipe.swf

[Oban]

Onyxia wipe: the animation

http://www.partingvisions.com/onywipe/onyxiawipe.swf

Ha!  The childish animation went very well with the audio of the psychopath's breakdown. 

I give it a:

 

[Phred]

I believe Blizz stated it was a mistake to put the resisitances on tier 1/2 gear due to its impact on PVP. So... yea, I think the days of gear that doubles as main and resist gear are over.

Yay. let's fuck up the pve game for the sake of pvp balance.

You say that like its a bad thing...

It is if you could give 2 shits about PvP. I'd prefer they stripped pvp characters naked and gave them all standardized equipment based on their pvp rank when they zoned into battlegrounds to them putting resistance heavy PvE fights in the game and then gimping the resistances of the PvE gear because of the PvP whiners. Besides, the resistances on existing sets that were such a mistake are pitiful as it is. Even the tieir 2 stuff might add 20-30 to several resists if that. Hardly unbalancing. The whiners are focused on stuff like dark iron, put in specifically to make the heavy fire based fights doable at all. Trying to do ragnaros with even a full set of Tier 2 gear would be suicide.

[Calantus]

It actually was pretty genuine. For priests. On my priest I have ~30-40 FR just naturally on gear I'd use in PVP. I then decided to up that with a few pieces with minimal sacrifice. I now sit on ~120 FR with mark up and it is actually pretty noticeable. I rarely ever take a full damage fire spell and 1/2 resists happen often enough to give mages fits I'd imagine. Naturally no other class tends to gimp their other stats for survivability, but PVP priests often do, and the results are pretty amusing.

Of course generally people only had 20-40 resistance if you were unlucky, which is minimal at best.

[Xanthippe]

Onyxia wipe: the animation

http://www.partingvisions.com/onywipe/onyxiawipe.swf

 

[HaemishM]

Onyxia wipe: the animation

http://www.partingvisions.com/onywipe/onyxiawipe.swf

Le art. That's why God invented Flash.

[Dren]

Onyxia wipe: the animation

http://www.partingvisions.com/onywipe/onyxiawipe.swf

I would be so dead in that group.  I wouldn't be able to play due to laughing so hard.

[Paelos]

Wow, that...was...AWESOME!

[Tale]

I think this is taking it a bit far: http://mordots.com/
(meanwhile a domain parking company has taken http://moredots.com)

Also, to expand on the info someone posted above ... The voice is Dives (Tauren Warrior) the leader and MT of Wipe Club on Chromaggus EU server.

Original source: http://koti.mbnet.fi/djcowio/

People say his accent is Turkish, but he says:

as for the accent ive lived in romania/finland/sweden and norway. so i guess its a mix :D

Dives' posts on the official boards:
http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread-search.aspx?ForumName=wow-realm-chromaggus-en&Author=Dives&Cluster=Wow

Dives on whether they are real or staged:

They are both real, and onyxia was like that because it was not the first time we are doing it and we wiped 4 times.. when we usually do it in 1.

As for razorgore.. well.. that lightened the mood a lot. :D

RL pics of Dives:
http://irc-galleria.net/archive.php?nick=Dives

Wipe Club guild forums:
http://wipeclub.2cd.pl/Forum/index.php

Wipe Club guild website (not in use, but owned by Dives):
http://www.wipeclub.org/

[Slayerik]

I quit playing WoW, but someone asked what is needed for BWL. First off, get wiping now on Razorgore...the fight is all practice. Vael is as follows IMO:

80+ Unbuffed FR Healers
130 Unbuffed rogues
Around 250 for tank (we had our tanks put on non-FR tanking gear, find a good balance)

We found some cheap solutions, and remember for Vael you dont need ANY SPI or INT gear! +healing , Stam , and FR is where its at for casters. Look up Wizardweave Cloth items for cheap Vael gear to help get FR up. Also, there are DM drops for the rogues, and the bracers off Incendius.

Vael was my favorite fight, even though he can be a cockblock.

[SurfD]

yeah, infinite Rage/Energy/Mana really allows for the situational gear selections needed to make vael an easier fight.  Essentially, Vael is a total Aggro management fight.  You MUST have tanks who know how to trade off aggro at the appropriate time, and rogues who know how to NOT take aggro from the tanks, while still doing good damage.   Vael is an easy fight, provided aggro is managed properly.  All it takes is one rogue pulling aggro and not losing it fast enough to get 2/3 of your raid breathed and then its game over. (Oh, and make sure whoever gets burning gets the hell away from teh rest of the raid to die :P )

I dont know that i would call him a cockblock.  Back when you could only attempt him for 1 hour every 24 hours, yes, but now, no.

[bhodi]

have all the rogues go about 80% out (100% is simply slamming your backstab key) and vanish at 23%. Then, feel free to go all out (slam that backstab key!) and feint when it's up. Rogues will never get aggro.

[Calantus]

Vael is all about the tanks IMO. It's utterly trivial to heal a Vael raid and if the tanks are good it's terribly hard to pull aggro off them as anything but another warrior. Hardest part is the transition of tanks, by far.