FoxNews: Your source for complete lies about video games.

[Fabricated]

Just a few minutes ago I saw FoxNews trot out yet another douchebag from yet another "Family Institute" on what games to avoid this year.

The list:

1. Far Cry
2. F.E.A.R.
3. Stubbs the Zombie
4. Blitz: The League
5. True Crime

Bonus: The guy they had on said that the object of F.E.A.R. was to eat people, and at one point in the game the player eats someone. Awesome.

Also, how did Far Cry end up higher up the ladder than F.E.A.R. to begin with? I'd say F.E.A.R. would fuck up your kids way more than Far Cry, the damn near comical Stubbs the Zombie, or any of the other games would.

[Lt.Dan]

Probably just beefed up the story to fit the 2 min slot.  Sound bites = News on Fox. 

The whole report is available at http://www.mediafamily.org/research/report_vgrc_2005.shtml 

I went here to find some crackpot movie review to ridicule but alas.  I skim read the report and it doesn't seem so outrageous, and certainly not quite Jack Chick type douchebaggery.  Their main points are - ratings aren't always accurate of content, ratings aren't enforced in most stores, and parents don't seem to be aware that there kids are playing 'M' rated games.

The actual game list is a bit of a 'duh' moment.  Games that you shouldn't buy teens and children are all rated 'M'.

(Just so this thread doesn't immediately degenerate, I'm not defending their research, telling anyone how to raise there kids, or inferring that anyone's upbringing caused them harm)

[HaemishM]

I imagine Fab's problem isn't so much with the report as with the lack of depth and soundbitishness produced by the 2 minutes of FuxNews. It paints a picture of douchebaggery on the part of uptight conservative assholes, wheter or not those uptight assholes might have a point that couldn't otherwise be gleaned by looking at the game's rating.

EDIT: Then again, in the secnod paragraph of the report, we get this:

The industry's efforts to be good corporate citizens have not kept pace with its explosive growth. The industry that generated 25 billion dollars in worldwide sales last year (nearly 10 billion in the U.S. alone) seems increasingly focused on the bottom line,

Welcome to fucking capitalism, bitches.

at the expense of its customers, especially children and teenagers. Killographic and sexually explicit games are still finding their way into the hands of millions of underage players.

BZZZZT. You get fifteen billion demerits for using the idiotic phrase "KILLOGRAPHIC." I'm sorry, that proves you are a fucking retard too swayed by media to be involved in the raising of my children.

[HaemishM]

Reading further, we get this:

The ESRB video game rating system, like its cousins in the movie and television industries, is owned and operated by the industry it is supposed to monitor. This obvious conflict of interest is why only eighteen games out of ten thousand have ever been rated Adults Only (AO). It seems that every year M-rated games are on average more violent, contain more sexual content and have more profane language than games released with the same rating the year before. Study after study shows that ratings would be stricter if parents were doing the job. It took explicit porn to get Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas an AO rating, even though the original version, still rated M, rewards players whose onscreen persona had sex with prostitutes and then killed them. We have been calling for AO ratings for the Grand Theft Auto series for years - now it is clear why the ESRB has ignored our request.

Uh, BZZZZZZZZZZZTTTT again, fucktards. You do not have ONSCREEN sex with prostitutes. It is implied sex. There is no nudity, and no fucking shown. The same kind of thing would get you a PG-13 in the movies. Even with the Hot Coffee mod, you still did NOT get EXPLICIT PORN. There was no nudity in the Hot Coffee mod. At worst, there was dry humping and some grunting. That isn't porn. That kind of thing has been on broadcast TV before. A kid can see worse than that by sneaking into their parent's bedroom at night.

It's one thing to warn parents about mature video games, you know, like the rating system already fucking does. It's another to distort facts and OUTRIGHT LIE about them to prove your point. Fucktards.

[Dren]

That isn't porn. That kind of thing has been on broadcast TV before. A kid can see worse than that by sneaking into their parent's bedroom at night.

Bzzzzt wrong.  They can see that in the light of day on soups.  With partial nudity.  And heavy breathing.  AND the graphics are almost lifelike!!

[Evangolis]

I've had a touch of the flu lately, and therefore have spent a bunch of time in the lazyboy so I can breathe, which therefore puts me in front of the TV during the day.  Lacking cable, I've watched a lot of kids cartoons.  I have to notice that, unlike the PBS shows, most of the mainstream cartoons are shockingly violent; far more realistic than the Tom & Jerry/Roadrunner stuff I saw as a child, and worse than many games.  Frankly, I generally think there is too much violence and gratuitous sex in our media, but games are far and away the trailers in this race. 

I can't help but contrast the much maligned public broadcast system's excellent children's programming with the political pontificating and hypocritical cowardice of the anti-game people who backhandedly support violent media when it is too powerful to risk opposing, but try to make political points against games.  The whole matter could do with more good works like PBS and less posturing like the 'family' groups are prone to indulge in.

[HaemishM]

Hell, watch any episode of the new Batman cartoon on WB Kids if you want to see shockingly violent. They did a movie for Halloween, Batman vs. Dracula that I was really surprised they released. The Joker got turned into a vampire and was licking up blood like it was syrup on a biscuit. The fight scenes are really well done and do not "pull any punches."

Of course, these people would say that Hollywood is just as bad, but then they've apparently never read some of our greatest literature for examples of violence. Filming Moby Dick accurately would produce a movie at least as violent as an M-rated game.

[Margalis]

My opinion has always been that the context is what matters, not the level of sex and violence. I don't think sex and violence are bad. What troubles me is sex and violence being portrayed as normal and acceptable.

For example Friends was terrible in that regard. Everyone had casual sex all the time, with everyone else. The show does not seem particular fantastic. It's vaguely realistic people doing vaguely realistic thing. So it normalizes casual sex.

On the other hand something like Dragon Ball Z has plenty of violence but it's clearly fantasy. It doesn't normalize the violence. What matter is that Friends seems to imply that certain behaviors are more normal than they should be - it pushes unacceptable things to be acceptable. Dragon Ball doen't portray those unacceptable things as normal. They are only normal in the context of you are a guy from planet Vegeta who can shoot fireballs, fly and is friends with a talking cat.

[Fabricated]

I get pissed about how the games are getting blamed for kids and parents buying them.

That, and how they TOTALLY FUCKING GET THE PREMISE OF ALL THE GAMES WRONG.

THE OBJECT OF SAN ANDREAS IS NOT TO FUCK PROSTITUTES YOU STUPID BIBLEHUMPING FUCKERS, THE GUY IS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHO KILLED HIS MOM. YOU JUST HAVE THE ABILITY TO PICK UP PROSTITUTES AND RUN THEM OVER AFTERWARDS.

YOU DO NOT AT ANY POINT IN FEAR, EAT SOMEONE. EVER. PERIOD. NOT FUCKING ONCE. YOU'RE TRYING TO *STOP* THE GUY WHO EATS PEOPLE. IT'S SCARY AND BLOODY, NOT PROMOTING CANNIBALISM.

[Signe]

I killed a man once and ate him afterwards. 

It wasn't my fault, though.  I was compelled to after playing Nethack.  He was spoiled, though, because I left him in the tin too long. 

No, really.  It's all true.

[Dren]

I will have to concede to one point.  Last night I was watching a game with some of the guys at my house.  This was the standard networks mind you, not cable.  A commercial came up that showed the new Prince of Persia game.  The one scene that keeps playing over and over in my mind is where he wraps a chain around a guy's neck and yanks while blood goes spurting out in one direction killing him.  This was all done in slo-mo.

While I probably would think that was cool if I was playing the game, by myself away from the children's view, this was on public TV during a commercial during a football game.  Short of blanking the screen during commercials, what control did I have over that??

After seeing it, one friend turned to the rest of us and said, "That was a bit excessive, wasn't it?"

I have no problem with that game existing and it looked pretty cool, but that kind of advertising is just going to fuel the fires that are already burning.  Of course, if these guys do target that game, it will break records in sales!

[Margalis]

Commercials are an interesting case. You can choose to not watch a show or not buy a game, but you can't choose your commercials. Some people don't like beer commercials with swimsuit vixens during football either. Unlike in games or shows you have no control.

[Lt.Dan]

Violence is overflow.  You can appeal to the FCC about nudity/profanity but they have no mandate over violence.  Hence you can watch Anthony Hopkins serve up Ray Liotta's brain to Ray Liotta at 4 o'clock in the afternoon on cable TV.

[Pococurante]

I can't help but contrast the much maligned public broadcast system's excellent children's programming with the political pontificating and hypocritical cowardice of the anti-game people who backhandedly support violent media when it is too powerful to risk opposing, but try to make political points against games.  The whole matter could do with more good works like PBS and less posturing like the 'family' groups are prone to indulge in.

PBS and Noggin are the only things I let my pre-schoolers watch.  They can go outside and eat bugs and mess up my grape arbor before I'll let them tune into NickJr or any of that other crap.  I predict they will be finding lots of excuses to go to a friends house once they hit school age since my censorship will continue for as long as I can get away with it.

BTW of the two I prefer Noggin over PBS.  Noggin's worst flaw is that on Sunday they switch over to reruns for a teen audience - I can live with that.  What bothers me is most of their programming comes from Australia and Canada - apparently not enough US content producers can be bothered.

[Shockeye]

A lot of what is on Noggin is recycled from NickJr. Disney Channel also has some very good kids shows like Bear in the Big Blue House and Book of Pooh. Even Wiggles can be amusing from time to time.

[Pococurante]

Yeah but Noggin is commercial free (well, except for self-promotion) - makes all the difference.

Miiiiffy!
(she's a little bunny!)
Miiiiffy!
(a fuzzy little bunny!)

The pace and sensory overload of the shows on NickJr are bad enough but the commercials practically put me in an epileptic state.

[Shockeye]

Miiiiffy!
(she's a little bunny!)
Miiiiffy!
(a fuzzy little bunny!)

Miffy is one of those shows that can put you into a daze and captivate you for far longer than it should. Don't get me started on Oobi.

[HaemishM]

NickJr. is just Viacom training camp for future MTV consumerists bimbots.

[Pococurante]

Miffy is one of those shows that can put you into a daze and captivate you for far longer than it should. Don't get me started on Oobi.

Grampoo scares me. ;)

NickJr. is just Viacom training camp for future MTV consumerists bimbots.

Damn skippy.

[Shockeye]

Setting the Record Straight

The current kerfuffle in the US media about Stubbs the Zombie can be summed up in one word: semantics.

Stubbs, they say, is a cannibal.

This is nonsense, as anyone with a working knowledge of cannibals can tell you. Stubbs fails all the classic litmus tests for cannibalism. He does not wear a bone through his nose. He does not help FBI agents track down serial killers. He has not written a cookbook. He is not named Jeffrey Dahmer. The list goes on and on.

Stubbs is a zombie. Thus the title "Stubbs the Zombie." Zombies eat brains. That's what they do. Stubbs cannot just saunter into the cafeteria and order a plate of Freedom Fries. He has to fight for his meals. In fact, actual cannibals only make it harder for Stubbs to eat, which is why this "cannibalism" story is insulting as well as injurious.

It's no surprise that the all-human media cartel resorts to distortions and name-calling; their anti-zombie bias has been evident for decades, and Stubbs is just the newest target.

If you're a thinking adult, you're probably ready to hear the other side of the story. You'll find it in Stubbs the Zombie in Rebel Without a Pulse, in stores now for Xbox, PC and Macintosh. Don't let the humanity-centric media tell you what to think about zombies. A free mind is a tasty mind.

[Lum]

So, without a working, accepted regulatory system you get the kind of fear uncertainty and doubt that Rupert Murdoch's media tend to thrive on (I'm pretty sure the NY Post has used the phrase "killographic" - it's supposed to be like pornography, but with gore instead of boobs).

I played Fear. I enjoyed it. It's absolutely not suitable for children. Neither are most "R" rated movies. Generally 12 year olds have a difficult time getting into "R" movies. I think. I'm old. I avoid malls. Maybe they just get waved in now, while carrying their GTA:SA boxes.

The problem is that the gaming industry and to a large part the media and marketing machine surrounding it rewards shock. Rockstar's made a killing at it. Meanwhile people who'd like to make games that don't come in plain brown wrappers or whose NPCs use obscenity every 15 seconds (Hi, Fear) are getting for the most part lost in the shuffle.

Still, the most popular games are squarely PG (World of Warcraft, The Sims series) and the most egregious offenders actually tend to bomb (50 Cent, Postal). Hm. Maybe the media and marketing machines are clueless about what people actually want! Who would have guessed!

[Sky]

Of course, these people would say that Hollywood is just as bad, but then they've apparently never read some of our greatest literature for examples of violence. Filming Moby Dick accurately would produce a movie at least as violent as an M-rated game.

Well, there's your avatar's movie, Haemmy.

And the "good" book. The BLOOD!!

[HaemishM]

So, without a working, accepted regulatory system you get the kind of fear uncertainty and doubt that Rupert Murdoch's media tend to thrive on (I'm pretty sure the NY Post has used the phrase "killographic" - it's supposed to be like pornography, but with gore instead of boobs).

How could I have impugned the integrity of such a journalistic icon as the New York Post.

Anyone who seriously uses the word Killographic to describe a video game or any other form of media should be taken out to the backyard, tied down to a stake and beaten with a fucking Webster's Dictionary. Then just before they lose consciousness, they should be cut with the thousand cuts not from paper, but from broken edges of a Britannica CD.

Videogames don't make me violent. Stupidity does.

[Sky]

Videogames don't make me killographic. Stupidity does.

FIFY! Merry Christmas!

[CmdrSlack]

The fight scenes are really well done and do not "pull any punches."

But who will save the children from this pun?

[Dren]

Haemish is killoriffic!

[Righ]

1. Play video games
2. Wear black trenchcoat
3. Do drugs
4. Listen to Marilyn Manson
5. Kill other children with automatic weapons

It's a gateway thing.

[Evangolis]

I played video games as soon as they came out, and did lots of drugs, but lacked access to black trenchcoats and Marilyn Manson.  I did try to substitute camo BDUs and Alice Cooper, but it wasn't enough.

Born too soon for my destiny, alas.

[Righ]

I think us older types were supposed to listen to Judas Priest backwards or something. I couldn't even listen to them forwards without laughing.

Congratulations. You've just discovered the secret message. Please send your answer to Old Pink, care of the funny farm, Chalfont.

[DevilsAdvocate]

1. Play video games
2. Wear black trenchcoat
3. Do drugs
4. Listen to Marilyn Manson
5. Kill other children with automatic weapons

It's a gateway thing.

We need to ban Black Trenchcoats! The line must be drawn here! Right here! NO further!

[Margalis]

1. Play video games
2. Wear black trenchcoat
3. Do drugs
4. Listen to Marilyn Manson
5. Kill other children with automatic weapons

It's a gateway thing.

You know what the really funny thing is here? The Columbine killers weren't big Manson fans. IIRC they were into KMFDM. It was widely reported that Manson was a strong connection then those stories were quietly retracted later. I was telling that to some of my coworkers the other week. My explanation was "hey, they weren't good guys, but they had good taste in music."

[Roac]

You know what the really funny thing is here? The Columbine killers weren't big Manson fans. IIRC they were into KMFDM. It was widely reported that Manson was a strong connection then those stories were quietly retracted later. I was telling that to some of my coworkers the other week. My explanation was "hey, they weren't good guys, but they had good taste in music."

Beware the nice, quiet ones.  The outrageous death-metal loving ones have found an outlet for their angst; the nice ones haven't.  Yet.

[Righ]

The Columbine killers weren't big Manson fans. IIRC they were into KMFDM.

That makes sense. What do you get when you write KMFDM backwards? MDFMK, who were founded right after KMFDM split a couple of months before the Columbine Massacre. It's all about the backwards. TRBOR.

[Llava]

I played lots of video games.
I wore a black trenchcoat (pre-Columbine, I should point out)
I listened to Marilyn Manson

I didn't do drugs, though.

Oh, right, and I didn't kill anyone.  Wanted to a bunch of times, but never did or seriously planned to.

Howzabout that.

Killographic

Was "violent" too hard to spell?  Are we just making up new dumbass words for subjects that already have perfectly good words?  Cool, I'd like to point out that, from now on, "killographic" is to be considered a perfectly cromulent word.

[Sky]

It's scrumtrulescent.