Q Re: Super Relexes

[Mesozoic]

For defense against melee atacks, Reflexes allows two different options.  Focused Fighting is toggle, and Dodge is automatic.  Versus ranged attacks its the same, Focused Senses (toggle) versus Agile (auto).

I have the mandatory Focused Fighting, would Dodge be a waste?  If I go for FSenses or Agile, will I need the other?

[daveNYC]

If you run out of endurance, the toggled defenses will drop.

[Mesozoic]

Yeah I'm clear on the nature of toggle vs auto, I'm just wondering if these particular powers are worth stacking up and if not, which is better.

[daveNYC]

Dunno about that, I just mentioned that point because I'm a big fan of auto-powers.  My reason being, if you're fighting and you're out of end. you are probably in trouble already, having your toggled defense buff drop at that point would be double plus ungood.

[Alkiera]

On the other hand, it's been stated that active powers, i.e. those that use endurance, are more effective than passive powers.  I know for the Invuln. power line, the passive resists aren't nearly as effective as the endurance-sucking one.

--
Alkiera

[Mesozoic]

Conventional wisdom from the CoH scrapper boards, if I'm reading it right, seems to be that there's little to nothing wasted by stacking them, and that combined they can make you quite the slipperly motherfucker.  That said, I'm end-starved ATM and will go for the autos first.

So, yay, I answered my own question by wandering outside this dick-waving, insular, shitstack home of ours.  The outside is a terrible place.

[geldonyetich]

Back in beta I've tried out the Super Reflexes set and I was quite dissipointed with it.   The problem was that anything yellow con or higher would have little difficulty hitting me even if both my Focused Fighting and Agile going for me.

However, one very important thing has happened since then:

Generic "Defensive Buff enhancements have been made much easier purchasable from stores when the "power 5" enhancements became the "power 10" enhancements.

When I was playing with it myself, I had to go without because I was completely reliant on villian drops and wasn't lucky enough to get it in the 6 levels I was playing a Super Reflex Scrapper.

Ultimately the important thing to remember is that Super Reflexes will be much more useful against lower level foes while higher level foes are likely to hit you regardless.    With Regeneration or Invulnerability you're coping for damage you've already taken, but with Super Reflexes you're banking on not being hit at all.    So ultimately, Super Reflexes is a great choice as long as your sticking to white or maybe yellow cons.

On the other hand sticking a bunch of defencive buffs on there should also increase the effective level in which Super Reflexes is good for.   I can't say just how much, but it probably works somewhat like Personal Force Field which, as Geko said:

One last Test.

This time I took my level 3 Defender againt 2 level 6 Hellions.
Normally, they would have a 66% chance to hit me. With PFF with 1 Def Buff Enhancement on, that should be reduced to 19.5%. After 50 attacks, I was hit 15 times. Thats a 30% success rate, a little higher than designed, but it is a random number, so it could go either way. I will look into testing a bit more to get better sampling, but all seems well.

Remember, the more Def Buff Enhancements you put in, the higher level foes you can defend against.  

There, I think I beat that horse good and dead.

[Mesozoic]

Well shit.  I suppose that as a demoness I should have taken Dark anyway.

And a tail.  People keep noting that I don't have a tail.

[geldonyetich]

There are some fringe benefits that Super Reflexes gives you further down the line besides just evasiveness.

Practiced Brawler (lvl 10) gives you the resistance to Knockback/Disorient/Hold/Sleep/Immobilization which a good front line fighter oft needs.

Quickness (lvl 20) grants you both an increase in speed and attack rate and is an always on auto-power.   So that's a Swift-like ability with an always-on Hasten rolled in?  Not bad.

The main issue I see with Super Reflexes down the line (besides it being less effective the higher level mobs you're up against) is that it looks like half the powers are toggles that suck endurance.  Fitness/Stamina seems like a requirement to make full use of the power set.

[CmdrSlack]

My katana scrapper in beta was very endurance challenged even around lv 10 due to the toggle powers from reflexes.

Even with end reducers slotted in, I found him running out midway through large fights, and sometimes only making it out of smaller fights with minimal stamina.  I came to expect that my toggle powers would drop during a fight due to the endurance drain.

I never got a chance to slot in DOs and find out otherwise, however.

[Furiously]

Reflexes works great against even/yellow con mobs. Against Reds prepare to die.

[geldonyetich]

One approach that may not be a bad one to go with Super Reflexes is to avoid the toggle powers as much as possible.  With the exception of Practiced Brawler, which you'll want when you're up against mobs that like to hold, mez, knock you around ,ect.    

So you'd basically pick up Focused Fighting (required since it's the lvl 1 ability), Agile, Practiced Brawler, Dodge, Quickness, Lucky and possibly Elude (since it may offer neigh invulnerability temporarily).   Then slot the hell out of those auto powers to make up for not picking up the toggle powers.

This leaves you without Focused Senses and Evasion, which can become two more power pool powers.   So you'll end up with your entire attack base and four (five without Elude) power pool powers of your choice.

Not a bad template, really.  Might be a little boring since many of your powers are non-interactive in nature.   Given four power pool slots I'd probably take Swift, Health, Stamina, and Hasten.   Given five, Swift, Health, Stamina, Hasten, and Super Speed (so you can have a travel power at 14th).  Broadsword or Dark Melee would be good combinations to go with it since their attacks' high recycle times would be nullified with Hasten and Quickness together.  Comparitively, martial arts, claws, or spines may be a less productive choice because their recycle time is already very low.

[HaemishM]

My natural martial arts scrapper is built with super relfexes. I've got Focused Fighting slotted with 1 15+ training def, 1 DO def buff level 15, and 1 15+ training end. red. buff. I just added agile with a 15+ defense buff. I suggest taking Leaping as a power pool and adding Combat Jumping as well. I have combat jumping slutted with 1 end. reduction, 1 jumping, and 1 def. enhancement.

I can solo most of the things I'd expect to be able to solo.

[Kyper]

My main is dark melee/reflexes.  I like the always-on defensive powers and focused senses is a must have when you're facing mez/stun mobs.  

Personally, I only use the toggle powers when I'm facing tougher mobs (yellows, oranges, reds and purples).  They do burn a lot of endurance, so I save them for when I really need them.

I'm also going the stamina pool power route to improve my endurance regen.

There are a number of dark melee powers I don't plan to take, but I will take all of the reflexes powers.  The reason is that the higher level dark melee powers are quite specialized.  I can already do nice amounts of damage with what I have at level 14.  What I do need is more defense.  

Overall, I'm happy with reflexes.  I also think the power gets much better at higher levels.