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Topic: Continuing from WT: A question about online poker (Read 76558 times)
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Margalis
Terracotta Army
Posts: 12335
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I'm dealt As10h and it folds around to me on the button. I raise, SB folds, BB calls. Flop comes all low hearts. BB checks, I check. Turn brings an A. BB bets, I raise, BB calls. River brings a 4th heart to give me the 10 high flush. BB checks, I bet, he raises, I call. He shows AhKh for the flopped nut flush.
BB called your raise. An ace hits and you have an OK kicker that you raise with...why? You have top pair with mediocre kicker and could already be drawing dead. This is a check-call all the way. --- Bad poker does not win. End of discussion. Come sit at table with me sometime and I'll show you how to beat bad players. I people played high limits the way they play low limits I'd be rich.
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vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
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Abagadro
Terracotta Army
Posts: 12227
Possibly the only user with more posts in the Den than PC/Console Gaming.
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Bad poker does not win. My position on micro/low limit: This is 100% true. It is, however, often frustrating to play against. I will take a table full of calling station fish any day of the week over a tough game. However, if I am going to absorb horrendous beats so I can ultimately average 3BB/100 hands (my current win rate), I want those big bets to at least be worth the time/aggravation/blood pressure spikes.
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"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”
-H.L. Mencken
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Rasix
Moderator
Posts: 15024
I am the harbinger of your doom!
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Bad poker does not win. End of discussion. Come sit at table with me sometime and I'll show you how to beat bad players. I people played high limits the way they play low limits I'd be rich.
OK, I'll concede that point. But it's hard to lose to suckouts like that and believe. It really bothers me when people keep ride something to the river when all they had was a couple of low suited cards or a low pair and people are betting/raising all over the place. I guess that's a good thing, I'm starting to notice people that are playing really bad poker and know who to milk for money when I'm holding an ace high flush and there's no sign of a full house on the board. It's made me really tight too with my bets. I did something I thought I'd never do, ever. I folded a set of Jacks due to the presence of a king and queen on the board and some very agressive betting between 2 others playing the hand. I felt somewhat good about laying down and somewhat sickened by it at the same time. I probably should have ridden it out, but for once I followed my gut and folded. I can't even remember how the hand ended I was so frazzled at what I had done (I really should find that hand in my history and check it out). I just wish I could play these people at higher limits. They'd seriously pay for part of a home loan with the way they constantly throw their money around. Of course, they'd probably do a lot more folding. A pair of pocket 9's looks OK when you've only got to bet 50 cents or a dollar, but it looks like dog shit when you're having to call 10 bucks.
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-Rasix
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WayAbvPar
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I did something I thought I'd never do, ever. I folded a set of Jacks due to the presence of a king and queen on the board and some very agressive betting between 2 others playing the hand. I felt somewhat good about laying down and somewhat sickened by it at the same time. I probably should have ridden it out, but for once I followed my gut and folded. I can't even remember how the hand ended I was so frazzled at what I had done (I really should find that hand in my history and check it out).
If you are pretty sure you are beat, don't feel bad about laying them down. With two other players going to war in the hand, chances are that at least one of them has you beat. I know how you feel about laying down big hands- I had to dump AA in a tourney a couple of weeks ago when the turn put a 4 card straight on the board and my opponent was betting back at my on the flop AND the straight. He may have put a move on me, but under those circumstances I can't afford to find out.
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When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM
Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood
Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
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Mediocre
Guest
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If there was aggressive betting with QK on the board, my best guess would be that one guy had AK, one guy had KQ, and your set of jacks was the winning hand.
Pot odds with two very aggressive betters would have led me to call bets to the river against the raisers who are probably capping every street anyways.
So, IMO, folding the set of jacks may not have been the best thing to do.
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Rasix
Moderator
Posts: 15024
I am the harbinger of your doom!
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If I can find the hand in my history, I'll post it here. I may be remember all of the details wrong, but it just screamed "GET THE FUCK OUT". It was pretty much a straight board also. There were just too many ways I could have gone down.
Last night I played for about 50 minutes with a much more focused mindset. Won $15 bucks and I only put money voluntarily into the pot like 20% of the time on around 60 hands. I only went to 5 showdowns, which I won all of them. I didn't win much without a showdown, but I did have a couple people that only folded when I check/raised on the river (about 4 total wins without showdown).
It also helped that most of the time there was another guy there that was pretty damn good. It was fun to play against him and watch him gut the river runners when I wasn't.
Here's some stats: Hold'em (Real Money): 100 hands played and saw flop: - 9 times out of 19 while in small blind (47%) - 14 times out of 17 while in big blind (82%) - 16 times out of 64 in other positions (25%) - a total of 39 times out of 100 (39%) Pots won at showdown - 8 out of 12 (66%) Pots won without showdown - 5
Here was my favorite hand of the night, even though I tied: *********** # 30 ************** PokerStars Game #354366684: Hold'em Limit ($0.50/$1.00) - 2004/03/26 - 01:18:48 (ET) Table 'Antares' Seat #4 is the button Seat 1: BlindDuff ($5.25 in chips) Seat 3: dawgstud ($41 in chips) Seat 4: PeteyBalls ($11 in chips) Seat 5: RiverRipper ($13 in chips) Seat 6: thomase12 ($72.25 in chips) RiverRipper: posts small blind $0.25 thomase12: posts big blind $0.50 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to thomase12 [Ac 9c] BlindDuff: calls $0.50 dawgstud: calls $0.50 PeteyBalls: folds RiverRipper: raises $0.50 to $1 thomase12: calls $0.50 Parsec joins the table at seat #2 BlindDuff: calls $0.50 dawgstud: calls $0.50 *** FLOP *** [Qs Ks Jc] RiverRipper: bets $0.50 thomase12: calls $0.50 BlindDuff: calls $0.50 dawgstud: calls $0.50 *** TURN *** [Qs Ks Jc] [Td] RiverRipper: bets $1 thomase12: raises $1 to $2 BlindDuff: calls $2 dawgstud: raises $1 to $3 RiverRipper: calls $2 thomase12: raises $1 to $4 Betting is capped BlindDuff: calls $1.75 and is all-in dawgstud: calls $1 RiverRipper: calls $1 *** RIVER *** [Qs Ks Jc Td] [6d] RiverRipper: bets $1 thomase12: calls $1 dawgstud: raises $1 to $2 RiverRipper: calls $1 thomase12: calls $1 *** SHOW DOWN *** dawgstud: shows [Ad 5s] (a straight, Ten to Ace) RiverRipper: mucks hand thomase12: shows [Ac 9c] (a straight, Ten to Ace) thomase12 collected $3.50 from side pot dawgstud collected $3.25 from side pot BlindDuff: mucks hand thomase12 collected $10 from main pot dawgstud collected $10 from main pot *** SUMMARY *** Total pot $27.75 Main pot $20. Side pot $6.75. | Rake $1 Board [Qs Ks Jc Td 6d] Seat 1: BlindDuff mucked [Tc Jd] - two pair, Jacks and Tens Seat 3: dawgstud showed [Ad 5s] and won ($13.25) with a straight, Ten to Ace Seat 4: PeteyBalls (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 5: RiverRipper (small blind) mucked [Ts Qd] - two pair, Queens and Tens Seat 6: thomase12 (big blind) showed [Ac 9c] and won ($13.50) with a straight, Ten to Ace
dawgstud was the good player I was referring to. I knew he had the ace but the others had shit. That guy RiverRipper chased just about every river ironically and would bet heavily agressive all of the time. I probably should have reraised on the river, just to see if we could have gotten any more cash out of RR.
It's been fun. It's a lot more fun when you feel like you're playing decent.
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-Rasix
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UD_Delt
Terracotta Army
Posts: 999
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If only all nights could be like last night. We had our weekly homegame. A bunch of people bailed on us last minute so we only ended up playing with 4. We played 3 $10 tourneys (payed $30, $10) and 1 $5 ($15,$5) tourney. I took 3rd, 1st, 1st in the $10's and second in the $5.
Not a huge money win but everything seemed so easy last night. My only stupid play was in getting picked off in a semi-bluff in the first tourney for all my chips but it turned out ok because in the next game I was getting paid off on all my good hands.
The second place finish in the final tourney was just my luck running out and being too drunk and tired to care anymore. I went in that time with the chip lead but after two coin flips where I was the slight favorite, 1010 vs KQ and A9 vs K4, I lost both and that was the end.
Now hopefully I can carry this over into my online play this weekend. I finally got Poker Tracker registered and went over a lot of my hands. I did find quite a few leaks such as chasing baby flushes from the BB, I lost a number of hands flush to flush because of that. Also, KQo seems to be a bad hand for me, I'm losing a decent bit when I hit a K or Q and I'm either outkicked or beaten by two pair.
In general I seem to be losing money whenever I'm holding one pair so I must be playing that too aggressively. I should have realized by now that in no-foldem it's not often that one pair holds up. Any suggestions on how to play top pair in no-foldem micro limit games? Should I switch from betting out to check-calling w/ good kicker and check-folding w/ low kicker? That just seems to passive to me but maybe that's what needs to be done?
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Rasix
Moderator
Posts: 15024
I am the harbinger of your doom!
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In general I seem to be losing money whenever I'm holding one pair so I must be playing that too aggressively. I should have realized by now that in no-foldem it's not often that one pair holds up. Any suggestions on how to play top pair in no-foldem micro limit games? Should I switch from betting out to check-calling w/ good kicker and check-folding w/ low kicker? That just seems to passive to me but maybe that's what needs to be done?
Playing a single pair is often tricky for me in low limit. If I have the top pair out there and nobody really went to town on the preflop betting, I'll bet. This is really only 50 cents, so you're not losing much if it doesn't pay out. If I'm raised, depending on my kicker, I'll fold. A call at this point doesn't mean much and more often that not you'll get the limpers to fold with a simple 50c bet. Then I'll check/call the rest of the way down the board. Sometimes if the board is something like Q 7 5 10 and I'm holding QA or QK, I'll lead off with bets. Raises and I'll likely fold. If a pair shows up on the boad, I'll fold. If it's a straight or flush board, I'll fold. If the betting gets to aggressive and you're not sure your stuff is going to hold up, fold. Pairs aren't usually big paydays anyhow. Overall, I tend to find that playing pairs very conservatively is the way to go in low limit holdem. But then again, I'm naturally a very tight player (compared to what I've seen).
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-Rasix
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Abagadro
Terracotta Army
Posts: 12227
Possibly the only user with more posts in the Den than PC/Console Gaming.
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I've actually been check-raising my TP/Decent Kicker from early position (which is where you will get TP the most) in LL against a lot of players a lot more lately and it is working out well. Usually goes something like this. 5 limpers and I'm on the button with something like K10. Flop comes down 10 7 2 or some other crap. If I bet, all the overcards and even someone with a 7 will call (i.e. almost everyone). If I check, it will likely be checked a ways before someone bets, then you raise it and make it two bets for the rest of the folk. I get more folds that way which is what I want with a vulnerable hand like that against a big field.
Doesn't always work, but been having some success with it lately.
I disagree with you that if a pair comes on the board, it automatically hurts you and its a no-brainer fold. I find it helps me more than not because it has counterfeited someone holding a crapy middle two pair against my overpair or top pair. I'll almost always raise at that point and see what happens. If I get heavy action back, I know they hit their trips. However, you still have a tiny draw to the boat and by that point the odds usually justify pealing off one card. If bet into after you don't hit, you can fold pretty easy.
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"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”
-H.L. Mencken
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Rasix
Moderator
Posts: 15024
I am the harbinger of your doom!
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I disagree with you that if a pair comes on the board, it automatically hurts you and its a no-brainer fold. I find it helps me more than not because it has counterfeited someone holding a crapy middle two pair against my overpair or top pair. I'll almost always raise at that point and see what happens. If I get heavy action back, I know they hit their trips. However, you still have a tiny draw to the boat and by that point the odds usually justify pealing off one card. If bet into after you don't hit, you can fold pretty easy.
I didn't mean to speak in too much absolutes. I'll usually feel out that pair on the board with the betting. If someone's throwing down cash like they just can't lose, I'll hastily retreat. Good idea on the checking and then raising in the overcard pair situation. I'll have to try that out. As you can see, I'm still very new at this. But these conversations help a lot as evident last night, I tightened up a bit and overall played much better.
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-Rasix
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WayAbvPar
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Top pair will stand up more often than you think, but it isn't a license to bet your ass off by any stretch. If there was no preflop raises (other than a cutoff or button raise, which are likely to be positional), I bet out almost any pair if it is checked to me. If there is a bet in front of me, I will call with most pairs. On the turn, I will bet out (if in early position) with top pair, or raise (in late position) to see how my opponents like their hands. If I get callers or get raised, I slow down in a hurry. If the river doesn't help me, I will check/call or check/fold, depending on my read of the opponent.
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When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM
Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood
Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
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UD_Delt
Terracotta Army
Posts: 999
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Top pair will stand up more often than you think, but it isn't a license to bet your ass off by any stretch. If there was no preflop raises (other than a cutoff or button raise, which are likely to be positional), I bet out almost any pair if it is checked to me. If there is a bet in front of me, I will call with most pairs. On the turn, I will bet out (if in early position) with top pair, or raise (in late position) to see how my opponents like their hands. If I get callers or get raised, I slow down in a hurry. If the river doesn't help me, I will check/call or check/fold, depending on my read of the opponent. I play them the same way. At least I like to think I do. But like I said according to Poker Tracker I'm overall a loser on playing pairs. I'll have to try and look a little deeper and see if maybe I'm losing too often on second pair. I wouldn't think so since I pretty much always fold second pair unless I have a good draw to go along with it. My results right now could just be an anomoly though considering I only have 3000 some hands loaded.
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WayAbvPar
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I am hosting a home game tomorrow night, and have been doing some research (it beats the shit out working!). I found a great page ( here) for some basic rules and variants. Any one have any additional games they play in home games that aren't listed here?
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When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM
Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood
Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
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WayAbvPar
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Heh- I think I linked there on the old WT thread...great site. The fun thing about poker on TV is that more and more 'regular' players want to try playing tournaments. Since my game is more tuned to tournaments than to ring games, this is a +EV move for me =)
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When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM
Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood
Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
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Madman
Terracotta Army
Posts: 143
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I am hosting a home game tomorrow night, and have been doing some research (it beats the shit out working!). I found a great page ( here) for some basic rules and variants. Any one have any additional games they play in home games that aren't listed here? Well I didn't think they had Between the Sheets listed there, but they call it In Between (Acey Duecy). That is by far one of the best games to play, it's fast, it's dirty and only one person comes away happy. I always like to play it double on the posts. There really is nothing like watching a friend have something like 2 K, bet the pot and then manage to ring the post and double that pot. Yes, it has happened to me and it really hurt to toss like 40 bucks into the pot. Usually when I play various home games it's usually a 7 card stud variant. I like No Peek (Blind) Baseball, Chase the Queen (or Ace[not the game - the Ace preceeds the wildcard]), Black Mariah, or Hi(or low) Chicago. I also like 5 card Progression. Guts is also a good game to play with friends. Most of the other ones on that site I haven't played before.
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Mediocre
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WayAbvPar: Some tips on the difference between tournaments and ring games?
Before I played tourneys online, all I played was NL Hold'em home tournaments, 10-man. But that's not a whole lot of XP, even though I was a decent winner overall.
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UD_Delt
Terracotta Army
Posts: 999
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Back in high school our favorites were Acey-Ducey, Guts, 7Stud-Low Hole + Follow the Queen, and Benny.
Benny is a Guts variation where you deal 3 cards, your lowest card is wild. You then hold the chip and drop just like guts. If you stayed in you get 2 more cards, you then deal "Benny" which is a phantom 5 card hand. If you beat everyone who stayed in and "Benny" you scoop the pot. If you stayed in and lose to either a player or to Benny you match the pot. With a $1 ante and 6-7 people we often had over $100 pots playing this game.
Our Acey-Ducey pots used to get out of control too. We had some friends who just loved to throw money into the pot. Any 5 card gap was good enough for them to give it a shot. If you have friends who really like to gamble games with match the pot rules get exciting fast.
I also used to deal a lot of Black Jack during study halls and such. Nothing worse than getting busted by a prick teacher who would just nab all the money on the table rather than pass out the detentions. All worth while though when I would clear $25 or so each study hall.
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WayAbvPar
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WayAbvPar: Some tips on the difference between tournaments and ring games?
Before I played tourneys online, all I played was NL Hold'em home tournaments, 10-man. But that's not a whole lot of XP, even though I was a decent winner overall. The biggest difference (obviously) is that when you go broke, you are done (you can't reach into your pocket and buy more chips). I try to avoid coinflip situations or worse for a lot of chips- I build my stack slowly but surely. Since most people understand that keeping their chips is the only way to stay in the tournament, you can get away with a LOT more blind stealing and reraises with crap...as long as YOU are the aggressor. You should rarely limp into a pot...open raising will oftentimes net you the blinds and/or antes. Sklansky has a theory called 'The Gap Concept'. Briefly- this means that there is a gap between the quality of hands that you would open raise with and the quality hands that you would call a raise with (you would need a much better hand to call a raise than in a ring game, since you can't afford to bleed too many chips). I also LOVE playing shorthanded (especially head to head)- I get to switch into hyperaggressive mode and really put the pressure on my opponent. I have had relatively few opponents (at least at the lower limits) that I feel are as good or better than I am heads up; thus I have many more 1st place finishes in tournaments than 2nds (I will have to check pokertracker to be sure, but my gut tells me this is the case). Most players don't realize HOW aggressive you have to be in order to have success shorthanded (provided that the stack sizes are relatively equal). There is a definite flow to tourneys that you don't get in ring games (which eventually get boring, playing ABC poker). I feel like I get more opportunities to outplay my opponents in tournaments, instead of always having to show down the best hand.
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When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM
Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood
Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
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Margalis
Terracotta Army
Posts: 12335
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I also LOVE playing shorthanded (especially head to head)- I get to switch into hyperaggressive mode and really put the pressure on my opponent.
I love shorthanded, tourney or not. I get to play more hands by % and quicker as well. In a tourney situation if I get heads up unless I am outchipped more than 2:1 I feel like I have a great chance. One thing about tournaments is position really matters. Being in late position is a huge help, you can buy a lot of pots.
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vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
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Mediocre
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Back in high school our favorites were Acey-Ducey, Guts, 7Stud-Low Hole + Follow the Queen, and Benny.
Benny is a Guts variation where you deal 3 cards, your lowest card is wild. You then hold the chip and drop just like guts. If you stayed in you get 2 more cards, you then deal "Benny" which is a phantom 5 card hand. If you beat everyone who stayed in and "Benny" you scoop the pot. If you stayed in and lose to either a player or to Benny you match the pot. With a $1 ante and 6-7 people we often had over $100 pots playing this game.
Our Acey-Ducey pots used to get out of control too. We had some friends who just loved to throw money into the pot. Any 5 card gap was good enough for them to give it a shot. If you have friends who really like to gamble games with match the pot rules get exciting fast.
I also used to deal a lot of Black Jack during study halls and such. Nothing worse than getting busted by a prick teacher who would just nab all the money on the table rather than pass out the detentions. All worth while though when I would clear $25 or so each study hall. You played hundred-dollars-in-a-single-pot games in High School? What Bus of Incredibly Fucking Rich Young People did you fall off of? :)
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Mediocre
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WayAbvPar: Some tips on the difference between tournaments and ring games?
Before I played tourneys online, all I played was NL Hold'em home tournaments, 10-man. But that's not a whole lot of XP, even though I was a decent winner overall. The biggest difference (obviously) is that when you go broke, you are done (you can't reach into your pocket and buy more chips). I try to avoid coinflip situations or worse for a lot of chips- I build my stack slowly but surely. Since most people understand that keeping their chips is the only way to stay in the tournament, you can get away with a LOT more blind stealing and reraises with crap...as long as YOU are the aggressor. You should rarely limp into a pot...open raising will oftentimes net you the blinds and/or antes. Sklansky has a theory called 'The Gap Concept'. Briefly- this means that there is a gap between the quality of hands that you would open raise with and the quality hands that you would call a raise with (you would need a much better hand to call a raise than in a ring game, since you can't afford to bleed too many chips). I also LOVE playing shorthanded (especially head to head)- I get to switch into hyperaggressive mode and really put the pressure on my opponent. I have had relatively few opponents (at least at the lower limits) that I feel are as good or better than I am heads up; thus I have many more 1st place finishes in tournaments than 2nds (I will have to check pokertracker to be sure, but my gut tells me this is the case). Most players don't realize HOW aggressive you have to be in order to have success shorthanded (provided that the stack sizes are relatively equal). There is a definite flow to tourneys that you don't get in ring games (which eventually get boring, playing ABC poker). I feel like I get more opportunities to outplay my opponents in tournaments, instead of always having to show down the best hand. I'd heard the Gap Concept mentioned before, which is why I went to Barnes and Noble, flipped to that chapter of Sklansky's book, read it and understood it, and put it back on the shelf. (He already has $60 of my money from TOP and HPFAP so I don't feel too bad for him) What I tend to do is run a coinflip situation all-in at the beginning of the game if I can. If the other guy folds, I'm up a decent amount of chips from whatever significant raise I made before I put him all-in. If he calls, I have a 50/50 shot at doubling up and being the chip leader for the majority of the game -- at $10 with a shot to win $50 if I'm the tournament winner, with a 50/50 chance of becoming the chip leader and usually propelling me straight into the money, I find it's a winning proposition for me to take those 50/50 situations early on. Mid-game, I play extremely tight. My raises get respected, which is very important going into short-handed; also, the minor pots I steal/make keep me above the rising blinds (in our tournaments, with eight people, blinds double every time someone goes out. We start with $10 in chips, blinds at .5/.10, then at 4 people it's gone up to .80/1.60 -- very important to play aggressive.) The problem is, I always end up splitting with second. If it's 50/20 for first and second, I usually go 35/35. Because, quite frankly, the guy I usually end up heads-up with is a maniac. He's been known, in tournaments, to do things like show everyone he has a two-seven offsuit, flip over his cards, and go all in. And then get a flop that comes 277. Luckiest bastard ever -- and in a ring game I could punish him easily, but in heads-up NL tournament play it scares the shit out of me.
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UD_Delt
Terracotta Army
Posts: 999
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You played hundred-dollars-in-a-single-pot games in High School?
What Bus of Incredibly Fucking Rich Young People did you fall off of? :) Yeah, I went to a rich kids school. Porche's in the parking lot and all... Unfortunately I was the poor kid at the rich school. My first 40 hour a week 8-5 job was working at the school over the summer buffing and waxing floors, cleaning lockers out and whatnot. It was legal since I didn't actually get paid it just all went toward tuition. Following that I always worked somewhere after school and during the summer so I always had money to spend or gamble once I covered 50% of my tuition. The only other option was public high school which had 1000 people per class... Most of the rest of my friends were just wealthy. To give you an idea, one of my friends' mothers moved to Florida to live with her boyfriend and just left him with a $250,000 house and money to pay the bills. It's nice being a senior in HS and having your own quarter mil private house with no parental supervision. Lots of gambling, drinking, and debauchery was done in that house.... Seeing as money actually mattered to me and not them it was usually easy to win a few dollars in those games because they were all so willing to throw money around...
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Mediocre
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I go to a public high school in Orange County, CA with plenty of richy-rich kids... but nobody I know plays for those sort of stakes, heh.
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Kairos
Terracotta Army
Posts: 65
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I recently started on PokerStars after having played on TruePoker for a couple weeks (and having gotten sick of the crappy interface). Tripled my starting bankroll in a couple hours, though I've just been playing with play money so far.
Which leads me to my question: do the people in the low limit real money games play significantly differently (read: better) from the ones in the play money games? I've been thinking of putting some cash into it and giving it a shot.
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Margalis
Terracotta Army
Posts: 12335
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Which leads me to my question: do the people in the low limit real money games play significantly differently (read: better) from the ones in the play money games? I've been thinking of putting some cash into it and giving it a shot.
No, they don't. Give it a shot. Start at .05/.1 holdem or .04/.08 stud.
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vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
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Mediocre
Guest
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EmpirePoker is sending out special re-upload bonus codes.. check your e-mail :)
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Pig Destroyer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 126
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Can you have accounts at both Empire and Party?
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Mediocre
Guest
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I do.
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UD_Delt
Terracotta Army
Posts: 999
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Can you have accounts at both Empire and Party? You can but I don't think they really want you to because of bonus whoring. That said, all you have to do is sign up for the other account using a different PC or a different IP address and then you can play both accounts on the same PC. You can't sit at the same table as yourself though since they do still check for that...
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Anger
Terracotta Army
Posts: 20
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I think I may have to accept Way's Challenge, and start tonight (er, now). I've been playing with play money on PokerStars, and have been itching to try the real thing. However, since I have a pretty firm understanding of just how un-awesome I am, I think I'll start at the Fixed .25/.50 games. I'm hesitant to lose all my money in one session.
My confidence is a little rattled, since I encountered my Online Poker Nemesis last night. It was more than a little demoralizing, so much so, that it was almost funny. I thought I was doing pretty well, after 100 or so hands, I was seeing the flop maybe 30% of the time, and had won every showdown I saw. This all came crashing down as my sinister rival revealed himself for what he was. Suddenly, my OPN was beating everything I'd play, and beating it badly. This one person began consistently beating everything I played to the River.
For example, I'm dealt KK. Flop comes something like J69. Turn is a 3. Only OPN and I are left, and I'm feeling pretty good, raising away, as I seriously doubt he's holding AA. River comes up a 4. "Awesome" thinks I, and then get beat by two-pair, 9's and 4's. I cannot overstate how often this person beat me just like that last night.
Ok, ok. I'm buying in right now before I dwell on this any longer and lose my nerve. If I lose all my money, I blame this thread (and all its previous incarnations).
Side note: I seem to get heckled for my username (Anger) every other play session or so, normally by the creative genius behind such names as X Ray Eye, and baseballguy6574. The emotional trauma is crippling.
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Pig Destroyer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 126
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I started doing Way's challenge last week too. Goddamn but I hate $.50/$1. I get beat by complete and utter shit like 72o on the river more times than I can count. I've been up to as much as $62 but I am back down to $45. I suck...shoot me.
When not doing the whole OIC thing however I've been doing rather nicely. I am completely hooked on Sit n Gos. I started out at the $10 ones at Party but I was consistently finishing fourth, which is most assuredly not spectacular for one's bankroll. So I moved down the $5 SnGs and finished in the money 3 out of 4 times, with 2 1st place finishes. Also doing quite well at $2/$4 and $3/$6 limit games.
It certainly helps that I actually have money in my bankroll to cover the swings, I don't feel skiddish about betting for value, or for information. I am currently down a total of about $50 but I can feel the wins starting to come again so I think I am going to do well.
See you at the tables.
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Anger
Terracotta Army
Posts: 20
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Day one was pretty ugly for me. I'm down about $17. I'm thinking long and hard about dropping to the manly .05/.10 tables for a while. Problem is, at those stakes, betting feels so trivial... It's hard to decide if I really just suck, or have had a run of bad luck. Probably the former, with a side-order of bad luck.
I know that once I was down $10 or so, I chased a few hands that I knew I shouldn't have. I'd see the big pot, and have pretty good cards, just not the nuts. I'd talk myself into calling. Painful, every time.
I notice that I'm also more apt to stay in on the hand immediately after I win one, like fortune is going to smile on me yet again.
I think I'm ok on pre-flop play, but after that things get a little dicey. I have to say that playing even for such low stakes feels completely different than playing for play money. I like it! I just really, really need to improve.
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Rasix
Moderator
Posts: 15024
I am the harbinger of your doom!
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I also have taken up the .5/1 challenge.
I was at one point up 27 then went all the way back to 5 under (in one sitting, God it was aweful), and now I've been around 20-30 up for the past 2-4 days (should be around 79-80 bucks atm). I was up to 92 a day ago w hen I landed a table full of fish. I've never managed to get people in .5/1 dollars games absolutely fear my betting due to the trivial nature of the cash involved, but I had these people shitless. It was lot of fun (too bad I had to pull myself away to finish some homework).
I like to play in 30min-1hr chunks a couple times a day and with my fiance out of town it's more (she still has no idea I'm doing this even with a nice POKERSTARS icon on my desktop, she's somewhat anti gambling and very anti-internet gambling). I find that I play good one sitting, and one of my sittings always ends up whiping out about 10 bucks of winnings. I think I need to start cutting my sessions short where I don't feel like I'm playing well at all.
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-Rasix
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UD_Delt
Terracotta Army
Posts: 999
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For those of you just starting out read this article and print out the chart in it to keep next to your computer. http://66.209.66.200/?sec=afeature&art_id=13913This will help immensely with your post-flop play which is where you are going to win or lose most of your money. Just remember to only count a card as an out if you are 99% sure it will give you the win. I will admit I'm a bit tighter than the chart when it comes to drawing to odds and I usually make sure the pot is paying proper odds + some. I'm not sure how poor of play it is but it feels safer to me. Also, Rasix, I personally don't like the short sessions. I finally had a decent night last night since I was able to put in a good 3 hour session. I find if I'm there for more than an hour some people will start to pick up on your play style, even at low limits. If you are playing tight they'll start to fold to you more often. In the second and third hour I was able to steal a few pots and my hands also held up a lot better because people were respecting my bets and raises and folding their crap hands rather than playing their crap hands that hit the turn and river and then bust me.
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