The Beginning of Something Good (Batman thread)

[Morfiend]

I have high hopes for "Ghost Rider" and I would enjoy a movie "Doctor Strange" as long as they keep the awful dialogue from the comic.

Now I know we all love us some Ghost Rider... but...

Nicolas Cage as a possessed motorcycle rider hellbent on justice

[Shockeye]

Batman Sequel Proceeds

Batman Begins producer Charles Roven told SCI FI Wire that the cast is signed on for a sequel, the script is in the works, new cast members are being discussed and the only delay is an OK by director Christopher Nolan. "We all hope there is going to be another one," Roven said in an interview for the upcoming Terry Gilliam film The Brothers Grimm, which he also produced. "We're waiting for Chris Nolan to declare himself. We will do it after he does that."

Batman Begins star Christian Bale has signed on to reprise the role of the seething and dark Bruce Wayne/Batman, as have Michael Caine as the butler Alfred, Katie Holmes as the love interest Rachel Dawes and Gary Oldman as police detective Jim Gordon, Roven confirmed.

But Roven added that it's too early to talk about new cast members. He discounted rumors that The Daily Show's Steve Carrell is up for the role of the Joker. Roven is working with Carrell on the big-screen version of the TV spy comedy series Get Smart and said it's way too early to talk about new cast members for the as-yet-untitled next Batman film.

Roven said that it would be possible to proceed with another Batman movie without Nolan, but added that he would prefer Nolan to do another one.

"The point is that the studio owns the franchise, and they can do without any of us," Roven said. "But it was a spectacular experience with Chris [Nolan], and he kept everyone involved and was very collaborative. So we hope it will happen again with him."

So we're stuck with Holmes. Great.

[Llava]

Don't cast a comedian as the Joker.  He's more sinister than he is goofy.  Steve Carrel, much as I like him, would be among my last choices for the role.

[Triforcer]

Don't cast a comedian as the Joker.  He's more sinister than he is goofy.  Steve Carrel, much as I like him, would be among my last choices for the role.

I don't know.  You don't want Christopher Walken or Emperor Palpatine in whiteface.  I think a comedian would be better, actualyl, and Carrel could definitely pull off the insane smile/laughter the Joker needs.  He has the right kind of face for it too...other comedians, like Adam Sandler, just don't like it.  I can easily picture Carrel as Joker. 

[Llava]

Carrel has too much of a desperate look.  Blatantly false confidence is his thing.  The Joker's confidence and malice are quite real.  I'd be more inclined to look for someone like Dennis Leary than Steve Carrel if I was absolutely dead set on casting a comedian.

Actually, Leary might not be a bad choice if he takes the role seriously.

[Paelos]

Dennis Hopper.

That is all.

[Samwise]

I think Jim Carrey would have made a great Joker, but they already used him as the Riddler.

Johnny Knoxville?   

[schild]

Actually, on the Carrell note - I think Jon Stewart could make an incredible joker. As could Louis Black.

Edit: Black would have to drop 50 lbs though.

[stray]

Again I say: Ray Liotta or Crispin Glover.

[Yegolev]

Now I know we all love us some Ghost Rider... but...

Nicolas Cage as a possessed motorcycle rider hellbent on justice

I have a love/hate with Nick.  I simply don't like him but I grudgingly admit that he's a relatively decent actor with interesting roles.  I'll take a Cage to the gut to see a Ghost Rider movie.

[HaemishM]

I think Steve Carrell could do a fantastic Joker, because of the ability to go from dead serious to completely funny in a split-second. Crispin Glover would be good from a look-alike standpoint but I'm not so sure of his ability to do teh funney. I still say Mark Hammill.

[WayAbvPar]

Cock Knocker?

[Sky]

Don't you mean get scientology?

Apropos of nothing, look up L. Ron Hubbard in Oxford's book of quotations. There's only one entry, all scientologists should read it before joining up imo.

[ahoythematey]

Huh?

[Llava]

I guess Carrel is just too over the top for me.  I'd see him playing the Joker as out of control.  My preferred Joker is very much in control of himself, he just expresses that very strangely.  Just because his humor is over the top doesn't mean he is.

I've been reconsidering on Mark Hammill because he's not really built for the part.  But he ought to coach whoever does get the role.

And just because:

[fear and loathing]

I think Steve Carrell could do a fantastic Joker, because of the ability to go from dead serious to completely funny in a split-second. Crispin Glover would be good from a look-alike standpoint but I'm not so sure of his ability to do teh funney. I still say Mark Hammill.

Willard did a good sociopath in Willard, but I think Steve Carrell would be funnier with the mentally unstable role.  The thing I'd like to see most, though, is for Paul Dini's Batman: The Animated Series to be continued.  I loved that damn show.

[TheWalrus]

Jack Nicholson.

[MrHat]

Jack Nicholson.

/agree

[schild]

The Joker is not 200 years old.

[Llava]

Already been done.  I think we can do better.

[Big Gulp]

Already been done.  I think we can do better.

Whomever said Adrien Brody was on to something.  He's already got the look, and he's a decent actor.  I'll go with creepy, malevolent sociopath over someone trying to make the role funny, thanks.

[MrHat]

Del Toro?

[Sky]

Christian Slater?

I'll go with creepy, malevolent sociopath over someone trying to make the role funny, thanks.

Christopher Walken?

[Big Gulp]

Christopher Walken?

In his Dead Zone days, sure.  Now he's just too old.

[AOFanboi]

In his Dead Zone days, sure.  Now he's just too old.

As was Jack Nicholson, really.

Perhaps Matt Dillon? Frog knows he needs a good part after being associated with the Herbie remake.

[stray]

In his Dead Zone days, sure.  Now he's just too old.

As was Jack Nicholson, really.

Perhaps Matt Dillon? Frog knows he needs a good part after being associated with the Herbie remake.

He's condemned to Herbie remakes and Ensemble flicks from now on.

[Llava]

I'm sticking by Leary.  The more I think about it, the more I think that he, coached by Hammill, would do a fantastic Joker.

[Fargull]

James Marsters

[Furiously]

I say - lets reinvent the Joker.... P Diddy or Carrottop.

[Ironwood]

James Marsters

Christ, I can actually see that working.

arg.

[Llava]

James Marsters

Christ, I can actually see that working.

arg.

Ditto, actually.  Not perfect, but I could get behind that choice.

Plus we know he doesn't mind dyeing his hair.

[Xerapis]

James Marsters

OMG YES!

I love me some Spike action.

[Margalis]

James Marsters would be awful. The guy is terrible in everything, and comes off as a lightweight. The dreary british vampire...bleah!

I don't think casting comedians for the Joker would work. The guy is insane, not a standup comic. They tried it with Carrey as The Riddler and that was awful. (A lot of that was the direction to be fair) The Joker doesn't tell jokes, he thinks the whole world is a joke. He doesn't value anything. (Yes, he does tell actual jokes sometimes, but in the good stories at least to illustrate that theme) For example when he shoots Batgirl in the back and makes jokes comparing her to a book with a damaged spine. It's not like "I just flew in from Arkham and boy are my arms tired!"

Jack Nicholson had played a lot of characters with varying degrees of sanity, including in The Shining. He has a sort of dangerous aura to him. That's the main thing the Joker needs - he needs to put you ill at ease and feel dangerous. Even though he isn't much of a fighter, doesn't have powerful weapons or super powers. The kind of guy you really wouldn't want to stand next to in an elevator.

Dennis Leary sort of fits that part. He's the type of guy that seems like he could just go off and do anything at any moment. But he's more angry than crazy, and the Joker doesn't really come off as angry very often. Somtimes bitter and vindictive, but never just rageful.

John Stewart I could maybe actually see except his face would never work. I don't think Christopher Walken would work because the Joker has a sort of youthful, manic energy to him that Walken is the exact opposite of.

If Angelina Jolie were a man I would say she would be good. She has that sort of crazy gleam in her eye. Someone you don't want babysitting your kids. Antonia Banderas might not be that bad. (I can't believe I just wrote that)

The basic criteria are these:
Someone who can display manic energy
Someone who radiates unpredictability and a dangerous edge.
Someone who can derive pleasure and humor from sadism.
Someone who does something just because they can.

Kevin Spacey? yeah, that's my final answer. I can so see Kevin Spacey as the Joker! I'm a casting genius. I'm quite happy now because the more I think about it the more I can see how good that would be. He certainly can project a sort of unstable edge, he could deliver comedic lines with wit and sarcasm and bile and not seem fluffy or jokey but sinister.

Edit: Apparently Spacey is already playing Lex Luthor in some new Superman movie. I really think he would be better as the Joker. Take his characters from Swimming with Sharks, Seven, The Usual Suspects and K-PAX and you're halfway there. (Ok, just kidding on that last one) Kevin Spacey can play guys who are somewhat deranged and Lex isn't really deranged enough.

[Llava]

You are right on the angry count.  The Joker is always menacing, but there's one scene in Mask of the Phantasm in which he actually gets angry and he gets even more frightening, albeit just for a second as he quickly diffuses the situation with a joke:
"DON'T TOUCH ME, OLD MAN!  I don't know where you've been, hah!"

[Ironwood]

How come I agree with everything Margalis said, but find all the casting choices he made woeful ?  I don't get it.  We seem to see the Joker as the same person, but not actors...

I still think McGinley could do it if he lost some weight and bulk.  The guy has played some really, really frightening characters in his time and his current Scrubs persona seems to fit the energy and comedy aspects.

However, I think we ALL will agree on one thing :  Finding the RIGHT unknown would be much better than any other option.  That way he can make the Joker his own.

(For example, I think everyone in this thread who says Nicolson was in any way good as the joker needs to be shot in the head.  But that's just me.)