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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  City of Heroes / City of Villains  |  Topic: Controller- Fire/Kinetics Any Good? 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: Controller- Fire/Kinetics Any Good?  (Read 2462 times)
Venkman
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on: April 20, 2004, 08:03:04 AM

I've concentrated really mostly on Blaster archetypes. I just like the big flashy AOEs, DDs and Roots (or knockdowns). But I started messing around with other things last night, and am going to continue trying other stuff tonight.

I was thinking:

Controller: Fire Control / Kinetics.

I'm not much into the crowd-control stuff. Maybe someday later once Bat Country is established or something. But I like the Necro-esque transfusion (steal energy) and siphoning (steal +dmg) from the Kinetics Secondary as they potentially work with Single/AOE Root, Blind and DDs of Fire Control. I eat endurance for breakfast and my Inspiration slots are pretty much always full of +Endurances.

Anyone have any thoughts on this? Will my damage output be laughable?
Alluvian
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Reply #1 on: April 20, 2004, 09:03:09 AM

Kaid had this character on Jenny Psycho.  He liked the fire control primary but cursed and cussed at the Kinetic due to it's gimpy heal.  You have to actually land a hit roll on an opponent to heal and then the healing is aoe around yourself so you have to get that hit landed while chasing your heal target.  Pain in the ass, and misses will get people killed.
CmdrSlack
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Reply #2 on: April 20, 2004, 10:11:53 AM

From my experience, it depends how you want to control crowds.

Earth/Storm is how I specced out my controller.

So far I have:

Stone Prison -- single target root, minor DoT
Stone Prisons -- AoE root, minor DoT, stacks with Stone Prison
Fossilize -- a bit more damage, immobilize, single target
Stalagmites -- AoE disorient, minor damage
Gale -- cone AoE knockback
Snow Storm -- AoE slow, eats lots of end
Steamy Mist -- def buff, resist buff, stealth -- works on group
Hover

And I'm about halfway to 13.

With controllers, you DO NOT want to miss your attacks.  I have stuff socketed up between durations and accuracy.  I've been fooling with duration vs. accuracy vs. end reducers.  

However, I don't have a heal.  There's O2 Boost from stormcalling, but I was afraid it would suck, and for the low levels, I really needed stone prisons to root multiple enemies.

Damage output sucks, but socketing up for damage means you don't socket up for accuracy, which is most important IMO.

I may try to hit 14 before the wipe on Thursday to test out the Fighting power pool.  Why?  Because when I solo, it takes forever.  If I had the ability to dish out some melee damage beyond the brawl power, that would be huge.  With stalagmites and fossilize socketed up for duration and accuracy, I can generally get a few good punches in before I need to refresh the fossilize.  Stalagmites gives everyone else the drunk walk (aka gay arm), and a good stone prison keeps some DoT on them while I work on one guy at a time.

The fire control powers look cool, tried some with a fire/fire blaster I made for one of the launch day tests.  It would really depend on your playstyle, I guess.  However, if you want to dish out major damage, controller is not the way to go.  Defenders outdamage me.

However, Gravity control seems to be the way to go for controllers who want to get some direct damageish powers.  Plus it looks cool when people toss pool tables and shit at bad guys.

I traded in my fun blog for several legal blogs. Or, "blawgs," as the cutesy attorney blawgosphere likes to call 'em.
Alluvian
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Reply #3 on: April 20, 2004, 10:18:25 AM

O2 boost is one of the better heals in the game.
WayAbvPar
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Reply #4 on: April 20, 2004, 11:40:41 AM

Quote
However, Gravity control seems to be the way to go for controllers who want to get some direct damageish powers. Plus it looks cool when people toss pool tables and shit at bad guys.


That sounds like fun- I started a Magic/Grav controller last night. Any idea which controller template is best tuned for mass crowd control? I would like a team-friendly character that plays similar to an EQ enchanter if possible...

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kaid
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Reply #5 on: April 20, 2004, 11:55:55 AM

Okay here is the run down of fire/kinetic controllers.

Fire ring single target root standard controller root

Choke single target hold very nice only gripe is it is kinda hard to see when it lands.

Fire cages aoe root very good to have

Smoke odd power you cast it on groups and it blinds them to you and works like stealth as well as lowering their accuracy. The odd thing is this apparently can stack so you can hit a bunch of mobs in a group with it to really jack up their accuracy but that is probably a bug.

Hot feet aoe snare/aoe damage um this thing at level 14 sucks up so much end with 3 DO enhancers on it that it just is not usable at the moment. Eventually it will be handy but probably not until I get SO slots.

Flashfire Very handy targted aoe disorient teensy dot. This is a good power kinda slow recharge but not bad throw it down on a mob and anything near it will go gimp arm and stagger around.

Cinders pbaoe hold this is bread and butter controller power for locking down lots of mobs.

Bonfire Ground targted aoe damage plus knock back. This power is basically something you slap down to disrupt mobs kinda like fire rain.

FIRE SPRITES fire sprites are THE NUMBER ONE REASON TO TAKE THIS SET. Yes it is that good imagine being able to summon 4 to 6 tiny flaming scrappers to slash into your targets. Each fire sprite can hit for up to 100 damage and with controllers aoe holds allows you to destroy big groups of mobs. This power turns fire controllers into soloing MACHINES. I have seen them in action and it is very sick. It is still a bit rsiky if you fail to lock things down the sprites cannot take much damage but  my god they dish it out.


Kinetic

Currently I only have two kinetic powers

Siphon the first power you get has to be one of the most useless friggin heals EVER. It is point blank area effect around the targeted creature. This thing misses ALOT even when slotting up alot of accuracy. That and its aoe is small by the time you get it to land in general the mob has been knock backed, is dead, or the person you really want to heal is avoiding the mob because THEY NEED A HEAL. Pointless and diffult to use. I do not consider it a heal I consider it something you throw randomly when you are in the mood which may or may not do any good.


Siphon speed. This is kinda  fun ability allows you to get super speed in a limited form. It also works as a gimpy targeted snare on targets. The problem with this is you need to agro a mob to use it and you will get hit at least once for using it due to animation time. Fun power but frankly not sure why you would waste a slot just wait to get super speed for a speed power that stays on all the time.

Kinetic has some nice powers but most look so situational or in practice are so ineffective I cannot recommend it to anybody.


kaid
CmdrSlack
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Reply #6 on: April 20, 2004, 12:06:57 PM

Quote from: WayAbvPar
Quote
However, Gravity control seems to be the way to go for controllers who want to get some direct damageish powers. Plus it looks cool when people toss pool tables and shit at bad guys.


That sounds like fun- I started a Magic/Grav controller last night. Any idea which controller template is best tuned for mass crowd control? I would like a team-friendly character that plays similar to an EQ enchanter if possible...


I'm having a lot of fun with the earth/storm....but it doesn't do what EQ chanters do...

Maybe the illusion or mental (?) one...schild was working on an illusion/storm controller last night.

I traded in my fun blog for several legal blogs. Or, "blawgs," as the cutesy attorney blawgosphere likes to call 'em.
kaid
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Reply #7 on: April 20, 2004, 12:28:35 PM

Illusion is fun but odd. It has the least ammount of normal crowd control but it makes up for it with weird pets to cause confusion and distract opponents.

Kaid
Venkman
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Posts: 11536


Reply #8 on: April 20, 2004, 01:02:03 PM

Thanks for the great list Kaid!

I rolled this guy at lunch and gotta agree, Transfusion (targetted Endurance drain to gain HPs) was a disappointment. Of course, had I read this thread before rolling, I'd have known that I wasn't going to get back Endurance like I though. Mana good. Medding bad.

Fire Cages plus Char is just fun as heck, particularly with +Timer and +Damage enhancements. But they take longer to do what I've been doing as a Fire Blaster, and except for Storm Summoning, the Controller Secondaries are very group oriented.

So tonight I'll be rolling a Fire Control Storm Summoner. Gale > Fire Cages > Char for soloing and everything else for group.

I'm really going by "feel" at this point. So far, everything's pointed me back to Fire Blaster. I even have the exact look already planned :) And being able to play from work is going to really maximize my catassing...
Fargull
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Reply #9 on: April 20, 2004, 02:18:51 PM

Quote from: kaid

Siphon speed. This is kinda  fun ability allows you to get super speed in a limited form. It also works as a gimpy targeted snare on targets. The problem with this is you need to agro a mob to use it and you will get hit at least once for using it due to animation time. Fun power but frankly not sure why you would waste a slot just wait to get super speed for a speed power that stays on all the time.


Know a defender that uses this with Hover and moves faster than flight currently while Siphon is active.  Zing!

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kaid
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Reply #10 on: April 20, 2004, 02:33:52 PM

Hehe yup I had only found out about that today since my character does not have hover but siphon speed stacks with most other movement powers except super speed. Supposedly it stacks with super speed but there is a max cap for how fast you can go and apparently siphon plus super speed hits it and so it isn't quite as great a boost as hover plus siphon speed.

Kinetic does have some good tricks but I find that the power set just does not mesh with my play style.

Good points of kinetic

Siphon power lowers mob damage to raise party damage at low levels or maybe just as a controller it dosnt do much but it adds a few extra damage to attacks.

Speed boost allows you to make targeted folks very fast almost super speed level  + endurance recharge. The downside is I have seen tanks in group ask for this power which should be good to not be cast on them. The reason is it makes melee very erratic on laggy systems and is just to fast for combat use for some.

Those are some of the ones I have seen used to good effect the last two powers in the category from what I hear are VERY good but I have never seen a kinetic user high enough to have them so I cannot say for myself.

The biggest mistake you can make about grabbing kinetic is thinking it will allow you to heal. Any actual healing siphon does is bonus and do not count on it nor expect it to work EVER when you need it.

edit

Forgot my final point kinetic is not horrible I just find myself not liking it as much as othe power sets. Also I think kinetic would work better for Defenders than controllers. Most of its powers are such that if you want to use them at all you will want them to be as good as possible which means defender. The decrease controllers take for it being secondary for accuracy and boosts turns powers which should be pretty decent into kinda MEH things that are a lil underwhealming.


Kaid
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